Curriculum blues? Literature base curriculum woes.....

[TXMary2]

We are using WP this year after previously using Sonlight and a mix of textbooks. Is it just me or are the WP guides very disjointed? I have Animals and Their Worlds and Quest for the Middle Ages. I love the concept of both, but I don't feel like things are flowing very well. I have tweaked AW so much that I am almost doing my own thing. The QMA I haven't tweaked yet (except for eliminating some things), but I want to.

 

Maybe it is just that time of year when curriculum boredom/anxiety sets in, but I am just really feeling like we just go through motions checking off a list instead of really investigating and learning about something. I am thinking that maybe the literature based, read a ton method just isn't for us. I feel like we need more comprehension and *lessons* when it comes to some of the literature, more focus on vocabulary and memorizing things instead of just reading and completing a worksheet here and there. I spent a lot of money on WP this year and now I am just slightly annoyed that is isn't *perfect* for us. Am I being anal because I can't just go with it or am I normal? I don't want to spend any more money so I am not saying I want new curriculum, I guess I am saying I want to re-work what I have. Which, is another annoyance because one of the reasons I have used SL and now WP was because all the planning was done and it was just supposed to be "open and go." Sigh.

[Guest Cindie2dds]

You aren't alone. WP didn't flow well for us. The first week drove me crazy and the second week it was gone. We did SL last year and while it wasn't a long-term fit for us, it wasn't nearly as "choppy." If I could give you a hug IRL I would. I understand exactly where you are!

 

There are some people out there who have made WP work, maybe they will pop in and help.

 

ETA: I know the last thing you would want to look at is something else, but have you seen Ambleside Online, most of it is free and the rest is library. They have the curriculum laid out with tests and everything. We also like Simply Charlotte Mason ~ another free curriculum guide, books linked with your library. HTH!

Edited November 5, 2009 by Cindie2dds

[Lovedtodeath]

That is one thing that I am worried about with WP. You need more than a schedule, and it seems that WP is just a schedule, and it has a pretty hefty price for that.

 

Are your kids learning? It may be working just fine for them and the problem is just that it is something you aren't used to.

[Guest Alte Veste Academy]

We are using WP this year after previously using Sonlight and a mix of textbooks. Is it just me or are the WP guides very disjointed?

 

I spent a lot of money on WP this year and now I am just slightly annoyed that is isn't *perfect* for us. Am I being anal because I can't just go with it or am I normal?

 

I guess I am saying I want to re-work what I have. Which, is another annoyance because one of the reasons I have used SL and now WP was because all the planning was done and it was just supposed to be "open and go." Sigh.

 

Definitely not just you! I bought AS1 early this year thinking it would be so wonderful to have everything ready to go, with everything scheduled. I could just plug in a few extra books and replace some paper crafts with real handicrafts. Not at all! There was no flow to the reading, IMO. I was so disappointed. Even the Native American study was out of sync with the rest of the history study.

 

Thankfully, I bought it used so I don't have much financial regret, as I still ended up with some good books at a great price. I basically just scrapped it and came up with my own schedule based on some of the WP books and a large number of American history books I already had on hand.

 

You aren't alone. WP didn't flow well for us. The first week drove me crazy and the second week it was gone.

 

:lol: This reminds me! When I first got it, I read through the first couple of weeks and thought, no, surely it can't be this disjointed. Then I sat DH down and schooled him in history with the first couple of weeks of AS1 (reading only). He wasn't happy with the flow either and, of course, he didn't want to do the crafts. :lol:

 

I know it works well for some people. I've said before in these WP posts that I'm hung up on flow...and happy to be hung up on flow. It matters to me. For those who aren't hung up, it can be a good fit. As Cindie said, hopefully someone else will post. However, if you feel it this strongly, I don't know how much that will help, you know? No amount of hearing how well it worked for others made it work for me.

[Guest Alte Veste Academy]

That is one thing that I am worried about with WP. You need more than a schedule, and it seems that WP is just a schedule, and it has a pretty hefty price for that.

 

Exactly! And you know, this is what bothered me more than anything else! That schedule comes with a hefty price tag for what it is (no discussion questions, for example), so you think it would have flow at the very least, you know? :confused:

[Jennifer in NH]

I found AS1 very disjointed as well. I ended up tossing most of their schedulal and doing my own thing. Now I look at what books they are using and what books Sonlight uses, and take what I want from both..much cheaper, but not exactly plug in and go.

[Lovedtodeath]

Exactly! And you know, this is what bothered me more than anything else! That schedule comes with a hefty price tag for what it is (no discussion questions, for example), so you think it would have flow at the very least, you know? :confused:

This is disappointing to hear. I bought the old AS1 guide. I don't think that Classically Eclectic will have American History by the time we are wanting to do it.

 

We have only done a couple of weeks of the WP Science Shoot and Sprout Buzz and Bite. I am trying to get more of that done, we'll see how it goes.

[Guest Cindie2dds]

:lol: This reminds me! When I first got it, I read through the first couple of weeks and thought, no, surely it can't be this disjointed. Then I sat DH down and schooled him in history with the first couple of weeks of AS1 (reading only). He wasn't happy with the flow either and, of course, he didn't want to do the crafts. :lol:

 

I did the exact same thing! I made my poor dh sit down through the first week (after it drove me nuts). He just shook his head and said go find something else.

 

It's so hard to spend that much money on an exclusive when you aren't sure it's going to work. You know, Heather (Siloam) has made WP work and she's a tweaker, and very organized, you might want to pm her.

 

Poor, patient Audrey, I have completely filled her pm box with every. single. question before I bought OM; and I was still shaking in my boots after I ordered. :lol:

[Guest Alte Veste Academy]

I did the exact same thing! I made my poor dh sit down through the first week (after it drove me nuts). He just shook his head and said go find something else.

 

It's so hard to spend that much money on an exclusive when you aren't sure it's going to work. You know, Heather (Siloam) has made WP work and she's a tweaker, and very organized, you might want to pm her.

 

Poor, patient Audrey, I have completely filled her pm box with every. single. question before I bought OM; and I was still shaking in my boots after I ordered. :lol:

 

That's hilarious! I'm sure DH thought he was the only one to ever be tortured this way. :lol:

 

These ladies who have BTDT are so incredibly helpful, aren't they? I know I've used Heather's advice in the past and I'm sure I'll use it many more times. For this though, I just went ahead and planned out our two year study of American history myself. So far it's working very well and I'm pretty happy with it. I will be excited to take a planning break for the four following years though, as I already know we're going to be using SOTW and the AGs.

[Lovedtodeath]

I plan to continue with Sonlight readers when we do AS 1. Since they have comp questions and map work I am thinking that will help. Did you all use the readers from WP? Are there no comp questions, etc? Are they scheduled wonky? I have heard that it seems like they were not preread? What about LA? Have any of you used the WP LA and still feel like it isn't a good program? I am thinking the comprehension, writing, etc would be included in the integrated LA program. But wowzer! That is even more $$.

 

These ladies who have BTDT are so incredibly helpful, aren't they? I know I've used Heather's advice in the past and I'm sure I'll use it many more times. For this though, I just went ahead and planned out our two year study of American history myself. So far it's working very well and I'm pretty happy with it. I will be excited to take a planning break for the four following years though, as I already know we're going to be using SOTW and the AGs.

Those aren't exactly free of planning. You will have to choose which books to use as there are too many listed to do them all, some are too long to read in the one week that they are listed for, some are appropriate for a 3rd grader and others for an 8th grader, a lot of them are OOP... You will need to choose which projects to do and there isn't a list of things to gather ahead... Though it will be at least better than pulling it all together yourself.

[Guest Alte Veste Academy]

I plan to continue with Sonlight readers when we do AS 1. Since they have comp questions and map work I am thinking that will help. Did you all use the readers from WP? Are there no comp questions, etc? Are they scheduled wonky? I have heard that it seems like they were not preread? What about LA? Have any of you used the WP LA and still feel like it isn't a good program? I am thinking the comprehension, writing, etc would be included in the integrated LA program. But wowzer! That is even more $$.

 

Honestly, I'm not anyone to comment on this because when I saw that the main schedule wasn't going to work for me, I knew I would never pursue their LA. That was never my plan anyway though, as I had already chosen my FLL/WWE/AAS combo. I do think it's cool that they have LA packages for each history program at different levels though, especially since DS's reading skill increased so rapidly and 1-3 grade readers wouldn't have cut it anymore. Still, I chose my own. I happen to have some of the readers from the different LA levels but no, I pretty much kept what I liked (book-wise) and chucked the rest.

 

 

Those aren't exactly free of planning. You will have to choose which books to use as there are too many listed to do them all, some are too long to read in the one week that they are listed for, some are appropriate for a 3rd grader and others for an 8th grader, a lot of them are OOP... You will need to choose which projects to do and there isn't a list of things to gather ahead... Though it will be at least better than pulling it all together yourself.

 

Yes, I already have the SOTW books and AGs on hand and have read through them all. I've actually already got my SOTW1 selections on hand (because I was originally going to begin with ancients instead of American history, until I did the math regarding eras and my kids' ages in my head). I guess what I should have said is that I would personally consider using SOTW a break in planning because it would be minimal compared to what I had to do for American history, as you said. I feel like I pulled it all together myself, especially since I never did find a suitable spine. That alone makes SOTW a break in planning--no endless search for the perfect spine!

 

Must get ready for school in 30 minutes! Ack!

Edited November 5, 2009 by Alte Veste Academy

[Lovedtodeath]

 

That alone makes SOTW a break in planning--no endless search for the perfect spine!

You can say that again!:thumbup:

[~blessedmom~]

We're using Quest for the Middle Ages this year....and I don't find it disjointed at all!:glare: The weeks are grouped together by topic, not strictly chronologically, and I rather like that it puts what we're concentrating on in a context.

 

Some of the things we have read this week have been mentioned in one of the other books before, but it's a good "Oh, I remember that!" kind of moment. It reinforces prior learning, which I felt was missing in a program we did last year that was strictly chronological, to the extent of excluding some important information.

 

As far as no comprehension questions...we like the narrating method. I just ask them what they are thinking about "x" or how does that relate to "y" from last week. I do think some of their later American History programs have more indepth questions included.

 

Their LA programs that we have this year have weekly discussion questions for the readers, which nicely complement the themed program.

 

....It's working quite well for us!!:D It fills in all the holes I felt were in the program we used last year. The project ideas are intriguing and keep the learning hands on. We like it tremedously!!

[Veritaserum]

That alone makes SOTW a break in planning--no endless search for the perfect spine!

 

:iagree: We use SOTW and and generally read a couple more library books listed in the AG. I like that the AG has the questions right there along with map and additional book choices.

 

We do a WWE/FLL/AAS combo, too. :)

 

I hear ya on the lit-based programs/schedule/flow stuff, too. We tried SL for a little while and gave up. My solution has been to write my own lit program for each time period with discussion questions and whatnot. My kids and I are both happier. :)

[LittleIzumi]

I highly prefer WP as a booklist, lol. The IG does NOT work for us, with LA or Animals & Their World.

[Laura W.]

Is it just me or are the WP guides very disjointed?

 

...I am just really feeling like we just go through motions checking off a list instead of really investigating and learning about something.

 

I used WP one year (Adventures in Sea and Sky). It didn't feel disjointed to us, but I do remember feeling like we were just checking off a list. Also, even though I used the Sea and Sky Guide for K-3 to try to include my younger ones, it wasn't a good fit. I did what you are already doing - tweaking. We got through the year and moved on to something else, and I used most of the books one way or another. No real advice here, except to keep on tweaking, and focus your irritation into a search for something that will be a better fit for your family next year. :grouphug:

 

Sorry I couldn't help much.

 

Blessings,

 

Laura

[Annie Laurie]

Definitely not just you! I bought AS1 early this year thinking it would be so wonderful to have everything ready to go, with everything scheduled. I could just plug in a few extra books and replace some paper crafts with real handicrafts. Not at all! There was no flow to the reading, IMO. I was so disappointed. Even the Native American study was out of sync with the rest of the history study.

 

 

 

I found AS1 very disjointed as well. I ended up tossing most of their schedulal and doing my own thing.

 

Really?! I was planning on buying AS1 used and then filling in SL core 3 (I already have many of the books from doing 3+4 in the past) and kind of combining them or trying them both to see which we liked better.

 

But the thing is, I kind of thought we might like AS1 more because of how it's arranged into units. It just seemed like it would be easy to plug in extra books and projects that way.

 

But now you all have me second guessing, because I have also bought and tried AW and CAW and did not like either. So if AS1 is more of the same, then I won't like it either. I have owned AW for almost 3 yrs now and have tried to do it something like 4 different times and just can't stand it.

 

Maybe I should stick with SL and add some VP. Someone mentioned SOTW and I do think it looks easy to do, even without a schedule. But I kind of want to do SL 6 and 7 in the future and it used the SOTW books.

[Joy at Home]

This is why I switched from SL to TOG. It made me sad because I've used SL for years and LOVE the books, but felt like we were losing focus of any tangible facts and historical context. TOG focuses me on what the objectives of the week are, has teachers notes to brush myself up, vocabulary, maps. And I really do like the literature but will not hesitate to substitute a SL books. I kind of feel like it's the best of both worlds, using great historical fiction but not at the expense of anything else.

 

Good luck,

Lisa

[TXMary2]

Thanks for all the input. I am glad to know there are others who feel the same way. I wish I could find that perfect curriculum, but I proabably have to accept that no matter what I will have to do some tweaking. I was just hoping to save myself time, but I am destined to be planning I guess!

[Guest aquiverfull]

I'm in the same boat as you are. I tried SL Core 1+2, then we did WP AS1. I tweaked them both extensively. This year I bought MFW ECC, and alas I'm still tweaking. :( Maybe it's just my nature to tweak, but nothing we've tried for history has really worked for us. I wish I could find the perfect program too. I'm thinking ahead for next year when I want to restart the history cycle and I have no idea what I'm going to use. I love the looks of TOG, but it would be way too expensive for me, as I've already checked my local libraries and they have almost none of the books TOG uses. :( Plus, I'm a little hesitant to spend a huge amount of money on another complete history curriculum, with the track record we've had..lol.

[Lovedtodeath]

 

I'm in the same boat as you are. I tried SL Core 1+2, then we did WP AS1. I tweaked them both extensively. This year I bought MFW ECC, and alas I'm still tweaking. :( Maybe it's just my nature to tweak, but nothing we've tried for history has really worked for us. I wish I could find the perfect program too. I'm thinking ahead for next year when I want to restart the history cycle and I have no idea what I'm going to use. I love the looks of TOG, but it would be way too expensive for me, as I've already checked my local libraries and they have almost none of the books TOG uses. :( Plus, I'm a little hesitant to spend a huge amount of money on another complete history curriculum, with the track record we've had..lol.

Is there something specific that you could say was wrong with them?

[Guest aquiverfull]

Hmmm.. let's see. With SL, I really liked the books they scheduled. I really didn't like the way the schedule was laid out. It felt to me, like we were jumping all over the place. So I rearranged that, which I kind of felt defeated the purpose of buying the schedule in the first place. Same thing really with WP, we liked the books overall. But again the schedule was just too disjointed for us. We ended up pretty much ditching the schedule and doing our own thing. Again, I felt like I should have just bought the books and not the Teacher's manual.

 

I also felt that both were kind of lacking in what I was looking for. I don't really know how to explain it well, but it felt like all we were doing was reading a bunch of facts. I felt like the element for joining all those things together, helping my dd to really put it in perspective was missing. I'm not sure what I was looking for though. It just always felt like something was missing. WP seemed to be a little better in that area because it did have some extra activities that helped cement the facts with my dd. I would have liked to have seen more map work for one. Maybe I missed something, but WP recommended buying the Old world maps, yet I never saw any instructions on what exactly to do with those maps. Perhaps, I was supposed to come up with that on my own. We never used them however. The notebooking pages were hit and miss with us. Some of them we really liked, yet others again seemed lacking. They really didn't feel like what I would consider a notebooking page. We didn't really do narrations, so perhaps that would have helped.

 

With MFW this year, I feel that the Teacher's guide was again a total waste of money. And it was $100. :glare: It's much of the same situation. I don't like how it is all laid out. We are only using it for the geography section and a little of the science, so much of it we don't even need. I also don't like how I have to look at the schedule and then read the notes for more info about an activity. I guess they can't squeeze it all on those small boxes, but I also don't like having to read through the other stuff to find what I need to know to complete an activity.

 

Every year, I think I should have just bought the books and did my own thing. However, I feel inadequate and worry that I'll forget to cover something. Or I'll think the Teacher's guides will have a cool idea or activity that I didn't think of, etc. I second guess myself constantly which is why I keep buying these teacher guides...lol.

 

I wish I could find something that I didn't have to change around so much. I don't know if it's out there or not. I only fear it will get worse when I have to add in my other daughters and try to combine them all.:001_huh:

Edited November 11, 2009 by aquiverfull

[Lovedtodeath]

The SOTW AG really takes the guesswork out without being expensive or having a jumpy schedule. I bet you'd like it.

 

Do you think the schedules should have you reading from one book longer instead of small bits of several books? I see that complaint alot, but I was reading The Aenied to DD today and only got through 3 pages (8x11, it was a text file) she loses interest so quickly. :tongue_smilie:

[Guest aquiverfull]

The SOTW AG really takes the guesswork out without being expensive or having a jumpy schedule. I bet you'd like it.

 

Do you think the schedules should have you reading from one book longer instead of small bits of several books? I see that complaint alot, but I was reading The Aenied to DD today and only got through 3 pages (8x11, it was a text file) she loses interest so quickly. :tongue_smilie:

 

Thanks for recommending SOTW AG Carmen. I've been considering buying it along with SOTW1.

 

Yes and no, to your question above. Some books, we like to read more than scheduled others no. I guess that's one of the reasons I like to write my own schedule. I like the flexibility in that.