It completely depends on your child. I have two dds with different learning styles. The one completed 5 levels in 2.5 years (and I was slowing her down a bit). The other is likely to take about a year to complete a level at her current pace. The flexibility is what I like about AAS. It's very easy to match its pace to your child's.

Miquon is a great program, too. I used it in conjunction with Singapore, as the two work very well together. I didn't find Singapore 1 lacking in any way for the Gr. 1 level.

Wow, thank you all so much for the incredibly thoughtful posts here. Thanks for sharing this. You've really got me thinking about the things that do trigger sudden math meltdowns here. Huh. I need to process that more, but thanks for the idea! Even if I do know it, I appreciate you reminding me. I often lose sight of that when I sense that she's jumped in other areas, and could very easily do that here. This is helpful, too. I need to get better at this, and so does dd. She hates leaving any pages or questions blank in her workbook. This seems to mesh with Dana's suggestion above, of using just CWP6 / IP6 after SM5. Out of curiosity, why are you moving to DM instead of what seems to be the popular AoPS? Thank you! It's good to hear that BA is a good component in a successful math lineup.

I don't have much to offer in the way of specific curriculum suggestions (my kids are younger than yours, so I have only the vaguest of plans for that age!). But I did just want to comment that I think that one of the reasons that there are few TE science programs out there is because there really isn't a need for them. Science is just ... science, and it feels a bit odd to have to label some science programs as "secular." (I know why we need to in the homeschooling world, and I respect that, but it still feels odd to me.) What I miss more are good faith resources for us. The Farraday site is, I think, going to be very helpful in that respect.

We're theistic evolutionists here, but are working at a much lower grade level than you are, so I can't comment specifically on Apologia at that level. Recently serendipitous journey shared how she uses Apologia with her younger student: basically she rewrites the entire text so that she keeps the tone and style, but eliminates the YEC / design elements. (You can read about this in posts 9 and 11 of this thread -- she even shares a copy of a rewritten chapter.) My thinking is that if it is that much work to make Apologia usable in the younger years, I suspect that it's going to be much harder at the Gr. 7 level. I already find it so much simpler to use secular books. I think that for theistic evolutionists, YEC / OEC / ID materials are difficult to work with because developing a coherent science program requires more than just skipping the creationist / design bits. We would probably agree that evolutionary theory provides the framework for the study of biology, so that as students learn more about biology, they should be expanding in their understanding of how that theory provides coherence to the subject. Similarly with geology or astronomy: deep time is so embedded in a scientific understanding of these fields that students need to be able to work with it all throughout their study of the subject. It's not something that can be tacked on at the beginning of a program. And that's where I really struggle with creationist / design materials -- I may be able to edit out parts that I disagree with, but I can't as easily integrate in those foundational concepts and theories.

I'm not familiar with MCP or MUS. But I do know Singapore, and it is a rock-solid program that will serve your students well. You can be confident that with its strong progression, you won't be missing major topics. I've found it to be well-organized and simple to use. If you go the Singapore route, I recommend getting the HIG, text, workbook, and CWP to start. Bear in mind that some parents use the CWP a bit (or even a full level) behind because of its difficulty level. Some people have expressed a dislike of all the books that comprise the program, but I simply haven't encountered that as a problem. To me, the variety of books means that I can tailor the program to my child's level. A typical Singapore day might look like this: I check the HIG for ideas on how to introduce the topic with manipulatives, and then do those with my student. We do the related section in the textbook, usually orally, so that I can check how well she has understood the topic. Then she does the related pages in the workbook. The Singapore teaching style is to move from concrete (with manipulatives) to pictorial (usually the text) to abstract (manipulating numbers in the workbook). My favourite manipulatives with Singapore have been c-rods; while not included in the HIG, I've found that almost every manipulative-based activity can be done using c-rods. :001_smile: HTH

I popped back in here to link to this thread where I received some ideas about using Beast Academy as a spine. In Posts 5 and 7, Dana outlined a possible Beast Academy spine / Singapore supplement progression. She suggested using BA as a spine and supplementing with Singapore IP and CWP; if the student finds something in IP confusing, that's the time to turn to the Singapore text. I was really intrigued by the idea that with this combination, Gr. 6 could be mostly Singapore CWP / IP with some other fun resources thrown in. In Post 12, Bill makes a pretty good case for continuing with the full Singapore program alongside of BA. (Bill has never been a friend to my pocketbook! :001_smile: ) I found their thoughts so helpful as I'm figuring out math next year.

I suspect that your boys will work through BA at different rates anyway, so I don't know if you'll find it easier if you try to sync them. The nice thing about BA is that it *can* be very independent for an older child. So I would imagine that your older student would be able to read the guide and tackle all of the problems on his own, while your younger student may need you (or big brother) closer at hand at the beginning. And on the skip counting -- we just finished that section up here, and it's not your regular skip counting! The section was more about discovering patterns and structure within the natural numbers, a skill that is so valuable for higher-level mathematics. I would consider doing more than just the starred questions in that section.

All About Spelling has been good with both of my K-ers.

I've been thinking of doing this. My dd loves Beast! I'm going to use at minimum the Singapore IP and CWP along with Beast.. But ... I've also got the Singapore text and workbook handy in case we flounder. And just recently some folks here made a pretty convincing argument for continuing with the full two programs. In reality, this is probably what I'll do. It's definitely the most expensive math year yet!!

That's fantastic! It's a great program! All the best with your class next year.

Tin Man Press has some activities and books worth checking out. Fun and offbeat, but effective!

I had my 7 y/o take the DORA recently and it took a while to wrap my head around the numbers. I'd take both word recognition scores with a grain of salt; speed plays a role in the high frequency words. Basically I think that the test has confirmed your suspicions: she's reading at a much higher level than her age-based grade, and is spelling at a bit lower than her age-based grade. I try to challenge my daughter with her reading. She has "assigned reading" time daily (20-30 min at this age), where she has to read a book that from a list of assigned reading books. Some of these she picks herself, pending approval from dh or me. She gets a sticker for each title completed, and the chance to choose a book of her own when she's done a whole list of 10. Dh and I select titles that will challenge without frustrating. Outside of assigned reading time, she gets to read anything she wants. We also read aloud together, and sometimes I choose rather complex books for this so that we can learn together how to tackle challenging texts.

I like doing both!

I second the suggestion of starting with what TWTM recommends. I mentally divide subjects into "essential, important, and gravy" categories. Essentials I am very strict with myself about getting to on a daily or almost-daily basis. Important subjects I expect we'll get to several times a week, but I don't beat myself up if we only do them once or twice a week. Gravy subjects are the extras that I add in that, if we miss, I just shrug and move on. For Gr. 2, I broke these down in this way: Essential math phonics-based spelling (or, if reading is not yet strong, phonics for reading) writing (via copywork and narration, as in WWE) daily independent and shared reading Important grammar handwriting science history French Gravy art Latin and/or Greek geography Hope that this helps!

Bill, you make me laugh! Thanks so much -- this was helpful. I think I wanted to hear that I'm not messing her up eternally if we've lagged a bit behind her possible level in Singapore. (And that's what I'm taking from your message, although I don't know if you intended that! :001_smile: ) I really do not think that this child would fall in the "gifted" group in mathematics, but she is bright and has a huge love for the subject now. (When I compare our early days starting with Saxon to how she is thriving with math now, I am SO GLAD that I bumped into you and others on this board who helped me find Miquon & Singapore. Thank you a thousand times!) Okay, I think that you, Dana & Julie are saying similar things: don't panic and mess up this important foundation by thoughtlessly rushing through anything. That means I'm going to have to get every. single. Singapore book again next year, isn't it? Oh, DH is going to love this ... :lol: Thanks for helping me think this through!

It sounds like Saxon isn't going to work for you. It didn't for my dd, for the same reasons that your son seems to experiencing, and I'm just glad I discovered that pretty early on! I think that Life of Fred has a lot in it, but imo it takes some attentiveness on on the parent's part to turn it into a full curriculum. I don't have the skills to do that, although I know that others who post here have been able to make it work. Programs that I've used that might work for you (and that have already been recommended) include Miquon, Singapore, or MEP. Singapore's Challenging Word Problems are simply excellent and could supplement any math program.

Thank you! We do love supplements here ... Zaccaro, logic puzzles, Life of Fred, Hands-on-Equations. Actually, I think I have a supplement problem. :blushing: I'm suspecting that I've let her main spine to date (Singapore) languish a bit behind where she is working at in other areas. And I am 100% with you -- I don't want to skip so much as to accelerate by being more efficient. Thanks for the reminder that it's okay to skip problems -- dd has a thing about that.

Welcome! It looks like you have a great lineup. Like Erin said, WWE is just done 4 days/week. FWIW, if your dd7 hasn't been doing copywork and narration yet, you may find it more appropriate to begin with WWE1. (WWE 4 is optional, and it seems that some parents are waiting until Gr. 6 to begin WWS anyway, so starting WWE1 in Gr. 2 won't leave your child "behind" in the long run.) FLL is designed to be used 2-3 times per week. If you start with FLL 1, you could use it with both girls together, as it's almost entirely oral and very repetitious. Alternatively, you could go straight to using FLL 2 with your Gr. 2 student, and wait for another year to introduce grammar to your K student. If your elder dd is reading ahead, is she also ready for a spelling program? I didn't see one listed in your siggy. I haven't used MM for any length of time (I love the program, but my girls found the pages too full for them). Bear in mind that Maria Miller has deliberately included more problems than are usually needed to master a topic, so that you always have the ability to provide extra reinforcement on those topics where your student needs extra support. You may want to plan to do every other problem in a lesson and then see if your student needs more practice before assigning the others. One way to do math is to just set the timer each day. Close the books when the timer goes, and pick up again next day.

:lol: But children complicate things so much! My pretty plans just fall apart in their hands!

Thank you -- I was really hoping you'd plan our math progression for me offer this helpful information. :D I'm making notes! I don't want to accelerate with her so much as make sure the various pieces we're using are at the right level. Your recommendation to use Beast as a spine for a bit with the IPs / CWPs / Process Skills makes such good sense. (As I think about it, Beast is a great working level for her at the moment.) I love the idea of doing just the CWP / IP / Process Skills for 6 (and I must Google Elements of Math now!) Thank you, thank you!

:iagree: How could I have forgotten these essentials? Off to make myself a cup of coffee and have a piece of dark chocolate now ...

Dana, you have been so helpful here. Thank you!!!

I haven't used Math-U-See, but I understand that it has a non-standard sequence that would need to be followed for several grades. I suspect it would raise more parental concerns because of its unusual progression. It wouldn't be an option for me if I were only considering Gr 1 & 2. Math Mammoth is another strong program, but I wonder how it would play in a classroom? It is written to the student -- would that make it easier or harder for a teacher in a group setting? When I reflect on my time teaching in a small classroom many years ago, I think that parental buy-in will be important. Of the programs I've used here, Singapore would probably be the easiest for parents to feel confident in. It "looks" like a typical math program, has good reviews for parents who Google that sort of thing, and has a wealth of resources for the teacher (tests, problem solving books, extra practice books, instructor's guides). Miquon and MEP would probably require more explaining about the methodology for some parents to buy in.

Miquon would probably need extra word problems thrown in. I've used Singapore's Process Skills in Problem Solving (more as an instructor's guide) and its Challenging Word Problems to fill that need. As for place value ... hmmm ... I think it develops a deep understanding of place value in Gr. 1 (Red & Orange) and the first half of Gr. 2 (Blue), and then gives more formal language for it in the second half of Gr. 2. But ... with Miquon, students may be moving ahead in areas of interest, and you can always start a "thread" early if it suits them. If it's something you're interested in, I'd recommend getting First Grade Diary, which is a record of a year of using Miquon with Gr. 1. If you're interested in MEP, you can watch a video of the program on which it's based in action in a classroom.