Rod and Staff 7th English users...

[ThelmaLou]

My oldest has just hit a wall. Has anyone else found this? We are trying to wrap up the chapter on adverbs, and everything's falling apart. He limped along in the chapter, then bombed the test. Mind you, he always makes at least 90% or better on all of his English tests.

 

So, I went back through the chapter with him, doing lots of handholding. We painstakingly completed 2 lessons a day (trying not to lose too much time). We read the lesson material, did all of class practice out loud, did loads of diagramming and did all of the worksheets for reinforcement. Yesterday, I had him do the review lesson independently to determine whether he's ready to take the test again. He was totally confused all over again. Trying to distinguish between adjective and adverb phrases/clauses, and determining whether they modify verbs, adjectives, adverbs, verbals, etc... is overwhelming him. He's now gone through the chapter twice.

 

Now what? Retest? Move on to the next chapter? Do the chapter on adverbs a third time?:confused:

[Kelli in TN]

Hmmmm.....I think I would make a mental note that this topic is NOT mastered and move on. I would bring it back up later, but not with the Rod and Staff book. I might go to the local teacher supply store and purchase an inexpensive workbook, or find an online source or just use the Rod and Staff chapter as a base to write my own curriculum on the topic.

 

I think when a child has become frustrated with something, it is possible that his brain is just not going to grasp that right now.

 

That last sentence makes no sense as a I reread it, but I know what I am trying to say. Maybe you will know what I am trying to say too!!!:D

[MIch elle]

We're on adjectives chapter 7 now. I'll watch out for the adverbs chapter.

 

I would move on but have dc memorize in lesson 84 "An adverb clause is a dependent clause that modifies... It begins with a subordinating conjunction." Then he would also need to memorize the list of subord. conj.;and memorize in bullet box point 2 in lesson 86.

 

Will he be doing R&S English 8?

[Beth in Central TX]

We are just finishing up R&S 6, but I have R&S 7 on hand as I plan for next year. It looks very, very thorough and complete. I'm seriously considering breaking this book up over 2 years--7th & 8th. Then I would use the 8th grade book as a refresher course for high school. But I digress...

 

Adverbs is in Chapter 8 out of 11. My guess is that it may be the clauses that are confusing right now. The next chapter is prepositions, so I would be leary of pushing on without mastery of this area. R&S usually builds on itself, not only grade by grade, but also chapter by chapter.

 

So, I would do one of two things. Take a short break on grammar. Maybe pull out R&S 6 and review adverbs again on a level that he understands. Then I would go through Chapter 8 in R&S 8 again. If you don't want to stop your progression through the book, then I would move into Chapter 9, but I would review Chapter 8 as I moved along and compare/contrast the differences between adverbs and prepositions. For example, let's compare the diagrams on page 420 and 374. Although the more I think about it, the more I think it would be difficult to move forward with prepositions if he hasn't mastered adverbs. If you look on page 419, there's this statement: "Prepositions must not be confused with adverbs." I think I would work on adverbs until your son masters it. So, I would go with my first option. FWIW...

 

HTH!

[Tressa]

We are just finishing up the adjectives, but my son really seems to struggle with the clauses. I think that this has been a very complete grammar book. I don't see myself buying the 8th grade book. Is anyone else planning on finishing up with grade 7? I would like to focus more on writing and literature.

Oh, but to answer your question, I would move on. If you plan on using the 8th grade book I am sure that it will come up again there. You could also move on and come back to it later in the year and try again. If I had my son do a chapter a third time it would be a major battle, and his brain would shut down. :)

[nutmeg]

We are just finishing up R&S 6, but I have R&S 7 on hand as I plan for next year. It looks very, very thorough and complete. I'm seriously considering breaking this book up over 2 years--7th & 8th. Then I would use the 8th grade book as a refresher course for high school. But I digress...

 

May I digress with you?

 

This is exactly what I am thinking. I have not got my hands on R&S 7 yet, but I am toying with the idea of stretching 7 and 8 over four years. We have followed R&S faithfully through 3,4,5,6, and I am very impressed with what we have covered and learned. Next year (7th grade) a want to start her with Lightning Lit and step up our composition instruction. I think creeping our way through R&S 7 might give us the breathing room we need.

[Beth in Central TX]

We're on the same page as you since we've almost completed R&S 6 and we started at R&S 3. 7th grade is already going to be challenging for my oldest son with Omnibus I, CW Homer B, Latin, & Greek.

 

Here are some observations as I flip through R&S 7: both books are surprisingly thicker than R&S 6 (I didn't think a grammar book could get any bigger); there are 11 chapters with 125 lessons, 12 tests (including the final), & 60 worksheets; the diagramming appears to be much more intricate; the written lessons appear to be the same length, but there are more exercises and review problems.

 

I'm thinking of either working through chapter 6 of R&S 7 in 7th grade, and then scheduling the remaining chapters 7-11 in 8th grade. I'm also thinking of skipping the writing exercises in R&S 7 since we are doing CW too which would eliminate 35 lessons and 10 worksheets. This might let me work through the whole book in 7th grade without feeling rushed.

 

I'm just thinking out loud here though. I'll probably need to plan it out on paper to see how much it really is. I may even go through some of the lessons on my own to see how time consuming and/or involved they really are.

[Hoggirl]

I am glad you all are having this discussion. We will also finish R&S 6 this year after having worked through 3 - 6. We also use something for writing, so if 90 lessons are grammar, it seems like it would be a little tricky to divide it neatly in half. 3 lessons per week would take up the entire year (with some cushion and test-taking), but 1 lesson per week wouldn't get you halfway through, and also doesn't seem like "enough." I guess 2 could be done per week with extra cushion or finishing up a few weeks early. How would you schedule the grade 7 book if you split it over two years. We, too, are going to start LL 7.

Lovin' this thread.

[Beth in Central TX]

If I split it up over 2 years, then I think I would keep the writing assignments. There are 67 lessons through chapter 6, and we also do the tests, so this would be 73 lessons. We have 36 weeks in our school year, so we would have 2 lessons per week with one lesson leftover to combine or drop.

 

In 8th grade we would finish up R&S 7 with 58 lessons and 6 tests including the final for a total of 64 lessons. This would give us 32 weeks of instruction for the year. After 6 years of R&S grammar, I don't think a month off is too much to ask.

 

I'm thinking I like this approach the more I mull it over.

[ThelmaLou]

"My guess is that it may be the clauses that are confusing right now. The next chapter is prepositions, so I would be leary of pushing on without mastery of this area. R&S usually builds on itself, not only grade by grade, but also chapter by chapter."

 

Yes, Beth, this is what I was thinking. I like the idea of perhaps going back to his 6th grade book to work on adverbs a little more. I'm afraid that moving ahead to prepositions will just confuse him even more. We are planning to continue with 8th grade next year. After that, I think I'm gonna call it quits.

[Beth in Central TX]

Right now, I'm planning on going through R&S grammar 8 too. I've heard that the 9th & 10th grade books contain mostly writing instruction and present more of their Mennonite doctrine. After glancing through R&S 7, I think my boys will have plenty of grammar even if we don't do the high school portion.

 

Take care,

[nutmeg]

....but 1 lesson per week wouldn't get you halfway through, and also doesn't seem like "enough." I guess 2 could be done per week with extra cushion or finishing up a few weeks early. How would you schedule the grade 7 book if you split it over two years. We, too, are going to start LL 7.

 

 

Right now, I'm planning on going through R&S grammar 8 too....I think my boys will have plenty of grammar even if we don't do the high school portion.

 

 

I like the idea of 2 grammar lessons per week (we do not do the R&S writing), as at least one of my daughters will need extra practice on these. This, along with Lighting Lit, Latin, Wordsmith, and continued spelling for one child, will be 'enough' Language Arts for us. :)

 

So for my eldest, this would mean doing R&S 8 as part of the 9th and 10th grade language arts credit. From what I have heard and picked up here, R&S 8 will cover more grammar than I ever learned in high school and beyond. LOL I need the teacher's manual just to get through year 6!

[Rhondabee]

Instead of memorizing the subordinating conjunctions (I know "that" can be *either* a sub. conj. OR a relative pronoun) I would really work on knowing what questions adjectives and adverbs answer.

 

Then, for *every* word, phrase, clause you are finding or noting or diagramming, have dc tell you what question it is answering. (Even if R&S doesn't specifically ask dc to do this.) And, practice reading the related phrase underneath all the possibilities to see which "fits". (This is in the lesson on adverbs and very helpful!)

 

Also, be sure to remind dc (maybe 100 times might do it?) that an adjective clause can only come directly after a noun. (don't ask :rolleyes:)

 

OP: I agree with Kelli - There were things my dc just didn't quite get last year that now he "gets" without a hitch. And, don't forget, you have *so* much review in R&S that when it comes up in the review, you can use that to re-teach it a little bit. (If it's still not solid, I would just go on - knowing there's always next year!)

 

I do guess in some ways we are lucky that we didn't start R&S until 6th grade, 'cause we're not tired of it yet! :)

[ThelmaLou]

"Then, for *every* word, phrase, clause you are finding or noting or diagramming, have dc tell you what question it is answering. (Even if R&S doesn't specifically ask dc to do this.) "

 

Yes, this is *exactly* what we've been doing. I keep telling him that he's getting into trouble by *not* asking himself what question it's answering. He's trying to determine what these clauses modify without asking the right series of questions! Indeed, that is the key.

[Rhondabee]

So, I am no real help.

 

It looks like all of Chapter 9 is dealing with adjective phrases and clauses vs. adverb phrases and clauses. And then Chapter 10 is going to use that info to teach comma usage. So, I think I would consider doing the writing lessons only for a while, or maybe Chapter 11. (Just get away from phrases and clauses for a bit somehow.)

 

Then, after some "fresh air", head back to Chapter 9. You might even look at using the R&S English Handbook. Read through the pages dealing with phrases and clauses, and let him keep the book handy for when he has a question.

 

Our problem area was tenses and not changing tenses when switching between passive and active voice. I just kept going in the book, and then when we reviewed it, looked back at the original lessons, made (some more) charts, and prayed. (I think we took a whole day to do the Oral Review and the Written Reviews.) Somehow we got it that second time through. I'm sure your guy will get it eventually, too!

 

Best wishes!

Rhonda