Lial's, Saxon or BJU for Pre-calculus????

[shastanarnia]

Hi - I need some help deciding which to use for my daughter's pre-calculus class:

 

Lial's

Saxon Advanced math...or

Bob Jones

 

Any advice??

 

Darlene

[Halftime Hope]

We've had previous threads on this, but it has been awhile. There have been some really great insights shared by "math-ier" folks, so it might be worth your while to see if you can find any of the threads in a search.

 

Hopefully others will chime in.

[Jeanine in TX]

Is your child already using Saxon Math?

 

I think Jann in TX said that people should not try to use Saxon for the first time above Algebra I. The books assume prior knowledge as presented the "Saxon way". Your child may struggle if switching from a different math curriculum.

[Susan C.]

We've had previous threads on this, but it has been awhile. There have been some really great insights shared by "math-ier" folks, so it might be worth your while to see if you can find any of the threads in a search.

 

Hopefully others will chime in.

 

Some of the negative things have been posted by me because of some of the frustrations with the BJU class, but it is a good option for kids that need more instruction than other programs provide. It also isn't as rigorous as Precalc. programs that use college texts, but is a definite next step in math after Algebra 2 and a good option for those who get "weak in the knees" when they see the college texts (like me!).

 

I have an upcoming 11th grader who will be doing BJU Algebra 2, but I am going to preview Lial's (for both Algebra 2 and Precalc.) because it has gotten very good reviews on this forum. But if dd "melts", then we will stick with BJU for 11th and 12th grades (and do BJU Precalc.).

[Halftime Hope]

We used BJU precalc during ds1's junior year, about three years ago, with the BJU satellite class option which has been discontinued. I can't say enough good about their biology and chemistry courses, but the Pre-calc and Physics classes from those two years were not good at all. Mid-year we switched to a combination of Lial PreCalc with Thinkwell videos, supplemented occasionally by a tutor. That got ds through. He placed into Calc I at the local university, but we backtracked instead and had him take PreCalc 1 and 2 at the uni his senior year, b/c he was planning on EE, and having a less than adequate foundation would have been disastrous. It turned out to be a good thing. The six months with BJU was an excersize in frustration, and the Christian math prof who tutored him said that she felt the BJU text was sorely lacking, even for a high school level text. She had never used the Lial text but was very happy when I brought it to her.

 

BJU may have updates their text and teacher, but if they haven't, I would find something else. (Kind of a blunt opinion...)

 

Some of the negative things have been posted by me because of some of the frustrations with the BJU class, but it is a good option for kids that need more instruction than other programs provide. It also isn't as rigorous as Precalc. programs that use college texts, but is a definite next step in math after Algebra 2 and a good option for those who get "weak in the knees" when they see the college texts (like me!).

 

I have an upcoming 11th grader who will be doing BJU Algebra 2, but I am going to preview Lial's (for both Algebra 2 and Precalc.) because it has gotten very good reviews on this forum. But if dd "melts", then we will stick with BJU for 11th and 12th grades (and do BJU Precalc.).

[Susan C.]

We used BJU precalc during ds1's junior year, about three years ago, with the BJU satellite class option which has been discontinued. I can't say enough good about their biology and chemistry courses, but the Pre-calc and Physics classes from those two years were not good at all. Mid-year we switched to a combination of Lial PreCalc with Thinkwell videos, supplemented occasionally by a tutor. That got ds through. He placed into Calc I at the local university, but we backtracked instead and had him take PreCalc 1 and 2 at the uni his senior year, b/c he was planning on EE, and having a less than adequate foundation would have been disastrous. It turned out to be a good thing. The six months with BJU was an excersize in frustration, and the Christian math prof who tutored him said that she felt the BJU text was sorely lacking, even for a high school level text. She had never used the Lial text but was very happy when I brought it to her.

 

BJU may have updates their text and teacher, but if they haven't, I would find something else. (Kind of a blunt opinion...)

 

I don't mind the bluntness, in fact I appreciate it. No, it hasn't changed, wish they would redo the dvds with the Alg. 1 and Geometry teacher, we LOVE her. We ducked out of the text for a part of it, and that might be the part you found lacking. That year, ds senior year, we started with BJU, went to TT (w/o dvds, they had to phone tutor him, but could not stand the constant review), then small amounts of CD Alg. 2 that were precalc-like, then back to BJU at the end. He too placed into Calculus, and took it as a freshman in college (and barely passed it... makes you really wonder about those placement tests.....). You are right, he was ill prepared, and then failed Calc. 2, and changed majors to English..... So part of this can be that he is more liberal arts bent. IF we do BJU for Precalc. for dd it is because we have exhausted all other options, and also know to take college algebra first in college! I am really going to try to get her to like Lial's, but she REALLY likes to watch the classes, she says her mind doesn't move very fast with math, and she learns better by watching it... And for all of the frustration in BJU Precalc., they are very good at giving you plenty of time to absorb the math!!! :001_smile:

[Jann in TX]

I would not suggest Saxon Advanced Math unless the student used Saxon for Algebra 1 and Algebra 2.

 

The Larson text was visually overwhelming for my middle dd (and me)--tiny print, big vocabulary... while we like Dr Mosley- dd just COULD NOT watch him every day...

 

The Lial text has more 'open space' on each page. I think the Lial text transitions from Algebra 2 easier than the Larson. There are video lessons for Lial--they are called the Digital Video Tutors (DVTs)... my dd is not using them but for about $35 they make a nice support--she has found the examples in the text (and a few peeks at the solutions manual) to be enough... I've always been hands-off for the most part with my dds in Math--they rather ask me for help in subjects I know very little about :glare:

 

As far as graphing calculator use... Lial has the option of completing the Pre-Calc text WITHOUT a graphing calculator--but it does have a graphing calculator manual (very helpful) and specific problems designed for use with a graphing calculator. My dd prefers to use her TI-34 (multi-line display) instead of her graphing calculator.. but I still have her work problems with the graphing calculator in each lesson. We use the graphing calculator as a TOOL not as a method.

[shastanarnia]

ok...i tried replying a while ago...and i must not have posted it...so i'll try again.....Thanks for all the great replies to my post. Sorry to "re-hash" old posts regarding math, but i needed some more direction. My dd did do Saxon from gr. 3 to alg. 1...but then she started with the potter's school and did their geometry and alg. 2 (they use chicago math). She's been getting A's...but struggles some with it AND i end up tutoring her .... so my thinking is that it's not worth me spending the money on an online course she's not making use of (prefers Text book learning). I've already ordered a used Lial's from Amazon for $7 (including shipping)!! So...i guess that'll be what we use...thanks again for your opinions!!