11th grade English--too little, too much, just right?

[Garga]

I had anticipated using some literary guides from Progeny press for the books we'll read, but I think that adding in lit guides will be overkill.  Here was what I had planned before I started thinking about literature guides.

1.  Read 8 British Literature books/plays (not yet chosen, but something like Dickens, Austen, and Shakespeare, etc.).  We'll use shmoop to guide us in our discussions we'll have to together about the books.  The Shakespeare play will probably take a bit more time to read, and I'll look for a resource to help us understand it.  

2.  Write 7 papers based on the above books and/or based on things learned in other classes, until all of these types of essays have been written: 
Compare/Contrast
Summary/Response
Persuasive
Narrative
Argumentative
2 Research papers

I have these little guides to help us methodically work on the essays.  

3.  Windows to the World for literary analysis--only the 18 weeks of core lessons, not the 26 weeks for supplemental lessons.

4.  A bit of grammar review--about an hour a week.  A 40-yo friend of mine came to me needing grammar instruction for a college placement test she's taking.  I realized that my son is rusty on some of the grammar terms, and I want him to have a brush up on grammar before he hits college in two years.

So:

8 books with discussion
7 essays/research papers
WttW
Grammar review

That's enough, right?  I don't need the lit guides, do I?

@Lori D., what do you think?

[8filltheheart]

I would allow yourself to be flexible. The WttW course might leave you wanting to spend more time exploring short stories. We've spent entire semesters on short stories and they have been some of most fun literature courses.

[8filltheheart]

Fwiw, we have a pattern for studying Shakespeare that I have found works well with my kids. First we read an adapted version from Garfield's book. Then we read all g with an audio version. Then we watch a recorded performance. Then if possible we attend a live performance.

[Ethel Mertz]

Looks like enough to me. How long are the papers to be?

[Garga]

14 minutes ago, Ethel Mertz said:

Looks like enough to me. How long are the papers to be?

 

Good question!  I hadn't gotten to thinking about that part yet, except for the research papers.

He's never done a research paper, so I was going to have the first one be 4 pages long (due in December) and the second one be 7-8 pages long (due at the end of the school year).  I'll have him do 3-4 more research papers in 12th grade.  

For the other essays, I don't want them to be less than 3 pages long, especially considering how the first page has all that blank space at the top when you use MLA formatting.  So, probably 3-5 pages long per paper.  My son isn't a natural writer, so I'll feel out how it's going from paper to paper.  If it's a mighty struggle to get out 3 pages, then his papers will be shorter.  But if he's working an appropriate amount and able to meet the challenges, I'll increase the page number as we progress through the year.

[Farrar]

Seems like plenty to me. It's basically two books and two papers per quarter with some other assignments in there. Not a challenging honors level course, but that's not what you were going for. Plenty for a basic high school English course. Papers don't need to be long to be enough either. Sometimes the challenge is getting fewer words on the paper and still saying everything you need to say succinctly and elegantly.

[Lori D.]

Agreeing with 8FillTheHeart to allow yourself flexibility to go longer if desired, and permission to either drop some thing(s), or extend some thing(s) into next year -- whatever best works for you, your student, and your goals. Here's some "background" info that might help as you plan:

re: Shakespeare resource
We used and liked Peter Leithart's Brightest Heaven of Invention: a Christian Guide to Six Shakespeare plays. It is not a "religious" resource, but is more about showing how Christian themes are developed in the plays). We also liked the Parallel Shakespeare materials (the side-by-side guide of original and modern text + the student workbook + the teacher guide -- there is also a teacher version of the workbook with the answers, but I skipped it). Also, while we didn't use it, I understand that the teacher resources at the Folger Shakespeare Library website are good. No Fear Shakespeare is the Sparknotes website free side-by-side original and modern translation of the text.

re: our experiences with Shakespeare
We read/discussed the plays aloud together, and did the reading as "reader's theater", by both DSs and myself (and sometimes DH when he was home) dividing up the roles in the scene(s) we were doing for the day, and each having a copy of the play (book or online), and having fun letting out our "inner thespian" with fun voices and emoting.

Not a question you asked, but as far as which plays... our DSs loved Macbeth. I personally think it is one of the easier plays to start with. (Afterwards, we watched and enjoyed the Akira Kurasawa film Throne of Blood, which is the story but not the words, of Shakespeare's play). We also did Hamlet, which Das also enjoyed. For just watching (not reading/studying/discussing), we watched the Kenneth Branagh film version of Much Ado About Nothing, and went to a live performance of A Midsummer Night's Dream, and DSs highly enjoyed both. We did a little advance prep about who the characters all are and the basic storyline in advance to help them keep it all straight.

re: Windows to the World
This is a full 1-semester program, if you do all of it. You can pick and choose exercises and assignments as desired to shorten it up. It can also be flexible, as you can spread it out and do a unit or two throughout the year (we actually spread it out over 2 years by plugging in a unit here and there. If spreading it out, I'd recommend keeping the following units together:
- units 1-3
- units 4-5
- units 6-8
- units 9-10
- units 11-12
- units 13-15

Another thing to keep in mind is that WttW has some longer writing assignments, and will definitely cover you for writing a longer literary analysis essay, which you might want to do in place of one of the 2 research papers. You can still have plenty of time to practice research papers in 12th grade, if that is what DS needs. But DS will need to understand how to do a literary analysis essay, as a reader response is like a "lite" version of an analysis essay. And literary analysis is a type of persuasive writing -- argumentative essays are another type of persuasive writing.

re: type of writing assignments
My guess is that your DS does not really need the "summary" and "narration" if you've already done some of that in your schooling with narrating history passages, etc. If that is the case, you might want to substitute a different type of assignment there -- perhaps an oral presentation with slideshow/powerpoint. Or business writing, such as a resume (which is GREAT prep for a research paper, as you have to "research yourself" to come up with the facts/info to put into a resume) and cover letter or letter of request or complaint or commendation. Or, start working on a college application essay (a type of personal narrative writing).

re: number/length of writing assignments
In case it helps, below is the amount of writing assignments that my homeschool high school Lit & Comp co-op students can manage in a year (bearing in mind that we have to go a bit slower than a home-based class due to only meeting once a week) is LESS than what you have there -- the quality vs. quantity that Farrar mentions above. My experience with my own DSs and with the co-op students (the majority of whom have NOT written much before or are not very fond of writing) is that it is MUCH better to do more SHORT assignments in the first half of the semester -- like once a week, do a 1-3 paragraph paper and build up to 3-5 paragraphs, which then helps the student transition into tackling a multi-page paper done over a number of weeks in the second half of the semester without much wailing and gnashing of teeth. (:P

That also allows students to get solid in:

•  what needs to be in each type of paragraph (intro, body, conclusion)
• what goes into a thesis statement -- 1. topic (the overall paper subject), 2. claim (your "take" or "opinion" on that topic), and 3. direction (overview of the points of the paper that are developed in the body)
• how to build an argument (thesis in introductory paragraph, individual points each have their own body paragraph that starts with a topic sentence, followed by any needed sentences of explanation, followed by sentences of supporting facts, examples, details, followed by a sentence of commentary explaining how/why the example supports the point of that paragraph, followed by a sentence of concluding commentary that explains how/why the point supports the thesis claim

 

Again, in case it helps to see the "volume" of writing for the typical high school students in my co-op classes, here's my typical schedule for two 16-week semesters:

semester 1 - focus: writing basics & research paper
week 1 = 2 assignments, practicing MLA format, complete sentences and complete paragraphs:
      #1 = 4 sentences: one of each type -- declarative, interrogative, imperative, exclamatory
      #2 = 1 paragraph: a reader response (from choice of prompts)
week 2 = 1 paragraph, descriptive 
week 3 = 1-3 paragraphs, narrative
week 4 = 1-3 paragraphs, expository: process paper ("how to")
week 5 = 1-3 paragraphs, argumentative 
week 6 = 3-5 paragraphs, argumentative
week 7 = revision -- choice of week 5 or 6 assignment
weeks 8-16 = 5-6 page research paper with in-text citations and Works Cited page

semester 2 - focus: literary analysis (type of argumentative writing)
week 1 = 1 paragraph (approx. 100 words) reader response (usually from a choice of prompts I provide)
week 2 = 3-5 paragraph (approx. 300-500 words) essay, compare/contrast
week 3 =1-3 paragraph essay (approx. 150-300 words), literary element (how a literary element is at work in the literature being read)
week 4 = 3-5 paragraph essay, character analysis
week 5 = 3-5 paragraph essay, theme analysis
week 6 = revision -- choice of a week 1-4 assignment to revise, using teacher comments as help/guidance
weeks 7-15 = 3-5 page literary analysis essay
week 16 = 1-3 paragraph essay, personal application (a type of response paper, responding to something that "spoke" to you in one of the works read)

re: persuasive essay writing/timed essay writing
One of the best things we did for writing throughout high school was an idea I snagged from 8FillTheHeart: weekly timed essay from a prompt. With my own DSs for writing in our homeschooling years of high school, we would work on writing for 4 days a week, and 1 day a week all 3 of us would do a timed essay from a past SAT essay prompt. All 3 of us would do it, and we would read them aloud and do a gentle critique -- no grading. Once in awhile (maybe 3-4 in a year), we would take one and polish it to practice revision and proof-editing. We started slow and built up (started with 10 minutes and 1 paragraph, and then slowly added an element that we would focus on, and then started adding length and time, so that by the end of about 1.5 years, we were up to the full time and length of essay). That weekly practice took care of all our argumentative essay needs.

Hope something there is of help as you plan, Garga! Warmest regards, Lori D.

[Lori D.]

5 hours ago, 8FillTheHeart said:

Fwiw, we have a pattern for studying Shakespeare that I have found works well with my kids. First we read an adapted version from Garfield's book. Then we read all g with an audio version. Then we watch a recorded performance. Then if possible we attend a live performance.

Agree. And you can also go in the opposite direction as well, if it works better for your student:
- read an adapted version (or watch the 30-min. Shakespeare: The Animated Tales) to understand who the characters are and what the basic plot is
- then watch a recorded or live performance
- and then read and dig into it now that you "get" what the story is about.

[Lori D.]

Garga, I realize that I gave you a WAY overly long and detailed answer to your question of "Is it enough/too much/too little." Sorry!

My short answer (lol) is yes it is plenty for 1 credit, and for many students it will be too much, so gauge as you go if you need to drop some things. Do NOT feel you have to do every bit of all of these things you have planned. Instead, I'd suggest keeping an eye on your time and just "loop" what was not done to the next day, or give yourself permission to drop or abridge as needed.

Just me, but I found that about 75-90 minutes total per day on English (so about 6 hours a week) worked for us:
- Writing = 30-40 min/day, 4-5x/week
- Literature (read + discuss + "work with" the lit) = 45-60 min/day, 4-5x/week
- Grammar review = 5 min/day, 2x/week
[DS#2 also did a remedial/individualized Spelling for about 10 min/day 4-5x/week]

The 5th day of the week, it was nice to have "unscheduled" for finish up/catch up.
 

On 7/21/2018 at 10:31 AM, Garga said:

I had anticipated using some literary guides from Progeny press for the books we'll read, but I think that adding in lit guides will be overkill.  Here was what I had planned before I started thinking about literature guides...

8 books with discussion
7 essays/research papers
WttW
Grammar review

That's enough, right?  I don't need the lit guides, do I?

JMO = WttW is a FULL 1-semester of digging deeper into 6 short stories. I don't know as though you would have the TIME to do more than just read those 8 novels on top of that, other than to possibly spend a bit of time going deeper with a Shakespeare play. If you find that you are running short on time, maybe plan to bump 2 novels to next year. Or enjoy them over the summer as a family read-aloud/discussion. Just a few thoughts! Wishing you and DS the BEST in your 11th grade studies! : ) Warmest regards, Lori D.

[Garga]

2 hours ago, Lori D. said:

Garga, I realize that I gave you a WAY overly long and detailed answer to your question of "Is it enough/too much/too little." Sorry!

My short answer (lol) is yes it is plenty for 1 credit, and for many students it will be too much, so gauge as you go if you need to drop some things. Do NOT feel you have to do every bit of all of these things you have planned. Instead, I'd suggest keeping an eye on your time and just "loop" what was not done to the next day, or give yourself permission to drop or abridge as needed.

Just me, but I found that about 75-90 minutes total per day on English (so about 6 hours a week) worked for us:
- Writing = 30-40 min/day, 4-5x/week
- Literature (read + discuss + "work with" the lit) = 45-60 min/day, 4-5x/week
- Grammar review = 5 min/day, 2x/week
[DS#2 also did a remedial/individualized Spelling for about 10 min/day 4-5x/week]

The 5th day of the week, it was nice to have "unscheduled" for finish up/catch up.
 

JMO = WttW is a FULL 1-semester of digging deeper into 6 short stories. I don't know as though you would have the TIME to do more than just read those 8 novels on top of that, other than to possibly spend a bit of time going deeper with a Shakespeare play. If you find that you are running short on time, maybe plan to bump 2 novels to next year. Or enjoy them over the summer as a family read-aloud/discussion. Just a few thoughts! Wishing you and DS the BEST in your 11th grade studies! : ) Warmest regards, Lori D.

 

I hadn't realized that WttW would be a full semester.  I mean, now that you say it, it's obvious.  For some reason, I was thinking it would be half of what we'd do each week and we'd be done it in half a year.  But if we want to be done in half a year, we'll have to do only WttW all week.  I don't want to spend a full half year on WttW alone.  

In another post above, you'd written that if we spread it out over two years, which is what I'm wanting to do, we'd want to keep certain units together, but then didn't say which ones.  Is it easy for you to find which ones should stay together?  If not, I can probably read over the book and figure it out.  

ETA:  And as always, thank you for all the information!  I'd rather have too much than too little.  

[Lori D.]

5 hours ago, Garga said:

I hadn't realized that WttW would be a full semester.  I mean, now that you say it, it's obvious.  For some reason, I was thinking it would be half of what we'd do each week and we'd be done it in half a year.  But if we want to be done in half a year, we'll have to do only WttW all week.  I don't want to spend a full half year on WttW alone. 

Yes, as you say here, to do all of WttW in half a year, it would be your sole focus in Lit. Or, you can do as you suggest here of WttW in half the week and other Lit. in the other half of the week, but you would have to be willing to spread WttW out over 1 year. Or, if your student is a hyper-focused kind of student and only wants to / is only able to handle one item of Lit at a time, then you'd probably want to do a chunk of WttW, then do a novel, and then back to a chunk of WttW, etc., but that also spreads WttW out over 1 year.

5 hours ago, Garga said:

In another post above, you'd written that if we spread it out over two years, which is what I'm wanting to do, we'd want to keep certain units together, but then didn't say which ones.  Is it easy for you to find which ones should stay together?  If not, I can probably read over the book and figure it out. 

Oops! Thanks for the reminder that I forgot to put in the units [doh!]. I went back and added those. : ) Mostly, you want to keep together the units that focus on a short story -- usually that is a unit and then the 1-2 units after the short story is assigned/covered. Sorry for the confusion. (:P

You might consider doing units 1-5 all together, as the first 3 units cover annotation, and then units 4-5 cover how to write a literary analysis essay, and how to use your annotations as your specific support for each point of your body paragraph. Whether you do the first 5 units all together or as separate "mini-units" scattered throughout your year, when you tackle units 4-5, I recommend setting aside whatever you are doing for Writing, and use those 2 units of WttW to focus on learning how to write a literary analysis essay, and then writing one about "The Most Dangerous Game", which is the short story that goes with those 2 units.

Bonus thought (LOL): also, for annotating and WttW, check out this past thread: "Why does my DD have lots to say...", which has some more ideas about how to guide your student through annotating. What worked here was that I did WttW with both DSs at the same time, made photocopies of the short story from WttW and we ALL annotated, doing about 2 pages a day, and coming back together after doing those 2 pages and discussing / comparing notes about what stood out to each of us of what we annotated and why. I think that really helped model for DSs what the heck annotation was all about and why you would bother to do it, when they saw that their annotations started to "link up" and suggest what might be significant or a theme, when they were seeing something repeated.

Enjoy! Warmest regards, Lori D.