Thanks, I will look up these books you mention. My son really struggles with all math facts. We have been working on multiplying for two full years. We have used times tales, flash cards, and now reflex math. I also let him use a multiplication chart while doing worksheets so he isn't completely overwhelmed and bogged down. He completely understands multiplication and division concepts, just cannot remember facts. My son does well with the c-rods, and we still use them to work through concepts like fractions, but I just meant he was too old for the Miquon curriculum anymore. I have a few friends with MUS so I can take a look.

Thanks. I am off to look this up.

Hi, my ds 10 is a struggling learner. He has ADHD, Aspergers, and dyslexia and dysgraphia (all diagnsosed with the exception of the dyslexia. We were told they were giving him a probable diagnosis due the the spread between I.Q. and performance but his actual performance was 1% off being able to diagnos him officially under the new DSM). Anyway, all that to say, we have lots of struggles on a daily basis with writing and reading but it is his math that is dragging us both down. He HATES math. He finds it difficult to maintain focus, he can't remember any facts (we have worked on them for years and continue to do reflex math daily), and really complains or gets angry almost on a daily basis. I am feeling worn out with this routine and I know he dreads math everyday. I am looking for advice. We use Math Mammoth and I try to do a lot of it on a white board with him so he can stand up, move around etc. The white board also lets him write BIG. He struggles to write anything smaller than about 2cm. We have used Math Mammoth for two years. When I first pulled him from PS we tried Miquon (which I liked and so did he but he is too old for it now), Singapore (he hated the multiple books), and Teaching Textbooks 3 (he could not stay focused and would zone out when the computer "talked" to him. He cried a lot with this program). He seems to do better when I teach him directly. We are in MM4B working with division, heading into long division. It is soo hard for him. If he could do everything on the large white board that would work better but I prefer to teach him, then have him do some examples on the white board with me, and then I like him to sit and do some on the MM pages so I can bounce around to his brothers. It always ends in a meltdown. MM pages are so cramped, he doesn't have enough room to write, he has trouble organizing his numbers, keeping them in the correct order etc. He does steps backwards, reverses the order of numbers and just exhausts himself. Please, please, please give me your advice. Should I stick with MM? I like the program, but it is so visually overwhelming and I just don't have the time to tweak each page and reprint. Is there another program that is very incremental, lots of white spaces, etc. What would you recommend? Thanks for any suggestions.

When you had her tested, what was her working memory scores. Specifically if they did any delayed memory work? It sounds like this could be a combination of a few things but definitely if her working memory is really low, most of what you mention above would be really difficult.

I know you mentioned you have limited resources so testing might not be an option but I would really recommend a full Neuro eval if possible. My youngest ds is almost 6 and still really struggles with toileting properly. He has been diagnosed with ASD (mild) and global low tone. He also has Apraxia which can complicate things further. My son is very sensitive - very similar to what you are describing with the Dora episode. My ds still runs from the room when a mean train comes on Thomas or the troll or witch comes on Dora.

My son has similar issues that we are trying to work through right now. He has a diagnosis of a learning disability - written expression. We are experimenting with software that he can dictate to and it is a little frustrating but much better than him trying to write or type anything while thinking. I will be following this in hopes you get some great suggestions. I know how scary this can be. Hugs!

Hi, I just wanted to say I too am in Canada and can completely understand the frustration over testing. We paid well over $2500 for our testing - ouch! My youngest has ASD and has had a lot of SLP intervention since he was very young. When he was nearing school entry age, I checked with the local school to see how speech therapy would work there is we sent him (we keep all our kids home but I was just checking on the he therapy out of curiosity). They said it would be at least a three year wait! WHAT! He has apraxia of speech and three years with no therapy would be devastating. Anyway, we thanked them and left and are paying for it privately (also really expensive). Ugh!

I am no expert and I suspect it could be a symptom of many different things. My ds is like you describe and he has dyslexia. Reading things himself will actually hamper his understanding of the subject matter. He is very verbal and learns best by listening in all areas of his schooling. However, If this is your only concern, dyslexia likely isn't the problem. I'm sure others on this board will have lots of suggestions for you. Good luck.

Hi, from what I can tell from the report and from her conversatons with us after the testing, they now have to fall below a certain percentile in one or more areas of the writting subtests on an achievement test to qualify for a written expresison learning disability. I think before the latest edition of the DSM, the actual percentage was factored in, but so was the difference between I.Q. and achivement. So for example, my ds was in the 96% and 91% for the two main parts of the I.Q. testing (Verbal and perceptual reasoning). His achievement scores for all of the reading subtests were down in the 20 - 40% - so very low compared to his I.q. That gap, along with her observaions and our feeback, had her give us a probable diagnosis of dyslexia. She basically said, he is dyslexic and you need to remediate and accomodate like he is dyslexic, but he didn't technically qualify for that diagnosis under the new DSM because his scores were not low enough. However, his written subtests on the achievement tests were all over the map with the lowest ones being 5% and another being around 19% (for spelling and writting fluency I think). These scores were low enough for her to give him a definitive diagnosis of Specific Learning Disability - Written Expression. I am not sure what the cut off is - maybe in the "teens". She was clear in our follow up that his large gaps in I.Q. verses performance would be problematic and frustrating for him.

Hi, I do think the concerns you have listed sound like it could be dysgraphia (now referred to as a written expression learning disability). My ds (almost 10) was just diagnosed with this as well as suspected dyslexia. He actually would have been given a full dyslexia diagnosis last year under the old DSM but the new one doesn't accout for difference in I.Q. verses preformance. I believe my son is a true stealth dyslexic. He can read at grade level but it is always hard for him. His reading out loud is painful for him. His decoding skills are rough too. He has all the other tell tale other symptoms (reversals and generally directionally impaired in all aspects of his life - he subtracts in the wrong direction a lot, he mixes up letters in a word, he uses capitals inconsistently and within a word (so he might spell his name with two or three capitals within the word), spells at a first grade level, despite 4 years of punctuation work he never includes any in his written work, his letter are poorly formed, float above and below the line, run into each other so it is impossible to see where any word begins and ends etc.) I know evals are painfully expensive but I found they gave me so much valuable information. I assumed my son was struggling with a learning disability, but what i didn't expect was how many amazing high level skills he had that his learning disability were masking. For example, my son is awesome at math reasoning - tested at the high school level. However, his computation of basic math facts is really a struggle (because he mixes up signs, lines things up improperly etc.) so we never really got to see him shine in math. Now that we know, we can accomodate his struggles (work on facts, use multiplication charts, etc.) and his amazing abilities in math emerge. Good luck with whatever you decide.

Thanks, AAS is working as far as he is retaining some rules when you ask him and he doesn't mind doing the program, but I don't see any results in his everyday work. I am going to keep at it because we like the program and hope more results come. I will try IEW because we already have it. I am looking into rewards too. Thanks. For math we use MM and I really like it but we have to do most work on a giant white board or my son melts down.

Thanks, so nice to know we are not alone.

Thanks for all of these suggestions. This has been really, really helpful. I looked up the Rewards. Is this the only place to buy this from? I am in Canada so just wondering what my options are. Have you tried Dragon Naturally Speaking? I let him dictate into my iPad right now and edit in notability. I am just wondering if DNS would be better or similar (just looking to knot spend more money if it is the same thing). I have IEW both the TWSS and SWI A. I would like to start it with him but worried he wasn't ready for it yet. I may work my way through this year and try it next year once I have more time to watch TWSS. We also have all levels of WWE but it is just not a great fit for him. I still keep them and go through the narration with him and he has done really well with that but we don't do any of the dictation (serious nightmare trying to do any length dictation). Thanks, I signed up for reflex math today for him and will have him give it a try today. He hates anything timed but this may work for him. I will let you know. I see this directional issue with a lot of his stuff. He reverses letters and numbers as I mentioned but he also does math in the wrong direction a lot. For example he will write 25 - 12 and be fine, but if he writes it in columns ( or if it is presented to him in columns) he will often subtract in the wrong direction (trying to take 25 from 12). He can't seem to remember which number goes on top and even if they are written for him, he can't remember to subtract the bottom FROM the top. It is frustrating for him. He would do much better just figuring it out in his head because he understands the concepts but get directionally confused when it goes on paper. I love the idea of self correcting. I think he might be frustrated that it slows him down ( he just wants school to be DONE each day) but I am going to give it a try. Do you have a Franklin speller? Which one would you recommend? I like AAS, we are on level 4 now, but it doesn't seem to translate to his work EVER! The second sample you posted of your child's work is EXACTLY like my sons work (the spelling errors are just like his) except my son doesn't space his words as well (they all run into each other so it is really hard to see where one starts or ends). Thank you for sharing these with me. I have more hope that improvement is possible. I feel like he hasn't improved much in his handwriting since K. I was worried it might always look like it does now. Thanks for all of your thoughts and suggestions :)

Thanks for this and all of your other suggestions. I have made a list of them all and will investigate them today.

Thanks, this is really helpful. I know I need to keep this all in perspective. He is a wonderful, smart little guy. I want to enjoy this time in our lives and not get too bogged down with worry for him or upset as we both struggle to teach / learn together. When you talk with him, he is so interested in everything, learning, asking thoughtful questions etc. but the minute we switch to anything on paper or even on the computer, he shuts down. He is also very distractable and I know this interferes with a lot of his learning if he isn't fully engaged.

I actually have IEW but haven't used it yet. I keep thinking he isn't ready but maybe I should give it a try. He is still writing at the sentence level, paragraphs are way too much writing for him in one sitting. I have started letting him dictate a paragraph so his handwriting doesn't hold him back too much, but even forming the ideas for a paragraph is hard for him. I will look into Apples and pears. Thanks.

She has recommended some social skills role playing for the ASD and lots of suggestions about breaking things down into little parts so he isn't overwhelmed. She also included a section on his planning, organization and really anything that requires him to do more than one things at a time will be a big challenge for him. She provided a book list and I have a bunch of them on hold at the library already. I am wondering what kind of accommodations parents with similar kiddos have given at home. I worry about not knowing how to challenge him enough and still accommodate areas that he struggles with. I am also just really worried for him. We have worked for 4 years doing AAS and he still scored so low in spelling. Spelling and writing are such a struggle for him but he refuses to try to type (we tried for a few months and he cried every time). I just am not sure how to help him. I wondered about Barton but his reading is pretty good. She felt he didn't fully qualify for a dyslexia diagnosis because he could decode individual words pretty well so I don't want to buy a program he doesn't need. I am wondering how to help him with his writing and spelling as well as his everyday math calculations and fluency. Despite lots and lots of practice he doesn't know most multiplication facts (or adding and subtraction). Should I just give him a calculator or continue to plug away at the facts? Thanks for any help you can give me.

I finally got the report from my ds's (almost 10 years old) neuropsych eval. I posted a little bit about what the Dr. told us verbally, but she hadn't really evaluated everything at that point so there was lots in the report that was surprising to us. I will post his results below but please don't quote from them as I I will remove them later. My biggest concern is just where to go from here. His results are so spread out, even within the same area, I just don't know how to help him. He finds schoolwork so hard (yet is clearly really bright). I just hate to see him struggle so much and hate school work. Edited to remove results. She told us that under the old DSM he would have likely qualified as dyslexic and possibly a math disability as well (although she isn't sure about his math because the results are so spread) but under the new version he doesn't technically qualify. She said he definitely has a very large spread between I. Q. And achievement in a lot of areas. She did officially diagnose him with a Specific learning Disability in Written expression (I believe what used to be dysgraphia), ADHD, and mild ASD (What would have been Aspergers). She feels he is really borderline for an Aspie diagnosis but thought it would better inform our decisions on school. So, how do I move forward? How would you tackle reading, writing and math? He finds writing torture (both the physical act, generating ideas, and organizing anything). He finds math really hard but if you ask him word questions and allow him to just figure it out in his head and tell you the answer back, he can solve high level questions no problem. Anytime he has to write it down he will likely get it wrong. He still reverses many letters and numbers, his printing is nearly illegible, and his spelling is really a struggle. He will spell the same word incorrectly on the same page multiple ways, omits vowels a lot, and reverses the letters within a word a lot ( he spelled IT yesterday as TI), things like this are very common. If you out made it to the bottom of this post, thanks for reading. Any suggestions would be so, so helpful. I am feeling overwhelmed and not sure how to help him.

I think ADHD can be so pervasive into all other aspects of their school work it is hard to tease everything out. It sounds like you got a lot of information that will take some time to digest. I made the decision to not think too much about it over the holidays and just wait until I get the written report before I really make any changes based on the eval. It sounds like you have done a fantastic job getting him to where he is now, overall he is doing really well. My ds was just given an ADHD diagnosis too and I still am not sure how to proceed with that info (and all the other info we were given). I do know I am so glad to have gotten the information and I know eventually if I will better inform my teaching for him. I would recommend taking a break for the holidays and letting it all sink in :)

Hi,I am just seeing this thread now. I just wanted to say you are a great mom!

We just read Wonder. It was really fantastic.

Hi, I'm just wondering how your feedback session went? I think you mentioned it was this week?

Hi everyone, O.P. here :) Thank you very much for all of your helpful feedback and advice. We went to the N.P. yesterday for the feedback session and this is a quick breakdown of what she told us: - on the Wisc he scored in the very superior intelligence range ( I think she said he was at a 124 or 125). There wasn't any great discrepancies in any of his scores on this test, they were all about the same level. - on the WJ achievement test, he was all over the map. His spelling was the lowest at only a 2.0 grade level (he would be considered in 4th grade, 4th month currently), so significantly behind. He was also lower in his writing which was somewhere in the 3 grade range. Everything else was about average except for anything to do with his memory (story recall etc. ) being off the charts at above a grade 13 level. - she also said he definitly qualified for a diagnosis for ADHD and feels like his impulsivity, and inability to sustain focus is really presenting a challenge for him. -she also felt that he qualified for an ASD diagnosis, although just barely. He would definitly be labelled Aspergers if that label was still used. He really struggled with many aspects of the ADOS like reciprocal language, rigidity, reading non verbals etc. however, he didn't have any trouble displaying non verbals himself ( he can be very animated when he talks), and he doesn't have any repetitive movements etc. She wasn't sure if she was going to give him an ASD diagnosis or a provisional one ( I'm really not sure what difference it will make). In addition, she feels he is struggling with a planning, attention, simultaneous, and sequential processing disorder ( this is totally new to me, I had never heard of it before). She would like him to come back in to do the PASS module once she orders it in. Overall, she said he was one of the most complex little guys she has ever evaluated. She felt like he was experiencing so much frustration with schoolwork likely because there is a large gap between his I.q and achievement in most areas, likely due to a big deficit in planning, attention, and being able to simultaneously process pieces of information. She said he also has many dyslexic traits but that he wouldn't fully qualify for that label either because he did well decoding the nonsense words. She didn't give us the report yet and said it will be very long. She promised to offer lots of reading suggestions and some guidance on specific subject areas. So, anyone out there have any similar experiences? I am still trying to digest this all. I would love to hear what you think? Thanks.

Hi Lecka, sorry if I offended you in anyway. You are correct, I have a lot to learn about Austism. I am trying to figure all of this out and was just surprised by some of my sons answers on the ADOS. I think I assumed because he wanted to play ay with other kids a lot, that he did so well, or the way a typical kid would play. I am wondering if my assumptions about how he plays, and what he thinks about friends is actually true or if he is struggling in this area more than I recognized. He has always been rigid in his play so I know that can irritate his friends a lot. I just don't know if there is more to it. Anyway, again, sorry if I was in anyway insensitive in my previous posts.

I am so sorry the NP was so dismissive when you asked about the testing so far. I don't think it is unreasonable to ask what tests they are running at all. The NP we are working with didn't tell us what tests they were running either but her assistant told me when I was asking questions from the other room (I watched everything from a t.v. monitor in another room). Our NP also has not wanted to tell us much as far as what she is seeing along the way. I suspect she wants to father all the info first. She did tell me how he was doing generally when I asked her ( she said he did really well in one math section and really struggled in the grammar section) but without much detail. We get our results next Thursday so we are on a very similar timeframe. Good Luck.