When They Keep Shutting Down?

[Paige]

How do you reach a child who shuts completely down when asked to do something when he or she doesn't want to do it or is a little upset or stressed about something? I don't think it is a case of disobedience. I think my child completely blanks out and cannot retrieve her thoughts or anything that she has learned. Examples- she's filling out a page on antonyms and genuinely cannot come up with anything. What's the opposite of hot? Young? Happy? My 5yr old is jumping up and down with the answers but this child (9) is in tears. Struggling and absolutely believes she cannot do it. I know she's fully capable of doing it when she's not stressed. Same child can't tell me what 100 plus 10 is- even when it is written in columns, she can't spell words she's been able to spell for years, she's not able to read, can't tell me what a syllable is...and on and on- almost every day.

 

I think most people would say to tell her to take a break and try again later. I try this but it just piles on. She then becomes stressed because she's behind and upset because she doesn't want to be behind, and then she is in tears, and then she can't think. And she is getting behind because I have to let her take so many breaks to get over her anxiety. She's behind in her own head because she has a twin doing the same work- not behind some arbitrary school schedule.

 

Today, she started work after her sister because she was being slow getting to the table and her sister is the type to wake up early and try to get it done before 9am. She was stressed because sister was mostly done with everything and jealous and wanting to be able to play. She began her work with no complaints or drama but began crying as soon as she made a mistake. It was a minor mistake that she knew the answer to, but just wrote it in the wrong place. I asked her to switch it, and she froze. She no longer knew the answer right in front of her. From that point on, she knew nothing. Continuing work was pointless because she was too upset. I told her to take a break and we'd try after lunch. She had lunch, was fine, read some books, then we tried to work again. Now, she's upset because everyone else is done and she's not. Immediately she is incapable of coming up with the most basic of answers. I am at a loss. I don't think she's scamming me. Nobody would be this miserable on purpose. I think I should just have her quit since we are getting nowhere, but then....she's getting so little completed and is getting farther and farther behind. She wants me to feed her answers but I feel I cannot. I may as well do all her work for her. She does this in other situations too. Does she need a psychiatrist? Xanax? Is this just normal and nobody talks about it?

[PeterPan]

I can't fathom anyone telling you to take a break to solve it, mercy. Have you done evals? Kind of hard to tell from your description specifically what's going on. That's when you get evals, when you've got a 9 yo who can't read, who is locking up on expressive language, who is having unusual levels of stress and anxiety. It's time. Whether it's an expressive language problem or processing speed or what, that's where you need a professional to tease things apart. But no, it's not a wait kind of thing.

[texasmama]

I agree that it is time for an evaluation. You cannot treat what has not been diagnosed. Things will be much more clear with the information provided by a thorough evaluation.

[Paige]

She had an evaluation. The psychologist said she may have some auditory processing issues and some anxiety. We left with no diagnosis because he said she was so minor. She probably performed well for him because he's friendly, low stress, and she is a people pleaser. It wasn't a test to her. And she does have good days. The psychologist said she performed in the exceptional range for most areas. She can read and she reads quite well when she's not spacing out. It's more of a performance anxiety kind of thing. She saw the psychologist several times and we'd need a referral for more visits. He was happy releasing her and said she didn't really need much help.

 

She can do so much when she's doing something on her own. That's what kills me- I know she can do everything asked because she does it on her own time and in the course of every day life. If she is asked to do it, however, then she frequently freezes and no longer can remember anything.

 

I didn't want to take her to a psychiatrist because I know the one we will be referred to would be happy to start her on some drugs and I wasn't sure if we should go there. She also is scared of the water, scared to get a shower, to swim, scared to go upstairs alone, and too nervous to know what to do when she's thirsty and her cup is empty (fill it up from the water dispensor!).

[3monkeys]

Is she taking any medications for seasonal allergies by chance? My son had the same problem with irrational fears (going outside, scared to go upstairs alone, being stung by a bee, and on and on) We were minutes away from taking him to a psychologist because we thought he had an anxiety disorder. Decided to google his allergy medication and I read about the nasal spray Nasonex that he was on. Others had the same side effects. So I took him off of it and 2 days later.....ALL OF HIS ANXIETIES WERE GONE! He also did the same thing with shutting down. It seemed like he only wanted to be perfect, so as soon as he realized he couldn't, he gave up. He would rather not try at all than be wrong. He did get tested and found he struggles with processing speed and working memory. Those two things can cause lots of frustration especially with a bright child. I truly believe a lot of my son's issues are allergy related. He is also allergic to certain foods and had chronic ear infections as a baby. I'm finding lots of connections with this and learning difficulties. We are currently doing the supplementation program from Dianne Craft's Biology of Behavior CD. You should get it and listen to it. May help her a lot!

[Paige]

She's been taking claritin for about 2 months. She actually has gotten worse since then but it's not completely new. I don't know. I'd hate to take her off because then she's a mess from being up all night coughing and she gets asthma like wheezing. I could ask the doctor for something else. My DS took nasonex for about 2 weeks before I took him off because he became irrational.

 

She's got some other issues too that I know are contributing to anxiety and takes some other meds but I don't think they cause her anxiety. I think her physical issues/symptoms are exacerbating it, but I don't know by how much. We're working with other doctors for the physical problems but it's a slow process.

[Ravin]

I have some of the same issues with my DD. Meds, counseling, and a great deal of patience on my part have all helped. Also making sure to guard DD's sleep with a solid routine. It hasn't made it go away 100%, but she has more good days and the little stuff doesn't set her off as much.

 

We're still waiting for evaluation of her learning difficulties that feed the anxiety in the first place...

[3monkeys]

Zyrtec or Singulair are two my son takes well without side effects. He did have emotional breakdowns on Clariton. I forgot about that because it's been several years ago. May just want to switch and see if there is any improvement. Singulair by the way is prescription but known to help the wheezing where Zyrtec and Clariton do not. Praying you get answers!

[Tiramisu]

I would look closely at the meds and especially the claritin. I also know people who felt really weird on that.

 

My gut is telling me you need a different psychologist, preferably a neuropsych. And an experiened pediatric audiologist familiar with auditory processing disorders. My dd has APD but the neuropsych didn't pick up anything about that because of the quiet conditions of the testing. If your psychologist picked something up, it may be time to pursue that. If money or insurance coverage is an issue, I'd put the money into a good neuropsych evaluation first and see what turns up and then possibly just assume APD is in the mix, too, if you couldn't manage that testing right away.

 

From your description of the anxiety, once you get the current medication issues sorted out, I'd definitely consider something for anxiety. Xanax is not what you want and I can't imagine any psychiatrist giving that to a child. To me, it's at the point that you need to address quality of life for your little girl and break any negative cycle.

 

Anxiety exacerbates processing and attention issues and could explain a lot of what you're seeing.

[geodob]

You wrote: 'She's behind in her own head because she has a twin doing the same work-'

While children compare themselves to other children and their siblings.

This comparing takes on a different level with twins, and even more so with identical twins.

Where 'performance' has a direct equivalent to benchmark one self against.

So that if one twin has a 'difficulty', then it is highlighted to a greater extent.

 

When you said that she becomes stressed because she's behind and upset because she doesn't want to be behind.

Is this behind her twin?

So that what might be most helpful, is if she could learn to stop comparing herself to her twin?

[Ravin]

Just wanted to add that we've made step # 1 of all problems solving: "Don't freak out, don't panic." DD and I both realize she learns and understands when she is calm, not upset. Keeping her from freaking out from square one is 9/10 of my job as her teacher at this point.

 

If it occurs in situations besides just schoolwork,across the board, a psychiatric eval and meds might be worth considering.

[Ravin]

double post

[Paige]

Just wanted to add that we've made step # 1 of all problems solving: "Don't freak out, don't panic." DD and I both realize she learns and understands when she is calm, not upset. Keeping her from freaking out from square one is 9/10 of my job as her teacher at this point.

 

If it occurs in situations besides just schoolwork,across the board, a psychiatric eval and meds might be worth considering.

 

 

She's not as bad in other situations except pools and showers and baths, but I still see her freezing up some. She's actually much better than when she was younger.

 

What do you do if she does freak out? Do you try to push through it or do you quit until she's calm?

 

Yes, she's comparing herself with her twin. I don't think there's any way to stop that. She has other areas where she excels and her twin struggles so it evens out.

[geodob]

You wrote that she has other areas where she excels, and her twin struggles.

Where this could be used as a key?

Rather than trying to stop her comparing herself with her twin?

Given that each twin has different areas of strengths, this could be highlighted.

So that she gains a recognition and acceptance that they each have different strengths.

Where they can compare themselves with each other, but not try to match each other in each area.

As she understands that they each have their own strengths, and are equally 'smart' in their own ways.

[jetzmama]

Lone voice here.... All of mine have been known to shut down when things are not going as expected (interruptions, wrong answers needing redone, sibling starting break a bit earlier...). Read into that 'when things are not going their way.' When things have not gone their way, they can shut down. I've learned that, at times, this can manifest itself as a flawlessly executed bit of manipulation to usurp my authority by imposing their will. I rarely deal with this nowadays. Some things that have helped: make them responsible for checking their own work as much as possible (if they find a math error on their own, they not only learn better by finding and correcting it themselves, but there is no one telling them they got it wrong, either. For perfectionist kids, the difference b/t being told or shown something is wrong and finding he error themselves can be huge.). Make them responsible for their own schedule as much as possible (JoAnne Calderwood at www.Urthemom.com has some great resources we've used to help with this). For us, being part of a co-op in which there is accountability for arriving with work complete has also been a tremendous help in the kids 'owning' the work.

 

This may not be related to your situation at all, but wanted to throw it out there as another possibility to consider. Obviously you know your children best!

 

Now if we can just get distractions under control!

[PeterPan]

Lone voice here.... All of mine have been known to shut down when things are not going as expected (interruptions, wrong answers needing redone, sibling starting break a bit earlier...). Read into that 'when things are not going their way.' When things have not gone their way, they can shut down. I've learned that, at times, this can manifest itself as a flawlessly executed bit of manipulation to usurp my authority by imposing their will. I rarely deal with this nowadays. Some things that have helped: make them responsible for checking their own work as much as possible ...

 

 

Hahaha, too true! And you know I was just thinking about having her check her own work on some things. I just figured I was being pragmatic. I didn't realize it would be so psychologically beneficial... :thumbup:

[Paige]

Today, I set DD up in her room by herself. She won't see or know what her sister is doing and she won't be stressed about me seeing if she's making a mistake before she's ready to show me, and she can have her own music, and her own cozy place. So far so good....We have a little tea party table in there with chairs so she has a place to sit. I'm going to minimize their interactions and what they do together.