scrapbabe Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 Okay, I just need real solid advice here and no judgement. For various reasons (those of you who have read my other posts might piece it together) my just turned 14 yr old is half way through 8th grade and just starting TTPre-Alg. He is super bright and math oriented. I know he can catch on to the pre-algebra concepts quickly. He understands fractions, decimals, and percents conceptually, but needs more practice to be fluent at it. He makes mistakes sometimes because he hasn't had a ton of practice. What I want is to jump into a rigorous pre-algebra/algebra course right away, while at the same time having him practicing and getting solid with fractions, etc. What would you do? Should I get the fractions, etc. down really tight first and then worry about getting him into pre-alg/algebra, or can I do them simultaneously? Or do you have a better idea? I just desperately want to help him catch up and have a good, solid math foundation. He definitely has the brains and desire to do it. Oh please help me figure out what to do. Thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dina in Oklahoma Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 (edited) "Should I get the fractions, etc. down really tight first and then worry about getting him into pre-alg/algebra . . . " That would be my first choice. I strongly believe that mastering arithmatic is crucial if one is going to be successful in upper-level math. Why the rush? Why do you feel he is behind? Just because he has an aptitude for math doesn't mean he is ready do to X level at X grade. My DD has a beautiful singing voice, but she's not ready to sing professionally. She needs time for her voice to mature. Just one opinion~ Best Wishes, Dina :001_smile: Edited January 29, 2011 by Dina in Oklahoma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelBee Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 "Should I get the fractions, etc. down really tight first and then worry about getting him into pre-alg/algebra . . . " That would be my first choice. I strongly believe that mastering arithmatic is crucial if one is going to be successful in upper-level math. Why the rush? Why do you feel he is behind? Just because he has an aptitude for math doesn't mean he is ready do to X level at X grade. My DD has a beautiful singing voice, but she's not ready to sing professionally. She needs time for her voice to mature. Just one opinion~ Best Wishes, Dina :001_smile: :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rootsnwings Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 :iagree: I can't recommend highly enough the LOF fractions & decimals and percents books for someone in your situation. Maybe have him use the LOF books as a supplement to whatever pre-algebra program he's working on and by the end of the summer he'll be ready to tackle algebra? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandy in TN Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 First, he is not behind. I promise there are plenty of children who do pre-alg in 9th grade. (I know that is sometimes hard to believe when you read these boards.) Even if he doesn't finish pre-alg until the end of 9th grade, he can still do 1 math each year and complete alg1, alg2, and geometry in high school. If that is what happens and he then goes on to college, many majors will only require one semester of college alg to graduate. It's not the end of the world and if he wants to major in something that requires more math, he will have to decide that it is important enough to buckle down and move forward. Second, meet him where he is. If he needs to work some more on fractions, decimals, and percents, then work on that. Fractions are foundational. They really need to be mastered for him to be successful moving forward into alg. My suggestion would be the Key to workbooks. They aren't expensive or flashy. They are just basic git-er-dun workbooks. He may not need to do them all. Since he does understand the basics, maybe he could do fractions books 2-4 and just a couple from decimals and the final percents. Maybe you could look at the titles and decide. Third- If the lack of knowledge on these topics is a deficit that is interfering with his ability to complete his pre-algebra lessons, then I wouldn't move forward. Even if it isn't I would not move on to a program more rigorous than TT without a solid grasp of fractions. However, if he isn't having difficulty with TT but you just feel that he needs some additional practice on these topics, then I would have him continue with TT while working through the Key to books. If you want to fit in more math before he graduates high school, I would suggest doing Alg1 and geometry in the same year rather than trying to push or skimp on these foundational topics. HTH- Mandy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wapiti Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 :iagree: Some other options for nailing down these topics would be the Key-to series (Key to Fractions, Key to Decimals, Key to Percents), or the MM blue series booklets on those topics. I'd probably do that first, before starting pre-algebra. Once those topics are nailed down, he's more likely to move easily/quickly through a rigorous pre-algebra. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrapbabe Posted January 29, 2011 Author Share Posted January 29, 2011 I love you guys! Thanks so much for helping me to see it clearly. I'm just too close to the situation to not feel like a failure. I feel like he's behind because we had a year or more in there where not much math was getting done, due to extenuating circumstances. I know if we'd have stayed on track he'd be much further along. We are doing TT Pre Alg, but right now it is revisiting fractions, decimals and percents. He is doing LOF along with it, and even supplementing a little with Key To... I guess it sounds better coming from someone else. I have just really felt badly that we "fell behind". He's super smart and had life not thrown us off course, he would be in Algebra right now. Thanks again! So much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelBee Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 I love you guys! Thanks so much for helping me to see it clearly. I'm just too close to the situation to not feel like a failure. I feel like he's behind because we had a year or more in there where not much math was getting done, due to extenuating circumstances. I know if we'd have stayed on track he'd be much further along. We are doing TT Pre Alg, but right now it is revisiting fractions, decimals and percents. He is doing LOF along with it, and even supplementing a little with Key To... I guess it sounds better coming from someone else. I have just really felt badly that we "fell behind". He's super smart and had life not thrown us off course, he would be in Algebra right now. Thanks again! So much! :grouphug: I can so relate to how u are feeling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dina in Oklahoma Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 Shalynn ~ I can completely relate to feeling behind (especially in math which is DD's nemisis.) We are all behind in some area. Every child has strenghts and areas they need to work on. Perhaps he would have been farther ahead without all the setbacks however, you are teaching him a valuable lesson in how to deal and adjust when life throws you a curve. Isn't that what parents are for? He will be fine with a caring mom like you! Blessings, Dina :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1Togo Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 Just to make you feel better. When our son left p.s., his math skills were so weak that he started homeschool math with Pre-algebra in 11th grade. He worked on math year-round, 6 days per week. He took a gap year before college to continue working on math and other skills. In his three years of school at home, he completed Pre-algebra, Algebra I, Algebra II, Advanced Math with Trig, and 1/3 of a Calculus text. With determination, a student can catch up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallory Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 I agree that he needs to get through pre-algebra well. One level of math that you can double up on is geometry. Perhaps now, but probably better to wait until he starts algebra or even algebra 2 and do geometry with those. (or do geometry 1/2 time during both years). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloridaLisa Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 Remember too that you can work through the summer, so even if you feel behind now, you may feel caught up by mid summer. It's always better to nail the foundational skills in any area before moving on to higher math. Otherwise, you'll lose time b/c you may have to backtrack to pick up rocky skills. So spend the time now -- bit by bit, consistently every day -- to continue on with the math where he is at. Definitely make sure fractions, decimals and percents are solid as well as other pre-algebra skills like transitioning between unit measures and such. HTH, Lisa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EKS Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 Lial's Basic College Math. It does a solid review of arithmetic and also has prealgebra. With a lot of work, you could get it done in a semester. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8filltheheart Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 Lial's Basic College Math. It does a solid review of arithmetic and also has prealgebra. With a lot of work, you could get it done in a semester. I 2nd this advice. IMHO it is a better track than TT and supplements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrapbabe Posted January 29, 2011 Author Share Posted January 29, 2011 I 2nd this advice. IMHO it is a better track than TT and supplements. Why do you think it's a better path? Why would Lial's be different? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8filltheheart Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 Why do you think it's a better path? Why would Lial's be different? Lial's is designed to do exactly what you are describing. You are attempting to put together a mish-mash of materials to cover all the bases. Lial's was written to help students in the position that your ds is in. Successful completion will land him in a strong position to begin alg. Would the list you have compiled? Probably. But, if it were my ds, I would go with a program that approached everything systematically vs. trying to supplement. Just my thoughts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrapbabe Posted January 29, 2011 Author Share Posted January 29, 2011 Lial's is designed to do exactly what you are describing. You are attempting to put together a mish-mash of materials to cover all the bases. Lial's was written to help students in the position that your ds is in. Successful completion will land him in a strong position to begin alg. Would the list you have compiled? Probably. But, if it were my ds, I would go with a program that approached everything systematically vs. trying to supplement. Just my thoughts. I really appreciate your response. Thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EKS Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 Lial's is designed to do exactly what you are describing. You are attempting to put together a mish-mash of materials to cover all the bases. Lial's was written to help students in the position that your ds is in. Successful completion will land him in a strong position to begin alg. Would the list you have compiled? Probably. But, if it were my ds, I would go with a program that approached everything systematically vs. trying to supplement. Just my thoughts. :iagree: Also, Lial's is designed for older students. There is nothing remotely babyish about it, which is a plus if he is sensitive about being behind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrapbabe Posted January 29, 2011 Author Share Posted January 29, 2011 :iagree: Also, Lial's is designed for older students. There is nothing remotely babyish about it, which is a plus if he is sensitive about being behind. So this is what you're talking about? http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0321557123/ref=s9_simh_gw_p14_d0_i1?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-2&pf_rd_r=0XCP0TC2R01BK7KSG23G&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=470938631&pf_rd_i=507846 It has a separate solutions manual. Is there anything that goes with it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8filltheheart Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 I would not buy the new edition. Jann in TX is a math teacher and she has posted quite a bit about Lial's. I did a quick search and found this post: http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2164055&highlight=bcm#post2164055 It looks like she recommends the 7th ed. BUt, if you have specific questions, you might try pming her. She is very knowledgeable and helpful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EKS Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 So this is what you're talking about? http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0321557123/ref=s9_simh_gw_p14_d0_i1?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-2&pf_rd_r=0XCP0TC2R01BK7KSG23G&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=470938631&pf_rd_i=507846 It has a separate solutions manual. Is there anything that goes with it? There are video lessons you can get, but they're probably not necessary. You can also get tests, but the book has a test at the end of each chapter as well that you can use. You can see samples of the text at pearsonhighered.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrapbabe Posted January 29, 2011 Author Share Posted January 29, 2011 There are video lessons you can get, but they're probably not necessary. You can also get tests, but the book has a test at the end of each chapter as well that you can use. You can see samples of the text at pearsonhighered.com. Thank you so much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dina in Oklahoma Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 Shalynn~ FYI --Jann also teaches online classes. She is awesome and helped me outline a path for my DD. Dina Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mryann Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 I just want to add my yes! this is a great idea to the suggestion to use Lial's. My 7th grader is halfway through the book this year and it's been the best year for him. He is so much more confident and comfortable with math. I decided to use it because of Jann in TX's post and also because it's part of my prep for the HSPT test in the fall of my son's 8th grade year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LauraQ Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 Start him in Algebra. If it proves to be too hard, drop back to a pre-algebra program, or a fractions-only program (such as Key To or Life of Fred) before returning to Algebra. I never ever ever ever took pre-algebra in school. I was bright, but not math-oriented. I did just fine. I made all A's in that class, in fact, because the teacher didn't require homework, so I didn't have any zeros averaged into my grades ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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