stm4him Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 I am thinking at this point that I'll be using this for my 3rd and 4th graders next year and then when LOE comes out with the advanced level we'll take a break from Hake and do that instead (or alongside depending on how long the lessons take for each). There are no samples up (they are planning to put them up soon I think) so I was just wondering how it was going for anyone who is using it..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stm4him Posted November 30, 2012 Author Share Posted November 30, 2012 And how long do the lessons take? Do you have to help with any of it or is it completely independent? If you help, how much time do you have to do and how much time by themselves? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarreymere Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 We have been using it since the beginning of this year. Personally, I really like it. It is as thorough as R&S (which we were using up through last year) but without the heavy Mennonite vibe. I think that the explanations are better and easier to understand in Hake, for both the grammar and the composition. Hake also has more examples, which we have found helpful. The composition portion of Hake is very clear and written in a very down to earth sort of way so that the instructions and examples seem just like common sense. I suppose you could say it is 'matter of fact'. It strikes just the right tone with my daughter and inspires a workman-like attitude in her. R&S isn't exciting and interesting, and neither is Hake. There is a lot of drill. It is laid out just like Saxon math. There are no colorful pictures or designs. It isn't cute or visually appealing. But it works for my daughter who just didn't remember things very well with FLL or MCT. I'm planning to stick with this program since it works well for her, even though she isn't exactly enthusiastic about it. She does well with Saxon math also. I guess it really does just depend on the kid. Apparently my daughter does well with curriculum that doesn't dress up the fact that learning is work. She did the least well with MCT, though she really enjoyed it. She can tell me the story in the MCT island book, but doesn't remember the actual grammar parts. FLL was another hit with her, but she focused on the poems and the more interesting parts of the book and I guess her mind just didn't process the grammar parts of it. In desperation I tried R&S, and amazingly she suddenly started to learn grammar. I don't want to stick with R&S because it doesn't have the kind of composition I want, and I'm not fond of the the Mennonite tone and the bible stuff, and even if I did like that I have to say the Hake is much, much better. There is clearly explained grammar, there is clearly explained composition. There is plenty of practice. It works. We just do our poetry and 'fun' language stuff separately. I would say she could do it completely independently, but at her age (9) she still 'needs' mom sitting with her to stay focused on the work, more for the company than because she needs the help. She doesn't get much done if I try to get her to do it by herself, but that is her maturity level and not a reflection of the material. The explanations and instructions are very clear. We do the initial practice verbally together some of the time and she does the review at the end of the lesson independently. Usually it takes around thirty to forty-five minutes for a grammar lesson. She has some fine motor issues and handwriting is not easy for her, but since it is something that she can improve with practice I haven't had her do the work on the computer keyboard. If she did do the work on a keyboard it would take less time since she wouldn't be struggling with the motor aspect of handwriting. I guess a child who can write easily shouldn't take more than thirty minutes with a lesson and sometimes less. The composition lessons take longer, but most of that time is independent as she has to actually write something of her own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stm4him Posted November 30, 2012 Author Share Posted November 30, 2012 Thanks so much, Rainefox! Do you do the writing lessons the same day as the grammar lessons? How do you lay out your week? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morningcoffee Posted December 1, 2012 Share Posted December 1, 2012 Thanks so much, Rainefox! Do you do the writing lessons the same day as the grammar lessons? How do you lay out your week? Thanks! :lurk5: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stm4him Posted December 3, 2012 Author Share Posted December 3, 2012 You have to buy it from the Hake site right now. The cost is 75 dollars and it is the school version but it is exactly like the homeschool version will be except that the student edition is in hard cover. Google Hake grammar and writing and you'll find their site. If you have trouble email them and they will get back to you soon with how to order..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KellyBean Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 Thank you for your reviwe Rainefox! This looks like what I have been looking for. Can anyone tell me what level this begins at? Looks like it begins at 4th (Like pp said ;) Here is the website--http://grammar.cc/?content=about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KellyBean Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 stm4him-Do you mind if I ask what you are doing now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasa Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 Does Hake Grammar include diagramming sentences? If so, at which grade level? Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mama25angels Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 stm4him-Do you mind if I ask what you are doing now? I would like to know also Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stm4him Posted December 3, 2012 Author Share Posted December 3, 2012 I am doing Logic of English with my 2nd and 3rd grader. Next year my oldest will go to Essentials at CC but I want to use Hake for her as a supplement (I think). My 2nd grader will use Hake 4 next year as well since LOE Advanced isn't out yet and when it comes out we'll pause from Hake likely and do that instead. I'm hoping my little ones will get all of LOE done before Essentials and Hake will be used a supplement as we have time or in the summers...... They start Hake at level 4 for now but eventually there will be levels all the way down to K!! I'm not sure how in the world I would fit that in but I bet I would try....lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KellyBean Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 "Does Hake Grammar include diagramming sentences? If so, at which grade level? Thanks. -" I looked at the samples on the link from abopve and Grade 5 has diagramming. Maybe someone who is using 4 can tell us. stm4him-I was looking into LOE for my 3rd grader as well. I thought it was just a spelling/phonics program. Can it be used for Grammar and Writing as well? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mama25angels Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 Does Hake assume prior grammar instruction? Could I jump into it with the 5th grade book? I'm assuming that I can just wanting to be sure. Thanks stm4him--if you have some time i'd love to ask a few questions about CC. We'll be doing it at home for now and I know you don't do it that way, but i'd still like to pick your brain,if you don't mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stm4him Posted December 4, 2012 Author Share Posted December 4, 2012 LOE also has grammar and composition but the composition is more focused on going from phrases to sentences and by the end they are doing paragraphs, but I am adding IEW's Fables, Myths, and Fairy Tales to my kids composition this year (it is level A). I think LOE is a great lead into Hake. LOE does not have diagramming but they do have a question answer type way of figuring out what the parts of speech are in a sentence the way Shirley Grammar does. And they learn a lot of rules and there is dictation, etc. You should look at the samples. I really like that the grammar is done using words they already know how to spell. We cover a lesson every 3 days (phonics day 1, spelling day 2, grammar day 3), making a total of 120 lessons for the year but you can do it any number of ways. We also starting using Saxon Phonics this year for our preschooler and K'er. I plan to use it again next year for their K and 1st grade years and then move into LOE for second grade. Depending on what I see with LOE's Foundations program when it is not in beta download form I may switch over or if I really like Saxon's new grammar books for the lower grades I may add those but that all depends on how it fits in and what looks the best once I can see them all. I have no idea how many years it will be until the lower levels are out because they are waiting on Lorna Simmons (who wrote the phonics programs) to write them. I love all Saxon programs so far even though I didn't like them at all at first. It is hard for me to judge since we aren't even in Essentials yet and though I know a lot about it there is always a learning curve as to how long it takes, etc. You should definitely be able to jump into to Hake 4 since before now that was the level they started in. I have heard of some people doing it a year early even (like I'm planning to do with my second child next year although by his age he will be fourth grade). I do Saxon Phonics one year ahead and I do Saxon Math one year ahead with my little ones (still getting older ones caught up) but will slow them down in 3rd grade and they will stay on grade level from that point on so I'm thinking I'll keep the grammar books at level for the most part with my younger ones, but we'll see..... I hope that all makes sense. If not, I'd be happy to clarify. I would be happy to answer any CC questions. Its one of my passions :-) Ask away! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mama25angels Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 Well, my questions are about the cycles, since i'm just getting my guide, we'll be starting cycle one after our Christmas break and i'm wondering what your thoughts are on just memorizing as much of cycle one as we can and then moving on to cycle two with the communities in Aug. when we resume our school year? We will work over our summer break, but i'd really like to use that time for reading and doing really big projects and continuing our math skills. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stm4him Posted December 5, 2012 Author Share Posted December 5, 2012 I think that is a great idea. I'm finding that the more we review individually the more we get done vs. doing it together where I feel everyone has to be present and behaving, etc. The cd in the car works wonders as does the ipad app (which I'm new to). The flashcards are also very helpful in my opinion. Let me know if you have any other questions..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mama25angels Posted December 5, 2012 Share Posted December 5, 2012 I'm using an older guide, and i'm wondering if it'd be ok to buy the 4th edition CD or should I look for a CD for the edition I have? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mom0012 Posted December 5, 2012 Share Posted December 5, 2012 I haven't seen level 4, but my son has used 5 and 6 and is currently doing 7. My dd is using it for the first time this year and I started her at level 5 for 5th grade. Honestly, all the levels are very similar, with just a little more added each year, IMO. I do love the program, though. The explanations and practice problems are great and the mixed review keeps everything fresh. The first year my son used Hake, I sat with him and read through the lesson and did the practice problems with him. Now, he's on his own. My dd has always been more independent, so she doesn't need my help at all. I do not use the writing. Both my kids are taking an outsourced IEW class this year and my son is slowly working his way through WWS. Lisa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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