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#1 MrsMe

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 11:28 AM

I have to agree that I agree with Pudewa on Grammar. Grammar programs use it out of context and if you speak English anyway, then some is just in one ear and out the other. Not to mention it's just overkill year after year, without it being applicable.

Does anyone use this as their sole Grammar program? Learning grammar in the context of writing which is what it's for anyway?

Any reviews? Ages you use it for? How it's scheduled?

#2 justLisa

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 11:34 AM

For NOW I am not focusing on grammar. It has given me a head ache for ever. DS went through FLL3 last year with no problems. But he is not writing ENOUGH right now to even really apply advanced grammar concepts or see how they work in his own writing.

I have MCT and think I may just read it to both of them. It's fairly meaty without being much work.

I don't know, grammar is the thorn in my side. I don't want to ignore it, but I don't see the value in diagramming right now.

I had DD start GWG this year. It's not the greatest, but it is very quick and painless.

ETA: Do you mean the fix it grammar from the IEW website? I have not used that.

#3 abrightmom

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 12:01 PM

:bigear: Streamlining grammar is a high priority for me. Listening in. My top contender is DGP Publishing. Still a grammar program but in daily bites. Looks thorough without dominating the schedule. A good compromise as it takes less time but still covers the bases. It isn't a fill in the blank workbook either; I don't like that approach.

I'd love to hear more about IEW's program. I assume Fix It is what you are asking about.

Edited by abrightmom, 19 September 2012 - 12:04 PM.


#4 MrsMe

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 12:36 PM

ETA: Do you mean the fix it grammar from the IEW website? I have not used that.


:bigear:
I'd love to hear more about IEW's program. I assume Fix It is what you are asking about.


Yes, Fix-it Grammar. I really have to say, dd has gotten not much out of "grammar" in the sense of the subject and I can't help but think that Pudewa has a point that it goes in one ear and out the other, because what is grammar for, but to write well and speak well. Plus, he said you know it because you speak it.

We are doing IEW Medieval writing and I think dd is getting more from having to use Adjectives and Adverbs in her writing more than picking them out of a dead sentence.

#5 justLisa

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 01:26 PM

Just do what I am doing. Skip it for a determined period of time, and then re-evaluate at that point in time. For me, it's during our Christmas break.

ETA: One thing I am considering is just something for basic mechanics ONLY. I do not want to weed through an entire grammar text just for that. I need to go look at daily grams again. From the Easy Grammar people. Or there are a few other workbook type things that just teach the basic mechanics. Like Evan Moore.....I forget what it's called. You could just do that a couple times a week and it only takes a few minutes.

#6 Jim

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 01:47 PM

As always, there is merit to seeing something in real life. Grammar is no different. Seeing at work is a great way to learn it. I can see both points of view on this one, though I don't believe that being able to speak reasonably well translates to writing well.

We've finished FLL 4 and will be starting Hake 5 within a few days but I wonder about dropping the whole thing and stressing reading/writing and teaching grammar through those assignments.

We've used Fix-It along side FLL. Lessons are short, since we're leaning on the knowledge from FLL. If used alone the lesson would stretch out as you explained the fine points. It could work but we've been unwilling to change.

In regard to Fix-It, we like it. It's short and ds has learned to edit. We can see the knowledge learned in FLL put to use. I'm not sure if we used Fix-It alone he would have the same grasp.

Each lesson (4x/week) has a few sentences that need editing for punctuation, homonyms, etc. We picj out strong verbs, -ly adverbs and the other tools EWI stresses in their writing programs. For about $30 you get four classic stories that should span four years along with a resource book that explains the fine points. Given their willingness to refund 100% of the cost for any reason it's worth taking a look.


Jim

#7 MrsMe

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 03:20 PM

As always, there is merit to seeing something in real life. Grammar is no different. Seeing at work is a great way to learn it. I can see both points of view on this one, though I don't believe that being able to speak reasonably well translates to writing well.

We've finished FLL 4 and will be starting Hake 5 within a few days but I wonder about dropping the whole thing and stressing reading/writing and teaching grammar through those assignments.

We've used Fix-It along side FLL. Lessons are short, since we're leaning on the knowledge from FLL. If used alone the lesson would stretch out as you explained the fine points. It could work but we've been unwilling to change.

In regard to Fix-It, we like it. It's short and ds has learned to edit. We can see the knowledge learned in FLL put to use. I'm not sure if we used Fix-It alone he would have the same grasp.

Each lesson (4x/week) has a few sentences that need editing for punctuation, homonyms, etc. We picj out strong verbs, -ly adverbs and the other tools EWI stresses in their writing programs. For about $30 you get four classic stories that should span four years along with a resource book that explains the fine points. Given their willingness to refund 100% of the cost for any reason it's worth taking a look.


Jim


I agree that speaking reasonably well does not translate into writing well. :) On the other hand, IEW writing is teaching using adjectives and adverbs, yes, the lys, at least in Medieval Writing. I don't know whether the younger levels of writing are teaching the meaning of the parts of speech as they go along, which would be teaching it in context. So the jury is out on whether they work together; teaching the use and meaning in writing and putting more of it to use in "Fix-It".

#8 TarynB

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 04:03 PM

:bigear:

#9 Canadianmumof5

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 06:15 PM

Our 2 oldest are taking the IEW classes on-line & Fix-It is incorporated into the lesson. Basically, as part of their assigned homework every week, they are given 4 complex sentences that they have to proofread. The sentences are from a piece of literature (DD's class us working on excerpts from Tom Sawyer). Things like spelling, underlining subjects & verbs, making sure correct verb tenses are used, whether or not a new paragraph is required (indentation), etc. Once they correct the sentences, they re-write them in a notebook. And basically each week's sentences build on the previous week do they are essentially rewriting the story & seeing how it should be written properly.

They take it all up in class and review it.

I think it is a valuable addition to the process.

#10 justLisa

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 06:41 PM

Our 2 oldest are taking the IEW classes on-line & Fix-It is incorporated into the lesson. Basically, as part of their assigned homework every week, they are given 4 complex sentences that they have to proofread. The sentences are from a piece of literature (DD's class us working on excerpts from Tom Sawyer). Things like spelling, underlining subjects & verbs, making sure correct verb tenses are used, whether or not a new paragraph is required (indentation), etc. Once they correct the sentences, they re-write them in a notebook. And basically each week's sentences build on the previous week do they are essentially rewriting the story & seeing how it should be written properly.

They take it all up in class and review it.

I think it is a valuable addition to the process.


Thanks for sharing that

#11 serendipitous journey

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 07:43 PM

:bigear:, and I haven't got experience with IEW grammar at all but thought I'd mention that KISS grammar, and the Killgallon Story Grammar, both use grammar in the context of actual English ...

#12 DarlaS

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 08:03 PM

:bigear:, and I haven't got experience with IEW grammar at all but thought I'd mention that KISS grammar, and the Killgallon Story Grammar, both use grammar in the context of actual English ...


I just started using this this year. All three levels actually. So far, I do like it, but may return to something more traditional after. (I'm withholding final judgment and any kind of review until we've covered at least half of it--but the idea sure makes a lot of sense.)

Some kids do need to be explicitly taught, and that might be a weakness of a program like this (unless mom is pretty grammar knowledgeable). It's a nice break from the usual though, and we'll see how it goes. I am using both the grammar and sentence composing books and plan to take my time with them.

ETA: I just remembered that Essentials in Writing includes grammar up through grade 6. Since both my kids are halfway through their respective grade levels, and had just covered grammar through that, it seemed like a perfect time to experiment.

Edited by darlasowders, 19 September 2012 - 08:07 PM.


#13 MrsMe

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 08:29 PM

Our 2 oldest are taking the IEW classes on-line & Fix-It is incorporated into the lesson. Basically, as part of their assigned homework every week, they are given 4 complex sentences that they have to proofread. The sentences are from a piece of literature (DD's class us working on excerpts from Tom Sawyer). Things like spelling, underlining subjects & verbs, making sure correct verb tenses are used, whether or not a new paragraph is required (indentation), etc. Once they correct the sentences, they re-write them in a notebook. And basically each week's sentences build on the previous week do they are essentially rewriting the story & seeing how it should be written properly.

They take it all up in class and review it.

I think it is a valuable addition to the process.


I have to say, I like this method. On the other hand it works best if you use IEW as a whole, although I know you can use it with another program as a supplement. And I'm not sold on the money I need to spend on IEW to continue it, because I have one child. However,....I'm really liking this Fix-It program!:D


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