ASD, high school, whats reasonable

[Janeway]

I am feeling down on home schooling my next up child, who is in 8th this year. Older child, who is 15 yrs old, is very smart, no learning disabilities, just ASD with a teenaged attitude problem. He has always coasted through things he wanted to do, quickly and with ease. For example, when he decided he wanted to learn Latin, he obsessed on it and did two years worth within a semester and then moved on. Now, he is working on German and Piano. He is making his own pieces for piano now. He has only been doing piano for a year and a half and is quite advanced in it. As far as language arts and history and such goes, he is so advanced and has completed so much in those areas that he is now working on books given to him by someone in an honors program at a university. 

 

Math and science, nope. We are not getting anywhere. Last year, for biology, he completed maybe 1/4 to 1/3  of the book. Algebra 2, he flunked the final. Then he made claims that we cannot possibly expect him to remember stuff from the beginning of the year. He refuses to show his work. He is very rigid and will not follow my instruction. Now we are re-doing algebra 2 this year, but it is a struggle every day with me having to frequently give him consequences for refusing to do his work. 

 

Now I look over to the 13 yr old who does struggle with learning disabilities. He is still eligible for public school. But I also know public school is rotten to kids with special needs. I would need to hide his learning disabilities for his sake if he went. So then I come back to how hostile that environment is and figure maybe he is just better off at home, even if he learns very little, than going to a public school where it is so hostile. 

 

What should I do about my 15 yr old? That is the main problem here. Should I give on the math? It is a shame as he is so good at it and so smart. 

[PeterPan]

It sounds like the math curriculum doesn't fit him, or he would be proactive and solve the problem himself.

[Plink]

Is it possible to hire a tutor 2-3 times per week for the subject he struggles most with?  That has saved my relationship with my ASD child.  

 

Also, wherever you can incorporate his current obsession into the lessons, do so.  Music and math go very nicely together for word problems, and I'd even play it up for showing his work - writing music without writing it down means that nobody can replicate the beautiful piece.  

[Innisfree]

I agree with having him be responsible to someone else for the subjects he won't do with you. Either a tutor or an online class might work. This is always assuming that there genuinely are no learning issues. And, remember, ASD is a learning issue all on its own. Some work with a behaviorist might be helpful. Flexibility sounds like an issue.

 

For the 13yo, I would not rule out public school without careful investigation and maybe a good trial.

 

Not every public school is a hostile place for kids with learning disabilities, and those that are a bad fit for some kids may be great for others. I would talk to the school, being honest about disabilities, and see what they have to offer, if you haven't already done this.

 

Good luck; I know all this is hard. I'm trying to think it through with my own almost-13yo ASD kid. There may not be any perfect choices, but I don't want to settle for too little, kwim?

[Janeway]

Is it possible to hire a tutor 2-3 times per week for the subject he struggles most with?  That has saved my relationship with my ASD child.  

 

Also, wherever you can incorporate his current obsession into the lessons, do so.  Music and math go very nicely together for word problems, and I'd even play it up for showing his work - writing music without writing it down means that nobody can replicate the beautiful piece.  

No, because I am already working...as a math tutor...to make ends meet. I would have to double my hours to try to pay someone else to tutor him. 

 

The curriculum is fine. He is just not interested and getting him to do something he is not interested is harsh. Today, we threatened to take away karate if he did not take test 3, so he took the test. I just hate having to punish all the time.

[Janeway]

I agree with having him be responsible to someone else for the subjects he won't do with you. Either a tutor or an online class might work. This is always assuming that there genuinely are no learning issues. And, remember, ASD is a learning issue all on its own. Some work with a behaviorist might be helpful. Flexibility sounds like an issue.

 

For the 13yo, I would not rule out public school without careful investigation and maybe a good trial.

 

Not every public school is a hostile place for kids with learning disabilities, and those that are a bad fit for some kids may be great for others. I would talk to the school, being honest about disabilities, and see what they have to offer, if you haven't already done this.

 

Good luck; I know all this is hard. I'm trying to think it through with my own almost-13yo ASD kid. There may not be any perfect choices, but I don't want to settle for too little, kwim?

This one is. I would assume most are not. But specific to this one, it is extremely hostile toward people with special needs or anything at all not-football mainstream about them.

[Janeway]

Also, making him accountable to someone else does not help. He went to outside classes last year for English/Lit/History, and chose to fail. He said he just didn't like her assignments.

[Janeway]

Also, he is taking it through Derek Owens this time, so I am not even the one teaching him. This really is just an issue of he doesn't feel like it.

[Innisfree]

Okay, then, it sounds like that's a compliance issue, as well as flexibility.

 

How recently has he been evaluated? Did you get any sort of detailed information about his functionality beyond intelligence?

 

His high IQ is kind of beside the point when you're dealing with a general lack of functionality, and so is the fact that he can excel at subjects that interest him.

 

Clearly he has issues with flexibility and compliance. There are plenty of kids with ASD who are brilliant but not functional enough in other ways to manage their lives. What sort of evals has he had, and what sort of therapy?

[Innisfree]

Also: what does he want to do in life? Have you sat down with him and worked backward, from his goals, through the prerequisites to where he is today? Does he see a reason for doing it, or is it just math because Mom demands math?

[Innisfree]

This is a reference OhElizabeth has posted before (thanks, OhElizabeth!). I finally read it, and found it both enlightening and a bit sobering, at least as regards our own situation.

 

https://www.socialthinking.com/Articles?name=Social%20Thinking%20Social%20Communication%20Profile

 

This is not a substitute for a complete evaluation. But what I found interesting, among other things, is that kids who fit into a wide range of profiles may have very high IQs, yet that does not necessarily correlate with an ability to function independently.

 

The suggestions for the most useful interventions for the different profiles might be useful for you. I hope you can find something that will help!

Edited August 22, 2017 by Innisfree

[Mrs. Tharp]

I am feeling down on home schooling my next up child, who is in 8th this year. Older child, who is 15 yrs old, is very smart, no learning disabilities, just ASD with a teenaged attitude problem. He has always coasted through things he wanted to do, quickly and with ease. For example, when he decided he wanted to learn Latin, he obsessed on it and did two years worth within a semester and then moved on. Now, he is working on German and Piano. He is making his own pieces for piano now. He has only been doing piano for a year and a half and is quite advanced in it. As far as language arts and history and such goes, he is so advanced and has completed so much in those areas that he is now working on books given to him by someone in an honors program at a university. 

 

Math and science, nope. We are not getting anywhere. Last year, for biology, he completed maybe 1/4 to 1/3  of the book. Algebra 2, he flunked the final. Then he made claims that we cannot possibly expect him to remember stuff from the beginning of the year. He refuses to show his work. He is very rigid and will not follow my instruction. Now we are re-doing algebra 2 this year, but it is a struggle every day with me having to frequently give him consequences for refusing to do his work. 

 

Now I look over to the 13 yr old who does struggle with learning disabilities. He is still eligible for public school. But I also know public school is rotten to kids with special needs. I would need to hide his learning disabilities for his sake if he went. So then I come back to how hostile that environment is and figure maybe he is just better off at home, even if he learns very little, than going to a public school where it is so hostile. 

 

What should I do about my 15 yr old? That is the main problem here. Should I give on the math? It is a shame as he is so good at it and so smart. 

It sounds like he is so smart he hasn't ever had to deal with natural consequences for his inflexibility. It is important that he have some idea of this before leaving home, however. Does he know what he might want to do for a career? Then you can show him how the math ties in to accomplishing that goal. Make a flowchart or something so that he has a visual backup.  How is he with life skills, chores, money, cooking, etc.?

 

In addition to tying present actions to future goals, you might consider hiring a behaviorist to develop a plan with you, with specific rewards and consequences for schoolwork and/or anything else he gives you significant trouble with. I agree that it sucks to have to punish him that way, but if he heads out into the real world with those attitudes he may not succeed no matter how intelligent he is. You only have a few more years left to work with him. Better he learns how to be flexible with you, now, than be forced into it later, when the consequences for failure are likely to be much more severe.