A crazy idea about Shurley English

[Tiramisu]

DH and I have been talking about grammar and what type of approach would be the most helpful for foreign language study. DH is a foreign language teacher, and one of the best students he ever had was a hs'd student who used Shurley.

 

Now I have a Shurley TM on my shelf and I like the grammar and the vocab, but I haven't seriously considered it because it is very teacher led and DD can't deal with instruction from me.

 

However, looking at Shurley again, it's so scripted that I realized DD could use it in the role of the teacher and I could be the student. I think she could actually learn very well that way. But I imagine the novelty would wear off quickly.

[Guest]

I think she'd learn a lot before it did, though.

 

I couldn't handle the teacher prep long term and probably only got a third of the way through Shurley 1 with my then-first grader. It's amazing how much he's retained. It reminds me of how my grandmother turned an old adage on its head and said "anything worth doing well is worth doing at all".

 

She was talking about needlework and creative writing, but I think it might apply to Shurley as well.

 

Maybe we can both use it as a tool and a resource even if we can't follow the scripts or our kids can't do absolutely all the activities in every lesson every single day for a whole year.

Edited August 5, 2016 by Guest

[Kat w]

I used to let my oldest do this. Worked out well. I think she learned more that way.

 

It sure won't hurt to try it.

I did this with alot of curriculums over the course of gr3-12 with her .

I even did it with latina Christiana after we got about half way through 1. She finished 1 and did 2 mostly by herself with the teacher guide and St. Book and CD.

 

Hubby speaks 3 languages , so he helped her when she needed ir we thought she did.

All worked out well for us.

Try it, shell probably like it :)

[umsami]

I actually really like that idea. :)

[knitgrl]

We used Shurley English Level 1 for first grade. I found the expectations for writing to be both insane and the modeled writing boring. I skipped that element entirely. She did learn Nouns, Verbs, Article Adjectives, Prepositions and Object of the Prepositions. It is easy to implement because of the script, and honestly, most of the lessons are the same day after day, week after week. Toward the end of the year, I would write the sentences on the white board and just have her classify them and the lesson was done. I felt that the first third of the book I felt new material was added at a reasonable rate, with enough review to make it stick, but then it just seemed to plateau and it was just the same old, same old, over and over. I've read other reviews of Shurley English where people skip books because there is so much review/repetition. I'm not even sure I will bother with a formal English curriculum in first grade for the next child coming up.

Edited August 6, 2016 by knitgrl

[Guest]

Ime there is a lot that some kids can make their own and run with. Worth a try.

[PeterPan]

Ok, I am a fan of Shurley for the way it handles the Q&A flow.  Agree, the writing is bleh.  The exercises to build sentences were good.  Vocab wasn't necessary for us.  We mainly used the Q&A flows, and yes we used the printed workbooks.  Then we would diagram one of the three sentences on the whiteboard.  

 

Really, you're talking 5-10 minutes.  It's 3 sentences to parse and one to diagram (if you diagram, which I recommend you do).

 

I think that because Shurley relies on Q&A flows and gives the answer immediately following that your dd is not going to use her brain actively reading it to you.  She might, and you know her.  I'm just saying I *think* it would be good to think up some more ways to interact with the material.  You could write the Q&A flow out as a sequence and let her do it herself.  You could teach only the first day the new is introduced and let her do the following days independently.

 

Have you looked at Abeka's grammar?  What grade is this dc?  Abeka is recommended in old WTM.  Shurley is really only good through the gr 6 book, and yes there's so much overkill that you have to skip.  So you can can 3,5,7 or 2.4,6 or...  But if she's old enough for JAG (same child?), then you're looking at a gr 4 or 6 book.  Now I LIKE Shurley, and me I wouldn't hesitate to do the Shurley 6 with a bright 5th gr and move on.  I like the foundational thought process, the way it analyzes language.  It's very much the way we did things for russian in college and it's the way BJU used to teach it.  (dunno if they still do)  

 

So to me the Q&A flow is why Shurley was useful to the kids, but it's not so useful as to compel you to stick with a program that isn't otherwise working.  Abeka is written to the student, easy to use, better than their history, and just sort of straightforward and normal.  I put my dd into it last year, because I really just needed a get 'er done, get 'er through this material kinda thing.  Dd does it, it gets done, it's fine, it's not objectionable.  And I'm SO overpicky, that's saying a lot.  

 

It's a fun time of year, sorting out things, isn't it?   :)

Edited August 6, 2016 by OhElizabeth

[Tiramisu]

Ok, I am a fan of Shurley for the way it handles the Q&A flow. Agree, the writing is bleh. The exercises to build sentences were good. Vocab wasn't necessary for us. We mainly used the Q&A flows, and yes we used the printed workbooks. Then we would diagram one of the three sentences on the whiteboard.

 

Really, you're talking 5-10 minutes. It's 3 sentences to parse and one to diagram (if you diagram, which I recommend you do).

 

I think that because Shurley relies on Q&A flows and gives the answer immediately following that your dd is not going to use her brain actively reading it to you. She might, and you know her. I'm just saying I *think* it would be good to think up some more ways to interact with the material. You could write the Q&A flow out as a sequence and let her do it herself. You could teach only the first day the new is introduced and let her do the following days independently.

 

Have you looked at Abeka's grammar? What grade is this dc? Abeka is recommended in old WTM. Shurley is really only good through the gr 6 book, and yes there's so much overkill that you have to skip. So you can can 3,5,7 or 2.4,6 or... But if she's old enough for JAG (same child?), then you're looking at a gr 4 or 6 book. Now I LIKE Shurley, and me I wouldn't hesitate to do the Shurley 6 with a bright 5th gr and move on. I like the foundational thought process, the way it analyzes language. It's very much the way we did things for russian in college and it's the way BJU used to teach it. (dunno if they still do)

 

So to me the Q&A flow is why Shurley was useful to the kids, but it's not so useful as to compel you to stick with a program that isn't otherwise working. Abeka is written to the student, easy to use, better than their history, and just sort of straightforward and normal. I put my dd into it last year, because I really just needed a get 'er done, get 'er through this material kinda thing. Dd does it, it gets done, it's fine, it's not objectionable. And I'm SO overpicky, that's saying a lot.

 

It's a fun time of year, sorting out things, isn't it? :)

Every time I think I'm done sorting it out. I start to re-think.

 

I like ABeka for grammar. I used it for another kid. This is my fifth grader, BTW.. I just don't know if the number of sentences in each exercise will throw her over the edge. That's why I liked JAG. I'll look again at ABeka, but I may just stick with EG.

[Kat w]

O.m.g.

 

We did Abeka with all 3 big kids.

Diagram diagram diagram. It got them so ready for college writing. They all aced the enc's they've taken and been a VERY easy class for them.

All 3 bigs did alot of it on their own with my monitoring. Having said that....I HATE Abeka lol. Only cuz I'm sick of it tho. 4 kkds later (had adopted a foster teen) I am so Bob Jones Ed and Abekaed out.

 

I will say tho, all 3 big kids thanked me for teaching them grammar and to write. It was annoying to them to have to go back for students who didn't know basics.

 

Abeka:awesome program. Won't hurt my feelings if I never see it again lol.

 

Sigh. OhE is right tho, Abeka is awesome . bju too but Abeka is more comprehensive .

 

PS. Who uses a gerund in real life??? Tee hee. K. Rant over.

..I thinkhaha :)

Edited August 6, 2016 by Kat w

[kbutton]

I like idea.

 

I got a good foundation of some kind with A Beka grammar many years ago, but it was very parts to whole, and I needed a more big picture view to ultimately feel confident about grammar. Before getting that view, my only confidence was pretty good grades in it and seeming to know more than other people, lol! Truly.

 

I have no idea if Shurley gives you a big picture or if she needs one, but I think that teaching something to someone else is almost always a more meaningful experience if you're set up with the proper tools to do it. It sounds like she could use Shurley to do that well.

[PeterPan]

The Shurley tm is a pain in the butt.  Have you actually looked at it to make sure she can negotiate it?  Drove me CRAZY.  That's why I had such a hack, simplified way of using it, because the organization of the tm was so uncomfortable.  Me, I like some routine (lesson always starts here, boxes to mark things, etc.).  Shurley had symbols, yes?  I had to go through it with a highlighter.  For a person like me, it was a nightmare trying to find the parts I wanted and skip the parts I didn't.  That's why I'm saying I'm not sure it's so conducive to handing her.  But look at the samples and see.

[Tiramisu]

The Shurley tm is a pain in the butt. Have you actually looked at it to make sure she can negotiate it? Drove me CRAZY. That's why I had such a hack, simplified way of using it, because the organization of the tm was so uncomfortable. Me, I like some routine (lesson always starts here, boxes to mark things, etc.). Shurley had symbols, yes? I had to go through it with a highlighter. For a person like me, it was a nightmare trying to find the parts I wanted and skip the parts I didn't. That's why I'm saying I'm not sure it's so conducive to handing her. But look at the samples and see.

I have the TM I bought from you years ago! Haha! And you're right, it's not pretty or easy to navigate. It's one of those things that convince me I must have undiagnosed visual issues.

 

But I like the Q&A. Maybe not enough to re-invent the wheel, though.

 

It seems much easier to toss a friendly pink workbook at her. It might not be perfect but if she does Latin like her sister did that's will plug a lot of grammar holes.

Edited August 7, 2016 by Tiramisu

[Tiramisu]

I should be asleep instead of thinking about grammar, but I'm charged up by eating too many chocolate chip cookies. I wish DD would stop baking. I keep having to do monster workouts to burn those calories. And then I use the rest of the energy to obsess about grammar which I know will really make little difference in the grand scheme of things.

[Kat w]

Bahaha^^^^

 

Laughing! Bought it from her. That made me chuckle this time of night.

You two are funny! :)

 

Mmmmm...baked goods.

Want lol :)

Edited August 7, 2016 by Kat w

[PeterPan]

Oh that is TOO funny!  Was it the gr 2 or gr4?  I had 2,4,6.  I can't remember what I still have and what I sold.  I've pondered using it with ds.  :)

[Tiramisu]

Oh that is TOO funny! Was it the gr 2 or gr4? I had 2,4,6. I can't remember what I still have and what I sold. I've pondered using it with ds. :)

6th. A long time ago before we were besties. 😉

 

It came with a lovely note and I can still picture your handwriting.

 

I wish I had kept your address for when the running away urge comes.

[PeterPan]

LOL, you wouldn't have to RUN AWAY to come visit me.  You could just come.  :)  We could eat cheesecake and take a ride and watch a chick flick and talk till 2am.  :)

 

And if you never come, well you could do those things without me and have a virtual chick flick nite in my honor.  :)

[Kat w]

Awwww....

That...is just too too sweet y'all.

Gave me warm fuzzies :)

[Monica_in_Switzerland]

This thread has given me a great idea to have my kids study their grammar lessons (French) and then "teach" to me.  A step towards independent learning...  Thanks for starting it!  Enjoy the cookies everyone!  

[Kat w]

You guys could do what me and my oldest daughter used to do. She was in Kentucky when her dh was stationed there.

We would text and ' watch TV shows together', then we started skyping and doing it together. Thats back when we had unlimited data though . She would eat chocolate chip cookies and taunt me, she could eat all she wanted cuz she was pregnant, lil bugar.

 

It was fun! :)