Possibly not except the teaching time required of me across subjects and grade levels is a lot in this season. If spelling can be run with more independence and less teacher time that is a big help. But I worry about it ....

Thanks everyone. I deleted my OP because I felt that it was whiny and I was talking to myself. ;) I am assessing the time required to teach WRtR or LOE to 2 of my kids and feel disheartened. I am a big fan of R&S spelling and wonder if in the long run it would be enough. Ido like memorizing the phonograms and applying that to spelling as we go (I.e. Mom, how do you spell ???? I answer with the phonograms rather than letters.). Another option is to use R&S and have each kid keep a spelling journal in which we tackle trouble spots and that would be the time to learn and practice a specific rule. Sighing loudly.

Ditto. ;)

NM ... Talking to myself here. ;)

Hi Jess, Ha! I am a mess with history. Still looking for the elusive perfect. I think History Revealed is very much "up my alley" except I concluded that it might not be the best timing to jump in. I think it looks like a better fit with my oldest student being older. My idealism takes hold of me and when I really mesh the expectations I have with where my kids are at I realize why it's not a good fit overall. Still thinking on MFW or MOH. I actually like MFW because it kind of meets in the middle with books and pads things with the book basket. Book basket worked out really well for us in the past and it seemed like everything else was "enough". Science is sticky because my oldest has ideas and we are doing what he wants in science this year for him. Beautiful Feet or Veritas Press may win out for being trim/streamlined and having excellent literature. I want a solid history course with strong Bible integration that won't take over. MOH feels huge to me once we get to year 2 and I KNOW I'll lose everyone but my oldest. History Revealed sounds quite good but REALISTICALLY I think I'll be spinning around trying to scrape unmotivated kids off their buns and get them busy with something meaningful. Personally, I'm not *sure* that I'd be content unless there was a good amount of reading and writing linked to history. My kids would be drawn to the easier, more creative output and I don't think we're at a maturity level to self-drive that here. It would end up being Mom driven. Anyhow, no matter what we DO we'll listen to Diana's cds. I adore them. History is THE subject that is ruining my life. It's such a monster. There are so many ways to go about it. I have multiple interest levels, reading levels, maturity levels, and limited time. I don't have the background to KNOW if I'm "doing it right" although I do know I want a few things: Strong Bible integration Strong Christian worldview (i.e. God is the Creator and He is sovereign) Fantastic literature and some of it (or most of it) is just there to be read and savored Some guided discussion and hopefully help for me to launch this with older students The usual timelines and mapwork and basic output (i.e. narration, notebook page, research topic) A few meaningful projects Audio/Video supplements Not sure what I need but maybe I will have to use MOH or VP as my spine and fashion it myself. I just do NOT know how to do this, how to multi-teach it, or how to have the kinds of discussions I want.

This is also a good idea Chelli. I think I own IYW (sheepish grin) and will take a peek. DS is going to use FLL 3 (rather than my beloved R&S) and it's a 3 day a week thing. I'll have to come up with a loop for him and I'll come back to share once I have it figured out.

My 9 year old will use it this year although I intend to help him jump between IEW and CAP's writing. He's a rising 3rd grader so we have plenty of time although writing will be very consistent this year. Thanks for the FB discount recommendation. Shipping was a lot so that 20% helped!

NM - ;)

We have been reading Volume 1 and enjoying it a lot!! I'd like to order the 2nd volume. Any deals for that? I'm poking around on VP's site and coming up short. Will keep looking though ...

No, I didn't. Just watched the videos. But, after all of that I'm considering using Writing Road to Reading. I've been reading through the 4th edition and it's pretty streamlined. We'll see . . . I feel torn between LOE phonograms (prefer her pronunciation) and teacher training and the simplicity of WRTR ONCE I get through the learning curve. Streamlined programs are my thing. ;)

OP, I hope the discussion has been profitable for you. :)

Yes on the basic research but would still need guidance. =) ACB would be our launching point. It looks awesome but I am still thinking on this. ;)

Thanks so much ladies. Soooooo, if my oldest is a rising 5th grader who will be 11 in October AND is a pretty sharp guy/strong reader would you recommend we wait or jump in this year. We *could* do an overview this year and/or study American History rather than do that when he is in 8th. Still thinking. :coolgleamA:

Yes, it zings! :coolgleamA: I want to purchase the blocks and Alpha, Beta, and Gamma in one order. Will I be frustrated if I only order one set of blocks? And, what about the storage case? I do like things organized and easy for the kids to use without me stressing about jamming them into an odd shaped box. Anything else necessary at this stage? I don't need the skip counting songs.

Not sure about the CLE loathing and I've made him use it despite his complaints. HOWEVER, I could write a novella detailing the reasons the dude seems to be "missing out" using MM or CLE. I really really think he needs the manipulative component of MUS and then we can skip back over and work in CLE or MM if we want to. :coolgleamA: I cried a lot in school and it was always over math. Frankly, I did NOT understand a lot of it and at some point was left behind. If I had been homeschooled and was able to study at MY pace and with the hands on stuff I needed and with the WHYS spelled out for me I am SURE I would've been a much more successful and less frustrated math student. Word problems terrified me and I floundered for years. One other thing about the school teaching vs the Mom.... I believe that often we push kids through in school because we have no choice. Keep up or sink. It's super easy to fall back on the algorithms and just filling in the blank and getting the right answer because there isn't TIME to slow down and truly learn why and how. Too much pressure to "keep up" and kids fall through the cracks and their understanding in math is damaged. I am definitely a case in point and have a lot of compassion for my son.

Susie, You are being such a big help to those of us investigating HR. I am hopeful the continuing discussion is helpful to the OP. Is there a "spine" feel? Narrative spines really work well for me (which is why I'm hesitant with MFW as it seems more choppy on paper ... maybe that's a wrong impression). Mystery of History does have that narrative feel but I really LOVE the hands on aspect of HR and the opportunity for my kids to have some freedom to investigate, respond, etc. There's something about the approach that appeals to me ...

So, I went back to the MUS site today to check pricing. :svengo: I have to really ponder this one as I think my guy needs bits and pieces of Alpha and Beta before hitting his sweet spot in Gamma. I do have two more kids coming up the ranks but still . . .

Thanks Susie. Okay, I remembered reading a review of DW's curriculum on Anne Elliot's blog here. It is concise (will take half a minute to read). Any thoughts or reactions? Busy work is pretty subjective and so I can't say for sure wether or not I'd feel that way. I am also a terrible judge of whether or not the projects/activities are best suited for a classroom rather than a family. What age do you believe is ideal to dive into HR? My oldest child will be 11 this fall and he's a sharp guy. With HOD he'd easily be using CtC this fall (and I am struggling with saying no to this in favor of family learning but it is ever so depressing to be tucked away in our little spots doing separate guides even though the guides are lovely and every kid is "on level". Four guides and I find myself spinning. Sigh.) Still thinking. :coolgleamA:

Susie, Thanks for this perspective. The bolded describes what I *think* my style is. Direction with flex; combination of individual work and group work and opportunities to share and learn from one another (a one room schoolhouse). Strong Biblical worldview, a variety of ways to learn and respond to what we are learning, meaty discussion questions, multiple book recommendations with a great variety in "style" of book, etc. I see HOD's Bigger in your signature. Are you doing that with a younger kiddo? =) I am trying to leave HOD because combining is a bust with every combination of kids in this family (it's been tough because there is a lot to love). I finished wading through all of the samples. :001_tt1: Now I wonder if I should wait a year before we start so my oldest two kids are 6th (12) and 4th (10). The boys will be 9 and 11 this fall but waiting a year means the middle guy is a bit more on target. In the meantime we could finish HOD's Preparing and/or study American History. I'm thinkin', I'm thinkin' ....

:coolgleamA: I have been so stuck with history ... Today I am digging through the samples at Diana Waring's website and this looks fantastic for my family and like it MIGHT be what I have been looking for. I'd love to hear the negatives .... are there any? Why don't more folks use this? Obviously it is heavily Biblical (yahoo) and so that narrows the playing field. I love the 3 year cycle idea with a year leftover for American. This may be premature affection for this curriculum plan but I feel hopeful today that I may have found someplace to begin with history studies for my crew (otherwise, I think it's MFW for us and that wouldn't be a bad thing :001_cool: ). Back to previewing the awesome samples.

This is an encouraging thread .... We have watched all of the sample videos. Maybe it's just me but I LOVE his teaching style and *seeing* the concepts presented with manipulatives is immensely helpful to this Mom. I want to buy all of the levels so I can watch the DVDs. Is this insane? I will call them but would love some feedback on what to purchase. I do think I want to buy Alpha, Beta, and Gamma at a minimum to start. But I truly want all of the videos for myself .... :coolgleamA: I worked through the Beta test for my son. Subtraction is his nemesis. He did absolutely fine with the addition and all of the word problems. Subtraction kills him ....

:coolgleamA: Would you be willing to flesh this out for me? Any recommendations on where to start with this guy? Thanks for sharing this. I am chewing on it and mulling it over. It excites me that I could have a hybrid. I DO so love MM and think that ONE of these days his brain will mature enough to "get" mental math. Historically, despite his struggles, he has LOVED math. Watching his little flame die out is unpleasant and I want to avoid it. My desire is to fan that flame back into existence and keep it burning .... Advice to use UPS noted. :coolgleamA:

Shaina, I really love this. :) What is the Mankind series?

My DS9 is a struggling math student and has been from the get go. The dude's brain just doesn't think the way his older brother's and we're stuck in the mud. My fave programs are Math Mammoth :001_wub: and Christian Light. However, NEITHER of these options really click for this kid. HE likes Math Mammoth but every.single.day we end up in fits with tears and throwing of school supplies. We have gone back to MM over and over again as he wants to keep trying but it is truly a VERY overwhelming experience and he is now experiencing feelings of being a failure. Christian Light was a gift from God last year as he was able to "do math" with relative ease although I think he was underplaced. HOWEVER, we began to build consistency in math facts and feeling successful. We skipped the second half of CLE Math 2 and went right into 3 (the kid was held back a year so is an older student for his grade anyway). 2 was really too easy and boring .... 3 has seemed a better challenge and he finished thru LU304 in mid Spring. We have been away from math for a daunting move. The math wheels are turning again here and we are STRUGGLING. He was adamant about using MM and he passionately hates CLE. I believe that the decision as to what math my kid does is firmly in MY camp however his strong dislike gives me pause. I prefer MM so conceded to trying it ........ again. We had a heart to heart about past struggles and the reality that he'd need to start at the beginning of 3rd grade with MM. We aren't out of the 2nd grade review and every day has been awful ..... I KNOW this isn't working for him. I KNOW it's a bad fit despite my adoration of MM and the incremental nature of it. He just.doesn't.get it. And the reality of life is such that I cannot spend every day dealing with fits over math because I am out of ideas as to how to demonstrate or explain each concept AGAIN and AGAIN and AGAIN in a way that will click in his brain. Enter Math U See. I researched Crewton Ramone and was ga ga. It looks so much like MUS and MUS seems MUCH easier for ME to implement day to day. Steve Demme is an engaging teacher and the way he teaches makes absolute sense. My son NEEDS this type of instruction and SEEING every concept with those blocks is the KEY for him .... I am sure of it. So, as I look at placement I feel disheartened as he'd likely be back in Beta. :001_unsure: And, it is a very different style than we are used to since it's uber mastery. Please help me to understand if going back to Beta would be worthwhile in the long run. I *think* it might be as this way of teaching math strikes me as PERFECT for this child. I have labored over math with him from the beginning and I have NOT jumped around other than between CLE and MM. He has learned but it seems like we're not moving forward as math is getting a tad more challenging and I really don't think he has mastered what he's learned. I could give many examples of why this is obvious to me but this post has gotten long enough already .... ANY counsel would be appreciated. I am *this close* to purchasing MUS for him and grabbing Beta and Gamma as I think he'd work fairly quickly through Beta but he NEEDS to plug holes and cement understanding of Place Value and addition/subtraction. I think MUS may turn on the light bulbs in his brain ....

Listening in as I find this VERY interesting ..... I am surprised that Billy Graham is included on a 161 point world history timeline.