SS in MD Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Hi all, I just came across the Logic of English program. I've been to their websit, but had a few questions (I appologize if they've already been answered repeatedly here- I tried searching through the posts, but didn't quite find my answers) 1) Would LOE be appropriate for a 5th grader who struggles with spelling and a 3rd grader who doesn't struggle? 2) Can I teach both kids together? (5th would use cursive wkbk, 3rd probably manuscript - if this matters) Teaching kids together would be a great time saver - but will older eventually move faster? 3) I went to RR and was blown:tongue_smilie:by all the options on what to buy - help! I don't have time to make the various cards and would like the games book, but also don't want to buy stuff I dont' need (ykwim) Can someone please tell me what I need to buy for my two dc? 4) I will be using R&S 5 & 3 with each dc, can I skip the grammar portion? 5) Also, using another handwriting program, can I skip the HW? 6) I read from the website the essentials curriculum can be complete in 8-16 wks? Is that correct? What do you use after LOE? 7) Any likes/dislikes? Is it worth the $$$? Thank you all for reading and taking the time to respond! Sangita dd(16),dd(14),dd(11),ds(8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BugsMama Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Sorry this is short- We LOVE it. No way it would be completed in 8-16 weeks. Most people will take a year (one week per lesson). There is plenty of meat and room to practice. Yes, you can teach them both together, and I think it would be perfect for those ages. You can use the two different workbooks, they are identical except for font. The only thing you NEED is the curriculum, and the phonogram cards. Ideally- you would have The TM, 2 workbooks, the phonogram cards, the game book, and two sets of game cards. If money is no option, the spelling rule cards, spelling journal, and the fold out chart would be REALLY nice to have, but not needed. The other cards are gravy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BugsMama Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 and Yes, you can skip the handwriting. The grammar is short and basic and reenforces the spelling. You can skip it, but i'm not sure you would want to :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BugsMama Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 And by "No way" for 8-16 weeks, I'm sure it could, but it would be 1.5-2 hours of work on spelling each day. Most people don't want to do that. :) but it COULD be done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorisuewho Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Hi all,1) Would LOE be appropriate for a 5th grader who struggles with spelling and a 3rd grader who doesn't struggle? 2) Can I teach both kids together? (5th would use cursive wkbk, 3rd probably manuscript - if this matters) Teaching kids together would be a great time saver - but will older eventually move faster? 3) I went to RR and was blown:tongue_smilie:by all the options on what to buy - help! I don't have time to make the various cards and would like the games book, but also don't want to buy stuff I dont' need (ykwim) Can someone please tell me what I need to buy for my two dc? 4) I will be using R&S 5 & 3 with each dc, can I skip the grammar portion? 5) Also, using another handwriting program, can I skip the HW? 6) I read from the website the essentials curriculum can be complete in 8-16 wks? Is that correct? What do you use after LOE? 7) Any likes/dislikes? Is it worth the $$$? Thank you all for reading and taking the time to respond! Sangita dd(16),dd(14),dd(11),ds(8) I really just agree with BugsMama but I'll answer away also instead of just putting "I agree" :D 1. Yes, completely appropriate for both of those children. 2. Yes, absolutely teach them together 3. You only NEED the Teacher Manual. But I highly recommend having The Teacher Manual and a workbook for each child. I wouldn't want to do it without the workbooks. YOu also need a set of phonogram cards, but you could make these. I like LOE's though. I would buy the game book and 2 decks of cards. The games are fun and helpful. 4. It is easy to skip the grammar. I do. But you may find you like it. 5. I don't really find the handwriting overly integrated. Don't buy the handwriting workbooks if you don't want to do the handwriting. There is handwriting built in by the directions saying "Say each new phonogram and write it five times as you say it" and things like that. So it won't matter what style the child is using. There is also dictation and composition, but there is no direct handwriting instruction in Essentials like there will be in Foundations. 6. There is no way in the world I would be able to complete the curriculum that quickly, except if I was working with maybe a middle schooler or high schooler. I think one lesson a week would be a better estimate, meaning this curriculum would last you 40 weeks. After you finish LOE you could go through it again with more challenging words (she has developed a list for this) or you could go onto a latin roots program. This is a complete program so I don't believe there will be any rules you didn't cover. 7. I think the material you get is definitely worth the cost. I was very impressed with the manual when I got it. The manual tells you exactly what to do. There is no guess work. Very very open and go with lots of extra options for extra practice. If one doesn't have the money for this program, than I think Writing Road To Reading is the way to go. It will take more time to figure it out and not everything will be handed to the teacher, but it is a solid program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatmansWife Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Sorry this is short- We LOVE it. No way it would be completed in 8-16 weeks. Most people will take a year (one week per lesson). There is plenty of meat and room to practice. Yes, you can teach them both together, and I think it would be perfect for those ages. You can use the two different workbooks, they are identical except for font. The only thing you NEED is the curriculum, and the phonogram cards. Ideally- you would have The TM, 2 workbooks, the phonogram cards, the game book, and two sets of game cards. If money is no option, the spelling rule cards, spelling journal, and the fold out chart would be REALLY nice to have, but not needed. The other cards are gravy. What is the fold out chart?? I just got everything from Rainbow (the complete kit plus extras) and I don't think I have any chart. I really just agree with BugsMama but I'll answer away also instead of just putting "I agree" :D1. Yes, completely appropriate for both of those children. 2. Yes, absolutely teach them together 3. You only NEED the Teacher Manual. But I highly recommend having The Teacher Manual and a workbook for each child. I wouldn't want to do it without the workbooks. YOu also need a set of phonogram cards, but you could make these. I like LOE's though. I would buy the game book and 2 decks of cards. The games are fun and helpful. 4. It is easy to skip the grammar. I do. But you may find you like it. 5. I don't really find the handwriting overly integrated. Don't buy the handwriting workbooks if you don't want to do the handwriting. There is handwriting built in by the directions saying "Say each new phonogram and write it five times as you say it" and things like that. So it won't matter what style the child is using. There is also dictation and composition, but there is no direct handwriting instruction in Essentials like there will be in Foundations. 6. There is no way in the world I would be able to complete the curriculum that quickly, except if I was working with maybe a middle schooler or high schooler. I think one lesson a week would be a better estimate, meaning this curriculum would last you 40 weeks. After you finish LOE you could go through it again with more challenging words (she has developed a list for this) or you could go onto a latin roots program. This is a complete program so I don't believe there will be any rules you didn't cover. 7. I think the material you get is definitely worth the cost. I was very impressed with the manual when I got it. The manual tells you exactly what to do. There is no guess work. Very very open and go with lots of extra options for extra practice. If one doesn't have the money for this program, than I think Writing Road To Reading is the way to go. It will take more time to figure it out and not everything will be handed to the teacher, but it is a solid program. As I said above, we just received everything but haven't started. I'm so confused by what you say about Essentials and Foundations. What does that mean?? Are there two different levels to this program or something? I have no idea what I got apparently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blessed3x Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 This is the fold out reference chart. http://www.logicofenglish.com/store/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/265x265/17f82f742ffe127f42dca9de82fb58b1/f/o/foldoutrefchart-frontcover-100dpi.jpg I am ordering mine from cbd.com, but it is also available from LOE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorisuewho Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 What is the fold out chart?? I just got everything from Rainbow (the complete kit plus extras) and I don't think I have any chart. As I said above, we just received everything but haven't started. I'm so confused by what you say about Essentials and Foundations. What does that mean?? Are there two different levels to this program or something? I have no idea what I got apparently. Essentials is what you purchased. Foundations is the kindergarten program that is currently in development. I'm sorry to have confused you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatmansWife Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 This is the fold out reference chart. http://www.logicofenglish.com/store/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/265x265/17f82f742ffe127f42dca9de82fb58b1/f/o/foldoutrefchart-frontcover-100dpi.jpg I am ordering mine from cbd.com, but it is also available from LOE. That looks like it would be handy to have. Jeepers....why isn't that just included in the big expensive set from Rainbow (it's like 200 bucks for what I got)? :glare: Essentials is what you purchased. Foundations is the kindergarten program that is currently in development. I'm sorry to have confused you! Oh, don't worry....it doesn't take much to confuse me. :001_smile: Thanks for explaining...I had no idea they were making a foundations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SS in MD Posted September 10, 2012 Author Share Posted September 10, 2012 Ladies, Thank you SO much for your detailed reponses. The more I look at LOE the more I think it will be a GREAT program for my stuggling speller and enhance my youngers writing. Thank you for telling me what exactly to buy and what to forego. Money is tight (husband on medical disability), so I'd rather save some money and not buy all the cards & journal. Just wondering if I only buy the phongram cards, game cards & book (as recommended above), do I need to make the other cards? Or are they optional?? (If I need to make them, it might be better to buy and save time(?) Thank you again! Sangita Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorisuewho Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Ladies,Thank you SO much for your detailed reponses. The more I look at LOE the more I think it will be a GREAT program for my stuggling speller and enhance my youngers writing. Thank you for telling me what exactly to buy and what to forego. Money is tight (husband on medical disability), so I'd rather save some money and not buy all the cards & journal. Just wondering if I only buy the phongram cards, game cards & book (as recommended above), do I need to make the other cards? Or are they optional?? (If I need to make them, it might be better to buy and save time(?) Thank you again! Sangita I guess it depends. Are you planning to do the grammar sections? If not, or if you are only planning to dabble in it, then maybe you don't need those cards. You will need phonogram cards. I'm thinking you could use your game cards as your phonogram cards. I like having the spelling rules on cards. If I didn't have the spelling rule cards, I would make up my own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2squared Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 My 5th grader is using LoE this year. I think she is a good speller, but I don't really know how she compares to others her age. She hasn't had explicit phonics instruction, but she has had years of daily dictation. She is completing one lesson over two days. She does the phonics and spelling on the first day and grammar on the third day. I skip most of the workbook pages b/c it's pretty basic stuff that she already knows. I must admit that I'm not requiring her to memorize the four different sounds of xx and the like since I find dictation to be more effective for this. Still, I find the phonics and spelling portions great review, and helpful for finding holes in her knowledge. When she is done with LoE, she will go back to daily dictation. I absolutely love LoE's grammar section. My dd hasn't had formal grammar to this point, and LoE is a very gentle introduction. We should be done with LoE grammar by November, and I plan on transitioning her to KISS grammar at that point. I started my 3rd grader in LoE as well. He hasn't had explicit phonics instruction either. My opinion, for him, is that LoE took too long for the payoff. I took him back to daily dictation and plan on running him through LoE in 4th or 5th grade. I really like LoE. I think it's perfect for my 5th grader, but mostly b/c the time investment to results ratio is right where I need/want. I didn't like it for my 3rd grader b/c it took too much time and effort for his results. I can get better results in less time via dictation for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kirstenhill Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 Ladies,Thank you SO much for your detailed reponses. The more I look at LOE the more I think it will be a GREAT program for my stuggling speller and enhance my youngers writing. Thank you for telling me what exactly to buy and what to forego. Money is tight (husband on medical disability), so I'd rather save some money and not buy all the cards & journal. Just wondering if I only buy the phongram cards, game cards & book (as recommended above), do I need to make the other cards? Or are they optional?? (If I need to make them, it might be better to buy and save time(?) Thank you again! Sangita Maybe others would differ in opinion, but I think you might even be fine skipping the smaller game cards. I find they are great for games with my younger kids who need a lot of repetition for learning the phonograms, but my 3rd grader would much prefer spelling games or games to play on paper (not the card games). She is definitely a struggling speller, but it turns out that she can remember phonograms pretty easily, and is just generally catching on to the LOE method of spelling, so we haven't needed the games quite so much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BugsMama Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 I guess it depends. Are you planning to do the grammar sections? If not, or if you are only planning to dabble in it, then maybe you don't need those cards. You will need phonogram cards. I'm thinking you could use your game cards as your phonogram cards. I like having the spelling rules on cards. If I didn't have the spelling rule cards, I would make up my own. The problem with this is the game cards don't have the sounds printed on them, so you would really need to have a solid grasp of the phonograms, the sounds, and the order of the sounds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SS in MD Posted September 17, 2012 Author Share Posted September 17, 2012 thank you all - So I should buy - TM, 2 student books (1 cursive, 1 Manuscript) for both dc Phonogram cards, game book & cards (2 sets) Since dd is in 5th do I the advanced phonogram cards also? thank you again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BugsMama Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 No, you don't need the advanced phonogram cards :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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