9yo boy struggling with math...what program do I use with him?

[MommyInTraining]

My son will be 9 tomorrow. He is still having trouble with simple math problems such as 12-5, or even 1+3. He has done some of Singapore EarlyBird and I started him in Singapore 1A a while back, but stopped. I don't know what to use with him. He is left-handed, so I don't know if that has anything to do with his math issues. Should I just start over with him in Singapore 1A, or pick up where we left off in 1A. I really don't know what to try with him next. I would appreciate your wisdom in this matter!

[Guest Cheryl in SoCal]

Math U See is what worked for us. You could have him watch the demo and see what he thinks. When we had several "lightbulb" moments just watching the demo I knew we would be switching to it. It is a mastery program that is teaches conceptually.

[robsiew]

We are happy MUS users too. I would recommend it for any child who struggles. Also... daily drill on those facts! Doesn't have to be boring.. could use games too!

[Zoo Keeper]

Give Miquon a look over. In math, some kids have to see it (touch it, work it out themselves) in order to believe it. One of mine is like that. Also, a lot of talking through Singapore out loud together has been very helpful for him; especially in the mental math sections.

[Lori D.]

My son will be 9 tomorrow. He is still having trouble with simple math problems such as 12-5, or even 1+3. He has done some of Singapore EarlyBird and I started him in Singapore 1A a while back, but stopped. I don't know what to use with him. He is left-handed, so I don't know if that has anything to do with his math issues. Should I just start over with him in Singapore 1A, or pick up where we left off in 1A. I really don't know what to try with him next. I would appreciate your wisdom in this matter!

 

 

Can you pinpoint the trouble more specifically?

- Does he need more visual/hands-on to SEE the concept? (manipulatives)

- Does he seem overwhelmed by the amount and/or variety of material on the workbook page?

- Does he have unique "work around" solutions to the math problems?

- Are there math topics he does connect with or "get" -- such as basic geometry, patterns, logic, etc?

- Do you think the problem is that he doesn't know the math facts -- or that he doesn't understand the concept of addition and regrouping?

- What about more intricate math concepts? Does he grasp those?

 

Answers to specific questions can often help you determine whether you are looking at a curriculum mis-match with the student's learning style, or if the student has a learning issue, or is just not ready for a certain math topic.

 

 

You mentioned left-handedness and that jumped out at me -- MANY lefties are visual-spatial learners (VSL), which means they usually need a visual and/or hands-on way of taking in information, and they process information randomly, globally, whole-to-parts (in other words, they are intuitive with the "aha!" moment; big picture-all-at-once-then-eventually-down-to-details, rather than parts/details adding up to the big concept). Most math topics are abstract, sequential and logically -- NOT strengths of the VSL. Geometry and 3D visualization are VSL strengths since they are very concrete, global, visual math concepts.

 

Also, many children mature in brain development areas later -- often not until age 7, 8, 9 -- or even later. Some students just do not "click" with the logical, abstract concepts of math until they are a little older and have developed brain maturity in those math areas of the brain...

 

We discovered Math-U-See in 5th grade (age 10yo!) for our VSL, and coupled with some brain maturing that happened at about the same time, we finally had a math program that WORKED! We did not know about MUS in those early grades, so I don't know how it would have clicked for our DS. He did use 4 different programs (grades 1-4), and of those, Miquon worked the best for him (use of visual/hands-on Cuisenaire rods and the ability to discover big picture overall concepts, then be able to work out details).

 

Singapore is a wonderful program -- but it is VERY abstract in presentation and moves VERY quickly. Our younger DS melted down trying to use Singapore in those early elementary years (in contrast, older DS thrived with Singapore). We were able to use Singapore 4A/B, 5A/B and 6A/B as a supplement in the middle school years once we got younger DS on track and learning/retaining math with MUS.

 

I recommend taking a quick online quiz (here or here) to see if your DS is possibly a VSL learner, and then seeing what Cathy Duffy's book "100 Top Picks for Homeschool Curriculum: Choosing the Right Educational Philosophy for Your Child's Learning Style" might recommend, if changing math programs seems to be the right route to go.

 

There is also the more rare possibility of having a student with a learning disability, and starting at about age 9 you could have some formal testing done to either rule out/confirm for you. I would only be concerned if you see other areas that are a subtle problem as well -- academic areas such as reading or brain processing, but also things like physical coordination, visual tracking, ability to remember and carry out a short list of commands, social skills (or lack of), etc.

 

 

No expert here at all, and it is always risky to either try to diagnose long-distance, or to say "try what we used because it worked great for us!" -- so take anything I've suggested here with a grain of salt. :) BEST of luck that you will quickly find what works for your family! Warmest regards, Lori D.

Edited May 18, 2010 by Lori D.

[Krista in Colorado]

:iagree: with all previous MUS commenters . . .

 

My 9yo dd has struggled with math since Day 1. After watching her first MUS video, she commented, "This is going to be fun!" Can't say I've ever been happier.

[Mommy22alyns]

There's also RightStart. :D

 

I'm no expert either, but I would suggest a change in programs. Becca struggled with math while we were using Singapore (and we went through 1A and part of 1B) but she is thriving with RightStart.

[MommyInTraining]

Thanks ladies!

 

Funny thing is, I HAVE MUS AND RightStart!!! I haven't wanted to do MUS with him for some reason (he did do Primer when he was younger). We also did some RightStart a while ago, but I didn't continue it with him.

 

Lori, thanks so much for what you wrote. I guess what I would say about him is...it doesn't "stick". Does that make sense? He can know the answer one minute and, the next minute, it is gone into some far off place :lol:.

 

Thanks for any other suggestions you all can throw my way!

[Aludlam]

I have to agree with MUS. You can also print drill sheets for free from Donna Young. If worksheets aren't his cup of tea how about flashcards or one of those hand held games or a computer game? We just stopped all math until we pretty much had all of them down. (weeks and weeks -- but it was worth it to us.) We also randomly (quite frequently) add a page of drill to our scheduled math sheets.

 

We're always waiting on the light bulb over here.

 

Angela

[mamato4girls]

My 9 yr old dd is the same way! She gets it one minute and then it is gone! Thank you for posting this question, I am leaning towards switching to MUS also.

Thanks ladies!

 

Funny thing is, I HAVE MUS AND RightStart!!! I haven't wanted to do MUS with him for some reason (he did do Primer when he was younger). We also did some RightStart a while ago, but I didn't continue it with him.

 

Lori, thanks so much for what you wrote. I guess what I would say about him is...it doesn't "stick". Does that make sense? He can know the answer one minute and, the next minute, it is gone into some far off place :lol:.

 

Thanks for any other suggestions you all can throw my way!

[nitascool]

Another vote for MUS from a reluctant purchaser... oh how I did not want to "waste" my money on such an expensive program...and oh how glad I am that we did.

 

My ds was like yours. He even cried over it thinking that he was stupid because he couldn't remember the math facts. We tried so hard with SM and he would have it one day and it would be gone the next. (I love SM it just didn't work for my boys). What was even more confusing is that he could do the CWP books with ease (verbally) but couldn't remember 10-4.

 

We started MUS in April of 2009 and he has done Alpha, Beta, Gamma and is now nearly finished with Delta. It was as a pp said, the light bulb just came on. It's still not his favorite subject or anything but he knows his stuff.

 

Just to let you know that even though he'd have to start over in the program... once it clicks they zoom through it. They also have an online drill that has really helped my writing phobic younger ds to cement those skills.

[MommyInTraining]

 

Just to let you know that even though he'd have to start over in the program... once it clicks they zoom through it. They

 

 

So, did you make them do every worksheet, or just until they "got" it?

 

Thanks!

[fractalgal]

- Does he need more visual/hands-on to SEE the concept? (manipulatives)

-

- Do you think the problem is that he doesn't know the math facts -- or that he doesn't understand the concept of addition and regrouping?

 

 

Answers to specific questions can often help you determine whether you are looking at a curriculum mis-match with the student's learning style, or if the student has a learning issue, or is just not ready for a certain math topic.

 

 

You mentioned left-handedness and that jumped out at me -- MANY lefties are visual-spatial learners (VSL), which means they usually need a visual and/or hands-on way of taking in information, and they process information randomly, globally, whole-to-parts (in other words, they are intuitive with the "aha!" moment; big picture-all-at-once-then-eventually-down-to-details, rather than parts/details adding up to the big concept). Most math topics are abstract, sequential and logically -- NOT strengths of the VSL. Geometry and 3D visualization are VSL strengths since they are very concrete, global, visual math concepts.

 

 

I recommend taking a quick online quiz (here or here) to see if your DS is possibly a VSL learner, and then seeing what Cathy Duffy's book "100 Top Picks for Homeschool Curriculum: Choosing the Right Educational Philosophy for Your Child's Learning Style" might recommend, if changing math programs seems to be the right route to go.

 

 

 

 

 

Great post, Lori D.!

 

As someone who is left-handed and a VSL, :iagree:. I had to draw pictures to figure out what was going on when I was confused with math concepts.

 

I have not used MUS, but I agree with others who suggest showing the concepts in a visual way from several different angles if possible if it would help him better grasp the concept.

 

I suggest having him demonstrate subtraction and addition to you with manipulatives; if he understands those concepts, then it sounds to me like he may need to brush up on math facts.

 

Good luck :)

[thundersweet]

My almost 9yo dd is exactly the same way. She will even hold her up hand and do 5-1 on her fingers. DRIVES ME INSANE!!!!! She is so bright in all other areas but math. It has been a struggle to say the least. We came from MUS. It just didn't work for us. She resisted the blocks after they novelty wore off. No matter how much she used them, it just wasn't working. We are now using Teaching Textbooks and it's going really well.

 

She still does not have her addition and subtraction facts down. I finally gave up and kept moving. She uses her fingers for now. I felt we were so behind, I just let her keep moving. My plan is to finish TT4 and spend the rest of the summer working on addition and subtraction.

 

We are into multiplication and division now in TT. I was letting her move along using a multiplication chart thinking we would work on those as well over the summer. She understands the math she is doing just doesn't have to facts in her memory. This past week I went to the homeschool store looking for something to help her with those facts. I bought this little book called Multiplication Facts In Seven Days. http://www.amazon.com/Multiplication-Facts-Seven-Days-Success/dp/1583242759 I have to say...she is doing really well with it and I *think* will have them down in 7 days. :) It gives you a daily plan for the seven days and tells you exactly what to do. It also has the child doing a worksheet every day. So far, she has memorized 2's,3's,'5, and the squares from the book. Obviously, 0's and 1's don't need to be memorized. She already figured out the 10's and 11's. I'm not sure why this is working but I'm so glad. When I quiz her on the facts she has learned, I also turn them into division problems and she is getting those right too! I am planning to see if there is something similar for addition since this is working so well.

 

With this child, I will need to drill them every day for a very long time for fear they will just disappear. :lol:

 

Hope you find something that works! I know just how frustrating this is.

 

Sandy

[Guest MamaBear10]

My DS is the same exact way, and I definitely say, go for Math U See. You could use Singapore as reinforcement. Many parents on here say not to bog down your young child with a lot of work, but if he needs a lot of help in Math, use any extra time you can.

 

Have him help you cook. For example, in the morning when I make breakfast for the whole family, I will say to my son, "Would you please get mommy six eggs?" He will get them, and then I will say, "Oh darn, I need 9 eggs. I already have 6, so can you please get me 3 more?" Sometimes he doesn't notice my use of math, and other days he will notice and join in himself. Sometimes I will ask him how many more I need if I have 6 and need 9.

 

It shows him there is more purpose to math than just a workbook. We also use candy sometimes :blush: That gets him into it.

 

That is what we do with my son and it seems to work well. We also review, A LOT. I'll do it with him during the day, and then his father and him will play Math games at night or work with flash cards. He loves the time with dad so he doesn't see it as work.

 

HTH