M&M
-
Posts
716 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Events
Blogs
Classifieds
Store
Posts posted by M&M
-
-
Who is going to ENOCH this weekend? What are you excited to peruse?
I'll be there both days.
Hope to see you there!!
-
Who is going to ENOCH this weekend? What are you excited to peruse?
I'll be there both days.
Hope to see you there!!
-
Singing like Michael Jackson...you wanna be startin' somethin'....I printed up the h.s. Biology lesson plans from Donna Young and all the RS4K, tops and kits I have....maybe...I'll keep you posted :)
I cannot wait to see what you come up with :D.
-
:lol::lol: Thanks for the clarification! My rising 6th grader is mathy, but since we have not done a lot of science there is no way I would plop him in Biology with his sister (she would hate that).
Thanks for clearing that up for me :001_smile:.
-
Well at least I am not the only one! Btw, I love your blog and your posts have been very helpful as I am in a similar boat with you. I guess I should look at Apologia and see what I can pull together ala TOG....oh my I may never sleep again!
-
You are going to use the high school biology book with your 12 year old? I have not seen the Biology book yet, but I was thinking it would be too much for my 12 yo 6th grader.
-
Am I asking the impossible? This fall my 9th grader will be doing Apologia Biology. Most of her labs will be done at Co-op, but we will have to do some at home. Since I will be teaching or at least supervising her learning Biology, I thought I could fold in my younger children.
So, have any of you found a way to teach science to grammar and logic stage children alongside a highschooler? What I would really like is something like TOG but for science. Since that doesn't exist, what are my options? I know I can teach the seperately, I have the lower levels of Apologia but I would at least like my 6th grader to tag along with his sister.
Science has always been the negelcted subject in this house and I would like to change it so I really need something to keep me on track. Any suggestions besides a whack on my head?
-
Please tell me how do you handle hotel reservations and online ordering?
We are getting rid of all our cc debt, and getting rid of all cc. So, how does one live in a credit society when you wish to pay cash for everything?
Thanks
-
This is a great question! I have no answers as we are just beginning this high school journey. I imagine when my youngest is beginning 9th and I have (Lord willing) graduated some I will have some wisdom in this.
When I thought about how the highschool years would be, I never considered the emotional toll dealing with teens would have on me. Choosing battles and knowing when to draw a line in the sand and stand firm is still my challenge. I imagine that I will have more clarity when I look back at these years...which is no help now.
Ok, I have rambled enough, hope that this at least gives you a bump and some btdt wisdom.
-
So, you all would have the 5th grader listen along with SOTW, do narrations on his own and then read and outline the encyclopedia? In the WTM it doesn't have the 5-8th grader doing SOTW anymore, but doing more research and reading on topics read in the encyclopedia.
Anyone else have any input?
When you look at the way WTM does history and how it spells out each stage of doing history, you must remember that it is describing the oldest child in your family. The 5-8th graders outline and do research, but they can still use SOTW as the jumping off point. Keeping all of your children on the same topic in history makes teaching much easier and the 5th grader will only gain by having a bit of an intro with SOTW (especially if he has never heard it before).
Use what will work for your family, you want your children to be engaged and excited or at least not bored :001_huh: about history, if SOTW gets you there, then you are succeeding!
-
I had always heard about people skipping parts of SAXON, or only doing half of the problems. Then I read some of the replies below and I read Art Reed's Book, Using John Saxon's Books. They convinced me that I should not only do the whole book but also all the problems. Placement is key, if you think you should advance your child, I would take the placement test (these are not for current Saxon users). One of the things I learned from the book is that although problems seem to be the same or similar, they build skills and there is a method to the "madness".
This is Jann in TX's reply:
You will get many different answers to this question. There are many here on the boards who only give the odds or evens out...the PROBLEM with this is that Saxon DOES NOT design their program to be used in this manner (many other texts are designed this way). When you skip problems with Saxon you are setting yourself up for trouble later on...the problem sets do not have ‘evenly spaced’ concepts AND some “concepts†may ‘look’ the same to the untrained parent--BUT each problem is actually teaching/testing in a different area. By routinely skipping problems you are missing out on critical review. In most of the series--7/6 and above the practice problems often DIFFER from the original concept (the one noted by the little number). As the student’s knowledge and experience increases so does their ability to COMBINE concepts. The review problems are often more difficult/complex than the original practice problems.
I’m a certified Math teacher--turned homeschool Mother. I have taught/tutored Saxon for over 7 years (1st grade -Advanced Math). The vast majority of the students seeking tutoring in Pre-Algebra and above are those who routinely skipped problems--working only half of the problem set.
Skipping problems in the texts below 7/6 MAY work out well for some students as the concepts taught are very basic. From 7/6 on it is very important to work EVERY problem. If the problem set takes ‘too much time’ to do each day most likely the reason is that the student needs MORE practice!!!
I have a dd with some learning differences and she has had success working 15-20 problems a day--continuing on the next day without skipping any problems. She completes a little over 3 problem sets a week.
Some people are fine with their students making a “B†in math. It is sad that those students could be making “A’s†if only they had used the text the way it was designed!
It is probably obvious that I am passionate about this issue. When you choose to use a program such as Saxon that is designed with a complex spiral review it is important to use the program correctly--taking shortcuts will only shortchange your child. There may be other math programs where working only 10-15 problems a day is sufficient--but Saxon is definately NOT one of them.
This is another reply:
Like Jann, I am a teacher turned homeschooling mom. I have an education background in curriculum development, as well as testing and evaluation.
I, too have seen numerous students struggling, who had been using Saxon and skipping problems. I have not seen many struggling who were using the program as Saxon designed it.
As far as getting a “B†instead of getting an “A,†I agree with Jann. But along with this, I would say that the degree to which a student actually learns and the length which a student retains the material is greater when all problems in the problem set are completed.
Saxon interweaves so much into the problem set it is hard to demonstrate through words on a screen. Not only are the previous concepts reviewed, but they are expanded and combined with other aspects of math along the way. If you were to go through an entire level of Saxon Math and write down all the problems that related to a certain lesson, you would be amazed to see the progression and the development. Not only that, but Saxon often relates one lesson to another by having the students work problems which relate to each other across the lessons, as review is done. Glance through your answer key [especially easy where the problem set answers are in a chart form]. You will see that there are multiple answers that are the same value, but if you look at the problems you will see that the problems were reviewing or expanding different topics. [but the number answer is the same-- this skill of seeing this within the lesson is great for Algebraic thinking and more] These types of things also help the student see the relationships between percents/fractions/decimals and more.
It would be much more helpful to spread the lesson out over more than one day and cover the material a bit slower, than to rush through and skip part of the teaching and learning involved. You may find that your student improves his work time and can easily complete an entire lesson in an allotted time frame. [although I have come across some home schoolers who try to complete each subject in 30 minutes, which may be unrealistic for the Algebras or higher]
None of this is shared to imply anyone is doing their math lessons wrong, but only to share from experience and research what has shown to work or not to work in other situations, so you can make the choice for your student and your home school.
-
I've been exploring various history options for my daughter who will be in 2nd grade come September. Keeping in mind that I also have a 4 year old and a 1 year old and thus need to keep things reasonably streamlined, here's what I'm considering:
I really love the living books that go along with TOG year one for lower elementary, but I'm debating whether it's worth the $ to go with the full program. Is the teacher's guide is worth the $240, or is it a reasonable option to just get the books and schedule them myself. Would I be missing a lot of the program if I only did the books? Also, if I did the TOG in three days a week, how much time per day would it require?
I'm also considering SOTW1 and the AG. I haven't reviewed it personally, but I'm having difficulty being enthusiastic about about a textbook, even one written in a narrative style.
Has anyone combined SOTW with the TOG reading? What are your thoughts on that?
Thanks for your input!!
If you are looking for a program that you can start now and build on as your children grow, and one that will give you time to prepare for the upper levels now; then TOG is for you.
SOTW is scheduled in TOG , so you can use the books you like with SOTW. You could also use SOTW with the AG which also give literature and additional history resources. I would not call SOTW a textbook by any stretch of the imagination. It is a living book written by an author passionate about history.
I have used SOTW with my younger children and TOG with the older children. I do wish I had TOG sooner so that I would have been better prepared to teach D and now R levels. This year we will do more TOG with the younger children.
HTH
-
Stop beating yourself up!!!! You have a very little baby at home, which probably means you are not getting a lot of sleep. I never ever function well or think clearly when I have a little baby.
My husband has to remind me of this constantly. I am harder on myself than anyone else. It is really hard not to compare yourself to others, but your children will not suffer from stepping back. If Mom is stressed then nothing is much fun at all.
We have stepped back from things, taken time off of school to have a baby and to move, not one of my children is suffering. Yes, they complain sometimes, but they learn that we do what works for our family. My children are very close.
Please don't beat yourself up, it often takes me two years after having a baby to feel myself again and that often means that I was preggo again! Now my youngest is 4 and today we are going on a field trip (something we haven't done in years) to the Edison Museum.
Trust me, it will all work out. Take care of yourself!!
-
As our family grew and we had more little ones in the house, we have slowed down quite a bit. Now that they are getting bigger, we can do more. We try to do activities that we can all do together. So, we are in a twice a month co-op that has something for all my children. Soccer is played at the same field for all children on Saturdays. Piano lessons are at our house.
Marcia Sommerville of TOG has a great talk about homeschooling with a housefull. She did not do outside activities if she had a little one that would miss a nap. Remember that life happens in stages, what doesn't get done now (acitivites) can happen later.
When we were out doing a lot, we were not getting a lot of schooltime done. What are the ages of your children? Why do you feel guilt that they are not doing? You are giving them the best, your time and attention. You should not compare to what others are doing, try to find a rhythm that works for you. That should result in happy children and a happy well rested Mommy.
-
We have had few problems using alt resources for D and lower levels. Anytime we were missing something we just looked it up online or skipped it. You might need more of the R level books, since you are digging deeper into the subject.
-
Some do, some don't. There are older threads here that show some feel that TOG R is closer to college level work. Karenciavo and Janice in NJ and others that I cannot remember right now do R level with their highschoolers. Honestly, everyone does TOG differently, that is why we love it so. Everything in TOG is flexible, you make it work for your family. You get to find the balance for each child instead of the curriculum dictating what they should do.
We will start highschool with my oldest this fall, and we will see how she does with some of the R level work. I really think that it will take time to find a good balance for her this year.
-
You might look at the D level books. It is really hard to jump into TOG at the R level, you might want to ease into it by mixing D and R levels for your oldest.
-
I will be there. Every year we start our vacation by going to HEAV. I am so glad that I can hear Susan and Jessie speak! I don't know if I'll be going to all of the workshops, but I will be going to the upper level ones.
-
Yes, I understand. No, my intention was to have the OP look at her needs not problems others have had with one program or the other. Sorry if it didn't come off that way! I have had to stop and start a few times between posts to care for the little ones here.
I have not used the HS program and it was beneficial to know that about MFW. I love learning about new curriculum.
-
I am totally a pick it up and go gal! I am also a don't tell me what I have to do each day kind of gal! Life is too unpredictable here for me to try to keep to a daily schedule.
Most of my time is spent learning, I am learning what my children are learning, so that when I sit down once a week to talk to my kiddos...I have a CLUE what they are learning. I spend an hour of quiet time reading my notes and picking what I think will be the most important threads to focus on. I pick out the books we will use and I make a pile for each child. On Monday, I give each child their books, any maps, student pages, notes, and any other info they need for the week. (I prepare ahead of time, one unit at a time, choose books and print out what I need). They plan their week, they decide how to get the work done, all I have to do is sit down with them and discuss. Since I have (ideally) already read my notes, I am ready to follow the discussion outline and help them make connections. If I am not prepared, the notes help me to be able to have a very good discussion (Mom is just not as talkative...maybe that's better LOL!).
That gives me time to teach my younger children, to read aloud, to do what I did with the older ones. For me it is the best of all things. My older children have learned how to be accountable for their learning, to plan the week and get it done. My younger children have face to face time with MOM!
Check out these discussions on TOG and how people use it
http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1438948#poststop
http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=146740
The cost is up to you. I have just purchased all my R and D level books(used in excellent condition) from a board member and it was not more than other programs. I will use SOTW mostly for my younger children, although I am tempted to purchase her LG and UG books as well ...soo many books so little time!
-
That's the beauty of MFW high school. Because the student is working mostly independently, Mom is only teaching one parent-led program with the elementary-aged children. :) Then Mom has her 1-on-1 time with the high schooler as needed, but Mom isn't "doing" two or three different packages for history.
Yes, but with TOG I have one teacher's manual, one set of notes one schedule to look at. TOG is also independent for the highschooler and even the D level. That was not my point, with MFW I would have to have 4 manuals for my 5 children that was the "doing" I was referring to! Even an independent program needs a facilitator.
Ditto MFW. All the books that come in the package are scheduled, as they are the core resources and literature that make up the 3 full credits in History, Bible, and English. But my dd does much more reading on her own than just what's in the package.
There are a lot of differences between MFW high school and MFW elementary. The main similarity is the way lesson plans are laid out in a weekly grid with teacher's (or in the case of h.s., student's) notes following. In fact, it's because of those differences that some people who love MFW elementary won't use it in h.s., and vice versa.
Doesn't sound that much different from how we use TOG for D and R levels. I am tired of this debate and usually don't post my opinions about MFW for this reason. IMHO, and this is only my opinion is that MFW is more challenging to do with mulitple levels. I don't do Sonlight for the same reason. I think Sonlight is great, but my children are spaced in a way that makes doing it challenging and takes more time than I have.
And that's as it should be! :thumbup1:
My point was really that both are great programs, and the OP needs to look at what tool is best for her. My opinion (or yours) can only help to a point and then she has to decide what works for her. Which is why I suggested printing up samples of BOTH programs. Nothing is perfect, no curriculum works for everyone.
-
Have you printed out one of the TOG free trials? Your question is difficult to answer because it depends on what you are looking for in a program. There are so many discussions about this on this board. You really have to decide what will work for you. I have used both programs (not highschool level) and I prefer TOG others don't.
I like not being tied to specific books or a specific schedule. I love learning along with and ahead of my children. I love that TOG has taught my older children how to plan their work and work their plan. I love that I will purchase 4 TOG year plans and I will be done curriculum purchasing for all the many TOG subjects for all of my children. I do not want to do two or three packages for History etc. for all the learning levels in my home. You can spend a ton of money on TOG if you want, I don't. When I don't have a book, I go to the library, internet, I find something to replace it. I will always fill my home with great books so I have no problem choosing what I like and letting SOTW and Streams of Civ or Kingfisher History fill in the gaps. I like flexibility, I didn't like some of the books we used in EX-1850 and my children ...well it just didn't work for us.
I feel I get more for my money with TOG, because it fills a need in MY homeschool. I like having more than I need so that I am never searching to add to it for the children in my home that need more challenge, yet I can feel free to cut what we don't need. What are the needs in your homeschool? What do YOU need as a teacher to teach the many learning levels in your home? What constitues fun in your home? Which tool will work for you?
There are enough TOG and MFW users on this board to debate this until day's end. Print out samples of both and try them on for size, you will only get a taste of them but it might be enough to help you decide.
-
I made copies of some parts of the rhetoric stage subjects and went over them with our dc at various times. They weren't overwhelmed, but they may have been older than your dc.
I mostly emphasized the processes, which I typed up and gave to each dc. I did the same thing with the essential booklists. I didn't include all the extra books in some subjects, like science. I tried to stick to the absolutely essential.
I also saved all lists on a thumb drive .... just in case any of them lose theirs. ;) They liked having their own lists so they can see where they're headed, and for jotting down any notes about the materials and books. Last year we all sat down with the GB's list and went through it book by book. Any (older) dc who had already read a book told us what they thought about it and if it was a total waste of time. The other dc jotted down notes on their own GB's lists for future reference to help decide how much time to spend on each book.
It might actually be overwhelming to some kids to ask them to read the rhetoric sections of WTM, however. I know it was very overwhelming to me when I first read WTM. I had to read and reread and take notes and outline - forever. I only did the above with our dc after they'd been doing WTM for a several years.
HTH
Kathy,
I love these ideas! This is what I had in mind. I think this will help her understand the process, and the goal we are working toward.
Thanks
-
I am wondering if I should give certain sections to my rising 9th grader to read this summer so we are on the same page. My concern is that it might be overwhelming to her. I mean I know plenty of adults that are afraid of WTM.
What says the hive? Has anyone tried this?
If you have 4 or more kids ...
in General Education Discussion Board
Posted
girl, boy, girl, boy, girl