Language Arts, TGTB, BJU, CAP W&R, etc

[Janeway]

I currently own CAP W&R, BJU English, and then have the free copy of TGTB. I have been trying out TGTB, but with it, do not have time for the other stuff. We were bored with BJU. BJU seemed to move so slowly and son is quick to master things.  I am frustrated with switching back and forth between the ipad and printed papers for TGTB. If I continue with TGTB, I think I need to order a hard copy. But before I order, I want to know if I am being wasteful? I have always wanted to do CAP W&R so I could just use that. Oh, I also already have spelling and handwriting separate from whatever else i do. 

[Shoes+Ships+SealingWax]

You may as well take the opportunity to give W&R a try, since you already own it. Perhaps the extra time would allow you the chance to find TGTB second-hand at the end of the school year, or manage to catch a sale. I love curricula & end up with a wide array... but I’m always mindful that we are at least using bits & pieces of each, or cycling them in somehow. The best curricula are those that get DONE 😉

[ktgrok]

TGTB is wonderful in some ways, and overkill in others, and terrible in spelling. I wish they'd take that out, because I think it ruins it, honestly. It is also teacher intensive, and depending on your kid, time, etc that can be good or bad. it is definitely a snuggle up at the table with a cup of coffee and go over it together program. I wanted to love it. parts of it I DO love. But my flat out hatred of the spelling means constantly skipping or crossing stuff out, plus I went down a level for my daughter's grammar level but that left her below her reading level which was frustrating, and it took forever. 

We have used other things as well, and for right now love (with caveats) Language Lessons for a Living Education. The hokey story that goes along with it is bleh. And we don't do the bible reading that comes up weekly, where you read  a passage and draw something and copy something, etc etc. In other words, we use it mainly for grammar and poetry instruction and composition. It is behind as far as composition compared to a lot of programs but personally that makes it perfect as far as I'm concerned. I am of the opinion that kids should focus on sentences, not paragraphs, until about 4th grade which is what it does. With my dyslexic that is perfect, although I do scribe for her with the paragraphs. It is short and sweet, and to the point. Instead of half a page of "circle the pronoun" it has you learn about pronouns and then write your own sentence using one. I think that using what you learned right away is perfect, and it is a good way for my student to get practice writing sentences. 

You can get the PDF to print or the printed version. I have the printed but we've switched to an independent notebook system and I would prefer to print it myself so I could do single sided 

[Hallyv]

What level are you using in tgtb? We did tgtb levels 1-3 and I used W&R with Tgtb level 3. We skipped all of the writing workshops in tgtb 3 and Did W&R instead. We used W&R sporadically, maybe every other week & we loved both together, it made for a really lovely combo! But, if you have a spelling you like, then you could drop tgtb, use W&R, and all you would have to add is a grammar and read books of your choice. Easy grammar comes to mind. I did this last yr- after tgtb level 3; we continued W&R with spelling one week, then Easy grammar with spelling the next week. Again, not sure what age, level you are thinking though. 

[Janeway]

1 hour ago, Hallyv said:

What level are you using in tgtb? We did tgtb levels 1-3 and I used W&R with Tgtb level 3. We skipped all of the writing workshops in tgtb 3 and Did W&R instead. We used W&R sporadically, maybe every other week & we loved both together, it made for a really lovely combo! But, if you have a spelling you like, then you could drop tgtb, use W&R, and all you would have to add is a grammar and read books of your choice. Easy grammar comes to mind. I did this last yr- after tgtb level 3; we continued W&R with spelling one week, then Easy grammar with spelling the next week. Again, not sure what age, level you are thinking though. 

Level two..the brand new one they just came out with. It is not that I have a spelling I love, but rather that I already had a spelling and had been told the spelling in TGTB was not the best.

[Hallyv]

18 minutes ago, Janeway said:

Level two..the brand new one they just came out with. It is not that I have a spelling I love, but rather that I already had a spelling and had been told the spelling in TGTB was not the best.

I see, we actually loved the spelling rules & dictation within the coursebook lessons themselves. My daughter thrived with level 2 (after finding what worked for us, dictation was difficult at first). We did not do the sp words from the companion because those words are read & practiced within the coursebook lessons- they are used within the sp dictation sentences as well. So you are actually learning & working with all of the spelling words without knowing you are. This replaces busy work, drill & kill.  But, maybe that has changed in the new updated version, not sure. But ordering the hard copy was worth it to me. I would wait until after level 2 to start W&R, but that is just me. My daughter is a creative, natural writer and this progression worked well for her. 

[Janeway]

10 minutes ago, Hallyv said:

I see, we actually loved the spelling rules & dictation within the coursebook lessons themselves. My daughter thrived with level 2 (after finding what worked for us, dictation was difficult at first). We did not do the sp words from the companion because those words are read & practiced within the coursebook lessons- they are used within the sp dictation sentences as well. So you are actually learning & working with all of the spelling words without knowing you are. This replaces busy work, drill & kill.  But, maybe that has changed in the new updated version, not sure. But ordering the hard copy was worth it to me. I would wait until after level 2 to start W&R, but that is just me. My daughter is a creative, natural writer and this progression worked well for her. 

The older child (son) is doing writing and rhetoric. He is in level 4. He only started TGTB LA when he was part way through his Spelling Workout. Daughter just started home schooling and I brought out the SWO right away for her and we have only done two lessons. It dawned on me that maybe for her, and both of them in the end, we could drop doing spelling as an extra subject and just use it from TGTB. Daughter is in level 2. Do you think I should start W&R with her after completing level 2? I am liking it a lot and it does not take much effort to do. 

[Hallyv]

14 minutes ago, Janeway said:

It dawned on me that maybe for her, and both of them in the end, we could drop doing spelling as an extra subject and just use it from TGTB. Daughter is in level 2. Do you think I should start W&R with her after completing level 2? I am liking it a lot and it does not take much effort to do. 

Yes! That is exactly what I did with my youngest- dropped everything but tgtb level 2 and just focussed on that for LA and she thrived! Less is more for her - maybe yours too?! It was easier for me as well. Then when we completed level 2, we started level 3 (which was a lot of review from 2 blah!). She begged to do writing. So We did W&R after completing Level 2. I don’t know what your goals are, but at this stage, I think if you want to minimize- wait to complete level 2, then start W&R. Doing W&R and L2 would have been too much at the stage we were at. My daughter also wasn’t ready for a writing curriculum until after tgtb 2. Hope that helps

[Janeway]

1 minute ago, Hallyv said:

Yes! That is exactly what I did with my youngest- dropped everything but tgtb level 2 and just focussed on that for LA and she thrived! Less is more for her - maybe yours too?! It was easier for me as well. Then when we completed level 2, we started level 3 (which was a lot of review from 2 blah!). She begged to do writing. So We did W&R after completing Level 2. I don’t know what your goals are, but at this stage, I think if you want to minimize- wait to complete level 2, then start W&R. Doing W&R and L2 would have been too much at the stage we were at. My daughter also wasn’t ready for a writing curriculum until after tgtb 2. Hope that helps

I think your daughter is like mine! Less is better. Plus, she is a natural learner so I don't think it takes a lot for her to get it. Thank you so much!

[Hallyv]

I hope it works for you both!
On another note, 
You said your son did W&R and level 4? How did you like it? I am trying to decide whether to continue on to Tgtb level 4 with W&R or just do W&R and a different grammar/spelling. 
Were you able to use W&R with L4, or is it too much writing? I keep looking at it and we love W&R & tgtb,  but I keep thinking “remember-Less is more for this child”. 
I don’t want to try to tackle too much... lol  Level 4 seems so different in format, we like the art but my daughter does not like geography. She already flipped through it and grimaced.... not a good sign as she really loved levels 1-3. Ugh! What to do, what to do! 

[Janeway]

50 minutes ago, Hallyv said:

I hope it works for you both!
On another note, 
You said your son did W&R and level 4? How did you like it? I am trying to decide whether to continue on to Tgtb level 4 with W&R or just do W&R and a different grammar/spelling. 
Were you able to use W&R with L4, or is it too much writing? I keep looking at it and we love W&R & tgtb,  but I keep thinking “remember-Less is more for this child”. 
I don’t want to try to tackle too much... lol  Level 4 seems so different in format, we like the art but my daughter does not like geography. She already flipped through it and grimaced.... not a good sign as she really loved levels 1-3. Ugh! What to do, what to do! 

Actually, we just started with level 4 and W&R. I am not positive we will continue with level 4. He was already doing spelling on the side and is good at it. But, we do not have a reading program so level 4 is more or less a reading program for us. Except, we barely get to it. I put W&R first. We are only on the first week back after Christmas break so I can tell you more later. I figure W&R is going so fast that we will have plenty of time to do TGTB LA too. I do not make him do all the tracing from geography, but do go over it. I skipped over the NY boroughs though. I pointed at it and told him what it was and then moved on. I did not buy the printed version though as I am not committed to it. I did buy the printed version for daughter doing level 2 though.

Edited January 10, 2020 by Janeway

[Hallyv]

It does look reading heavy, which I like. I like when reading is built into an LA spine like that, then I can just let her choose & read books about her own interests. 

Anyhow, I am Interested to hear your progress and see which direction you take! Good luck ❤️ 

[Janeway]

On 1/10/2020 at 3:18 PM, Hallyv said:

I hope it works for you both!
On another note, 
You said your son did W&R and level 4? How did you like it? I am trying to decide whether to continue on to Tgtb level 4 with W&R or just do W&R and a different grammar/spelling. 
Were you able to use W&R with L4, or is it too much writing? I keep looking at it and we love W&R & tgtb,  but I keep thinking “remember-Less is more for this child”. 
I don’t want to try to tackle too much... lol  Level 4 seems so different in format, we like the art but my daughter does not like geography. She already flipped through it and grimaced.... not a good sign as she really loved levels 1-3. Ugh! What to do, what to do! 

I think maybe I have something figured out that is working for us. Basically, level 4, first semester of TGTB, is only 43 lessons. We have completed it and it really only took 2 months. Anyway, we have not completed the Creative Companion through lesson 43 so my intent now is to work from CAP W&R while working on the Creative Companion. When we get done with W&R, or just tired of it, we will move back in to TGTB. I see TGTB only goes through level 7 and then moves to high school. There seems to be an expectation that level 7 would be completed by end of 8th grade. So I am not worried about the idea that he might start 5th grade still in level 4, but I am guessing that might not even happen. There seem to be about 50 lessons in the second half of level 4. We really like TGTB and it is nice that there is wiggle room to do other things too. What do you think? How have things gone with you?

Edited February 26, 2020 by Janeway

[Emily ZL]

You can also go through and just look at the lessons and decide if you really need everything. I don't know TGTB but with R&S grammar there's a lot of repetition from year to year. I felt pretty confident choosing the most important 36 lessons (one per week) and calling it good. Not sure if that can be done with TGTB but if you're feeling like you're trying to cram everything in, you might be able to go through and choose the most important bits rather than trying to check the box on every single lesson.

[Hallyv]

On 2/26/2020 at 8:08 AM, Janeway said:

I think maybe I have something figured out that is working for us. Basically, level 4, first semester of TGTB, is only 43 lessons. We have completed it and it really only took 2 months. Anyway, we have not completed the Creative Companion through lesson 43 so my intent now is to work from CAP W&R while working on the Creative Companion. When we get done with W&R, or just tired of it, we will move back in to TGTB. I see TGTB only goes through level 7 and then moves to high school. There seems to be an expectation that level 7 would be completed by end of 8th grade. So I am not worried about the idea that he might start 5th grade still in level 4, but I am guessing that might not even happen. There seem to be about 50 lessons in the second half of level 4. We really like TGTB and it is nice that there is wiggle room to do other things too. What do you think? How have things gone with you?

I am so sorry I just saw this! That sounds like a good plan. I like moving back & forth between curriculum to keep things fresh too. 
 

We are really enjoying Level 4! We tried to juggle W&R with tgtb L4 while finishing up IEW ATF&F that her coop was doing. That was too much. We have dropped the coop & solely focussing on tgtb & I have been very happy with everything in level 4 ! We have done the concurrent lessons in the creative companion and are almost done with part 1. I flipped through part 2 & the rest of the creative companion, and I really like the writing assignments. I think we will just keep on keeping on with tgtb for now. Maybe we will revisit W&R this summer. But I am really happy with TGTB level 4 and my daughter is doing really well with it too. I hope you are able to make all the things you want to do work! Enjoy !

[Janeway]

13 hours ago, Hallyv said:

I am so sorry I just saw this! That sounds like a good plan. I like moving back & forth between curriculum to keep things fresh too. 
 

We are really enjoying Level 4! We tried to juggle W&R with tgtb L4 while finishing up IEW ATF&F that her coop was doing. That was too much. We have dropped the coop & solely focussing on tgtb & I have been very happy with everything in level 4 ! We have done the concurrent lessons in the creative companion and are almost done with part 1. I flipped through part 2 & the rest of the creative companion, and I really like the writing assignments. I think we will just keep on keeping on with tgtb for now. Maybe we will revisit W&R this summer. But I am really happy with TGTB level 4 and my daughter is doing really well with it too. I hope you are able to make all the things you want to do work! Enjoy !

I do not think we will continue the W&R.  We enjoyed the stories, but, we were doing everything verbally and the last writing assignment was a bit long. I think we will finish level 4 and then decide if we wish to pick up the W&R again.