I feel like I am failing my youngest DD

[Ann.without.an.e]

She is very intelligent. Everything comes so easy to her...she is my "easy out". She is the child I don't have to think about schooling. I just hand her the work and she does it. The problem is that she is capable of soooo much more. It is all busy work for her because there isn't a single challenging thing there. I have DD12 and DS9 to work with while chasing down a toddler. She is happy to complete all of her "easy" work in 30 minutes or less and then go play. Intellectually she can work on a higher level than her older brother (17 months apart) and last year I combined them - moving her up two grades. She did fine and typically tested better than he tested in any given subject. At our end of year testing, the proctor suggested that I split them up for my DS's sake, she was afraid that his self-confidence was being tackled in the process of combining them. She said that DD was about to majorly surpass him. DD tested higher than DS on the end of year testing in every thing except Spelling, even though he tested at least at grade level on everything himself. I think they testing equally in reading.

Fast forward to this year....I split them again but ended up pretty much keeping her in the same grade as last year in order to do it. The proctor suggested two separate curriculums, but I just didn't have the time or money. Baby monkey was as at a difficult stage and it was just easy for me. I feel so guilty because her schooling has zero challenge for her. Except cursive, I am working with her on her cursive...she struggles with some of the letters.

She does learn a lot on her own. She loves to read non-fiction. She has re-read the entire MOH I book this year in her spare time and she has started over now a third time. Her reading level test at the end of 1st grade put her at a 6th grade reading level for both comprehension and fluency. I had the BJU Readers here and last summer she read them all in a few weeks, right through the 6th grade volume.

 

Any thoughts on challenging her without compromising DS's "confidence"?

 

Oh, and bless your heart if you have read this far :)

 

Edited to add: She is 2nd grade this year, if that matters

Edited December 29, 2010 by Charleigh

[iquilt]

A lot can be said for allowing her the freedom to read what she finds interesting and time to explore her own ideas thru play. Now I'm not an unschooler by any stretch, but my middle is my easy child who sits down to do her work, who is reading very well and who plays for hours at putting on plays, drawing at the art space and practicing ballet. She teaches her younger brother how to do games and puzzles. It doesn't sound to me at all that you are letting her down. HTH

[rwilliams]

Instead of trying to begin a whole new curriculum with her, could you just start challenging her in one area and get that working well and then figure out another area. Maybe start with a subject you already have some ideas in and try a new program or book with her. Carve out time to help her with that. Is that anything appropriate on the computer for her?

[ChandlerMom]

She is very intelligent. Everything comes so easy to her...she is my "easy out". She is the child I don't have to think about schooling. I just hand her the work and she does it. The problem is that she is capable of soooo much more. It is all busy work for her because there isn't a single challenging thing there. I have DD12 and DS9 to work with while chasing down a toddler. She is happy to complete all of her "easy" work in 30 minutes or less and then go play. Intellectually she can work on a higher level than her older brother (17 months apart) and last year I combined them - moving her up two grades. She did fine and typically tested better than he tested in any given subject. At our end of year testing, the proctor suggested that I split them up for my DS's sake, she was afraid that his self-confidence was being tackled in the process of combining them. She said that DD was about to majorly surpass him. DD tested higher than DS on the end of year testing in every thing except Spelling, even though he tested at least at grade level on everything himself. I think they testing equally in reading.

Fast forward to this year....I split them again but ended up pretty much keeping her in the same grade as last year in order to do it. The proctor suggested two separate curriculums, but I just didn't have the time or money. Baby monkey was as at a difficult stage and it was just easy for me. I feel so guilty because her schooling has zero challenge for her. Except cursive, I am working with her on her cursive...she struggles with some of the letters.

She does learn a lot on her own. She loves to read non-fiction. She has re-read the entire MOH I book this year in her spare time and she has started over now a third time. Her reading level test at the end of 1st grade put her at a 6th grade reading level for both comprehension and fluency. I had the BJU Readers here and last summer she read them all in a few weeks, right through the 6th grade volume.

 

Any thoughts on challenging her without compromising DS's "confidence"?

 

Oh, and bless your heart if you have read this far :)

 

Edited to add: She is 2nd grade this year, if that matters

 

One question: besides the proctor's comments, have YOU ever seen evidence your ds has confidence issues because of your dd's academic success? Was the proctor a developmental psychologist who has done a full psych eval on your kdis?

 

Personally, if you don't see it, I would discard those concerns and teach them together. If you do see confidence issues, deal with THEM -- don't create new issues by trying to hide the problem by separating them. DO you really thing ds won't notice hsi sis is ahead just because they aren't using the same curriculum??? I don't see how it is really any different from a classroom where some kids will be ahead of others. So what? Because it is your (younger) sister you shouldn't have to deal with it?

 

One of the joys of HSing is being able to define their "norms" and if dd and ds are hearing from YOU that it is great they can do things together. Sounds like your son is also excelling, so what is wrong with him learning to be proud of his little sis? Ultimately, is SHE going to feel she was held back because her brother's ed is more important than her own?

 

It sounds like if your goal is to provide an education for ALL your children that best serves their needs and abilities, there is no way to avoid your dd passing your ds. Instead of trying to avoid that and penalizing your dd for being younger, why not embrace it and find a way to spin it as a GOOD thing for both your kids?? They can be a team, they can learn "group projects" and he'll LOVE being able to split projects up with his sis! As long as your metric is doing the best to their abilities, there's no reason it can't be a very positive thing for both of them.

 

If you don't like the cards you're dealt, play a different game!

 

Good luck!

 

ETA: you don't need to feel guilty, you didn't do anything wrong. But it sounds like your gut is saying something's not quite right, so go from there. Only you and your dc's are actually living with these choices, so only you can decide what is best for all! Don't let the proctor, or me, or anyone else lead you astray from following your heart.

Edited December 29, 2010 by ChandlerMom

[Snowfall]

One of the joys of HSing is being able to define their "norms" and if dd and ds are hearing from YOU that it is great they can do things together. Sounds like your son is also excelling, so what is wrong with him learning to be proud of his little sis? Ultimately, is SHE going to feel she was held back because her brother's ed is more important than her own?

 

Or worse, that she was held back because his feelings were more important than her education? Self-esteem is kind of a joke when you make it about other people. Sure, you might not be the best at everything, but did you TRY hard? Did you put forth an effort that you can be proud of? Then there's a little self-esteem.

 

It sounds like your daughter is probably learning a lot on her own anyway, so I wouldn't be too worried that she's really falling behind. I just think it teaches everyone the wrong lesson in this situation. Your daughter sort of learns that she doesn't need to put forth any effort and your son learns that his sense of self is so delicate that everyone must fail to put for their best effort in order to protect it.

 

I'm definitely not any expert on home schooling 2 kids, so maybe take that with a grain of salt. I was a highly gifted kid, though, and when I switched from private to public school in 2nd grade, I was soooo far ahead of what those kids were doing, but they wouldn't bump me up a grade because I was already a year ahead. I still remember all those wasted days - it was years before we got to a point that I was learning anything new. I just think kids should be met where they're at, regardless of what the other kids think about it or whatever.

[Celia]

I would give her what challanges her, regardless of where other kids her age are at. It's a valuable lesson to any child to know that there are people who will have strengths in areas they don't. Your son will always have people around him that are better than him at something. I would, however, find something he enjoys and is good at that is all his so he doesn't feel overshadowed in every department. A sport or musical instrument or something.

[AuntPol]

My kids are 15 months apart. I school them at same level except for math, which my youngest is ahead in. Actually, you can say we try to stretch her to his level. He drives our curriculum choices more than she does because he loves school where she just sees it as a means to an end. On the other hand, she drives our social calendar, field trips, and arts.

 

I have discussed this with my older. She is gifted herself and his doing better is not any reflection on her capabilities. She tested at 93% for her grade which is not shabby unless you compare it to her brother's 99%ile for same grade. She has her own strengths and academics is not the end all be all of being a successful adult.

 

We thought about grade skipping DS but right now we are not going to do it officially because of sports (he talented enough to get a scholarship but he's already young for his grade and on the smaller end of the sprectrum for his age group)

[Capt_Uhura]

I think a big issue here as well is the lack of challenge for your DD. I saw what lack of challenge did for my DS in PS from K-2. It's time I will always regret. My boys are almost exactly 3yrs apart. My oldest learns very quickly and is very bright as is my younger son. My younger son does MCT Paragraph Town and practice town with his brother. The younger seldom misses anything. I give them the same spelling test and often my older misses more than the younger. I just emphasize that each have their strengths. So far it hasn't been an issue. I would combine them.

 

Think of it this way, if they were fraternal twins, what would you do? Would you purposefully hold one back in order to protect the self-esteem of the other? Granted she's just in 2nd grade so it's not as important now as far as her academics, but what other more important lessons might she take away from this, as the others have mentioned?

 

It's a tough situation and I wish you much luck! I also have a 4yr old DD and I know how hard it is to try and meet everyone's needs.

[WistfulRidge]

she needs to know that it is ok for education to take some work. when gifted kids never have to work at learning, they often come to think that everything should be easy and end up refusing to do any tasks that really challenge them.

 

 

:iagree:

 

This. I was one of those kids that got everything easily and without effort. Neither the school (when I was in PS) or my mother (when I was HS'd) ever really challenged me, and it hurt me in college. I did well, but I could have done so much better. Even though I knew that I could do better I always had a hard time going back and making something "good" be "better" because it had been ingrained in me that I was smart enough that everything should be easy. So if it took more effort that was strictly "easy" it was very hard to motivate myself and my education suffered for it.

[HomesteadMommy]

If your dd enjoys reading on her own she is probably learning a lot already. But if you want more challanging work for her I wouldn't hold it back because it "might" hurt your son's feelings.

If he was in a class room setting some children would be on his level others a head or behind him. Same will happen in the work place.

I would give her what you feel is the right level of challenge and the same with your son. If you see any problems coming from it then talk to them then and I'm sure you can work it out. :grouphug:

[Ann.without.an.e]

One question: besides the proctor's comments, have YOU ever seen evidence your ds has confidence issues because of your dd's academic success? Was the proctor a developmental psychologist who has done a full psych eval on your kdis?

 

 

 

 

 

No, DS is the most non-competitive child I know and DD is extremely competetive. If she was doing 6th grade math and he was doing grade level, he could care less. I have no idea why I let her sway me this way. She was afraid that inside there were inner problems. The reality is, she is gifted and he knows that. I don't think he is upset that he can't do the work better. I have told him - she is just really intelligent, it doesn't mean that you are not. He seems to completely understand that. He is a cool kid. Maybe I need to go back to working with them together? He really didn't seem to care :001_huh:

[Ann.without.an.e]

I'd go with the advice of using a different curriculum..it does not serve her well to remain unchallenged.

 

Consider applying for the Davidson Institute Young Scholars program. They have the experience to help you and it's low cost.

 

 

Hmmm...good thought. I have her last year's test and she excels their requirements, but I only have one test score and I don't know that I am going to pay for a second test right now. They require two different submissions. Seeing their suggestions, makes me realize even more how gifted she is, she excels even their test requirements. I really need to challenge her more.

[texasmama]

Haven't read any of the other replies...

 

I have two boys who are two years apart, currently in 4th and 2nd grade. The younger is working at the same level in several of our subjects as the older. I struggled at one point about the comparisons the older might make if his younger brother was in the same level as he was in some subjects, but in the end I decided that I needed to meet the individual needs of each child. This meant that we began the year with both boys in WWE2. When my oldest remarked that they were in the same level, I explained to him that I had looked at the higher level and decided that it was pretty advanced and he would be better served with more practice in the lower level. He accepted this answer just fine. Since then, he has moved up into the higher level.

 

Truth be told, my eight year old is better than I am in many things, particularly games. No really - he is...and not because I am a slouch. :tongue_smilie:He is just one of those naturally gifted individuals. Being naturally gifted intellectually comes with its own challenges.

 

I don't know if that helps you any, but the fact is that I have a younger child who will most likely leap past his older brother at some point. That will be a part of both of their realities in life, and I will handle the emotional impact of that as best I can as it arises. I don't worry about it, and I cannot change that reality. There is a good life lesson in there for both of them.:001_smile: We all have our own strengths.

Edited December 29, 2010 by texasmama

[HomesteadMommy]

No, DS is the most non-competitive child I know and DD is extremely competetive. If she was doing 6th grade math and he was doing grade level, he could care less. I have no idea why I let her sway me this way. She was afraid that inside there were inner problems. The reality is, she is gifted and he knows that. I don't think he is upset that he can't do the work better. I have told him - she is just really intelligent, it doesn't mean that you are not. He seems to completely understand that. He is a cool kid. Maybe I need to go back to working with them together? He really didn't seem to care :001_huh:

 

Yes you know your children better then ANYONE else. Follow your gut on this. :001_smile:

[RootAnn]

If she was doing 6th grade math and he was doing grade level, he could care less. ... He is a cool kid. Maybe I need to go back to working with them together? He really didn't seem to care :001_huh:

 

:001_smile: I think you've answered your own question. Talk with both kids. If you have the stuff, start them both together whenever you start back up with school (if you are currently on break). See how she does.

 

Most of all, :chillpill:

[Ann.without.an.e]

Consider using option #3 - the portfolio.

 

Deconstructing Penguins may be a good book for you to read..it'll help you see how to challenge her in lit. There are several threads on the board re: challenging in math.

 

Also consider the Talent Search provider options. They can be a lead on how to provide depth.

 

Since she's 8 and soaking nonfic, she could expand her world a little and find add'l challenge in a swim club or by studying an instrument. Or she can expand her book learning with drawing & nature study or projects of her choice, perhaps through 4H or with a mentor (any gp's or aunts/uncles?).

 

 

Good thoughts, thanks. :)

[Ann.without.an.e]

She may very well be above her brother's level. Have you checked out Hoggies Gifted? I actually found a book called "Teaching gifted kinds in the regular classroom" very useful in coming up with ways to challenge both of my kids. It is obviously not aimed at homeschoolers but was very interesting and helpful. Check your library. It talks about ways to have kids test out of material and setting them up to do open ended exploratory projects that are not teacher intensive. Very helpful for any of us! If you can't find it, PM me and I will give you a run down.

 

Finding the right level and pace to set for any child is difficult, even more so if that child has special needs and non-typical abilities.

 

 

My library does not have it, so sad : ( It sounds like a good one.

[MeganW]

One question: besides the proctor's comments, have YOU ever seen evidence your ds has confidence issues because of your dd's academic success? Was the proctor a developmental psychologist who has done a full psych eval on your kdis?

 

Personally, if you don't see it, I would discard those concerns and teach them together. If you do see confidence issues, deal with THEM -- don't create new issues by trying to hide the problem by separating them. DO you really thing ds won't notice hsi sis is ahead just because they aren't using the same curriculum??? I don't see how it is really any different from a classroom where some kids will be ahead of others. So what? Because it is your (younger) sister you shouldn't have to deal with it?

 

One of the joys of HSing is being able to define their "norms" and if dd and ds are hearing from YOU that it is great they can do things together. Sounds like your son is also excelling, so what is wrong with him learning to be proud of his little sis? Ultimately, is SHE going to feel she was held back because her brother's ed is more important than her own?

 

It sounds like if your goal is to provide an education for ALL your children that best serves their needs and abilities, there is no way to avoid your dd passing your ds. Instead of trying to avoid that and penalizing your dd for being younger, why not embrace it and find a way to spin it as a GOOD thing for both your kids?? They can be a team, they can learn "group projects" and he'll LOVE being able to split projects up with his sis! As long as your metric is doing the best to their abilities, there's no reason it can't be a very positive thing for both of them.

 

If you don't like the cards you're dealt, play a different game!

 

Good luck!

 

ETA: you don't need to feel guilty, you didn't do anything wrong. But it sounds like your gut is saying something's not quite right, so go from there. Only you and your dc's are actually living with these choices, so only you can decide what is best for all! Don't let the proctor, or me, or anyone else lead you astray from following your heart.

 

That's exactly what I was thinking! YOU know your kids a lot better than a proctor! If you aren't seeing those issues, go back to one curriculum for both!

[MeganW]

No, DS is the most non-competitive child I know and DD is extremely competetive. If she was doing 6th grade math and he was doing grade level, he could care less. I have no idea why I let her sway me this way. She was afraid that inside there were inner problems. The reality is, she is gifted and he knows that. I don't think he is upset that he can't do the work better. I have told him - she is just really intelligent, it doesn't mean that you are not. He seems to completely understand that. He is a cool kid. Maybe I need to go back to working with them together? He really didn't seem to care :001_huh:

 

I have triplets. One is completely typical. One is a gifted at math but can't get that letters go together to make words. One has some sort of processing problem - everything goes in but she struggles to get anything out when she needs the info.

 

In our house, it is NOT about test scores or who gets the most right or who is in highest level book. "Do your very best, with a smile!" The kid who got every problem right but sulked about doing the work is getting in trouble. The one who tried her very hardest with a good attitude is getting the praise, even though she got most of the answers wrong. Truly they don't even get that other people focus on grades / levels. If YOUR focus is on attitude & effort, theirs will be as well. Even when you talk to your spouse, talk about attitude & effort. Don't ever even mention grades / levels. Instead of saying "Meredith got all her spelling words right", say "Camille worked so hard on her spelling words this week - she copied them every day without me even asking!" Even if Camille got 90% of them wrong. Just give her some of those same words again next week.

 

I have on occasion had a kid ask "why can sister do that and I can't?", and I just casually answer, "some things come easily to sister, and different things come easily to you. Just keep trying, and you'll get it!" I also crack down VERY hard on anyone who brags or teases - that is absolutely unacceptable and you have to snuff that out at the very first hint!