Experienced WWE/FLL Users....

[Momof3plus]

 

I’m purchasing curriculum for 2018/2019. My son will be going into second grade. We’ve not done any formal writing programme so far but we have nearly completed FLL1 which has been a great fit for us. I love the style and format of the lessons and he’s retaining everything. Sometimes doing 3 lessons a day.

 

My question is, is WWE a really solid writing programme? I’d be combining it with FLL also. Will it give him the skills he needs and at grade level? I was just a bit concerned as it seems to be aimed at struggling writers, will I need to switch to a more traditional programme? What have your experiences been?

 

Xxx

[El...]

Well, Dd is only in 5th grade, but I'm really happy with her current capabilities, and all we've used is WWE 1-4 and FLL 1-4.  We're using WWS and the new PHP grammar program (the acronym of which I can't remember right now).  She writes very good summaries, and is becoming consistent with her grammar while writing.  She's also doing a shared story-writing project with a friend, and is downright decent at punctuating dialogue!  

 

I found the manual for Writing with Ease very helpful to read in addition to using the workbooks.  There were a few times Dd wasn't catching on to what the workbook was trying to teach, and since I knew where we were heading, I was able to lead her there more effectively than the workbook.  That only happened a few times, though.  I really like the program.

 

 

[Momof3plus]

Thank you eltoisees that’s reassuring to hear.

 

I was wondering whether I should purchase the manual text book as well as the workbooks. It may be worth considering, I’ll see how we get on.

 

With all the narration, dictation and copy work that appear in FLL, WWE and SOTW, would you recommend only focusing on one particularly area to focus on or should we do all the narrations, dictation and copy work for each of the writing, grammar and history books?

 

Thank you x

[ScoutTN]

If you are using both FLL and WWE, skip everything except the straight up grammar in FLL. (We did our own poetry selections.)

 

When my kids were that young, we did not always do narrations for SOTW. Sometimes we just talked about the story or compared it to a picture book we'd read. Sometimes the coloring sufficed. If we did a project of any kind, I skipped the narration. We did one narration a week in history. Remember, this is exposure. Your student will learn these same things again in later years. 

[El...]

We did pretty much all of it.  

 

I just remembered the other thing that helped me - the talk SWB gave about teaching elementary writing!  I highly recommend it, even if it isn't on sale.  :)  (The download costs a few dollars).  It was even better than the textbook I mentioned above, and covered a lot of the same things.  Oh, and the youtube videos of SWB doing dictation with one of her kids were also great!  

 

ETA: It's late here, and my reading comp is going down the drain... we did NOT do the SOTW writing on top of WWE.  Only recently has she been writing about history reading.  That would have been too much.

Edited January 23, 2018 by elroisees

[Momof3plus]

ScoutTN, thanks, that lightens the load somewhat.

 

I find my sons narrations are more of a retelling. He remembers a lot of details and basically resells the story to me. It’s a struggle to get him to be a bit more concise and pick out the relevant points as I don’t want to dampen his enthusiasm. I guess it’s a learned skill that will come with time. From looking at the FLL/WWE samples am I right in thinking that the constant asking of leading questions will help them to eventually ask themselves these similar questions about what are the important parts of the story?

[Momof3plus]

Thank you Elroisees, I’ll have a look at the videos you suggested.

Xx

[SparklyUnicorn]

I used both with both of my kids.  They are now 16 and nearly 13.  Both worked well.  The writing approach is somewhat different than what a lot of public schools are doing though.  So if you have any thought to place your child in school you might consider something else (my recommendation for the something else would be IEW which I've also used and still use).  The grammar is excellent preparation either way. 

[LMD]

I agree with listening to the talks, they are fantastic and I've relistened dozens of times.

https://welltrainedmind.com/p/a-plan-for-teaching-writing-grades-k-12-mp3/

 

Wwe works. Doing formal narration in wwe and sotw is unnecessary, one or the other each day is fine.

Retelling as a narration is also fine at that stage, wwe2/3/4 will teach him how to find the main ideas.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Not to sidetrack the thread, but how/in what order or combo did you use the three WWE-FLL-IEW? I'm still a bit off I think with the youngest two from adding more in, but I'm guessing in the summer/fall middle kid will be ready for more and I'm trying to figure out what that more should be. 

 

Well that's a tad fuzzy.  I started using FLL with my first kid ohhh 12 years ago.  At that point I don't even know if WWE was released.  Then eventually I added that in and I started with WWE 2.  We did all FLL levels.  We did WWE 2,3,4.  Then we used MCT for 2 years.  Then I started using IEW.  We took a year off from IEW and I just made up my own writing instruction/assignments.  Then I used IEW again (you can use IEW and not use IEW...it really DOES work that way).  Now I just assign essays and research papers. 

 

With the second kid it was similar but we only used WWE 1,2, and 3. Then MCT, then IEW, then EIW, and now we are back to IEW.

 

If that made sense to you, please explain it to me.  :laugh:

[MeaganS]

I have found it really good so far. I also vote that you listen to the lectures. I really like them and have listened to them on several occasions. 

 

One thing that I really like about WWE especially is that while the child is doing very little output for the first few years, it is QUALITY output. Every narration is discussed with me before we write it down. I give active feedback and help them refine their ideas and put them into words. Daily. This is very good training in sentence construction and writing in general. We talk about the grammar of almost every sentence they copy or have dictated. Grammar is informally discussed each time and in examples they are currently using. DD9 has some learning issues and was incapable of continuing to WWE3 at this time, but CAP Fable is working very well for her and she was easily able to transition to that 3rd grade program. I don't know if I'll have dd7 do Fable or WWE3 first. Probably both at different points. I have every intention of doing WWS once we're there, but we're still a few years off. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

:lol:

 

I interpret this to be use what works, whenever, and just keep them writing and it will all turn out okay and they'll be great at math too. ;)

 

Absolutely!  That's the way I look at it.  As long as they are doing some sort of writing each year who cares.  LOL

 

We buzzed through more than one book some years.  We also used a few other odds and ends, but don't ask me to recall all of them.

 

I feel bad not to give advice now that I ACTUALLY have experience (unlike when I gave advice when I didn't), but I literally cannot remember all the details.  :laugh:

[hollyhock]

Agreeing with everyone else. It is definitely a solid program, but it does look a lot different than what public school kids are doing. That, to me, is one reason why it's solid and works so well. If you are using it alongside FLL and SOTW then you don't need to do everything in all three, as others have said. Listening to the audio lecture or buying the instructor guide might be helpful for figuring that out. I think it's something like two narrations and two dictations or copywork selections per week, depending where in the program you are.

[Momof3plus]

Perfect, this is what I wanted to hear. I shall order our books! Yey! And with pdf versions I can have it in my hands almost instantly!

[Momof3plus]

Okay, so I'm just downloading the MP3 lectures you all recommended.

 

Would someone mind (if you have time or the interest!  :lol: ), having a look at this link and seeing how it compares to what is taught in FLL - its basically a link to the UK's national curriculum guidelines for Grammar introduction by year.

 

Year 1 is US Kindergarten, Year 2 is US Grade 1, Year 3 is US Grade 2 and so on https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/335190/English_Appendix_2_-_Vocabulary_grammar_and_punctuation.pdf

 

This is the link for the objectives for the writing composition objectives, its a lengthy document but if you scroll down to the year 1,2 & 3 they have the objectives concisely laid out.

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/national-curriculum-in-england-english-programmes-of-study/national-curriculum-in-england-english-programmes-of-study#lower-key-stage-2--years-3-and-4

[Momof3plus]

I’m listening to the lecture and she’s covering everything I’ve been thinking - I’ve been hesitant in choosing a programme as the kids in the UK appear to be covering more in the early years, or at least they’re expected to write a fair bit, but once they get to high school it’s not translating into great compositions.

 

If time was spent going slowly over the mechanics of writing in the early,they would do better later on.

[ScoutTN]

ScoutTN, thanks, that lightens the load somewhat.

 

I find my sons narrations are more of a retelling. He remembers a lot of details and basically resells the story to me. It’s a struggle to get him to be a bit more concise and pick out the relevant points as I don’t want to dampen his enthusiasm. I guess it’s a learned skill that will come with time. From looking at the FLL/WWE samples am I right in thinking that the constant asking of leading questions will help them to eventually ask themselves these similar questions about what are the important parts of the story?

 

 

Yes, leading questions will help the review before they narrate. 

Narrating as a story/retelling (some call it Charlotte Mason style) is natural and fine for younger kids. Only as they get older do they learn, slowly, to summarize, to sift and choose what is most important. That skill takes years to develop.  For now just let them retell.  I almost always had mine illustrate their narrations. 

[Momof3plus]

Great.  Thank you ScottTN.

 

xxx

[MotherGoose]

I've used them both twice with two kids. Be prepared to take some of the WWE lessons slowly. Learning to narrate is difficult. If your child can't manage all the narrations and stuff, just take your child's lead. It definitely works. In some of the early narrations with WWE I had to write down names of characters and things to help walk mine through it. Think of them more as something you will finish eventually instead of getting through wwe as proscribed.

[Momof3plus]

Thank you MotherGoose.

 

Xx