Literature Study--How often do you schedule it in Fifth Grade?

[Alana in Canada]

I've decided I need to have my rising fifth grader get familiar with Literature and studying it as such--

 

There are all sorts of terrific study guides out there. I just purchased one from Progeny Press for The Door in the Wall.

 

How often should we do these?

 

I'm thinking one every six to nine weeks or so--or would that be too much? Too little?

 

Thoughts?

[LanaTron]

Right now my older two students are using the guide for Redwall. Over the spring we did the one for Farmer Boy. We are really enjoying these!

 

I'm not sure if you're asking how often to schedule it each week, or how many you will do in a year's time. Ill give my thoughts on both.

 

If you stick with the PP guides, I would plan on doing anywhere from 1-4 in a year's time. I am planning on completing 2 this year, but we are going to alternate these with science, completing one PP guide followed by one science unit. How many you do depend on how much literature work you think is important at that age, how much time you want to devote each week, and how many of the activities you want to do. I personally don't think that type of lit analysis is necessary in elementary. I only started this to give my middle schoolers a taste of it before high school.

 

I would expect any one guide to take as many weeks as there are sections/lessons. For example, the Redwall guide has 8 sections, some before-you-read activities, plus an overview and final project at the end. I expect it will take us 8 weeks for the main sections, then another 3-4 weeks for the other stuff before and after going through the book. I suppose you could move things along quicker, but that will depend on your scheduling and your student/s.

 

HTH

[angela in ohio]

My fifth grader is doing four this year, which works out to one every nine or ten weeks. I like to have time "off" between them; she spends that time reading from a book list but not completing a guide.

[JFSinIL]

For Lit. I assigned good books, kid had to read daily and we'd discuss DAILY what she or he had read. I referred to free on-line guides and did my own pre-reading. Each kid got through about a book each month that way.

[Greta Lea]

I would do it *all* orally with her, unless you come to an interesting writing assignment that she might enjoy. When I used these in the classroom setting, I assigned a lot of it as written homework. That year, I found that all that written work centered around the books killed the love of those books...books that were usually considered favorite reading.

 

I'm using Sonlight with my 5th grade son this year. I consider his SL "readers" and also the Read Alouds his literature. We go over vocabulary together and I use the questions in the Instructors Guide *everyday*, but I do it ALL orally.

[Alana in Canada]

Thanks for the caution to do it orally. I was thinking about that after I posted this. I think that's a great way to do it--and not "kill" his efforts.

 

I also like the idea of alternating this with science.

 

I do want him to get more pactice writing, but like the process of narration, getting comfortable with *thinking it through* comes first.

 

As to frequency, one every nine weeks may be all the budget can stand, too!

[Jenny in Florida]

For Lit. I assigned good books, kid had to read daily and we'd discuss DAILY what she or he had read. I referred to free on-line guides and did my own pre-reading. Each kid got through about a book each month that way.

 

My approach with my daughter was a bit different, in that she enjoyed reading aloud together right up to the moment she left for college. (Well, okay, she still likes it and insists we keep up the tradition of reading aloud at breakfast when she's home for Christmas.) So, we read aloud several books each year and discussed them as we went.

 

I printed out copies of free literature guides and dipped into them for ideas, both for discussion questions and occasional writing projects for her. (My favorite freebies are the Glencoe guides: http://www.glencoe.com/sec/literature/litlibrary/ )

 

It seemed to work well enough, since she's been doing very, very well in her lit-heavy college classes.

 

My son does not especially enjoy being read to. So, he reads independently. I pre-read at least most of the books I assign (and some of the ones he chooses for fun), and we discuss. Every now and then, I'll get a bee in my bonnet and make him do a book report. More often, though, he gets really excited about something he's reading and wants to do a project of his own invention. Last year, it was the samurai Halloween costume after reading The Demon in the Teahouse and the sequels. At the moment, he's learning how to sew in order to make himself a cloak like the character wears in one of the series he's reading for fun. And his Halloween costume--which he's been planning for three months--is book-based, too.

 

Again, I keep some of the Glencoe guides around for ideas. But mostly, we just talk.

[Alana in Canada]

Interesting resource, Jenny, thanks. I've bookmarked it.

 

I knew I should have asked about freebies before I spent the $$!

[Hoggirl]

We used a PP guide for In the Year of the Boar and Jackie Robinson. I totally agree with the other posters about doing a lot of the PP guides orally. We actually read the book as a read aloud, but this certainly isn't necessary.

 

I would also suggest going through a workbook entitled Figuratively Speaking. I bought this at Rainbow. It covers a lot of literary terms/devices in a succinct way. The term or device is isolated in that each lesson covers only one and examples are given from classic literature. I felt it was a great way to get used to the terminology and recognizing terms without having to dig them out of a novel.

[LanaTron]

Yes, we do much of it orally, too, but my middle schoolers need to write more so I have them do some of it written. And when we are not working on a PP guide, my dc read lit corresponding to SOTW 4 and we discuss, as other posters mentioned.

[magistramom]

I've never used pre-made study guides for the Grammar stage - not really for the early Logic stage either. For me, it would sap all the fun out of the reading to have to answer to a set of Q&A's that lead to specific answers.

 

We're more organic - when necessary, we use TABLETOPICS BOOKCLUB for prompts. From there we usually end up having a great Socratic discussion.

 

Here is a link:

http://tabletopics.com/bookclub.html

 

For your Logic/Rhetoric child, Cliff Notes are great - get the LARGE versions though - they will have vocab and many, extra side notes not found in the slim versions.

[Alana in Canada]

Oh my.

 

It was just delivered to my inbox. We'll be dicussing most of it, absolutely! In fact, I hope it isn't beyond him (or me!).

 

Do we really need to learn literary terms?

 

I just wanted the guide as a way to get to the meat of a book: to make him aware that it's there and to engage him with it.

 

He's fairly "philosophical" by nature--just not all that terribly mature yet.

[Rebecca in VA]

I like to read literature and discuss literature with my reading-averse 6th grader. She simply won't take the time to dig into the meat of the story otherwise. We discuss vocabulary, summarize each chapter (sometimes each paragraph in a really challenging book), and make predictions about what might happen. She claims that literature bores her, but she always remembers and talks about the plot and characters of a book long after we're finished with it.

 

I'd never seen a literature guide that really thrilled me until I saw the Institute for Excellence in Writing Literature Guides. There's a free sample of The Bronze Bow guide up on the website, and it looks outstanding. I *just* read The Bronze Bow with my daughter last week, not knowing that this guide existed!! (Adam Andrews sent out an e-mail about the guides this past Monday morning.) The guides follow the Teaching the Classics format, but they're already written up for the teacher. They've only written a few guides so far, but I'm eager to use the elementary- and middle-level ones with her. They're half-price now, too. (The website is http://www.centerforlit.com/teacherguides.htm )

[Peela]

I like the WTM approach to this. I can't remember it specifically, but I remember it involves Socratic discussing, and it's all we did.

I couldn't fit it all in, certainly not literature guides or programs, so we did it all orally at that at that age.

There is plenty of time later for more in depth study. I don't like to ruin a good book with too much analysis.

[Alana in Canada]

That was my feeling for a long while, too, Peela. But he's kind of stalled at the "grammar" stage of thinking.

 

Maybe all we will ever do is the one Lit guide--and then our "socratic discussions" will be able to take place--I don't know. But I feel I need something to spark him to think a little more deeply. (And he's capable of it, I just have to figure out how to find the switch!)

[Colleen in NS]

That was my feeling for a long while, too, Peela. But he's kind of stalled at the "grammar" stage of thinking.

 

Maybe all we will ever do is the one Lit guide--and then our "socratic discussions" will be able to take place--I don't know. But I feel I need something to spark him to think a little more deeply. (And he's capable of it, I just have to figure out how to find the switch!)

 

Have you tried using the logic stage lit. discussion questions in WTM? We just started this in July, and it was different than just doing narrations, but I found that ds transitioned into it pretty easily. He doesn't give deep, deep answers, but he does answer the questions when we talk, and I can tell that he is learning to think through his answers, which is my goal - not endless dissection of the entire book.

 

As to schedule - I work through the WTM lit. list, checking books out of the library. I hand them to him, let him read what he wants (usually he reads everything), and each week I ask him which lit. book or story (if in a collection of stories/myths) he wants to discuss. We talk, then he writes up a narration about the book with my help. After the narration paragraph is another paragraph stating his specific opinion about why he did or didn't like the book. OK, reality is, sometimes he complains about having to write, so I end up going to the bookshelf and picking two books that he read, and make him choose one. :) But the idea is that it's about one book a week - discuss, then narrate and give opinion. And sometimes the opinions are pretty hilarious - sometimes he gives opinions that are completely opposite to mine, just because he wants to be opposite. Which is fine, as long as he can articulate his opinion beyond "I liked it" or "I didn't like it." It's the thinking-it-through practice that I'm after. It's funny to call his bluff, cuz he is always trying to outsmart me. And he sometimes succeeds. (in ref. to another of your threads, do ya think he's ready for logic stage???) :)

 

And in yet another ref. to another of your threads, I think you ARE figuring out what to do in homeschool - you are on here a ton lately, asking all sorts of great questions!!!! Remember a few weeks ago, when you were lamenting the lack of schedule and momentum and all that? Look at you now, girl! You're doing great!

[Alana in Canada]

Aw shucks.

 

You know, I will have him go through the WTM questions with me tomorrow and then follow that up with his doing a narration --or whatever you'd want to call it! That's our procedure with SoTW--do the review questions together and then send him off to do a narration.

 

He just finished 21 Balloons and I read it too, so that will be fun.

 

I get discouraged and frustrated 100x a day! I almost threw in the towel today, but the fear of getting behind (again) is keeping us moving forward!

[Peela]

That was my feeling for a long while, too, Peela. But he's kind of stalled at the "grammar" stage of thinking.

 

Just my 2 cents here but I don't think any 5th grader is going to be "stalled at the grammar stage of thinking". Many kids don't start thinking logically, as in "logic stage thinking" until they are 13, 14, 15 years old, and some of the other approaches (from WTM) take this into account. My own kids, one of whom is quite academically bright, have not started thinking in the logic stage way until recently, and they are 12 and 14. It is a gradual think, not something that always starts 5th grade. Although those 3 four year stages are nicely convenient for planning- our kids have their own agendas. Not that you cant start moving in that direction of course, but dont expect logic stage thinking just yet.

Just my thoughts on your comment. Dont expect too much too soon...slowly slowly.

[Alana in Canada]

Thanks Peela.

 

It won't surprise you to know that patience is one of those virtues I'm always working on. I wish I had it already!