If you had a K student who was already writing and reading well...

[The Governess]

What would you do for language arts?

 

We officially started pre-K last week. DD has been reading now for almost a year and is at about 2nd grade level. She is going through ETC book 3, and after a month we are halfways done with it. We'll do 3 1/2 next, I think.

 

We are doing the HWOT preschool book right now and she is 2/3 of the way through already. We will move onto the K book probably in a month or so. She is dying to do her writing herself but I've been holding her back until she has learned how to do her letters the right way. I'm going to try and take the K book nice and slow, make it last through the rest of our year.

 

At the pace we are going I'm guessing that we will finish through ETC 4 or 5 this year and I was planning on just continuing with that in her K year. If she has mastered the HWOT K book then we will probably move onto the next level and add a little copy work.

 

Do you think that I should stop with that? I'm looking into FLL and WWE and was planning on starting with these in grade 1 but I'm wondering if we should start earlier based on where her skill set is. This is a girl who has an amazing attention span and a very strong drive to master new skills, especially when it comes to anything to do with letters and numbers. Is it possible that if I wait until first grade to start FLL and WWE or similar programs that she will be bored with them by then? Has anyone had success using these programs with a kindergartener? I'm kind of at a loss about what to do with this girl.

 

Thanks!!!!

[abbeyej]

I think it's *fine* to move ahead, as long as you'll be equally flexible about stopping or taking extra time along the way, if you ever find she needs it.

 

I would *not* hold her back with writing. If she wants to do it, by all means move forward and teach her lower case letters. I understand that for kids who struggle to write, HWOT's method of capitals first can help reduce reversals. For kids who really *want* to write, I think it holds them back to be using a different lettering system than what they read. I would move forward fast so she can have the satisfaction of writing as she wants, or switch to another program that's better suited for kids who *aren't* struggling to learn to write.

 

The other thing I'd say is be sure you spend some time each day working directly with her on handwriting. Be a hawk, and gently correct her grip, make sure she starts at the top, etc, etc -- but *then* if she wants to write on her *own* at another time of the day, just be a cheerleader. Insure that she has carefully guided practice every day to help stave off bad habits, but the rest of the time, let her write what she wants and just praise the effort. (If she asks you "how do you spell ___?" or "how do I make a __?", etc, answer -- but the rest of the time, don't worry about the "creative" spelling, punctuation, random capitals or backwards letters, etc.)

 

As for FLL and WWE... FLL is light and rather fun and perfectly appropriate for an "accelerated" Ker. I would go ahead and get started, if you want. I would *wait* on WWE until your dd's handwriting is more fluent (and she's comfortable in both capitals and lower cases).

[katalaska]

I noticed in your signature line that your dd is accelerated Pre-K. Have you visited the Accelerated Learner Board here? Very helpful and experienced people over there :001_smile:...

 

My oldest started learning to read at age 4 and read the first Harry Potter book during kindergarten (at 5 1/2).

 

We use(d) a different handwriting program (Zaner-Bloser) and I completely skipped the kindergarten book with her. Instead, I did both editions of the first grade level during kindergarten.

 

She finished kindergarten math during that year so we moved right into first grade.

 

We only did three subjects during kindergarten: reading (finishing up instruction followed by reading through the various reading lists our library publishes, the entire Henry and Mudge series, the entire Mr. Putter and Tabby series, etc. I was mostly interested in improving fluency), handwriting (dd has poor motor skills generally so I felt that extra practice via two different editions of the same level of handwriting instruction from the same publisher would be a good idea), and math (at her speed).

 

At the time, I had a very active/difficult preschooler (she's near the autism spectrum but not actually "on" it, we found out later) and a new baby (and then a new puppy on top of it all). So, I didn't try to do more than the three subjects.

 

If I had been in a different situation and FLL had been available, I probably would have introduced it during kindergarten for her. We ended up using English for the Thoughtful Child and it would not have been appropriate for her during K.

 

I might also have started Spelling Workout (the spelling program I chose for our homeschool)--first grade level--during kindergarten if I hadn't been stretched so much already. I would have waited until her handwriting was well-established, though, because we did need some time to correct some of her letter-forming skills (she started writing on her own when she learned to read and loved writing us notes and authoring short stories...but this meant she developed her own method to forming letters that needed to be changed).

 

HTH

 

ETA: And I agree with Abbey. :) Teach her the right way to write during instructional times and then be encouraging when she wants to write on her own time.

[Sahamamama]

No advice, lovelearnandlive, but I'll be subscribing to this thread. My three girls are right behind yours, age-wise. My 3.5 year old Eager Beaver has started OPG/Bob Books, and wants to "do school." We also have 21 month old twins. I've been wondering what more I could do with my oldest, especially as she approaches the 4 yo mark. She seems to soak up everything, if I can only keep up with her. So I'm :bigear:.

[Marie in Oh]

she has just turned 7 and is tecnically a young 2nd grader, but she is way ahead. WE did Saxon K phonics when she was 4 (and she read at the 2nd grade level midway through the year) and Saxon 1 Phonics for K. I also did FLL with her in K and she did great. She is a grade or 2 ahead in everything and has not shown any signs of slowing down. I would if she did. She is verbal and precocious and catches onto things very quickly. I would follow your dd's lead. I think FLL is very appropriate for a bright K'er.

[gandpsmommy]

I think it's *fine* to move ahead, as long as you'll be equally flexible about stopping or taking extra time along the way, if you ever find she needs it.

 

I would *not* hold her back with writing. If she wants to do it, by all means move forward and teach her lower case letters. I understand that for kids who struggle to write, HWOT's method of capitals first can help reduce reversals. For kids who really *want* to write, I think it holds them back to be using a different lettering system than what they read. I would move forward fast so she can have the satisfaction of writing as she wants, or switch to another program that's better suited for kids who *aren't* struggling to learn to write.

 

The other thing I'd say is be sure you spend some time each day working directly with her on handwriting. Be a hawk, and gently correct her grip, make sure she starts at the top, etc, etc -- but *then* if she wants to write on her *own* at another time of the day, just be a cheerleader. Insure that she has carefully guided practice every day to help stave off bad habits, but the rest of the time, let her write what she wants and just praise the effort. (If she asks you "how do you spell ___?" or "how do I make a __?", etc, answer -- but the rest of the time, don't worry about the "creative" spelling, punctuation, random capitals or backwards letters, etc.)

 

As for FLL and WWE... FLL is light and rather fun and perfectly appropriate for an "accelerated" Ker. I would go ahead and get started, if you want. I would *wait* on WWE until your dd's handwriting is more fluent (and she's comfortable in both capitals and lower cases).

 

:iagree: My dd sounds similar to yours. She wanted to learn how to write when she was three, and she pretty much taught herself. She would ask me how to write a letter and I would show her (not on specially-lined paper, or with a handwriting program, just on ordinary old post-it notes or printer paper). It never occured to me that I should be looking for a handwriting program for her or trying to teach her to form the letters correctly, hold her pencil with the right grip, etc. It was just play to her, and I was just responding to her questions by writing down the letter she had asked about. And this is pretty much the way she learned to write. I did feel a little bit frustrated when we got to K5 and I was trying to get her to form letters a certain way, but overall it worked pretty well. I would recommend teaching your dd lowercase letters. That is what I did with dd, and it was very easy for her to learn the capital letters when she was 4 or 5. I started using HWT pre-K with ds last year, and I think it's going to be more difficult to transition him from all capitals to lowercase.

 

We used Getty-Dubay Italic handwriting for K5, and it worked well for us. But dd really wanted to learn traditional cursive, so we started doing cursive in first grade.

 

 

I heartily agree with Abbey's advice to go with your dd's excitement while it is there, as long as you are also willing to potentially take a break or slow down sometime in the future if she needs to. We did FLL in K5 and first grade. I think it would be easy to implement in Pre-K and K with a willing and eager student, such as yours. I know my dd could have done it, if I had known about it when she was 4. I also agree with Abbey that I would wait on WWE.

 

Good luck and have fun!

[Sebastian (a lady)]

she has just turned 7 and is tecnically a young 2nd grader, but she is way ahead. WE did Saxon K phonics when she was 4 (and she read at the 2nd grade level midway through the year) and Saxon 1 Phonics for K. I also did FLL with her in K and she did great. She is a grade or 2 ahead in everything and has not shown any signs of slowing down. I would if she did. She is verbal and precocious and catches onto things very quickly. I would follow your dd's lead. I think FLL is very appropriate for a bright K'er.

 

I used FLL in tandem with my then 1st grader and kindergartener. It worked great. In fact, I would use it now, while the student's reading ability is still growing rather than waiting. Once my kids were reading really proficiently, I switched to grammar workbooks that were directed directly toward the student rather than read aloud. (Lightened the workload on me)

 

The other thing we used was Wordly Wise 3000. The early books were light and easy but taught words that were easily confused.

[Mom to Aly]

My daughter could read before she was 2, and I never did a reading program, just let her read. She is 9, and has above a college reading level.

 

Handwriting is a totally different thing. She was so good at reading, I figured handwriting was nothing. She was always ahead in everything, so I assumed she was so good at reading, handwriting would be the same. She learned how to write, and at three could write things, but her handwriting wasn't great, she reversed letters, numbers, but everyone told me that was normal. At five, I got HWOT. She still did it, and hated writing anything, mostly because she was slow at it, and fast with everything else. I never pushed it, and she has horrible handwriting now. I finally, on the board's recommendation, switched to cursive, which she loves and is doing much better with, mostly because it is faster, I think.

 

So, my advice--don't stop her practice with printing!! Keep that going until you do cursive. Also, as far as reading, my dd has amazing spelling and vocab skills because of her high reading level, with me never having done anything with them. Her grammar is also perfect, but I am having to go through now just to teach her the terms, because she didn't learn those. I think early readers, especially if they did it phonetically, don't need a lot else. At least, that has been my experience.

[The Governess]

Thank you so much everyone!! It sounds like the consensus is that I can start FLL with her next year (or even sooner), but wait on WWE. I think I'll buy both now and look through them just so I'm prepared when she gets to the point where she is ready.

 

I would *not* hold her back with writing. If she wants to do it, by all means move forward and teach her lower case letters. I understand that for kids who struggle to write, HWOT's method of capitals first can help reduce reversals. For kids who really *want* to write, I think it holds them back to be using a different lettering system than what they read. I would move forward fast so she can have the satisfaction of writing as she wants, or switch to another program that's better suited for kids who *aren't* struggling to learn to write.

 

The other thing I'd say is be sure you spend some time each day working directly with her on handwriting. Be a hawk, and gently correct her grip, make sure she starts at the top, etc, etc -- but *then* if she wants to write on her *own* at another time of the day, just be a cheerleader. Insure that she has carefully guided practice every day to help stave off bad habits, but the rest of the time, let her write what she wants and just praise the effort. (If she asks you "how do you spell ___?" or "how do I make a __?", etc, answer -- but the rest of the time, don't worry about the "creative" spelling, punctuation, random capitals or backwards letters, etc.)

 

 

Thanks so much for this advice (and everyone else that gave me handwriting advice). She really does want to write, I guess I felt like she was zooming ahead with so many things that I needed to slow down on something. :confused: Maybe I'll keep going through HWOT since we already have it but I'll just do it faster than I was planning to. What do you think about speeding through the program so she is exposed to the correct way to write all of the letters and then going back through it more slowly to refine her writing?

 

I'm already keeping a close eye on her writing. She's learned half the capitals so far and I have been very insistent on her drawing the lines and curves in the same order and direction as shown in the book. She's not great at it but she has improved so much over the last month just based on the HWOT preschool book. And thanks for the tip on giving her time to write on her own, without correction.

 

I noticed in your signature line that your dd is accelerated Pre-K. Have you visited the Accelerated Learner Board here? Very helpful and experienced people over there :001_smile:...

 

 

 

I totally forgot about that board!! :001_huh: I usually read posts by clicking on "new posts" and rarely visit individual boards. Thanks for reminding me!

[Melissa B]

Thank you so much everyone!! It sounds like the consensus is that I can start FLL with her next year (or even sooner), but wait on WWE. I think I'll buy both now and look through them just so I'm prepared when she gets to the point where she is ready.

 

Well, I am doing just the opposite.:) I am going to save FLL for first grade. I think parts of speech/types of sentences, etc. will be too abstract and better suited to at least age six. In fact, I start FLL half way through first grade.

But I did decide to start my dd4 in WWE. SWB says you can start when the child can read four letter words well and write comfortably. DD4 is really enjoying the copywork and narration. She loves to write and worked through a handwriting book in only a few weeks, so I also bought the first Draw Write Now book to continue working on her handwriting and add in some coloring/drawing practice.

[Sahamamama]

These are great ideas! My husband has to get up at 3:30 am, so it's bedtime here, but tomorrow I'm going to get out my notepad and write it all down. Thanks!

[HomesteadMommy]

I used FLL with my oldest last year for K and she loved it! We would have finished the first part of the book had I not have put the breaks on "extras". Morning sickness knocked me right out for months. Anyway it's one of her favorite school books. :001_smile:

[Jean in Newcastle]

I do a couple of extra things as part of our language arts. We read a poem (the same poem every week for a month - the kids don't memorize it word for word but get very familiar with it). We also participate it the "Reading Rainbow" writing contest. It goes from K to 3rd grade. In Jan. they post their requirements on the PBS website. We also try to do one play each year that ties into our history. For kindergarten (because we didn't start the 4 year history cycle until 1st grade) we did a puppet show of the "3 Little Pigs". In 1st grade (when we started Ancients) we acted out "The Tortoise and the Hare".

[chanda7]

FLL worked fine for "1st grade" with my 5yo. We mostly did it orally and skipped the written activities when they were too difficult (my DD's fine motor skills were age appropriate).

[Allearia]

I would go ahead and move forward. I generally try to keep the skill level relatively challenging but keep the work load age appropriate. So if you start WWE 1st grade and she loves it, great, keep going. If she doesn't want to do it back off and just keep up the word practice. At that age or a little older my son loved making his own book and writing paragraph after paragraph. Then when he was done with that project he didn't want to do a lot of writing. I just kept going with a bit of copywork a day but he wrote so much more in the few months he did his own project before we officially started "homeschooling". I wish I could get him interested in a new project but so far it hasn't happened. He is liking dictation now better than copywork and we are increasing the amount of writing per day with no complaints so we are just going ahead until we hit resistance.

 

I would start with FLL now. It is so gentle and easy, by first grade your dd would probably be bored. I waited to start and we got through half of the first grade level, and now have jumped to FLL 3 which he loves. He loves poetry memorization which would be a fabulous way to round out your language arts plan. We use Andrew Pudewa's Linguistic Development through Poetry Memorization and the amount of beautiful poetry he can recite is just amazing and impressive. I would say that it is the best language thing we did.

 

Don't bother stretching things out to hold back your daughter. Take advantage of her interest right now; if later she is not so interested you can back down then.