Help me plan writing for my dd

[EmmaNZ]

DD is 8. She has done WWE1 and 2, and is now about halfway through 3. To say she hates it would be an understatement. She struggles a lot with both the narration and dictation, although she can eventually manage to do it most days.

 

I love the philosophy behind WWE, but wonder if there is a more painless way to do this? I worry that she is not benefitting from the lessons because she is spending the whole lesson thinking she can't do it. I have been looking at Writing Tales and W&R Fable. I wondered if one of those might help here?

 

I have IEW also, but wanted to wait a bit more until she has some of the other skills a bit more solid. I could just jump ship to that now though, and go back to WWE3 later.

 

What would you do? Grateful to mull it over with you all.

[Critterfixer]

Does she do any writing (creative, copywork, dictation or other) outside of WWE? How does she feel about writing in general? Does she read the selections herself, and if so, what does she think about them? 

 

ETA: few more questions to help with selecting a good choice for you and your daughter to use: What part of WWE is most aggravating for her? Do you listen to her narration and scribe it for her, or does she write part or all of it out? When you take a narration from her what does she struggle with that makes her think she can't do it? (That could be hard to track down, I know. I've got kids who bow up and can't do something that looks just a tiny bit different than what they did yesterday.) Can she keep characters and events straight in her head? Does she know what she wants to say, but then can't get that to paper? Does she want to retell everything or does she struggle with the summary aspect of the program?

[Chrysalis Academy]

There is a another really similar thread right now. Now that I'm homeschooling an 8 year old 3rd grader for the first time, I can't say that I'm surprised that kids are struggling with WWE3.  My dd did WWE2, but she's not ready for WWE3.  I did about half of WWE3 with my older in 4th grade when she started homeschooling.  She did great with it, and mastered summary and dictation in about half a year.  It's amazing how quickly they can pick up the skills when they are ready for them, and how painful and sloggy it can be when they aren't.  I wouldn't hesitate to put it aside until next year.

 

There are some great 3rd grade options!  Treasured Conversations, written new this year by a board member, is a big hit with a lot of 8 year olds.  CAP's Writing & Rhetoric program is also excellent.  We are enjoying and thriving with both of those.  Writing doesn't have to be miserable!!

 

link to TC:  http://www.treasuredconversations.com/

[EmmaNZ]

Does she do any writing (creative, copywork, dictation or other) outside of WWE? How does she feel about writing in general? Does she read the selections herself, and if so, what does she think about them? 

 

ETA: few more questions to help with selecting a good choice for you and your daughter to use: What part of WWE is most aggravating for her? Do you listen to her narration and scribe it for her, or does she write part or all of it out? When you take a narration from her what does she struggle with that makes her think she can't do it? (That could be hard to track down, I know. I've got kids who bow up and can't do something that looks just a tiny bit different than what they did yesterday.) Can she keep characters and events straight in her head? Does she know what she wants to say, but then can't get that to paper? Does she want to retell everything or does she struggle with the summary aspect of the program?

She likes to write her own stories. I would say she is my most creative child. She dislikes the rigidity of WWE. Having to get things perfect before she can write it down. The actual writing is not an issue, it's the 'thinking' that she has problems with! She has been finding it it exhausting for a while now, and I think there is an element of brain freeze creeping in - one of the main reasons I think switching would be good.

 

She reads the selection herself but often needs to reread in order to answer the questions and/or summarise. When it does come to summarising she rarely picks out the main points, she picks out the random snippets that she enjoyed. It is lovely and sweet, but leaves us with a disjointed summary at best. She certainly doesn't want to retell everything - not because she would mind writing it down, but because it isn't all in her brain anymore. Once we have actually talked through a reasonable narration though she can remember it just fine and writes it down easily. 

 

The dictations are just slow. She can do it eventually, but it usually takes many, many repetitions. She just finds that so disheartening.

 

There is a another really similar thread right now. Now that I'm homeschooling an 8 year old 3rd grader for the first time, I can't say that I'm surprised that kids are struggling with WWE3.  My dd did WWE2, but she's not ready for WWE3.  I did about half of WWE3 with my older in 4th grade when she started homeschooling.  She did great with it, and mastered summary and dictation in about half a year.  It's amazing how quickly they can pick up the skills when they are ready for them, and how painful and sloggy it can be when they aren't.  I wouldn't hesitate to put it aside until next year.

 

There are some great 3rd grade options!  Treasured Conversations, written new this year by a board member, is a big hit with a lot of 8 year olds.  CAP's Writing & Rhetoric program is also excellent.  We are enjoying and thriving with both of those.  Writing doesn't have to be miserable!!

 

link to TC:  http://www.treasuredconversations.com/

Thanks for your thoughts. It's good to know that you are enjoying W&R, that's one of the things I am considering. I'll go and have a look at the other threads I think. 

 

Just as an aside - I was under the impression that TC is limited to the US. Do you know if that's correct? That's an issue for me unless I wait until my DH is next over there which won't be until May or something I think.

[Critterfixer]

First, I'd take a break from WWE. Give her free-write time instead for a while, and just let her be creative. Encourage her to read it to you, praise it, enjoy it, and listen hard to how she writes, because I'm willing to bet she thinks as she writes. 

 

Really emphasize the fact that it does not have to be perfect. Perfect is paralyzing in itself, but it is almost the kiss of death for creativity. Things are often very messy in creating, and she should expect that. We don't do polishing until we've dumped all the dirt on the table, sorted out the good stuff, washed it up, cut it and THEN we'll think about polishing. 

 

Let her always have whatever she is supposed to be narrating in front of her. Mine did much, much better with narration when I taught some very basic outlining first for non-fiction work and some story-web for fiction. We did it on the board together, and things went much better. Be sure you are talking your narrations through. That's good for her, because it will help her in her own compositions.

 

Drop the dictation down to very, very short things. Pick stuff she has read and loved to dictate from. That could be poetry, her favorite stories, books, songs, etc. You want her to succeed at it. Every now and again, if she's game, give her selections from her own work for dictation, and narrating. Make it real.

 

As far as a switch, I'm kind of doing my own thing right now, with an eye to going to CW Homer this fall. I'll be tweaking a lot, because that program gives me the flexibility to do that. It seems easier for me to put a creative spin on it that most. CW Aesop wasn't as easy for me to alter, but because the idea was to retell a story instead of summarize, it was better for my creative writers. You might try doing the same thing with some of the selections in WWE, having her retell some, having her change the details, change the main characters (ie-what if the fox was an elephant? something like that) and do summary sometimes, creative spins other times, etc.

I hear a lot of good things about the creative writing in Bravewriter, but I've not used it, and I don't know its availability outside the US. But I'm kind of a take what you have and make it work if you can, before getting a new program. I think it really helps you find exactly what you might be looking for.

 

[kiwik]

Yes is still only US only. If you have family there you may be able to get them to buy it, print it (lots of people had it printed at a print shop) and post it to you.

 

If she actually likes write maybe ease off before that changes. Someone recommended kidspiration to me for thinking and planning.

[LindaOz]

This is what I am doing with my kids using Bravewriter's Arrow (although you could just use a selection from a book you are reading...)

 

Mon: Read passage, discuss vocab, interesting techniques etc. Copywork the passage and illustrate it.

Tues: Freewriting

Wed: Revise Monday's passage and take it from dictation.

Thur: Freewriting

Fri: Write Monday's passage from memory as much as possible, supplementing with own words when can't remember, maintaining the general flow and meaning of the passage. I find this an excellent exercise.