Seton history

[AimeeM]

Has anybody used Seton history? Specifically the fifth grade American history (Our Catholic Heritage) and/or sixth grade world history (Our Catholic Legacy)?

Is it dry?

[Avila]

If money is not an issue, I think you would like the Catholic School Textbook Project books better.

 

The Seton books are OK, but they are kind of dry and they can be over-the-top dogmatic. The CSTP books are still Catholic, but broader-minded.

 

You can also sometimes find the CSTP books used on CathSwap (yahoo group) or get slightly worn copies from CHC or direct from the publisher.

Edited October 12, 2011 by Asenik

[AimeeM]

We are going through Kolbe this year and we *have* Famous Men of Rome (the set from Memoria Press) and planned to use Kolbe's lesson plans for it; but *if* she goes back to Catholic school next year (like she wants right now), it will be expected that she did the second part of American history (I think from the Civil War to Modern) this year. I still want to cover world history though :o

Over thinking this, I know; but I thought it would be nice if we could stick with our more detailed world history using Kolbe, and just do a workbook centered overview of American (using Seton's fifth grade book). It would also be nice to kill two birds with one stone... history AND Church history :glare:

If money is not an issue, I think you would like the Catholic School Textbook Project books better.

 

The Seton books are OK, but they are kind of dry and they can be over-the-top dogmatic. The CSTP books are still Catholic, but broader-minded.

 

You can also sometimes find the CSTP books used on CathSwap (yahoo group) or get slightly worn copies from CHC or direct from the publisher.

[Avila]

We are going through Kolbe this year and we *have* Famous Men of Rome (the set from Memoria Press) and planned to use Kolbe's lesson plans for it; but *if* she goes back to Catholic school next year (like she wants right now), it will be expected that she did the second part of American history (I think from the Civil War to Modern) this year. I still want to cover world history though :o

Over thinking this, I know; but I thought it would be nice if we could stick with our more detailed world history using Kolbe, and just do a workbook centered overview of American (using Seton's fifth grade book). It would also be nice to kill two birds with one stone... history AND Church history :glare:

 

The Seton 5th grade book would work for that. Just be prepared for some overselling. :D

[AimeeM]

I've heard that about Seton. Lol.

It's cheap enough that it isn't really a loss if it doesn't work :D

The Seton 5th grade book would work for that. Just be prepared for some overselling. :D

[NoPlaceLikeHome]

I heard Kolbe will be using Catholic Textbook League and Singapore Math in the future:D

[AimeeM]

They may be adding those as options, but from what I understand, they always include a couple options for things like history.

We hate Saxon. With a passion; so we are substituting for that :001_huh:

I've heard mixed reviews about CTBP texts, to be honest. I have heard from some, that the books are bit too... progressive. I'm waiting for a few moms from my co-op to finish them and give a review. Lol.

I heard Kolbe will be using Catholic Textbook League and Singapore Math in the future:D

[Avila]

They may be adding those as options, but from what I understand, they always include a couple options for things like history.

We hate Saxon. With a passion; so we are substituting for that :001_huh:

I've heard mixed reviews about CTBP texts, to be honest. I have heard from some, that the books are bit too... progressive. I'm waiting for a few moms from my co-op to finish them and give a review. Lol.

 

I have not heard that. I wonder what specifically they have a problem with. Well, I use them and I am pretty sure I don't qualify as progressive. ;). I like them because they are updated and solid academically.

 

Maybe I am progressive and just don't know it ... I know I can't stand some of the other Catholic history books that most of the Catholic curriculum providers use.

[AimeeM]

I've only heard a couple of reviews, mind you. Lol. I really think it boils down to your approach.

Are the CTBP books inviting? Exciting?

I'm not really liking what I see in Famous Men of Rome... I wonder if the World History CTBP would be too difficult for a 10 year old...

I have not heard that. I wonder what specifically they have a problem with. Well, I use them and I am pretty sure I don't qualify as progressive. ;). I like them because they are updated and solid academically.

 

Maybe I am progressive and just don't know it ... I know I can't stand some of the other Catholic history books that most of the Catholic curriculum providers use.

[Avila]

I've only heard a couple of reviews, mind you. Lol. I really think it boils down to your approach.

Are the CTBP books inviting? Exciting?

I'm not really liking what I see in Famous Men of Rome... I wonder if the World History CTBP would be too difficult for a 10 year old...

 

I think they are inviting. I know the American history one has been chosen by Mater Amabilis as a living book for their Charlotte Mason-based curriculum. exciting is a relative term. ;). I think they are more engaging, less dry, and more balanced than most of the other Catholic choices.

 

All Ye Lands is the 6th grade book. It is not true world history. It is a history/geography hybrid. It is arranged by cultures first, and chronology second. I think a bright 10 year old would be OK with it. The reading level tends to be a little higher than the Seton books though.

www.catholictextbookproject.com

has sample chapters and the table of contents, which should give you a good idea of whether it is appropriate for your child.

 

Their actual world history books (Light to the Nations 1 and 2) are more complicated. There is a lot of information there, and a lot of it is higher level thinking. I wouldn't use them younger than recommended (7th grade). My only complaint about them is that they skip the beginning of world history and start mostly with the Birth of Christ.

[AimeeM]

I think they are inviting. I know the American history one has been chosen by Mater Amabilis as a living book for their Charlotte Mason-based curriculum. exciting is a relative term. ;). I think they are more engaging, less dry, and more balanced than most of the other Catholic choices.

 

All Ye Lands is the 6th grade book. It is not true world history. It is a history/geography hybrid. It is arranged by cultures first, and chronology second. I think a bright 10 year old would be OK with it. The reading level tends to be a little higher than the Seton books though.

www.catholictextbookproject.com

has sample chapters and the table of contents, which should give you a good idea of whether it is appropriate for your child.

 

Their actual world history books (Light to the Nations 1 and 2) are more complicated. There is a lot of information there, and a lot of it is higher level thinking. I wouldn't use them younger than recommended (7th grade). My only complaint about them is that they skip the beginning of world history and start mostly with the Birth of Christ.

Skipping the beginning of World History to start with the birth of Christ would greatly annoy me and my husband. Lol.

So, All Ye Lands... I kind of like the idea of cultures and geography, to be honest.

I think I need to stay away from the boards.

Tony keeps telling me that I "chase shiny objects" on matters of curriculum :D

[Avila]

Skipping the beginning of World History to start with the birth of Christ would greatly annoy me and my husband. Lol.

So, All Ye Lands... I kind of like the idea of cultures and geography, to be honest.

I think I need to stay away from the boards.

Tony keeps telling me that I "chase shiny objects" on matters of curriculum :D

 

Yeah, sorry about the whole "tempting you with shiny objects" thing. :D

 

I stayed away from these books for a long time, solely because of price. But with what I have bought and rejected, I could have bought this whole set a few times over. Lol. I liked the tone of some of the older books, but I wanted them to go to modern times and be updated with better maps and color photos. I don't like books that are sing-songy patriotic or over-the-top partisan, so that shot most of what was left. I used the WTM method with history encyclopedias, but I REALLY needed a narrative spine to go with that and tie it all together.

 

Now if you do decide to go the Kolbe route, let me know. I have some fabulous shiny things to tempt you with there that I use to supplement. :D

[AimeeM]

I am enrolled with Kolbe. They don't help by being so flexible :D

I'm caught up with not knowing whether I want religious instruction to permeate our studies (Famous Men of Rome won't do that and, as you know, I do not feel in a place to supplement on my own), or if I want to simply teach religion on its own. On that note, none of Kolbe history choices for this age/stage are really what I want - but I would LOVE for you to tempt me with shiny supplements. Supplements I can get away with - but if I switch curricula one more time, I think Tony will change our account passwords *chuckle*

Yeah, sorry about the whole "tempting you with shiny objects" thing. :D

 

I stayed away from these books for a long time, solely because of price.

But with what I have bought and rejected, I could have bought this whole set a few times over. Lol. I liked the tone of some of the older books, but I wanted them to go to modern times and be updated with better maps and color photos. I don't like books that are sing-songy patriotic or over-the-top partisan, so that shot most of what was left. I used the WTM method with history encyclopedias, but I REALLY needed a narrative spine to go with that and tie it all together.

 

Now if you do decide to go the Kolbe route, let me know. I have some fabulous shiny things to tempt you with there that I use to supplement. :D

[littlebug42]

The Light to the Nations books are not strict world history per se. They are the history of the world with particular emphasis on the Catholic impact on that world. That is why they begin at the birth of Christ. The All Ye Lands book does cover the civilizations prior to Christ's birth.

 

I have looked at the Seton books and I could never make it through them. I find the entire Seton program about as dull as it comes.

[AimeeM]

Have you used All Ye Lands?

The Light to the Nations books are not strict world history per se. They are the history of the world with particular emphasis on the Catholic impact on that world. That is why they begin at the birth of Christ. The All Ye Lands book does cover the civilizations prior to Christ's birth.

 

I have looked at the Seton books and I could never make it through them. I find the entire Seton program about as dull as it comes.

[Avila]

I am enrolled with Kolbe. They don't help by being so flexible :D

I'm caught up with not knowing whether I want religious instruction to permeate our studies (Famous Men of Rome won't do that and, as you know, I do not feel in a place to supplement on my own), or if I want to simply teach religion on its own. On that note, none of Kolbe history choices for this age/stage are really what I want - but I would LOVE for you to tempt me with shiny supplements. Supplements I can get away with - but if I switch curricula one more time, I think Tony will change our account passwords *chuckle*

 

History is my thing. I love it. My oldest DD loves it. So if your eyes start to glaze over and you start thinking overkill with what I do, at least you will now know why.

 

I did not have the CSTP books for my oldest. I planned her history rotation around WTM. I used a history encyclopedia because I felt like that was the easiest way to have solid coverage of non-Western civilization. For Western Civilization, I chose Dorothy Mills' books as my narrative spine. I love her books. She only goes ancients through renaissance, though, and that is where I started looking at CSTP.

 

For Rome, we used Mills' "Book of the Ancient Romans" and Famous Men of Rome. Mills was out of print at the time, but Memoria Press and Dawn Chorus Press are both reprinting her works. MP is also working on study guides for them. I added in "The Aeneid for Children" by Alfred Church, which is free on the Baldwin Project. We also read Augustus Caesar's World, The Forgotten Daughter, The Bronze Bow, and The Ides of April. We did this in one semester, because we spent the first half of the year on Greece.

 

I combined my own stuff with WTM and MODG recommendations to make our history cycle work. We did a year of Egypt/Mesopotamia/Bible history, a year of Greece/Rome, a year of Middle Ages/Renaissance, and a year of Modern (which included American).

[Avila]

The Light to the Nations books are not strict world history per se. They are the history of the world with particular emphasis on the Catholic impact on that world. That is why they begin at the birth of Christ. The All Ye Lands book does cover the civilizations prior to Christ's birth.

 

I have looked at the Seton books and I could never make it through them. I find the entire Seton program about as dull as it comes.

 

I figured that was the rationale behind starting there, but I still found it irritating.

 

We are using Light to the Nations 2, and it does a wonderful job of bridging world history from Middle Ages to Modern. It goes into the Enlightenment and the philosophy behind the American and French Revolutions. All the Catholic programs skip from Middle Ages straight to American, and this fills in that gap. Seton is supposed to be doing the same thing with their new 7th grade book. I am supplementing with the National Geographic Almanac of American History to cover American history more fully, but LTN2 is covering world history for the time period very thoroughly, and I am not supplementing that at all, which is a record for me.

[AimeeM]

So... All Ye Lands is "workable" for a young 10 year old (fifth grader)?

I figured that was the rationale behind starting there, but I still found it irritating.

 

We are using Light to the Nations 2, and it does a wonderful job of bridging world history from Middle Ages to Modern. It goes into the Enlightenment and the philosophy behind the American and French Revolutions. All the Catholic programs skip from Middle Ages straight to American, and this fills in that gap. Seton is supposed to be doing the same thing with their new 7th grade book. I am supplementing with the National Geographic Almanac of American History to cover American history more fully, but LTN2 is covering world history for the time period very thoroughly, and I am not supplementing that at all, which is a record for me.

[Avila]

So... All Ye Lands is "workable" for a young 10 year old (fifth grader)?

 

I think so. If you are using the Teacher Manual and tests, you may need to scale back expectations a little. But the text itself would work, I think.

[AimeeM]

Bah.

I think I'll just stick with Famous Men of (Rome, Middle Ages, Greece) via Memoria and Kolbe for this year; an overview of American with Seton; and then hope that she loves homeschooling so much that we can do All Ye Lands next year :lol:

I think so. If you are using the Teacher Manual and tests, you may need to scale back expectations a little. But the text itself would work, I think.

[littlebug42]

Have you used All Ye Lands?

 

I haven't used it yet but I plan to after we finish our current four year rotation which will put my girls in 7th/5th grades.

[8filltheheart]

I own and have actually used :tongue_smilie: both All Ye Lands and From Sea to Shining Sea. I much prefer FStSS over AYL. One of my kids detested AYL, so we haven't incorporated it into our school as much as FStSS. (I am actually using it w/my dd along w/ lots of other materials w/the Prairie Primer.)

 

I am not one that likes textbooks, but for a textbook FStSS is great. I personally don't agree w/the Catholic Project's grade level designations. I would never use either book for upper middle school and most definitely not for high school. I think that they are easily used by 4th- 6th graders. 7th is the oldest I would consider using them and then only w/lots of supplementing. I cannot fathom them being appropriate for a 9th grader.

[AimeeM]

What didn't you like about All Ye Lands?

I own and have actually used :tongue_smilie: both All Ye Lands and From Sea to Shining Sea. I much prefer FStSS over AYL. One of my kids detested AYL, so we haven't incorporated it into our school as much as FStSS. (I am actually using it w/my dd along w/ lots of other materials w/the Prairie Primer.)

 

I am not one that likes textbooks, but for a textbook FStSS is great. I personally don't agree w/the Catholic Project's grade level designations. I would never use either book for upper middle school and most definitely not for high school. I think that they are easily used by 4th- 6th graders. 7th is the oldest I would consider using them and then only w/lots of supplementing. I cannot fathom them being appropriate for a 9th grader.

[ElizaG]

I have not heard that. I wonder what specifically they have a problem with.

I find this puzzling, too. The only thing I can think of is that FStSS has a 2-page section on Dorothy Day and Peter Maurin. There are some dodgy types in the Catholic Worker movement (and likely always have been, as it's decentralized and staffed by volunteers), but it's my understanding that the founders were orthodox and motivated by gospel values. I can see how the authors' praise of their efforts might raise eyebrows in some circles, but it seemed appropriate to me.

 

We have some pre-Vatican II textbooks that are actually much more explicit than FStSS in their promotion of Catholic social teaching. They put a lot of emphasis on the encyclicals of Leo XIII, with discussion of how things like trade unions and social welfare programs fit into this. (The authors' portrayal of the New Deal is generally favorable, though students are encouraged to investigate and debate both sides.) In recent decades, it seems as if many American Catholics have become more polarized in their political and economic views. In this context, CSTP is bound to offend somebody if they mention any current issues at all. But I think their overall presentation is remarkably balanced.