mommyoftwinboys Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 The other thread I started got me thinking about Satan. One of the posters said that Satan can not hear your thoughts and plant thoughts in your head. I guess I'm confused about this. How does Satan influence you then? I guess if I simplfy it I picture the angel and devil on each shoulder whispering in your ear and you have to choose one-is that an inaccurate assumption? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Virginia Dawn Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 (edited) This is just my opinion: I believe that Satan only has the power that we allow him to have when we live in fear and doubt. I don't believe he whispers in our ears, but that he puts obstacles to faith in our path. The story of Job give us that example. The New Testament says trials and temptations test our faith. They are not from God, but God does allow them to happen. This is a hard thing to understand. Basically God told Job to accept that God's ways our not our ways. It helps to mentally separate our physical earthly life from our eternal spiritual life. But, no, no devil and angel whispering on each shoulder. Only our knowledge of good and evil, revelation (The Bible) , and ultimately- faith. HTH ETA: I think it is very easy to know when something is wrong, because it is spelled out clearly in scripture. All other issues we must use our God given intellect to come to a decision and live with the consequences. Edited October 30, 2009 by Virginia Dawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mommyoftwinboys Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share Posted October 30, 2009 Makes sense what you said but what about when you hear about someone that is demon possessed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karenciavo Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Read The Screwtape Letters, that's how I picture him. Satan is not omniscient, he's an expert on the nature of sin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
specialmama Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Read The Screwtape Letters, that's how I picture him. Satan is not omniscient, he's an expert on the nature of sin. :iagree::iagree::iagree: A more modern "version" is Randy Alcorn's "Lord Foulgrin's Letters" which was inspired by C.S. Lewis' Screwtape Letters. I never saw the point of Christian fiction until I read Lord Foulgrin's Letters. It revolutionized my life and walk. My advice while reading either of these books: be somewhat grounded in your walk. Know that He who is in you is greater than he who is in the world, and satan wants you to be afraid. Don't be. But the #1 rule of any war (in this case, spiritual) is to know your enemy and the tactics he uses. Both of these books will help you accomplish that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
runninmommy Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Respectfully, I disagree with the poster you mentioned that did not believe Satan has access to our thoughts. I think our thoughts and mindset are the biggest weapons he uses against us. He has direct access and starts manipulating us as children, setting up thought patters that are ultimately meant to destroy our faith, hope and joy. If you bear with me, I 'll give you a few examples of why I think this. Proverbs 23:7: For as he thinks in his heart, so is he. Another way to think about this is that as a man thinks in his heart, so does he become. Our actions are a direct result of our thoughts. 2 Corinthians 10:4,5 For the weapons of our warfare are not physical (weapons of flesh and blood) but they are mighty before God for the overthrow and destruction of strongholds, inasmuch as we refute arguments and theories and reasonings and every proud and lofty thing that sets itself up against the true knowledge of God; and we lead every thought and purpose away captive into the obedience of Christ. (the Messiah, the Anointed One. This passage indicates that we must know the Word of God well enough to be able to compare what is in our mind with what is in the mind of God; any thought that attempts to exalt itself above the Word of God we are to cast down. The Amplified Bible translation of this verse says that the devil argues with us; he offers us theories and reasonings. All of this activity goes on in the mind. The "weapon" we use to combat these attacks is the bible. Comparing your thoughts, actions and feelings with that of The Word. If it does not measure up to God's word, we are to discount it, throw it out and change our way of thinking. So, where do negative thoughts and mistruths come from? The father of all lies. (John 8:44) For we are not wrestling with flesh and blood, but against the despotisms, against the powers, against the world rulers of this present darkness, against the spirit forces of wickedness in the heavenly sphere. Ephesians 6:12 The battle is in our minds. You may want to check out the book; Battlefield of the mind by Joyce Meyer. It goes into all of these topics in great detail. I have found it to be refreshing and comforting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionfamily1999 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Oops, I answered this in your other thread... Satan puts the temptation in front of us, but we're the ones that dwell on it. It's like a button with a sign that says, 'do not push, but know if you don't it will haunt you for the rest of your life.' Well, there's no magic there (I'm borrowing from C.S.Lewis), but the temptation and the idea that you have no choice are there. How long you dwell on it, how much you let it eat at you, those are all up to you. Makes sense what you said but what about when you hear about someone that is demon possessed? I believe that's when you give permission for a spirit/demon to enter your body. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mommyoftwinboys Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share Posted October 30, 2009 I find this all very helpful and a bit confusing. I think it did confuse me when she stated that the devil is not in our thoughts because I remembered demonic possession and exorcisms...isn't that within us? Or do only Catholics and Orthdox Christians believe in exorcisms? (btw..I grew up Orthodox) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionfamily1999 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 I find this all very helpful and a bit confusing. I think it did confuse me when she stated that the devil is not in our thoughts because I remembered demonic possession and exorcisms...isn't that within us?Or do only Catholics and Orthdox Christians believe in exorcisms? (btw..I grew up Orthodox) I'd say there is a difference between Satan talking in our minds and possession. My understanding of possession is that you have to allow it to happen, you have to invite the demons in. Now, this may not be in so many words (please, come possess me!), it can be done through various choices of various paths. For instance, when dd started showing an interest in ghosts a friend of hers explained how to let a ghost use your hand to write out messages. I explained that inviting something to use your hand did not mean they would stop at your hand. IOW, you already gave permission for them to 'come into' your hand. What's stopping them from taking your whole body? I do think that much of what Satan does relies on us to dwell on it. I don't believe he's knocking around in my brain telling me things, I do believe that I am thinking too much about things that should not concern me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petepie2 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 I don't know if Satan and his minions have access to our thoughts or not. However, I do think that our sinful nature is often more responsible for our problems and conflicts than Satan. It isn't that Satan is not at work or should be underestimated, but I tire of hearing "the devil made me do it". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olan719 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 I don't know if Satan and his minions have access to our thoughts or not. However, I do think that our sinful nature is often more responsible for our problems and conflicts than Satan. It isn't that Satan is not at work or should be underestimated, but I tire of hearing "the devil made me do it". :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
runninmommy Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 :iagree: as well. (except, I do think thoughts are part of it) I think our downfalls and failures are a combination of free will, pride, lack of faith and in my case, pure stubbornness. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petepie2 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Here are John MacArthur's thoughts on the subject: http://www.biblebb.com/files/MAC/jm-234029.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mommyoftwinboys Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share Posted October 30, 2009 O.k. I read the article and while I see he said he can't hear our thoughts, then how are we influenced by him? I guess I'm just really confused. What part does he play in our sin? How does he *convince* us to follow his path rather than Gods? How does he *speak* to us..is what I mean.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petepie2 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 O.k. I read the article and while I see he said he can't hear our thoughts, then how are we influenced by him? I guess I'm just really confused.What part does he play in our sin? How does he *convince* us to follow his path rather than Gods? How does he *speak* to us..is what I mean.. Well, I guess just because he can't hear our thoughts, doesn't mean he can't speak to our minds. I guess it's a one way street. He "convinces" us to follow his paths when we believe his lies instead of believing God's truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olan719 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 O.k. I read the article and while I see he said he can't hear our thoughts, then how are we influenced by him? I guess I'm just really confused.What part does he play in our sin? How does he *convince* us to follow his path rather than Gods? How does he *speak* to us..is what I mean.. :grouphug: I can tell you are really confused and seeking out answers. I wish I had more to offer. I'll tell you my personal opinion. I am not a theologian by any means, but I do enjoy studying the Bible and seeking out spiritual truth for myself. Truthfully, I just don't pay that much heed to Satan. Yes, he was a fallen angel who rebelled (sinned against God) and who seeks to destroy God's chosen. But the Bible doesn't spend nearly as much time talking about Satan as it does our "sin problem" and how that is fixed through Christ. I don't blame my problems on Satan in any form. Man sinned, and I accept my own personal responsibility in my thoughts and actions. Yes, sin will continue to be a struggle in this fallen world until Christ returns, but I don't walk around feeling like Satan is trying to "get me" or "the devil made me do it." I just live my life trusting that the battle of good versus evil has already been won...because IT HAS. You asked how Satan speaks to us. I think he just operates through our own sinful nature that already exists. If you are feeling like he is "attacking your mind", again return to the Scriptures and realize that it could be a sin problem due to lack of faith on your part. He uses our "sinful tendencies" against us to make us fearful and full of doubt. I hope this is making some sense. My best guidance to you is to pray about this issue and search the Scriptures for yourself. Again, :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petepie2 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Here's a message by MacArthur on "How Satan Operates". It's kinda long and I haven't read all of it, so I'm not sure if it answers your question or not. Your question seems to deal more with "how" Satan communicates to us rather than "what" he's communicating to us, which I think is what the message is probably about. http://www.biblebb.com/files/MAC/1356.HTM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnandtinagilbert Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Temptation. Satans constant effort to put sin, of any kind, in our way. We dwell. Either in sinful thought alone or we then act and lose actual physical control. Either way Satan's temptations are all around. I don't think he can hear our thoughts, but recognizes the urges and signs of our giving in to temptation. Until we follow through with the sin (either thought or action), he can't hear our thoughts. I do think, however, once invited, any demon (all falling under the authority of Satan) can know just where our minds are on a certain subject and will then hit us with more and more so we will continue to walk and grow in sin, instead of walking in truth and righteousness. If we can be inhabited by the Holy Spirit, then I believe we can also be inhabited by an evil spirit. Both can communicate with us, so yes, Satan can speak to you. I'm neither Catholic or Orthodox and my understanding is that other denominations believe in demonic presence in a person. Ultimately though, the battle is the Lord's. We fight not against flesh and blood ultimately. It could not be our strength, but our giving our sin up to God. If He carries the yoke, then our burden is light and we may walk in truth. The hard part is not the battle against sin (cuz we can't fight it anyways), but actually the submission to God so He can fight, and win, our battles for us. Just my understanding and testimony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnTheBrink Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 We have sinful hearts and sin natures. Our thoughts and motives naturally stem from that. It doesn't take satan to cause us to think or behave in a sinful way. I think we do that just fine on our own! LOL But, I do believe that satan has dominion over the world system and that he is at work in causing Christians to doubt, mistrust, and rebel against the Word of God. Temptations are common for man and satan is well-versed in them. So, I don't think he plants thoughts, but he can plot circumstances that allow us to fall into sinful thinking. He can cause us to question what God's word says. "Did God REALLY say not to eat that fruit?" I think reading Job is a good study in learning how satan can work in a person's life, as well as how God works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tabrett Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 The hard part is not the battle against sin (cuz we can't fight it anyways), but actually the submission to God so He can fight, and win, our battles for us. WOW!!!! May I put this up as a quote on my FB? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thowell Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Temptation. Satans constant effort to put sin, of any kind, in our way. We dwell. Either in sinful thought alone or we then act and lose actual physical control. Either way Satan's temptations are all around. I don't think he can hear our thoughts, but recognizes the urges and signs of our giving in to temptation. Until we follow through with the sin (either thought or action), he can't hear our thoughts. I do think, however, once invited, any demon (all falling under the authority of Satan) can know just where our minds are on a certain subject and will then hit us with more and more so we will continue to walk and grow in sin, instead of walking in truth and righteousness. If we can be inhabited by the Holy Spirit, then I believe we can also be inhabited by an evil spirit. Both can communicate with us, so yes, Satan can speak to you. I'm neither Catholic or Orthodox and my understanding is that other denominations believe in demonic presence in a person. Ultimately though, the battle is the Lord's. We fight not against flesh and blood ultimately. It could not be our strength, but our giving our sin up to God. If He carries the yoke, then our burden is light and we may walk in truth. The hard part is not the battle against sin (cuz we can't fight it anyways), but actually the submission to God so He can fight, and win, our battles for us. Just my understanding and testimony. :iagree: and very well said. Let me also add that satan's best weapon against us is his deceitful nature. Also dont foget it was satan that came and tempted Eve in the garden. However, it was her own sinful nature that acted on the sin. I believe satan will do all he can to trick us and make wrong seem right. It is up to us to rely on God and the Holy Spirit discernment to make the right choices. As far as demon pssesion, yes, I believe it is real. And I am Independent Baptist. Jesus cast out demons in the New Testament and I didnt see anywhere that we are told this no longer happens. You can definitely invite them into you through your actions. I dont know if satan can read our minds or not but if you think about and dwell on something long enough you are bound to follow through with your actions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kate CA Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 I think it is especially important to always go to scripture to learn what Satan is and isn't. http://opc.org/nh.html?article_id=201 is a very good article by the late James Montgomery Boice that details, with much scripture, the nature and power of our enemy. Here is the end portion of it, but I highly encourage you to read the whole thing. The Devil Is Limited Finally, Satan is a limited being. That is, he is not omniscient, as God is; he is not omnipotent, as God is; he is not omnipresent, as God is. If Satan is a murderer from the beginning, he is limited in the area of the ethical life. If he is to face judgment, he is obviously limited in power. Although we should beware of Satan and be warned about him, we should not get into the habit of thinking of the tempter as anything like an evil equivalent of God. Satan is not omniscient. God knows all things, but Satan does not. Above all, he does not know the future. No doubt Satan can make shrewd guesses, for he knows human nature and the tendencies of history. The so-called revelations of mediums and fortune-tellers—when they are not outright deceits—fall into this category. But they do not give true knowledge of what is to come. Thus, the predictions are vague and generally do not hold water. At one point, God stated this in the form of a challenge to all false gods, saying, "Set forth your case, says the Lord; bring your proofs, says the King of Jacob. Let them bring them, and tell us what is to happen.... Tell us what is to come hereafter, that we may know that you are gods; do good, or do harm, that we may be dismayed and terrified. Behold, you are nothing, and your work is nought; an abomination is he who chooses you" (Isa. 41:21-24). Neither is Satan omnipotent. Thus, he cannot do everything he wants to do, and, in the case of believers especially, he can do only what God will permit. The best-known example is Job, who was safe until God had first lowered the hedge he had thrown up around him. Even so, God had his own worthwhile purposes and kept Job from sinning. Satan is not omnipresent, which means that he cannot be everywhere at the same time tempting everybody. God is omnipresent. He can help all who call upon him, all at one time. But Satan must tempt one individual at a time or else operate through one or more of those angels, now demons, who fell with him. Although Christians must never ignore or underestimate Satan and his stratagems, neither must they overestimate him. Above all, they must never concentrate on Satan to the point of taking their eyes away from God. God is our strength and our tower. He limits Satan. God will never permit Christian to be tempted above what we are able to bear, and he will always provide the way of escape that we may be able to bear it (1 Cor. 10:13). As for Satan, his end is the lake of fire (Matt. 25:41). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnandtinagilbert Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 The hard part is not the battle against sin (cuz we can't fight it anyways), but actually the submission to God so He can fight, and win, our battles for us. WOW!!!! May I put this up as a quote on my FB? Sure. Hope it encourages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AuntieM Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 As far as how he knows what we think, when he can't get into our minds, Charles Ryrie wrote that satan and his cohorts have studied human nature for thousands of years... apparently we are pretty predictable and the evil one sends temptations based on trends in our human behavior. Just something to consider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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