Seeking Math Recommendations - Child Thinks Horizons Math is the Devil

[Erielle]

My son is in 2nd grade and working through the second book of Horizons Math 2. He does well in math and Horizons was OK at first, but as the school year has progressed, every day has become a battle when the blue Horizons book gets pulled out. What should take no more than 1 hour a day ends up taking 2+ hours. Thinking the issue was the amount of problems per page, I cut back the amount of work he was doing from 2 pages per day to 1. And still the battle rages on...

 

He has grown to absolutely hate Horizons, both from the amount of problems on each page to repeating the same stuff over and over again. And I get it, I really do. It is the same thing over and over again, which is important for math but sometimes enough is simply enough. He wants more of a mix of things.

 

Originally, I was drawn to Horizons because of the spiral method, but now I'm seeing that just because that's what I like doesn't make it what he wants/needs. The math gets done eventually with mostly correct answers, but it isn't worth it to continue using this program if every day turns into a bad day just because of one frackin' book.

 

So, now that I've rambled enough and have realized that Horizons clearly isn't working, where should I go from here? A new math program is obviously needed. I don't want my child to hate school and say things to me like, "Mommy, I only like the weekends because I don't have to do my math book."

 

Saxon? Singapore? Math Mammoth? Something else?

(I'd like to say away from common core if at all possible.)

 

And, then there is deciding whether I should start a new program now or wait until grade 3... *sigh*

[Peaceseeker]

I would say whatever program you use, an hour a day seems like a lot of math for a second grader. I would probably top out at 20-30 minutes at that age. I wonder if some of the resistance isn't just due to the length of the lessons?

[nixpix5]

Often once the pairing of dislike with a curriculum happens, no matter how much you cut back will still probably cause agony.

 

My DD did all of 1st grade Horizon and by the end I could see she was feeling done. We switched to BJU math for her and it was a great switch. It was still colorful and still rigorous like Horizon but less problems and a bit more fun. It doesn't spiral but she doesn't need the constant repetition. We also do Singspore workbook US Edition along with it.

 

Anyway, it was a perfect switch and she is so happy. She does a page front and back of BJU and an exercise in Singapore per day. Sometimes she chooses to do more because after Horizon, it just feels like not as much. I would say her conceptual math understanding is so good with this combination too.

[desertflower]

I have a child in second grade math and we usually just do about 15 - 30 mins at a time.

 

I would definitely put Horizon back on the shelf and leave it there.

 

I would try something different.  A different approach.

 

Beast Academy came out with 2A and I hear 2B is coming out either this month or the next.  There are usually 4 books in a school year.  This has a comic book style approach.  It can be challenging for any student.  If it's not working out, perhaps just buy the guide and do something else.

 

Another alternative is Right Start math is a more hands on approach.  Very teacher intensive. 

 

I'm such a big fan of BA that I'm recommending the guide in BA and RS.  But hey, that's just me.  :)

 

I hope you find something. 

[shand]

We recently switched to MM and, so far, it's been good. DD doesn't love it, but she does enjoy the accompanying youtube videos. It's also easy to set a timer for 25 minutes and just stop when it goes off. That has been a huge advantage to MM that we didn't have with MUS or BJU since I felt we needed to complete the entire lesson so we wouldn't get behind. What should've only been a 30 minute lesson would always take so much longer. MM has actually turned into our "cuddle time". We sit together and she tells me how to solve each problem and I do the writing for her. This will change as she gets older, but for now we're loving it.

[EmilyGF]

I find that you need to pinpoint the problem exactly because no curriculum is exactly right for every kid. I've gone through this with three kids (and man, do I have compassion on public school teachers).

 

Kid 1 likes rules and did amazingly with RightStart, Singapore, and now AOPS (but here he needs to only have what he needs to master it and then toss everything else).

 

Kid 2 needs to figure things out on her own. She bombed RightStart, did great with MEP, and now does a mix of Singapore IP on her own and Math Mammoth (figures it out on her own).

 

Kid 3 is a perfectionist and needs to know what is expected of her. She hated math games/Beast Academy/etc. Any open-ended-ness stressed her out. Guess what she loves (after crying through math games all summer)? Singapore math. She's even raved about it to her friends.

So look first at your kid and then at the programs.

Emily 

[Erielle]

I would say whatever program you use, an hour a day seems like a lot of math for a second grader. I would probably top out at 20-30 minutes at that age. I wonder if some of the resistance isn't just due to the length of the lessons?

 

He doesn't do an hour of math a day. He will do maybe 30 minutes of actual work. The rest of "math time" is trying to coax him in to working. On days he is being super extra about it, it can take up to two hours of "math time" that includes 20-30 minutes of actual work. If I set only 30 minutes of time for math a day, we would never get any math done ever. Once those dreaded blue books come out, his personality immediately changes. It becomes excuse after excuse, saying he is sick or not feeling well, a million fake bathroom trips, claiming he is starving to death or too sleepy to work, a pencil seems to be perpetually breaking and constantly needs to be sharpened, throwing tantrums, tears, crying, daydreaming, flat-out refusal, etc. You name it and he probably does it.

 

It is only like this with Horizons. He has no issue understanding the concepts and problems. He'll do math for fun on apps or paper and enjoys solving problems mentally. Every other subject is completed in a timely manner and without issue and he'll even ask to do more work. So, no, there is no other issue causing the resistance (or at least none that I can see), except that he hates the Horizons books.

 

(My apologies if that sounded snarky - it wasn't my intention.)

Edited February 7, 2018 by Erielle

[Erielle]

I'm not sure why you want to avoid Common Core though. Beast is common core aligned, but I don't see that as any reason to be off putting. They aren't teaching whack-a-doo/touchy-feely/don't worry about the right answer strategies or anything. But it is a challenging program and makes their brains engage differently than something like MM. 

 

 

I'm not exactly opposed to CC. It wasn't the way I was taught so I prefer to not have to teach using a method I'm not familiar with. I have no issue with using a CC curriculum if that is what is best for him. I can hop out of my comfort zone to meet his needs if necessary. :)

 

Checking out that link now... 

 

 

Edited February 7, 2018 by Erielle

[Erielle]

Thanks for the feedback! My husband and I looked at them together and really loved what we saw at Beast Academy. We showed the BA samples to DS and he was excited about the comics and says that it is a math he'd like give a go. Crossing my fingers that this could be a program for us!

 

Still looking into the others mentioned above...

 

For now (and until we decide on a math program/curriculum), I'm dropping Horizons and switching to other worksheets I have from Brain Quest and EM's Basic Math Skills. He is already excited about our school day tomorrow, which makes me hopeful that better days are ahead. :)

[Ellie]

 

He doesn't do an hour of math a day. He will do maybe 30 minutes of actual work. The rest of "math time" is trying to coax him in to working. On days he is being super extra about it, it can take up to two hours of "math time" that includes 20-30 minutes of actual work. If I set only 30 minutes of time for math a day, we would never get any math done ever. Once those dreaded blue books come out, his personality immediately changes. It becomes excuse after excuse, saying he is sick or not feeling well, a million fake bathroom trips, claiming he is starving to death or too sleepy to work, a pencil seems to be perpetually breaking and constantly needs to be sharpened, throwing tantrums, tears, crying, daydreaming, flat-out refusal, etc. You name it and he probably does it.

 

It is only like this with Horizons. He has no issue understanding the concepts and problems. He'll do math for fun on apps or paper and enjoys solving problems mentally. Every other subject is completed in a timely manner and without issue and he'll even ask to do more work. So, no, there is no other issue causing the resistance (or at least none that I can see), except that he hates the Horizons books.

 

(My apologies if that sounded snarky - it wasn't my intention.)

 

 

See, I wouldn't make him continue to work on anything that long. It's possible that if you only did 30 minutes, no matter what, he would get it done. Kids are funny like that. :-)

 

Nevertheless, I'd toss that Horizons. And I would not make the choice of a new math based on whether it's spiral or mastery. I think children can like either one based on how it's presented. My favorite math publisher is Rod and Staff. Math like Singapore makes my eyes cross, lol. But if you think he'd like the way Singapore teaches, then do that.  Maybe you could get a couple of Math Mammoth workbooks to see how he'd do with that for his complete math, or just to be doing something productive while you research.

[fralala]

The other thing that I've found can help rehabilitate a hated curriculum is having the confidence to only assign the problems my kid needs. Maybe you already do this, but ANY curriculum might become torture for a kid who is forced to do every problem regardless of demonstrated competency or mastery. (With the exception of Beast, which sounds like it might be perfect for him.) Singapore might be decent. Math Mammoth, which I love, could be fine as long as you don't assign every problem (otherwise the number of problems on each page could create another situation like the one you've got on your hands).

 

The problem with choosing BA is of course the release schedule for level 2...some people do use the 3 level as the sole curriculum for their third graders, but I found that my third grader needed a basic foundation in third grade math concepts before attempting some of Beast's more challenging chapters.

 

I love your temporary solution, by the way, and it's awesome that your son's attitude is still so math positive despite his loathing of the old curriculum.