medieval or U.S. History for 9th, need some words of wisdom

[pjssully]

I have upcoming boys who will be doing 9th grade in the fall and I am having a difficult time with history.  Last year, we did TOG Ancients, Year 1 and they worked well at the dialectic level.  They generally liked the structure and independence this program gave them.  So, if we stayed with TOG, we would be looking at Year 2.  My only "problem" with TOG is the literature analysis at the Rhetoric level-it is very rigorous and more than they need in 9th grade. The dialectic books are too young for high school, I think.

 

Public schools do American History for 9th grade, so I am wondering if maybe that is a better option. But which program?  Do I do it in one year or two?  And what about the kiddos missing out on the 4 year cycle.....will we ever get back to the medieval times???  And when we do, will they remember the sequence of events with the fall of Rome and all that happened that ushered in the middle ages.

 

 I would really love some input- anything!!  I am just going round and round with this one so anything you say will be helpful, I am sure!

 

Thanks in advance for your comments!

 

pj

[Brad S]

I would go with medieval.  I think you're right to be concerned about forgetting things and would be concerned about losing momentum. 

 

Having just watched my DS finishing up 9th grade, the changes and increase in maturity is breathtaking.  What about starting out light on the literary analysis part and then increasing gradually over the year or trying a different program/text.  IMO you could cover some of the same conceptual issues later in Renaissance-early modern as in medieval (in part for that reason, we are actually planning to compress years 2-3 in the "WTM schedule" into one year, in 10th grade; that will allow us to cover world history by 11th grade in case 12th becomes mostly dual enrollment or DS otherwise goes off doing other things or we have a year for US history).

 

Best wishes on your journey!

[Lori D.]

Brad S. has good thoughts about continuing with Medieval History; I'll just play "devil's advocate" and give reasons why going with American History can also be a good idea… ;)

 

JMO, but at the high school age, esp. if you've already done one chronological history cycle, students are bright enough to get the general flow of history and "get" where they are in time, whether or not you do history chronologically or not in high school. There is the benefit of older students really grasping the connections of people/places/events by going chronologically, but older students are also smart enough to make connections when history is out of order, as well.

 

One possible reason (other than the ones you already mentioned in your original post) for doing American history now is that the Great Books/Literature that go with it are frequently easier to read and discuss (albeit, frequently darker or more depressing in worldview), than Ancient classics or Medieval classics. Also, so much of 20th century US History is entwined with World History, that it really wouldn't be much of a stretch to add in a bit of additional World History while doing American History if you know you're going to drop one year of a 4-year world history cycle in high school. So while you wouldn't be getting the full in-depth modern history year, you'd be getting a good amount of it.

 

Another thought for postponing Medieval History/Lit is that because much of the literature is either in translation or covering difficult ideas, British and World lit are usually saved for 11th and 12th grades; by saving the Medieval History for a later year, you put it closer to doing British and World lit. when it is more traditionally done and your students have had more time to mature to really be able to wrestle with the more difficult literature. 

 

If you do postpone your Medieval History/Lit by a year, I don't see that it would that difficult to spend a week with a quick skim-review to get up to speed again with context -- downfall of Rome and other factors -- of what led into the Middle Ages. You could even do that the week before you actually/officially start the school year. ;)

 

Just from my own experience: I just finished teaching a gr. 9-12 Lit. & Comp. co-op class this past school year that included some Medieval works (Beowulf, selected Canterbury Tales, Sir Gawain and the Green Knight) and one Shakespeare play (Macbeth), and while these were smart students, the 9th and 10th graders struggled to just understand what was happening, much less being able to take it another step and analysis/discuss. They had not read anything in translation or in verse format like that before, and really needed the section or chapter summaries that I handed out all along the way to help them over the hurdle of basic understanding. It was really the 11th and 12th graders who carried the class discussion.

 

One last thought: you may want to make sure you have 1 credit of American History on the transcript somehow (whether it was integrated in with your chronological studies, or was done as a separate study), as a LOT of colleges require 1 credit of American History in their list of required credits for admission of incoming freshman.

 

Because I knew we would need that, and that most colleges do not require 4 years of Social Sciences (History, Geography, Economics, Government, etc.), and that DSs might develop very different interests partway through high school that would require cutting out non-required credits to make room for the developing interests, I let them decide what History THEY were most interested in covering. We managed:

- 1 credit Ancient World History

- 1 credit 20th Century World History

- 0.5 credit each: Church History, Economics, Government

- 0.25 credit Medieval History

 

I do regret we weren't able to get a complete year of Medieval History in there, BUT, I really do NOT regret DSs getting to do all the things they did in place of that credit. There is so much history, and no one learns it all in high school, that I just figure that gives them the rest of their lives to continue reading and exploring… ;)

 

BEST of luck, whatever your decide! Warmest regards, Lori D.

Edited June 30, 2016 by Lori D.

[Amateur Actress]

I would do Medieval for 9th grade. At least here, World History is a 9th grade course and the upper grades are for American History & Government/Econ. We are a TOG family and I know they say that Dialectic is perfectly acceptable for 9th grade. At any rate, I would make sure we did not skip Medieval in high school. In my experience, that is the history that gets lost once kids are in high school, since there are less history credits required.

[happypamama]

DD will be doing medieval for ninth grade next year, largely because her younger brothers are at the medieval point in their cycles, and this is my one chance to have everyone together for a trip through the Middle Ages. But aside from that, I want to wait on US history until a little later in high school anyway because that's a good one to do either AP or dual enrollment, neither of which we are ready for quite yet for multiple reasons. If the lit selections are too difficult, we will adjust them as needed.

[regentrude]

I prefer a chronological progression and do not like isolated US history without an accompanying world history to put it in context, so with DD I covered "US history  in World Context" over 2 years. OTOH, I like to cover US history concurrently with US government because the latter is so entwined with the former, and I see no better time for a government course than the year of a presidential election. So, if you do not feel drawn to Medieval, I'd simply do a US history/Government within a world context study.

[MerryAtHope]

That's exactly what my ds did, subject-wise:

 

ancients in 8th

US in 9th

Medieval (actually up through the 1600's) in 10th

 

I agree with Lori--a quick review and you should be good to go.