Calculus and Physics AP

[choirfarm]

Ok, looking at the degree plans for the majors my son is excited about he will be taking Calculus I, II and maybe even III...tons of upper level math. He will also take Physics I, II and III.

 

He is doing Apologia Physics this year and loves it. He has already done Biology and Chemistry (hated Biology, enjoyed Chemistry). So.. I'm thinking we should do AP Physics next year??? But then he would go into Physics II never having actually taken a college course in it??? That seems a little scary. The other option would be to do AP Chemistry next year and that way he would have his Chemistry credit. ( Only has to take one class.) Then his senior year he could do Physics I at LeTourneau as dual credit??? Or would it be better to just do a home year long course of advanced physics and then just start with Physics I as a freshman in college?

 

Same question with Calculus. I chickened out of taking it my senior year in high school. I thought, if I am going to be a music major, then why do I need calculus??? So I dropped the class and took drama instead. So I have absolutely no experience and no understanding of calculs. DH took it a million years ago. So we can do Chalkdust Calculus... and/or community college calculus and then just start with Calculus I as a freshman OR have him take Calculus I as a dual credit as a senior at LeTourneau.

 

LeTourneau has TONS of tutoring available: 4 hours per week per class and part of this is this TI where upperclassmen who have done well in a class have weekly tutoring sessions. They say on average it raises their grade by a letter grade.

 

So... what is the best course? He is a 10th grader right now. He will do Precalculus next year...may start it in the spring as he will finish up Alg. II in February...though may just let him concentrate on the AP Statistics class he is taking.

 

Christine

[choirfarm]

Anyone?

[Michelle in AL]

My oldest wants to go into engineering which requires 4 calculus and several physics.

 

She'll take physics senior yr, not sure whether it will be AP or not. I want her to have a solid foundation instead of just eliminating a physics course.

 

For Calculus, here's what we were told by a dept head. Take Calculus senior yr. It doesn't matter where or if it's AP or not. This professor recommended retaking Calculus 1 at the university you choose. The reason is that different professor emphasize different topics. The professor at this univ prefers for students to take all 3 or 4 calculus courses at the same uni. Taking Calculus senior yrs lays a foundation.

 

My dd is currently in 11th grade. She is taking AP stats now. I wish I had had her take Calculus this yr and AP stats next so she could have continued in the precal/trig, calculus sequence.

 

I hope someone else chimes in. I'm no math or science expert and I'd love to hear others opinions too.

Edited November 10, 2010 by Michelle in AL

[Luckymama]

My son has taken AP Calc and AP Physics C. He doesn't yet know what his major will be, but his view on taking AP courses/exams is this: if he gets out of a non-major course through AP credit, fabulous. If his AP credit won't be counted because the course will be in his major (like Calc for engineering, for example), then he'll have a class freshman year he won't have to worry quite so much about :)

[regentrude]

He is doing Apologia Physics this year and loves it. .. I'm thinking we should do AP Physics next year??? But then he would go into Physics II never having actually taken a college course in it???

 

AP Physics is a good choice if he is interested in Physics. Even if he does so well on the exam that the university would allow him to skip introductory physics, this is not mandatory. In fact, I see students all the time in my class who have AP physics, but who discover that, even though it gave them an excellent foundation, it was not equivalent to the university class.

 

I have written this before: I would not encourage students to take AP physics with the goal of placing out of the intro level classes if they are required to take a whole series of courses in the subject. I would however, encourage them to take AP Physics to get a solid foundation and a rigorous physics class in preparation of college, if this is their area of interest.

For a student who is not planning to major in science or engineering and who does not have to take a whole series of physics classes, doing AP in order to get rid of a science requirement would make sense.

[Cinder]

I went to an engineering school (back in the day ;)) and at least 90% of the freshmen had already taken AP Calc in high school. It was rare for the school to grant credit for a core requirement. I only knew one person who skipped the lower calc and physics courses.

 

You should check with a few schools to see what their policy is on granting AP credit. Some may only grant credit for an AP score of 5. Your ds may end up having to take those same courses again in college. I don't think that's a bad thing at all. It gives the student a little breathing room (covering familiar territory in a new and faster way) and an opportunity to solidify concepts that will be built on later in his schooling.

 

Cinder

[Brenda in MA]

I have written this before: I would not encourage students to take AP physics with the goal of placing out of the intro level classes if they are required to take a whole series of courses in the subject. I would however, encourage them to take AP Physics to get a solid foundation and a rigorous physics class in preparation of college, if this is their area of interest.

 

For a student who is not planning to major in science or engineering and who does not have to take a whole series of physics classes, doing AP in order to get rid of a science requirement would make sense.

 

I would agree with regentrude here. If your son is only required to take one college level Chemistry course as part of his anticipated major, then you should have him pursue AP Chem or CC Chem while at home so he can get the credit at this eventual college (if they accept AP or CC credits -- most do, a few selective schools don't).

 

If he needs to take a series of Physics courses in college, you might have him take either AP-level Physics B or C as a senior, but don't transfer the credit (and skip the AP test and save yourself the $$$. It'll be his senior year, so come May when it's time to take the exam, he will already have submitted his admissions paperwork, so if you're not planning to transfer the credit, the score won't matter anyway).

 

AP Physics B is an algebra/trig-based physics, but it's comprehensive. The course hits almost every topic he'd see in college physics I, II, and III, but the math is a little easier. The upside of this approach is that he will get exposure to a broader array of physics topics. The downside is that he won't get to use Calc with the physics.

 

There are 2 AP Physics C tests -- one on mechanics and the other on electricity/magnetism. If he focuses on only one of these, he'll get a great background in one area, but nothing in the other. If he can manage both of these in his senior year, he'll have a great background for college physics, but they are time-consuming.

 

With my oldest, I chose to have him take CC Chemistry in his senior year and transfer the credits to his college. He enjoyed the class at the CC and now has fulfilled his Chemistry requirement for his engineering degree. He was also able to avoid the Chemistry I course at his college that is traditionally very difficult and a weed-out course.

 

He is taking the entire series of physics courses at this school, and he found the AP-level physics B course to be a good prep for those.

 

Best wishes whatever you decide,

Brenda

[MomsintheGarden]

You should check with a few schools to see what their policy is on granting AP credit. Some may only grant credit for an AP score of 5. Your ds may end up having to take those same courses again in college. I don't think that's a bad thing at all. It gives the student a little breathing room (covering familiar territory in a new and faster way) and an opportunity to solidify concepts that will be built on later in his schooling.

:iagree:

The best thing to do is to check with the college. If your ds wants to attend a selective school, I highly recommend that you have your son take as much physics and calculus as you can fit in, either AP or not. Our ds is majoring in engineering at VA Tech. He did Chalkdust Calculus and scored well on the AB Calc exam. He also did both levels of Apologia Physics (no AP exam). One of his homeschool friends applied to the engineering school and was turned down because he hadn't had physics and calculus in high school. They weren't part of the minimum requirements, but he was told that all of the other accepted candidates had had both.

 

I am generally for earning as much AP credit as possible if you want to go into engineering. Most students in these programs are on this track already in their high schools. Many have credit for Calc I, II, and III before attending. A lot of engineering students take more than four years to earn their degrees, so coming in with credit will help with the time involved.

 

It might be possible that a student could score well on an AP exam but not be ready to advance in a college math or physics sequence, but I would believe that a student who earns a 4 or 5 would be adequately prepared. Many engineering schools (VA Tech included) test their students prior to the beginning of math classes. If a student fails the placement test, he/she is put back, regardless of how high of an AP score was earned.

 

Check with the school's website first. Most schools post AP credit equivalencies as well as how many credits may be earned by exam.

 

We were pleased with Chalkdust for Calculus AP prep. Don't worry, it is an independent program. I went to engineering school forever ago, but my ds didn't really need my help. Mr. Mosely is very helpful if you get stuck.

 

GardenMom

[choirfarm]

So, sounds like we should just go ahead and do Calculus his senior year at home, perhaps take the AP test perhaps not but then go ahead and take it wherever he goes.

 

We will definitely either do the Chemistry at the junior college and transfer or do AP at home.

 

For physics, I guess I need to decide whether he should do the AP level at home and then just redo it at college or if he should take it at LeTourneau. It is VERY rigorous there, but they have so much tutoring available. We'll talk about it.

 

It also depends on what kind of computer science he wants to do: some had a high math emphasis, some had engineering emphasis and then some was just plain and looked very easy as in precalculus and trig were the maths!!! He isn't sure what type he wants to do or be, just that he loves computers.

 

I will tell you this, we aren't looking at the spectacular schools like MIT or Harvard or anything like that. He wants a small private, Christian school. We might apply to Rice just for fun, but it will probably be Baylor, LeTourneau or something similar.

 

Christine

 

Thanks everyone.

[creekland]

At every college we visited we were told profs like to see students having had Calculus, but not placing out of it. This way they retake it in college and have an easier fall semester course while they transition to college in general (a BIG transition for most). They also will know it better and generally fill in some gaps that they had missed.

 

I would assume a college level physics would be similar.

 

For courses outside a major, it probably wouldn't be as important. Within a major I could see it being very important.

 

You can always decide whether to repeat or not after a placement test from the college.

 

Community college classes generally are not up to par with the calc and physics needs of an engineering major. AP would be better. In our situation only the state college will accept cc classes for calc. Some of the other colleges will accept a 4 or 5 on the AP.

[memphispeg]

My dd took AP calc. BC in ps and did well on the AP exam and then placed into a calc. III class at a highly selective school. She was going to be a Math major so, that worked out well for her. But, she has settled on Philosophy instead. She thought the AP calc. was good b/c it meant she had completely explored the topic as much as she could have at her ps and could take it or leave it in college. Her college is a liberal arts/non-tech place so doing things this way was fine. My hs second dd is doing AP calc and physics next year. She wants to go into Marine Science so, she will probably have to retake them on a college level. This may give her a few "easier" classes which she will greatly appreciate.