Dealing with (false?)tears

[mommy4ever]

Ok, this is absolutely getting frustrating! DD11 is being unreasonable in working in LA... or really anything other than math or coloring.

 

Yesterday, we were using WWE level THREE workbook. So I backed up 2 levels really, to be sure it wasn't too difficult, but I pick and chose which passages I use, to be sure it would interest her. I had her read the passage. We went over any words she didn't understand, and had her re-read it so it was clear. Then we went to the questions. She answered the first question easily(side note, how do you get them to STOP repeating the question in their answer?). Next question - instant tears. 'it's too hard'. So I look at it. There is no way it was too hard. The only words that were hard were the names of the ship, but even not knowing what those words meant, didn't affect the comprehension of the passage. I know her comprehension is high. She can read at a much higher level. She has read at a higher level than that. So I read it to her, perhaps too quickly. But she answered the questions immediately. I don't think there was ever an issue other than not wanting to think about it. Before you say perhaps she doesn't absorb what she reads, she has no problem with doing it in history. Or that she wasn't interested in it. IF there's an animal, she's into it. This was about a mistreated animal. She's all over that, she's an animal lover. An hour or so later, she started talking about the passage with her older sister with lots of interest.

 

Let's look at working on her lapbook. If she doesn't find the answer immediately, she sits and pouts or cries. It's worse when I ask her more questions to direct her in the right direction, to have her think outside the box. She just wants the answer now. Not even so much given to her by me, but instant. I have a few books now, that are our references, some are internet linked, so again more info for her. But if that answer isn't on that first page she looks at, the first link she looks at, instant frustration.

 

French - OMG. This is the worst one. I looked long and hard to see where she was at. She was in french immersion for 6 years. She speaks it decently, in comparison to her classmates. She has a pretty big vocab. But to sit down and start to do work. If it involves asking a questions(other than for the answer), she refuses, she'd rather cry. I have brought home books from the library, fun, well written books. I was pre-reading it to be sure it wasn't beyond her level one laughing, she wanted to read it so bad. It was a very basic vocabulary with a few new words. She read 3 pages, set it aside, it's too hard. I had her read a passage out loud, she read it flawlessly, there were no words that she couldn't say. Even some challenging one didn't stop her. I had her give me a narration, and she did so. I didn't push, it was supposed to be for fun reading.

 

She's been out of school over a month now, her issues at school were bullies not learning issues.

 

We have essentially only been reading and working on math. We have only just started history, she enjoys learning that, the work has been really light as I feel my way through and wait for our resources to come in from the library. Science, the lap book was her idea, I think because she thought there would be little work. I am trying to start LA now, at her request, and if she has to think about the answer, or can't say it prefectly or write it perfectly the first time.... forget it.

 

How do you deal with it? I'm about to tell her to suck it up princess we're going to do it. I really feel, it's about giving me a hard time, testing the waters, not the work being too hard.

 

In order to learn, it has to challenge, or no learning is occurring. I have backtracked a couple of YEARS in a few areas because there was a complete blank in her education. Grammar... nonexistent - starting from the basics, this frustrates her as the little one is doing some of the same things, even though I have explained to her, that it has nothing to do with dd6 being smarter, it has to do with the schools messing up and NOT teaching, it's not her fault. Long division? They didn't touch it, so we are starting from square 1 - that is easier than fixing the mess they have left behind so far. Multiplying by 2 or more digits, complete lack of comprehension - so we backed up, strengthening the basic building blocks to that, and now she's loving it.

 

How can we get past the tears? And get her learning? I waste so much time dealing with this it's not even funny. And now the little one is starting to mimick.

[strawberry_fields]

:lurk5:

 

I so wish that I could help you... but we are having the same issues in our house, times two. Please know that you are not alone.

[Amy Jo]

If she has only been out of school a month (and had a bad time in school) can you give her more time? Maybe you can get a copy of Family Math or Life of Fred Fractions (if she can do long division) - just for something completely different. Or just do life math - cook, use money, etc. For reading can you give her a stack of books, then discuss them with her?

 

As far as perservering, can you work on that outside of schoolwork? Or is it only school she has a problem? Maybe she can learn a hobby / sport, or take up a long term project? You might look into Charlotte Mason's habit training (http://www.charlottemasonhelp.com/2009/07/habit-training.html, or http://simplycharlottemason.com/series/laying-down-the-rails/

 

I'm sure you want to fill in gaps, and I can't speak directly as my children are much younger, but I was reading a post a few days ago where the OP was advised to work on their relationship first. It was a well-written post, maybe someone can find it for you?

 

HTH!

[Lori D.]

First, welcome to homeschooling! And second, it sounds like you are doing a SUPER job of it, too: not doing too much to start with (just focusing on reading and math); seeing where learning was not happening and backing up to teach the building blocks (re-teaching multiplication/division); allowing her some input for ownership (science lapbooking); looking for what will be of interest to help make connections with new material and a new way of thinking about it (your selections of WWE passages)

 

 

I just want to encourage you with the reality that transitioning from school to homeschool usually takes about 6 months; extra patience is needed -- for DD, as she is having to not only learn the material, but she is having to learn a whole new *way* of *how* to learn -- and for YOU, as you are having to learn not only the various curriculum and how to present it/teach/mentor, but also how to "juggle more hats" (the teacher hat, the mommy hat, the disciplinarian hat, the counselor hat, the wife hat...) You are taking on a big load, and it sounds like you're doing a GREAT job of it; like with every big new responsibility, you will run into "hiccups" after the honeymoon period is over... sometimes just reminding yourself of that can help you have a little more patience. :)

 

 

Definitely, you're right -- need to work on those tears so they don't become a bad habit. Sounds like you've been staying calm and unemotional -- and that is exactly the best reaction. Now put the ball in DD's court. Outside of school at an unemotional time, talk about how life often throws us new things, the unexpected, or hard things, and that we will be able to learn from or grow from these experiences more easily if we have some self-control and can approach it without tears. Show her the relaxation technique of taking a slow, very deep breath in, holding it and tightening/clenching all the muscles in your body while you silently count to five, then slowly let out the breath an relax all the muscles. Try it together.

 

Now you've reminded her of her responsibility to have self-control. And you've given her a technique to use to help her use her self-control. And you've done this outside of the setting of doing school.

 

Now the next time she's doing school and has the instant reaction/tears, calmly remind her of the talk you had and suggest she try the relaxation technique (I'd do it with her so she doesn't feel odd -- but mostly because it would help ME keep my cool, too! :tongue_smilie:) If she refuses or persists in the attitude, then calmly, quietly guide her to her room with "It's hard to learn anything while you're so upset, so when you have your emotions under control, we can continue." Sitting in a room alone with no audience to react (positively or negatively) to your emotional fit is usually no fun.

 

If she persists, thinking she can use the "going to her room" as a way of getting out of school, then the disciplinarian hat needs to go on, and there are consequences -- you will still do the schoolwork, but it will be later, as homework, while the rest of us have fun free time; loss of privileges; etc. -- whatever works for this child.

 

 

Just my 2 cents worth -- take whatever helps (if anything) and leave the rest! Again, WELCOME to homeschooling! May you and your family have a wonderful journey together! Warmest regards, Lori D.

[saja1029]

Did you start homeschooling right away? If so, she needs a break between school and homeschooling to get used to being home, get the "school" aspect out of her system. Especially since school was a bad experience (bullying, etc.), she needs a break.....sometimes longer than a month.

 

I pulled my 11 yr. old son out of PS in February and gave him about 5 weeks off. I was going to go longer....but he seemed like he was starting to lazy (not a nice way to put it...but laying around a little too much) so I started HS. I started out slowly, about what I thought would be a part-tiime rate. So far, it has gone OK. He gives me grief, etc., but also has some really good days too.

 

Maybe she just needs a break??

 

Good luck:)

[simka2]

Would there me anyway for you to get her a completly different grammar program, than her younger sibling? Something that would help blur the lines between her and the younger one.

 

I wasn't able to give my children a break, because of state requirments. It's really great if you can! Stay encouraged! (at least that's what I'm telling myself too!) ;)

[5LittleMonkeys]

Oh my goodness! :grouphug::grouphug: I feel your pain! I know how frustrating this can be...I've gone through it with both of my oldest.

 

When I first pulled my dc out of ps we had a VERY difficult time adjusting. My dd12 had a snotty attitude about everything and my dd11 cried and whined that everything was too hard. They were testing to see what they could get away with and how much they could control the situation. Kids do that when they are apprehensive and unsure about events in their lives. They have to reestablish where they fit in the scope of things and what their new roles are going to be. Just one short week after bringing them home I'd had enough and I told them that we all needed an attitude adjustment and that I was disappointed that they felt my time was worth wasting. For the next week I gave them LOTS of household and yard chores to keep them busy. I told them that if they weren't going to be educated they had better know how to do some manual labor.:D After a week of having to work really hard and having almost no free time they came to me and said they were ready to be more cooperative. This is the plan I came up with during that week. (I have pulled this from another thread about kids taking ownership of their education; I think it may help your situation.)

 

 

This is what works for us. When I started homeschooling I told my dc that their education was just that THEIR education. They could do as much or as little with it as they wanted and that there would be consequences to deal with either way. I explained that I was going to include them in all aspects of their education.

 

When we first started out we learned all we could about styles of homeschooling together and each wrote down what we liked or disliked about certain methods. We finally decided that classical education was going to best meet everyone's expectations. We did the same with choosing the curriculum. They each made a list of what they wanted based on their individual learning styles and I helped them chose curriculum that was versatile in being able to be taught several different ways or that could be tweaked.

 

I had them write a basic schedule when we started but they grew to dislike it because the baby was too disruptive while we did the subjects they like the most. They complained to me about it and I said, "why are you complaining to me? It's your schedule, fix it if you don't like it." They recently re-wrote it so they could have my undivided attention for science and history during babies nap. dd6th scheduled herself to babysit in the morning so that I could work with my dd1st one on one.

 

My dd5th is struggling with writing so we sat down and talked about exactly what she was having trouble with and what she wanted to work on first. She complained at first and said she didn't want to have to come up with her own plan of action so I said that I would. After the first day she didn't like my plan and has requested another meeting to revise it. She will probably be much more willing this time to give constructive suggestions.

 

I could go on with examples but basically I don't say "Do this because I said so." I say, "You need to learn this, how do you want to go about it?". I allow them at every opportunity to take ownership of their education under my guidance. This in itself is a hard thing to teach and it takes time to train them to want to do it. That is where the consequences come into play. The two older have certain subjects that are assigned weekly. At the end of the week there will be a test or a report\summary required. How they manage their time to complete the lesson and be ready for the test or have the assignment completed is up to them. We had a few weeks of having double work to catch up and NO free time before they began self governing their time more wisely.

 

They also have written out long term and short term goals. Occasionally I will pull these out and let them re-read them to see if they are staying on track. At first this was hard for them to do because I don't think they were prepared for the responsibility of choosing their own academic path so I had them spend a few weeks really thinking about it and writing down all the things they were interested in and then looking at the common threads. They like the feeling that they are in control of their futures to some extent. It has empowered them. I don't ever say you will learn this or you have to learn that; I tell them that if they want to follow this path these are the things you need to know. This way they feel they have a choice. The end result is the same; they are going to receive an excellent education customized to their unique abilities and goals.

 

I hope something in all of that will help you with your dd. I occasionally have a relapse with my second oldest. Especially in math and writing but all I have to do is tell her that the work has to be done, it's curriculum that she chose and that having a bad attitude will make the work harder. Sometimes she chooses to put it off until the next day but not often because then she has double to do the next day. There are natural consequences for not completing work. Spending Sat. and Sun. finishing work not done during the week is a wonderful deterrent.:D

[Karen in CO]

First - It is hard to transition from school. She is very used to being told what to do and ahving very clear expectations of what to do. Years of filling in the blanks and assignments that are easy to grade for a teacher with many students has trained her to a particular way to think and with particular expectations of what school is and is not.

 

Next - :grouphug: it is hard for you too. You are having to transition to a new way to relate to her and at a difficult age.

 

And lastly - when I pulled my ds from school in middle school - we spent most of the first year just lying on the floor reading together. He did some art, and we struggled to figure out how to do math, but that is really all that we accomplished except we did learn how to talk to each other about history and literature and math and science. We worked hardest on our relationship. If she spends the rest of the year doing math and just reading and talking to you about what she's reading then you have really acheived alot and she will probably have learned alot.

 

Breathe. It is okay. You will be fine. She isn't going to get behind and be a failure in life because you are spending time de-schooling (that's the name for it by the way). My big fear when I withdrew my ds was that I had ruined his life by taking him out of school. Once he got his first college acceptance, I let out a huge sigh and realized I had been holding my breath for 6 years.

[3Rivers]

I agree with all the comments about the need for transitioning....that is huge and can take a while. You two are also navigating through a new way of relating to each other. It takes a while to find your groove. It really does, and you will find it! :)

 

Saying "it's hard" may be the best way she knows to express the feelings she's having about all the changes that have happened recently.

 

If it were me, I would make the lessons short and don't push academics too much right now. You can catch up later. Have some discussions about what it is like to have Mom teaching, telling her what to do in a new way, taking on a role that, until now, has been filled by a stranger....it could be that you also are adjusting to this and your own feelings are coming out in interactions with her. Talk, talk, talk. Help her put new, different words to her feelings, more specific than just "it's hard". Make suggestions as to what she might be experiencing and let her tell you if that is right.

 

Bringing kids home from school is rough. I did it twice. :tongue_smilie:

My tendency was to feel like I needed to "crack the whip" to be sure they saw me as teacher and not just "mom" so that they would do their work...but the way that actually happened was not by being tough, but by firmly establishing routines, which is why you need time more than anything to:

a) find what works for you, and

b) adhere to them long enough so the kids no longer balk but just do it.

 

 

You will also learn the magic of leverage tempered with kindness...."Oh man, your math sheet isn't done? I was hoping you could join us for a game at 3. Finish it in your room and then you can play, too." (My kids would rather do most anything than finish in their room all alone.)

 

Or in the case of my middle son:

"You know you can't do screens until you are finished for the day, so let me know how I can help you with this. I'm ready."

 

With that same child I found that sometimes he just wanted moral support. He would do his work, but sometimes just wanted me to sit with him. Other days I knew he was just not wanting to work. For those days, I set the timer and had a consequence for not completing it. Sometimes the requirement got pretty stringent: "Lunch is at 12. If you have not finished the page by then you will miss lunch. I would hate for you to miss that because snack isn't until 3.."

 

You will find your groove.

Hang in there! :D

[susankenny]

Hi,

 

That's tough. :grouphug:

 

The first thing that comes to my mind is her age. She is entering the stage of puberty most likely, and that makes it tough all around. Her emotions are probably out of sorts to begin with, and having a huge transition like this makes everything go into high gear. I would personally take the summer off & come back next year in full force. Another suggestion is to let her have say-so in what curriculum you are using. I feel 11 years old is big enough to plan alongside you. My daughter enjoys helping me decide how she will learn & it makes things run smoother IME.

 

Hang in there!!! :)

 

Susan