wyomom Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 I am so frustrated with our Latin experience. My dd's now 13 and 11 started out with Prima Latina with the dvd's and hated it because it was so dry and boring. Also, they couldn't understand the grammar or conjugating and declining part. So, I switched to Latin for Children thinking this is going to make it a little more lively and interesting. It did help a little but they are still struggling through the grammar, endings ect.... basically the whole structure of the language. They both seem so overwhelmed with it. They have both gotten through LFC book A and know the vocab words really well but nothing else if I ask them what the endings mean. They can recite the endings like the video has them do along with the vocab but they have no idea what they mean or how to use them properly. My 13 yr old can sort of explain what you do with mus, tis, unt but my 11 yr old is so lost I want to scream. I have thought many times that we just need to give up after trying to study latin off and on for 3 years and not getting anywhere, I feel frustrated. The girls hate it and don't understand why they have to learn it which makes for a poor attitude. Also, I have had 2 babies in two years and not been able to learn along with them like I should. I know a big part of their problem has been the fact that I have been relying on the dvd's and workbooks to teach them. Now, I am trying to help them out and for me to understand it, we have to back up and review because I have no idea where to start with them. LFC doesn't have enough explanation in the grammar part for me to explain it well enough to my 11 yr old and my 13 yr old just memorizes the vocab and doesn't retain any grammar. UGH! Is there a very teacher friendly program out there for dc who have developed bad attitudes toward latin? LOL! I don't know if I should try to stick with LFC and have them do books B and C or switch to something else. I really don't have alot of time to sit down and learn this myself at this point with a new baby, a 2yr old and a very hands on 6 yr old. He is at that stage in school where I have to sit with him during all his work which means my older dd's need to have work they can do independently so I can just check it real quick in the afternoon. My mornings are really full with 1st grade work, keeping the 2 yr old busy so he stays out of trouble and nursing a new baby every two hours. The thought of one more new subject I have to sit down and figure out is overwhelming to me. I think latin is very important and I really don't want to give up trying to make it click for them but at this point I am grasping at straws. Any suggestions to help make this work for us without making me any crazier than I already am? LOL! Thanks! Julie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peela Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 It sounds like because your kids are older they need to understand the bigger picture of Latin. We all certainly did. I have tried LfC too and after a bit really detested it because we didn't understand WHY we had to memorise all this stuff. I truly think all that blind memorisation is only suitable for grammar stage kids, and even then many kids need to see the bigger picture to be motivated. The program I would highly recommend for your kids, especially perfect for their age, is Latin Prep. It is a fun program- with a sense of humour and some whacky sentences- it teaches the grammar right up front, but it also teaches the bigger picture. You are translating from both Latin to English AND English to Latin right from the beginning. It is satisfying to be doing translations and reading Latin, and understanding WHY its important to learn the grammar. Many people here use this program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyomom Posted April 13, 2009 Author Share Posted April 13, 2009 Prima Latina is for K-2nd grades. I am not surprised they hated it! I would suggest Lively Latin because the explanations are right in the text and it goes over applicable grammar in English first. It sounds like the main issues are with the grammar so a program that relates the Latin grammar to English may help. They will need to work on memorizing vocabulary and endings everyday. Yes grammar seems to be a stumbling block for them. That and a lack of really believing Latin is necessary to add to their work load. :) I have heard about Lively Latin. Prima Latina is what we started out in about 3 years ago when my younger dd was in 2nd grade and my oldest dd was in 3rd. They were and still are completely lost in a fog and just can't seem to pull it all together. Thanks for the suggestion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ida Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 We started with Minimus as a fun hook, then tried LfC, and hated it. We ended up setting Latin aside for a bit, and are back at it this year with Latin Prep. I LOVE it. Latin is finally starting to make some sense to *me*!!! It probaby helped a bit that we had some previous exposure to the vocabulary and the idea of declension, but LP does such a nice job of explaining just ONE thing at a time and offering practice for that skill, then building on it. Instead of making you memorize a whole declension table, they teach each declension one at a time in a logical order. I admit that we still don't get to Latin as consistently as we should, but it is going SO much more smoothly. We are only on chapter 3 and I finally feel that, after years of floundering, we are finally getting somewhere in Latin. It's so rewarding to be able to translate multiple paragraph goofy stories already. I highly, highly recommend this program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amy from WT Posted April 14, 2009 Share Posted April 14, 2009 I thought of Latin Prep for you as well - not only does it explain the grammar well, but it is visually very friendly and fun for the students. But my only hesitation with it is that it doesn't have a teacher's book other than an answer key. And when you get to the higher levels, it's often nice to have a bit more explanation for the teacher. I think you should also look at Great Latin Adventure (http://www.classicallegacypress.com). It may be slightly young for your 13 yo, but would be absolutely perfect for your 11 yo. You really could put both of them into it without a problem. It comes with both a Teacher's Guide AND student workbooks for your children. Each chapter has a Grammar Lesson that is not only written well - I mean the grammar is explained really VERY clearly and concisely! - but is also written with a sense of fun. The author works hard to make Latin an enjoyable subject for BOTH teacher and student. Not only that, but the teacher's guide has Teacher's Notes for each chapter that go on to explain each Grammar Lesson further - outlining any questions the students possibly may have in regards to the current subject of the chapter. It goes on to discuss the worksheets included in each chapter and any questions that may arise from those as well. Wonderful! While I think both programs may turn around your children's interest in Latin, this second program may be the time saver you are looking for for yourself. Whatever you choose, I hope you succeed in making Latin an enjoyable subject in your home. All the best! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyomom Posted April 14, 2009 Author Share Posted April 14, 2009 It sounds like because your kids are older they need to understand the bigger picture of Latin. We all certainly did. I have tried LfC too and after a bit really detested it because we didn't understand WHY we had to memorise all this stuff. I truly think all that blind memorisation is only suitable for grammar stage kids, and even then many kids need to see the bigger picture to be motivated. The program I would highly recommend for your kids, especially perfect for their age, is Latin Prep. It is a fun program- with a sense of humour and some whacky sentences- it teaches the grammar right up front, but it also teaches the bigger picture. You are translating from both Latin to English AND English to Latin right from the beginning. It is satisfying to be doing translations and reading Latin, and understanding WHY its important to learn the grammar. Many people here use this program. Peela, I like the sound of this program as far as making Latin relevant. I read somewhere on these boards that LC and LFC were equally weak on grammar instruction. This was good for me to read because it would explain why we are having a tough time with everything but vocab memorization. I went from a weak grammar explanation program to another weak grammar program which was heavy on memorization. No wonder they can't pull it all together or see how it is relevant. Right now they mostly just memorize vocab and endings and don't understand the grammar explanations so they do enough to fill in the blanks and move on to the next lesson without retaining ANY of it. My oldest dd gets really frustrated when she puts alot of work into something and gets nothing out of it like we have done with Latin so I believe that is part of her hatred toward having to study it. Maybe Latin prep will help her with this. I will google this one too. Do you get it through Galore Park? Thanks!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyomom Posted April 14, 2009 Author Share Posted April 14, 2009 We started with Minimus as a fun hook, then tried LfC, and hated it. We ended up setting Latin aside for a bit, and are back at it this year with Latin Prep. I LOVE it. Latin is finally starting to make some sense to *me*!!! It probaby helped a bit that we had some previous exposure to the vocabulary and the idea of declension, but LP does such a nice job of explaining just ONE thing at a time and offering practice for that skill, then building on it. Instead of making you memorize a whole declension table, they teach each declension one at a time in a logical order. I admit that we still don't get to Latin as consistently as we should, but it is going SO much more smoothly. We are only on chapter 3 and I finally feel that, after years of floundering, we are finally getting somewhere in Latin. It's so rewarding to be able to translate multiple paragraph goofy stories already. I highly, highly recommend this program. AH yes the declension tables are really tripping them up. I hate the way LFC is laid out. I really have a hard time understanding how to apply those endings to the vocab. It's just way too much material at a time. They memorize it great but that's as far as it goes. Actually, the whole house has those endings memorized. We go around saying the little chants in our heads. O, S, T, Mus, tis unt. LOL! Don't know what it means but we sure can say it. LOL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyomom Posted April 14, 2009 Author Share Posted April 14, 2009 I thought of Latin Prep for you as well - not only does it explain the grammar well, but it is visually very friendly and fun for the students. But my only hesitation with it is that it doesn't have a teacher's book other than an answer key. And when you get to the higher levels, it's often nice to have a bit more explanation for the teacher. I think you should also look at Great Latin Adventure (http://www.classicallegacypress.com). It may be slightly young for your 13 yo, but would be absolutely perfect for your 11 yo. You really could put both of them into it without a problem. It comes with both a Teacher's Guide AND student workbooks for your children. Each chapter has a Grammar Lesson that is not only written well - I mean the grammar is explained really VERY clearly and concisely! - but is also written with a sense of fun. The author works hard to make Latin an enjoyable subject for BOTH teacher and student. Not only that, but the teacher's guide has Teacher's Notes for each chapter that go on to explain each Grammar Lesson further - outlining any questions the students possibly may have in regards to the current subject of the chapter. It goes on to discuss the worksheets included in each chapter and any questions that may arise from those as well. Wonderful! While I think both programs may turn around your children's interest in Latin, this second program may be the time saver you are looking for for yourself. Whatever you choose, I hope you succeed in making Latin an enjoyable subject in your home. All the best! Oh wow, I glad you brought this up. I really need alot of good explanation or at least my dd's do since they are pretty independent with their work at this point. If they get stuck, I need to be able to find out the problem in a TM somewhere so I can explain it to them. I love how Teaching Textbooks helps me this way with my oldest dd's algebra. Otherwise I would be all day relearning algebra trying to explain to her the problems she got wrong. Now, if she gets one wrong, we put in the cd and the teacher goes through them with her. What a lifesaver. I need something like that for Latin. LOL! Thanks for the link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudoMom Posted April 14, 2009 Share Posted April 14, 2009 As we neared the end of LfC A, I found my boys didn't understand the why behind what they were memorizing. I like LfC (I like the DVDs and Chant CD), and hope to stick with it. That being said, right now I'm having my guys work through Getting Started With Latin. I originally bought it for me, but they are enjoying it. They were frustrated with Latin, but today when I asked ds8 if he understood is English grammar and Latin he replied "I think I understood my English, but I know I understood my Latin." My plan is to have them work through GSWL over the summer, we'll finish up LfC A when we're done and then move into B. Once we return to LfC, though, I'll be diligent with having them translate the History Readers (I didn't do this before). My hope is that GSWL will give them enough of a "big picture" that I can stick with LfC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debbielong Posted April 14, 2009 Share Posted April 14, 2009 ...we had a fabulous experience with Memoria Press's online Latin classes - here is the link... http://www.memoriapress.com/course/ The nice thing about these courses is you enroll per semester. While it does cost $150 for the semester, if it doesn't work out, at least you are only out the time and money for half the year. The benefit of the online instruction is you get a knowledgeable teacher who supplements the information learned in the curriculum. The class chat environment works well for asking questions and playing grammar games. MP uses Latina Christiana. So, if you purchase the Latina Christiana DVD's (and I can't imagine having done this program without them)...yes, you still have the lovely and delightful Leigh Lowe as the DVD instructor. But, now that they are older, your children may appreciate her straightforward, no-nonsense approach to Latin:). After two years in LC, Memoria Press students can go directly to high school Henle. You can email me directly at tlong6 at woh dot rr dot com if you want to as more specific questions. Meanwhile, hugs you to you and your family. I couldn't pull off Latin when I had ONE little one - much less three!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forty-two Posted April 14, 2009 Share Posted April 14, 2009 You might want to give Cambridge Latin Course a try, at least as a supplement to use for reading material. You can pick up used copies on Amazon for cheap. I've been using it for myself, and it is a lot of fun. I'm just reading through the stories - no translating or anything. The stories are entertaining - I find myself spontaneously "narrating" to my dh the particularly funny parts :tongue_smilie: (which also helps my retention, thus giving me firsthand experience with the power of narration). The first unit doesn't have much more grammar than LfC Primer A - it would give them a chance to see the grammar in context, as well as a fun way to use it. I'm not sure you'd want to use CLC as your main program; even though it has a lot of ancillary materials, I'm not sure if it would work for a complete novice to teach. But it would be a great, fun supplement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katilac Posted April 14, 2009 Share Posted April 14, 2009 If they are relatively strong students overall, I would place both of them directly into Henle or another high school program that makes the grammar more explicit. I recently ordered it for my rising 6th grader to use next year, and, looking it over, I kept saying, well, why didn't you tell me that before?! Memoria Press sells a study guide that gives day by day instructions for using Henle at a slower-than-high school pace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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