Singapore Math ??

[abrightmom]

Anyway, it doesn't matter as I really don't think Singapore is well set up to be a stand-alone program.

 

I'd love to hear why you think this! There does seem to be widely varying opinions about HOW to use Singapore (stand alone as in just the workbook/textbook, HIGs or no HIGs, supplemental materials, extra practice, etc. etc.).

 

It's a question that I have been wanting to ask. WHY so many opinions on HOW to use Singapore and make sure it is effective?

[pgr]

Can I ask why you say this? I'm considering Singapore for my DD for first grade. What do you feel is lacking?

 

I'd love to hear why you think this! There does seem to be widely varying opinions about HOW to use Singapore (stand alone as in just the workbook/textbook, HIGs or no HIGs, supplemental materials, extra practice, etc. etc.).

 

It's a question that I have been wanting to ask. WHY so many opinions on HOW to use Singapore and make sure it is effective?

 

 

I'd love to hear more about this as well, as I'm also consdering for my DD's first grade. It also seems that different people are supplementing with different (types of) materials/methods?

[jewel7123]

My understanding is if you use all the components (IP, CWP, HIGs, etc.) it is definitely a full and complete program.

[Dana]

My understanding is if you use all the components (IP, CWP, HIGs, etc.) it is definitely a full and complete program.

 

:iagree:

 

I'm very happy with it.

I use Miquon as well for different approaches (I really like how they do division) and additional practice. I think the Standards edition includes enough practice, but the US edition didn't for us. If a child is stuck on a concept, they may need more practice than is available in Singapore (but I think that'd be true of any program).

[mystika1]

I use Singapore Math as a stand alone program and it is more than enough. I do use everything though.(Text, Workbook, Higs, Extra Practice and Word Problems) I think if someone is coming from a program like Saxon that covers things like the calendar then maybe they feel it is not enough.... but we covered the calendar in PreK with days of the week and don't find anything missing. I have also heard that some people don't like having so many books to use. I don't find it to be a problem but... I have removed the binding from my workbooks, Extra Practice books and Word Problem books and made one large workbook. For each workbook page I matched the EP sheets up and added word problems so for each lesson everything that my dd will be writing on is in one place ready to go.

 

HTH,

 

Penny

[Spy Car]

 

It's a question that I have been wanting to ask. WHY so many opinions on HOW to use Singapore and make sure it is effective?

 

This in part can be explained in the fact that different children have different needs, as do their parent-teachers. And people have different goals.

 

I see it as a strength of the Singapore materials that there is an à la carte quality to selecting books that we feel match our children's needs. More problems at the same level, as in the SE "Extra Practice" books, would be a poor fit with my son, but might be just the thing for someone else's child.

 

I love the US Edition IPs, but I can see they might be too hard for some kids. So we get to "customize" what works for our children. We just have to realize children have different needs, and parents have different needs as well in the kind or amount of teaching support they desire.

 

Guaranteed, you will never (ever) find unanimity of opinion on the teaching of mathematics on this forum.

 

Bill

[abrightmom]

Guaranteed, you will never (ever) find unanimity of opinion on the teaching of mathematics on this forum.

 

Bill

:iagree:

[poetic license]

I see it as a strength of the Singapore materials that there is an à la carte quality to selecting books that we feel match our children's needs. More problems at the same level, as in the SE "Extra Practice" books, would be a poor fit with my son, but might be just the thing for someone else's child.

 

I love the US Edition IPs, but I can see they might be too hard for some kids.

 

 

Ok, I'm confused-- I added bolding about the part I'm not clear on.

 

Is the Standards Edition "Extra Practice" the equivalent of the US Edition "Intensive Practice"?

 

So for those who prefer the SE HIGs, then you'd add in the IP from the US edition? Is that OK? As in, does it end up being compatible, or do you have to stick with the US ed. if you do the IP?

 

My head is spinning. :confused:

[Spy Car]

Ok, I'm confused-- I added bolding about the part I'm not clear on.

 

Is the Standards Edition "Extra Practice" the equivalent of the US Edition "Intensive Practice"?

 

No it is not, and I understand the confusion.

 

The "Extra Practice" books from the Standards Edition series are books of additional problems at the same basic degree of difficulty as the problems found in the corresponding Workbook. They are, as the name suggests, "Extra Practice."

 

Because the SE is relatively new singaporemath has not yet published Standards Edition versions of the "Intensive Practice" books yet. These IP books contain work that is definitely more challenging (and I would say more interesting) than those in the Workbooks. The IPs are only currently available from the US Edition series. So those like myself who are using the SE and want to use IPs use the ones from the US Edition. Not a big deal, but it can cause confusion when ordering.

 

So for those who prefer the SE HIGs, then you'd add in the IP from the US edition? Is that OK? As in, does it end up being compatible, or do you have to stick with the US ed. if you do the IP?

 

My head is spinning. :confused:

 

Yes. Yes. And Yes and No.

 

I use the Standards Edition and have had no problems using the US Edition IPs with the Standards Edition Text and Workbooks. Many people do the same, this is what singaporemath advises until the publish SE IPs (which last I asked seemed like they were a long way off). The SE is usually ahead, if anything, in sequence. Not a problem. The IPs add an additional level of challenge and raise the bar on the whole program quite a bit. So I mix books from the two series to good effect. You can too.

 

 

Bill

Edited February 24, 2011 by Spy Car

[abrightmom]

Extra Practice is "on level" and is tied to either edition (so you choose U.S. or SE as far as I can tell). For example, if you're enjoying a lesson but find that your kiddo needs more problems of the same type/level to bring it home then you could use Extra Practice as seen here http://www.christianbook.com/Christian/Books/easy_find?Ntt=singapore+extra+practice&N=0&Ntk=keywords&action=Search&Ne=0&event=ESRCN&nav_search=1&cms=1&search=.

 

The Intensive Practice series is more advanced and is presently only available in the U.S. Edition. More knowledgeable users can help you with how to correlate it with your studies. I am brand new to Singapore. The IP series is challenging and I've had it recommended to me to use it half to one year behind. For example, if your child has completed 2B then perhaps you'd use IP 1B if you want to stretch your kiddo's brain :D. Here:http://www.christianbook.com/Christian/Books/easy_find?Ntt=singapore+intensive+practice&N=0&Ntk=keywords&action=Search&Ne=0&event=ESRCN&nav_search=1&cms=1&search=

 

*** If my links look weird please forgive me! I'm learning how to use a Mac and it's challenging me!***:lol:

[poetic license]

Aha, I think I understand it.

 

Are the Challenging Word Problems similarly considered to be about a level ahead?

 

ETA: Thanks for the explanations :)

[ondreeuh]

I'd love to hear more about this as well, as I'm also consdering for my DD's first grade. It also seems that different people are supplementing with different (types of) materials/methods?

 

I hesitate to even write, because I know there are some die-hard Singapore fans who will take offense and argue with me, and I am not interested in debate. So I will preface this with it being my opinion only.

 

Singapore is a mastery program. In each grade level, you work on one skill for a while, then move on to another, then another. The review is periodic and not daily. Times table practice is to be done on your own.

 

I do not argue that this works well for many students. However, I do not like the way it is set up. Doing problems of one type for several days in a row (at the exclusion of everything else) and then moving on to something else, with only occasional review, leads to many, MANY students missing long-term retention. There's just not enough follow up for it to be effective. When we used it, I had to go back and re-teach concepts that had been previously "mastered." This led to lots and lots of frustration for my child, who knew he should know how to do the problems but couldn't remember. It also wasted a lot of time. :glare: It reminds me of friends who have spent extended time in another country and learned the language through immersion. Once they got home they quickly forgot the language because they weren't using it.

 

Measurement, for example, is done towards the end of each grade level. If I'm remembering correctly that there are no questions on measurement in the earlier lessons of each grade, you could literally go 10-12 months before working on measurement again. Some kids will do okay with that, but many (most?) will not. In contrast, spiral programs will keep asking the student to measure things all year long, which puts the skill in long-term memory. You don't have to back-up and re-teach because nothing has been lost.

 

The people who seem to make Singapore work for them juggle 3-5 different books and make up their own review. This keeps it from being a stand-alone program. It has its redeeming qualities and I love the way it teaches certain concepts, but I don't think it lends itself to long-term retention unless you manipulate the program or supplement it.

[Allearia]

I use Singapore Math as a stand alone program and it is more than enough. I do use everything though.(Text, Workbook, Higs, Extra Practice and Word Problems) I think if someone is coming from a program like Saxon that covers things like the calendar then maybe they feel it is not enough.... but we covered the calendar in PreK with days of the week and don't find anything missing. I have also heard that some people don't like having so many books to use. I don't find it to be a problem but... I have removed the binding from my workbooks, Extra Practice books and Word Problem books and made one large workbook. For each workbook page I matched the EP sheets up and added word problems so for each lesson everything that my dd will be writing on is in one place ready to go.

 

 

 

I just started 2A with my younger son and wanted to do this but was caught up by sometimes the other side of the page going with the next unit, so I would have to copy some pages and I wasn't sure it was worth the trouble. Tell me how you did this! A bit off topic but I would love to try this...

[Spy Car]

Extra Practice is "on level" and is tied to either edition (so you choose U.S. or SE as far as I can tell). For example, if you're enjoying a lesson but find that your kiddo needs more problems of the same type/level to bring it home then you could use Extra Practice as seen here http://www.christianbook.com/Christian/Books/easy_find?Ntt=singapore+extra+practice&N=0&Ntk=keywords&action=Search&Ne=0&event=ESRCN&nav_search=1&cms=1&search=.

 

The Intensive Practice series is more advanced and is presently only available in the U.S. Edition. More knowledgeable users can help you with how to correlate it with your studies. I am brand new to Singapore. The IP series is challenging and I've had it recommended to me to use it half to one year behind. For example, if your child has completed 2B then perhaps you'd use IP 1B if you want to stretch your kiddo's brain :D. Here:http://www.christianbook.com/Christian/Books/easy_find?Ntt=singapore+intensive+practice&N=0&Ntk=keywords&action=Search&Ne=0&event=ESRCN&nav_search=1&cms=1&search=

 

*** If my links look weird please forgive me! I'm learning how to use a Mac and it's challenging me!***:lol:

 

Aha, I think I understand it.

 

Are the Challenging Word Problems similarly considered to be about a level ahead?

 

ETA: Thanks for the explanations :)

 

Again it get down to the ability to customize. We are doing Singapore a year ahead of grade level, so are now in 2B in First Grade and use the same Level 2B IPs and the Level 2 CWP.

 

What someone else might do might depend on their child. No question about it the IPs are harder than the Workbooks. Does that mean you use them in conjunction with the same level Workbook because your child finds the Workbooks "easy", or do you do them behind, or do you forget about it and do Extra Practice instead, or do you just stick to the Workbooks and Textbook, or do you chose some other combination entirely?

 

Many options. Options can confound, but they allow us to tailor materials to our children's needs.

 

Bill

[catz]

If you are mathy , HIG's are not necessary . You get very intuitive looking at the textbooks only .

I'd save the money and buy the intensive practice and CWP instead. For grades 3&up , I'd consider buying the HIG's but only if using SM as the main or only math.

 

I would buy the HIG's if you are not a math person or if your child needs a lot of extra practice and you are not creative enough to invent games .

 

:iagree:

 

I took my son through 6B and he's now in NEM1, and I've never owned an HIG. I have a math degree, and I have a very mathy kid (he's a 4th grader). I have no problem coming up with manipulatives to demo things on the fly. Even my first grader is starting to roll her eyes when I bring out the manipulatives.

 

So it really depends on you and your child. I had no problem without the HIG.

[abrightmom]

I hesitate to even write, because I know there are some die-hard Singapore fans who will take offense and argue with me, and I am not interested in debate. So I will preface this with it being my opinion only.

 

Singapore is a mastery program. In each grade level, you work on one skill for a while, then move on to another, then another. The review is periodic and not daily. Times table practice is to be done on your own.

 

I do not argue that this works well for many students. However, I do not like the way it is set up. Doing problems of one type for several days in a row (at the exclusion of everything else) and then moving on to something else, with only occasional review, leads to many, MANY students missing long-term retention. There's just not enough follow up for it to be effective. When we used it, I had to go back and re-teach concepts that had been previously "mastered." This led to lots and lots of frustration for my child, who knew he should know how to do the problems but couldn't remember. It also wasted a lot of time. :glare: It reminds me of friends who have spent extended time in another country and learned the language through immersion. Once they got home they quickly forgot the language because they weren't using it.

 

Measurement, for example, is done towards the end of each grade level. If I'm remembering correctly that there are no questions on measurement in the earlier lessons of each grade, you could literally go 10-12 months before working on measurement again. Some kids will do okay with that, but many (most?) will not. In contrast, spiral programs will keep asking the student to measure things all year long, which puts the skill in long-term memory. You don't have to back-up and re-teach because nothing has been lost.

 

The people who seem to make Singapore work for them juggle 3-5 different books and make up their own review. This keeps it from being a stand-alone program. It has its redeeming qualities and I love the way it teaches certain concepts, but I don't think it lends itself to long-term retention unless you manipulate the program or supplement it.

Ondreeuh,

 

Thanks for being brave and for sharing! :001_smile: I myself am a little baffled by mastery vs. spiral right now. I'm nervous . . . we'll see how my son handles his end of the year "test" with Math Mammoth which is also mastery. I honestly wonder if he'll forget half of what he's learned :D. Experience will teach each of us something different!!:001_smile:

 

Thanks again for sharing!

[Chaqar]

This in part can be explained in the fact that different children have different needs, as do their parent-teachers. And people have different goals.

 

I see it as a strength of the Singapore materials that there is an à la carte quality to selecting books that we feel match our children's needs. More problems at the same level, as in the SE "Extra Practice" books, would be a poor fit with my son, but might be just the thing for someone else's child.

 

I love the US Edition IPs, but I can see they might be too hard for some kids. So we get to "customize" what works for our children. We just have to realize children have different needs, and parents have different needs as well in the kind or amount of teaching support they desire.

 

Guaranteed, you will never (ever) find unanimity of opinion on the teaching of mathematics on this forum.

 

Bill

 

:iagree: Well said.

 

For those concerned about a child needing more review to retain what has been learned, I can see how this might be very true with some children. I find the review is easily accomplished by staggering the chosen supplemental materials. I have not needed to create any additional review.

[Chaqar]

Sure , I have 1 , 2 and 3 Hig's but have not used them much. I would not say they are useless , but they are not necessary for someone who is math minded. I did not see anything different in the way they teach math than I do ... except for the games. They do have very good games and I am not creative at all . For me they were still worth , just for the games.

 

Maybe it has to do with the fact that I was schooled in Europe? Maybe our math was presented in a different way than US ? Or maybe it has to do with the fact that I am a right brainer ? Not sure , but for grades 1-3 , there is nothing special about SM that one cannot teach without the HIG's . Just my opinion of course :)

 

Interesting. I, too, have purchased all the HIGs but not used them much. I am glad to have them on hand because I occasionally pull them out when I'm struggling to explain a concept, but they are too cumbersome to navigate on a daily basis. The games have helped us out of a rut on occasion, too! I feel confident that I am teaching "The Singaporian Way" from the time that I have spent reading over the HIGs (and Liping Ma's excellent book). It seems erroneous to assume that one cannot possibly be doing it "right" without the HIGs, though I can see how this is sometimes (perhaps often) the case.

 

Your thoughts on being right-brained are interesting to me. I'm a strange blend--both mathy and artsy--and I find the textbook drawings (thanks to the included thought bubbles) to be very intuitive as well. I can also point to a few excellent math teachers that were sprinkled into my education over the years. They challenged me to understand everything that I learned on a conceptual level.

 

Anyway, I can relate to your thoughts. :001_smile: