Update in post 1. Weight watchers

[Bluegoat]

Well, a diet people can't stick to is going to be worse, probably, than one they can't, even if the second might work better.

[Catwoman]

Eating cereal at all is going to be crazy. It's empty calories. She was going to make him some egg/veg things to have with skim milk. Which is why I mentioned whole milk might be a better option.

I definitely agree with that! I was just thinking that if he eats a lot of cereal, that's a lot of milk, so the lower fat milk would be better for that.

 

I drink 1 or 2% milk because I prefer the taste, but I don't use low fat anything else, so I'm definitely not a big supporter of low fat dairy foods in general.

[SparklyUnicorn]

I know the ADA is very sketchy about recommending low carb diets. They recognize that it's better for diabetics to eat low carb, but their diet plan isn't low carb because they say people don't stick to low carb diets long term.

 

That makes no sense to me, either. Common sense dictates that lower carbs would be better!

 

Well it is true that it is hard to stick to. 

 

I've eaten lower carb for years because I do not want to have diabetes and there are several in my family with it. 

 

So far so good.....

 

But I admit, it's not always fun and easy.  Nope.  It's way more fun than a laundry list of medical problems though. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

Yeah cereal makes me feel starved.  I love cereal.  I have not eaten it in many years though because I'd need to eat the whole box as well to feel satisfied.  It's not a very good breakfast food.  Maybe more suitable as a dessert. 

 

 

[Catwoman]

Well, a diet people can't stick to is going to be worse, probably, than one they can't, even if the second might work better.

:iagree:

 

But I do understand the argument that they could publish both diets and say that the low carb one will be more effective, but that the other one is still better than the average diet.

 

I'll be honest -- I couldn't follow a truly low carb diet unless my life absolutely depended on it. We tried it after my dh's transplant to help control his blood sugar, and we all hated it.

[kiana]

I definitely agree with that! I was just thinking that if he eats a lot of cereal, that's a lot of milk, so the lower fat milk would be better for that.

 

I drink 1 or 2% milk because I prefer the taste, but I don't use low fat anything else, so I'm definitely not a big supporter of low fat dairy foods in general.

 

Kinda funny but I ended up with skim milk and full-fat cheese. Since I never found even whole milk in the least bit filling shifting to the lower fat made sense for me, plus quite honestly I prefer the taste now -- whole milk seems to leave a thick coating in my mouth if I drink it. There's plenty of fat from other sources (like cheese) in my diet. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

I believe my life DOES depend on it.  So yes, I do it.

 

My sister has almost died several times.  It's no joke.  And like I said she is in her 30s.  At the rate she is going, I can't imagine her living a long life.  And if she does, it's not going to be a very enjoyable one.  So that's enough to scare me straight. 

 

But I get how hard it is.  I really do. 

[Bluegoat]

Yeah - and I think if you give people some room, they may find they can maintain a relativly lower carb diet too.  Maybe not all the time, but a lot of the time.

[Catwoman]

Well it is true that it is hard to stick to.

 

I've eaten lower carb for years because I do not want to have diabetes and there are several in my family with it.

 

So far so good.....

 

But I admit, it's not always fun and easy. Nope. It's way more fun than a laundry list of medical problems though.

Definitely. It's better to stay ahead of the game when it comes to something as serious as diabetes.

 

We did it when my dh needed to watch his blood sugar so carefully and it was worth it. We did it again when he was on a steroid that raises blood sugar levels, too. We did it as a whole family so he wouldn't feel deprived while we sat there eating all of his favorite foods. Dh kept telling us to eat whatever we wanted, but ds17 and I would have felt terrible about it. We would do it again if it ever becomes necessary. It's a nuisance, but life and well-being are more important.

[Guest]

Yeah - and I think if you give people some room, they may find they can maintain a relativly lower carb diet too. Maybe not all the time, but a lot of the time.

I don't think the ADA even gives that option. They just say to stick with low or fat free, whole grains and injections and you will be fine. The cynic in me wonders who they are working for.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Yeah - and I think if you give people some room, they may find they can maintain a relativly lower carb diet too.  Maybe not all the time, but a lot of the time.

 

I don't know.  I think there will always be psychological difficulties with very low carb or the typical ADA recommendations.  But what low carb does do better is control hunger and physical cravings.  The ADA does not do that.  So you are screwing yourself twice really (psychological cravings and physical cravings).

 

To me it's like telling a smoker to cut each cigarette in half with the idea that they will want to smoke less.  Sure....

[Catwoman]

Yeah - and I think if you give people some room, they may find they can maintain a relativly lower carb diet too. Maybe not all the time, but a lot of the time.

Yes, and I think a big problem is that a lot of people see it as all or nothing, instead of thinking of ways they can modify their diet so they can gradually reduce the carbs and replace them with other foods so it's not such a feeling of deprivation. If you tell yourself you can never have another slice of bread as long as you live, I would think you would become obesssed with how much you want that bread, but if you know you can have some bread here and there, it becomes a lot easier to say that you can skip the bread for this meal and pick something different.

 

In Sparkly's case, I could understand if she wants to be very strict, though, because she sees someone she loves suffering from a disease that she could conceivably get.

[Catwoman]

I don't think the ADA even gives that option. They just say to stick with low or fat free, whole grains and injections and you will be fine. The cynic in me wonders who they are working for.

As I posted earlier, the most recent ADA information is that low carb is more effective, but they haven't changed their recommended diet because they have found that people tend not to stick with low carb diets. They also do not solely recommend insulin. They also say that pills are an option for many people, and that proper diet and exercise can completely control diabetes for some people.

Edited April 10, 2017 by Catwoman

[Greta]

I don't think the ADA even gives that option. They just say to stick with low or fat free, whole grains and injections and you will be fine. The cynic in me wonders who they are working for.

 

 

Yeah, I've heard several stories, some people I know IRL and some on message boards including this one, of people who controlled and even reversed their diabetes with a very low-carb diet.  And then they get yelled at by their doctor or nutritionist, saying that they need to go back to eating white bread and sugar so that they can get back on insulin injections!  It's as if selling insulin is the goal, not the health of the patient.  It makes my blood boil.

[kiana]

Yes, and I think a big problem is that a lot of people see it as all or nothing, instead of thinking of ways they can modify their diet so they can gradually reduce the carbs and replace them with other foods so it's not such a feeling of deprivation. If you tell yourself you can never have another slice of bread as long as you live, I would think you would become obesssed with how much you want that bread, but if you know you can have some bread here and there, it becomes a lot easier to say that you can skip the bread for this meal and pick something different.

 

Plus, for some people, making a "never again" rule leads into this feeling of "Oh I blew it and had a donut and ruined my diet, I'll start my diet again tomorrow ... but as long as I blew it I'll finish the box"

[SparklyUnicorn]

Hey, sometimes I've wondered if the standard American diet isn't what has caused such rampant diabetes. 

 

 

 

 

[Catwoman]

Yeah, I've heard several stories, some people I know IRL and some on message boards including this one, of people who controlled and even reversed their diabetes with a very low-carb diet. And then they get yelled at by their doctor or nutritionist, saying that they need to go back to eating white bread and sugar so that they can get back on insulin injections! It's as if selling insulin is the goal, not the health of the patient. It makes my blood boil.

That's terrible! My dh's doctors weren't like that at all.

[Guest]

Yes, and I think a big problem is that a lot of people see it as all or nothing, instead of thinking of ways they can modify their diet so they can gradually reduce the carbs and replace them with other foods so it's not such a feeling of deprivation. If you tell yourself you can never have another slice of bread as long as you live, I would think you would become obesssed with how much you want that bread, but if you know you can have some bread here and there, it becomes a lot easier to say that you can skip the bread for this meal and pick something different.

 

In Sparkly's case, I could understand if she wants to be very strict, though, because she sees someone she loves suffering from a disease that she could conceivably get.

Our ideas about food are so messed up. There is a line in "It Starts With Food" (I think) that I keep coming back to. Basically, this isn't hard. Changing your diet isn't hard. Fighting cancer is hard. You have a working brain, the ability to make choices, full control over your hands. Just don't eat crap. Not alway fun but not hard. I can't wrap my brain around being obsessed with bread (or anything). I just don't eat it. Not hard.

[SparklyUnicorn]

I am a tad lucky in that I have no sweet tooth.  I could have 10 boxes of donuts right in front of me and have no desire to eat any of them. 

 

Chips are my poison.  :laugh:

[Lang Syne Boardie]

Concerning diabetes - low carb is one way, Fuhrman's high fiber vegetarian way is another; the ADA is very disinterested in either option, no matter how many of us explain to our doctors and diabetes educators that our numbers are consistently lower - into non-diabetes range - on these plans than on their meal plans and pills. Of course, there's very, very little money to be made in telling people to eat their vegetables and take a walk...

 

still, concerning Scarlet's son, I will have to join the ranks of those wondering what difference the milkfat percentage makes if he's eating three or four bowls of cold cereal for breakfast. Come, now.

[Catwoman]

Plus, for some people, making a "never again" rule leads into this feeling of "Oh I blew it and had a donut and ruined my diet, I'll start my diet again tomorrow ... but as long as I blew it I'll finish the box"

:iagree:

 

Exactly!

 

I also think a lot of the fat-free foods are a big problem because no matter what you tell them, some people think if the box of cookies says fat-free, it's okay to eat the whole box. Because apparently fat-free must also mean calorie-free. :rolleyes:

[SparklyUnicorn]

Yeah, I've heard several stories, some people I know IRL and some on message boards including this one, of people who controlled and even reversed their diabetes with a very low-carb diet.  And then they get yelled at by their doctor or nutritionist, saying that they need to go back to eating white bread and sugar so that they can get back on insulin injections!  It's as if selling insulin is the goal, not the health of the patient.  It makes my blood boil.

 

yeah my doctor is a joke in that department

 

I don't discuss food with her.  Only leaves me annoyed.  LOL

[Catwoman]

Our ideas about food are so messed up. There is a line in "It Starts With Food" (I think) that I keep coming back to. Basically, this isn't hard. Changing your diet isn't hard. Fighting cancer is hard. You have a working brain, the ability to make choices, full control over your hands. Just don't eat crap. Not alway fun but not hard. I can't wrap my brain around being obsessed with bread (or anything). I just don't eat it. Not hard.

It's hard for a lot of people, though. You're very lucky that it's easy for you.

[kiana]

Hey, sometimes I've wondered if the standard American diet isn't what has caused such rampant diabetes. 

 

It is an enormous contributing factor. We have massive amounts of calories available for most people and most of them are in processed foods that are deliberately designed to be non-satiating to encourage consumption. Non-satiating foods tend to be the ones that drive an insulin response in the first place, and because they encourage overconsumption, they lead to weight gain, and excess fat also drives an insulin response, which leads to more hunger and more consumption, and it is just a vicious, vicious circle. And buying real foods that are more filling requires more knowledge, more preparation, more money, and ignoring the seductively singing Sirens of your taste buds and every food advertisement that you see. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

Concerning diabetes - low carb is one way, Fuhrman's high fiber vegetarian way is another; the ADA is very disinterested in either option, no matter how many of us explain to our doctors and diabetes educators that our numbers are consistently lower - into non-diabetes range - on these plans than on their meal plans and pills. Of course, there's very, very little money to be made in telling people to eat their vegetables and take a walk...

 

still, concerning Scarlet's son, I will have to join the ranks of those wondering what difference the milkfat percentage makes if he's eating three or four bowls of cold cereal for breakfast. Come, now.

 

I can see that being as effective.  Absolutely.

[Guest]

It's hard for a lot of people, though. You're very lucky that it's easy for you.

It isn't luck.

[Catwoman]

Kinda funny but I ended up with skim milk and full-fat cheese. Since I never found even whole milk in the least bit filling shifting to the lower fat made sense for me, plus quite honestly I prefer the taste now -- whole milk seems to leave a thick coating in my mouth if I drink it. There's plenty of fat from other sources (like cheese) in my diet.

Same here! I could have written your post word for word. :)

[Bluegoat]

I don't know.  I think there will always be psychological difficulties with very low carb or the typical ADA recommendations.  But what low carb does do better is control hunger and physical cravings.  The ADA does not do that.  So you are screwing yourself twice really (psychological cravings and physical cravings).

 

To me it's like telling a smoker to cut each cigarette in half with the idea that they will want to smoke less.  Sure....

 

Sure.  But that is kind of what I am getting at - if you know that lower carb will be better, you can more often make that choice.  I suspect that their "whole grains" rec accomplishes that to some extent as it cuts out a lot of processed food, but many people might make a slightly different set of choices even if that was meant to be minimized.

[Guest]

Hey, sometimes I've wondered if the standard American diet isn't what has caused such rampant diabetes.

Totally!!

[Catwoman]

It isn't luck.

What would you call it?

[Greta]

 

still, concerning Scarlet's son, I will have to join the ranks of those wondering what difference the milkfat percentage makes if he's eating three or four bowls of cold cereal for breakfast. Come, now.

 

 

The cereal is definitely the bigger problem in this situation!  Using whole milk makes it somewhat more likely that you'll make it to lunch without a blood sugar crash and/or intense hunger.  But I would ditch cereal completely before I worried too much about which kind of milk.

 

(ETA: I meant, in this hypothetical situation.  I don't think Scarlett's son was actually eating that, right?)

Edited April 10, 2017 by Greta

[Guest]

What would you call it?

I educated myself and I do what is best for my health.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Sure.  But that is kind of what I am getting at - if you know that lower carb will be better, you can more often make that choice.  I suspect that their "whole grains" rec accomplishes that to some extent as it cuts out a lot of processed food, but many people might make a slightly different set of choices even if that was meant to be minimized.

 

No it really doesn't though.  If you look at the carb count on any whole grain stuff...it's still very very very high.  Just about as high as stuff without it.  Now granted over the long term that probably adds up to a difference.  But day to day?  I hardly see the difference.  And it's day to day that is really going to matter for someone with diabetes. 

 

I mean yes, any day of the week, it's better to eat some whole grain bread than a bunch of Oreos.  But for a diabetic, whole grain bread, is not healthy for them.  Not at all.  For someone without that issue, it's probably fine.

[Bluegoat]

Concerning diabetes - low carb is one way, Fuhrman's high fiber vegetarian way is another; the ADA is very disinterested in either option, no matter how many of us explain to our doctors and diabetes educators that our numbers are consistently lower - into non-diabetes range - on these plans than on their meal plans and pills. Of course, there's very, very little money to be made in telling people to eat their vegetables and take a walk...

 

still, concerning Scarlet's son, I will have to join the ranks of those wondering what difference the milkfat percentage makes if he's eating three or four bowls of cold cereal for breakfast. Come, now.

 

That wasn't the breakfast she was contemplating offering him.

[Greta]

Hey, sometimes I've wondered if the standard American diet isn't what has caused such rampant diabetes. 

 

 

You might be interested in Death by Food Pyramid.

[SparklyUnicorn]

That wasn't the breakfast she was contemplating offering him.

 

Yeah the milk he was getting was probably the healthiest part.

 

Swap the cereal. Not the milk.  Cereal leaves a lot of people hungry.

[Catwoman]

I educated myself and I do what is best for my health.

That's fine, but you said it was easy for you. Making dramatic dietary changes is not easy for everyone. Many people have trouble with craving their favorite foods, but it sounds like you don't. That's why I said I thought you were lucky that it is easy for you to never eat bread (or whatever.)

 

I don't think we can assume that most people can simply change their diet without any problem at all, simply because they know it will be better for their health. I'm glad you were able to do that, but I would bet that you are in the minority, because many people have trouble sticking to a very healthy diet, even though they are educated and are concerned with their health.

[Bluegoat]

No it really doesn't though.  If you look at the carb count on any whole grain stuff...it's still very very very high.  Just about as high as stuff without it.  Now granted over the long term that probably adds up to a difference.  But day to day?  I hardly see the difference.  And it's day to day that is really going to matter for someone with diabetes. 

 

I mean yes, any day of the week, it's better to eat some whole grain bread than a bunch of Oreos.  But for a diabetic, whole grain bread, is not healthy for them.  Not at all.  For someone without that issue, it's probably fine.

 

Just specifying whole grain cuts out large amounts of easy foods and will tend to mean they are replaced with something different.  Plus, whole grain foods are more filling so people won't tend to eat the same amount.

 

And it isn't just the carb count, it's what your body does with it, and what else it offers alongside.

 

Though - there is a lot of fake whole grain food around at the moment.

[SparklyUnicorn]

 

Though - there is a lot of fake whole grain food around at the moment.

 

Like Big G cereals that they serve to school children every day in many schools in the US?

[Lang Syne Boardie]

That wasn't the breakfast she was contemplating offering him.

 

It seemed to me that previous posters were discussing ways to make his cereal preference healthier; Scarlett had said that the multiple bowls have been his habit. So he's supposed to cut his portions by 1/3 to 1/2? I think (JMHO) he might prefer to eat something else entirely, such as the egg "muffins" Scarlett is going to fix, which sound like a great idea.

 

(It's not that strange for teenaged boys to eat half a box of cereal, either; my guys are not at all overweight and very athletic, but never bother with just one serving of cereal. Which is one reason we try to get them to eat oatmeal or eggs, or anything else that will actually stick to their ribs.)

[SparklyUnicorn]

That's fine, but you said it was easy for you. Making dramatic dietary changes is not easy for everyone. Many people have trouble with craving their favorite foods, but it sounds like you don't. That's why I said I thought you were lucky that it is easy for you to never eat bread (or whatever.)

 

I don't think we can assume that most people can simply change their diet without any problem at all, simply because they know it will be better for their health. I'm glad you were able to do that, but I would bet that you are in the minority, because many people have trouble sticking to a very healthy diet, even though they are educated and are concerned with their health.

 

Although, you know what is not easy about it?  Other people.  Really, if more people ate like this, life would be easier.  There would be more demand for the healthier foods.

 

I'm fine at home.  I love the food I make.  It's not deprivation by any stretch.  But going out to eat?  Forget it.

[Catwoman]

No it really doesn't though. If you look at the carb count on any whole grain stuff...it's still very very very high. Just about as high as stuff without it. Now granted over the long term that probably adds up to a difference. But day to day? I hardly see the difference. And it's day to day that is really going to matter for someone with diabetes.

 

I mean yes, any day of the week, it's better to eat some whole grain bread than a bunch of Oreos. But for a diabetic, whole grain bread, is not healthy for them. Not at all. For someone without that issue, it's probably fine.

The whole grain bread should have a lower glycemic index than the white bread, so your body should process it differently.

 

But if you're diabetic, the whole grain bread is still just the lesser of two evils. It's not like you can sit down and eat half a loaf of whole grain bread and have it not affect your blood sugar.

[Catwoman]

Just specifying whole grain cuts out large amounts of easy foods and will tend to mean they are replaced with something different. Plus, whole grain foods are more filling so people won't tend to eat the same amount.

 

And it isn't just the carb count, it's what your body does with it, and what else it offers alongside.

 

Though - there is a lot of fake whole grain food around at the moment.

Personally, I eat smaller amounts of whole grain foods because they taste like rocks and twigs to me. ;)

[Greta]

What would you call it?

 

 

I just wanted to use this as a jumping off point to say that a considerable amount of education about low-carb is necessary to make it work, and I honestly think that's a big part of why doctors don't recommend it.  It's very time consuming to explain.  It sounds easy in theory, just eat fewer carbs!  Voila!  But it isn't.

 

A lot of people don't realize that dropping your carb intake super low is actually easier than just cutting back a little, because it changes your appetite.  People are afraid to replace the carbs with fat, because fat has been so falsely demonized in our culture, and a diet that is both low carb and low fat can be very difficult to maintain.  Some don't realize that being in a ketogenic state drastically increases your body's need for sodium, and they suffer with headaches, muscle cramps, and fatigue, and think it's the fault of the diet when it's actually the fault of insufficient education about the diet.

 

And then there's the whole issue of how our society is set up for a high-carb diet.  Grocery stores are full of processed foods with white flours and added sugars.  Restaurants and social eating situations are filled with high-carb delights.  Eating low-carb is made harder by the fact that everyone around you is eating all of the foods you're not supposed to eat.

 

It's definitely not easy.  But it definitely is do-able with a combination of determination and education.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

That's fine, but you said it was easy for you. Making dramatic dietary changes is not easy for everyone. Many people have trouble with craving their favorite foods, but it sounds like you don't. That's why I said I thought you were lucky that it is easy for you to never eat bread (or whatever.)

 

I don't think we can assume that most people can simply change their diet without any problem at all, simply because they know it will be better for their health. I'm glad you were able to do that, but I would bet that you are in the minority, because many people have trouble sticking to a very healthy diet, even though they are educated and are concerned with their health.

 

I will concede that it's very hard. Furhman's diet is so restrictive, inconvenient, and expensive that I can't believe anyone does it, let alone myself, as I've never considered myself a person who has time or brain space for extreme measures. Turns out it's not really willpower; I am more afraid to go back on insulin than I am afraid to do without a craving! Simple as that.

 

I really don't have a problem with people who would rather be diabetes patients (with pills, shots, appointments, insurance premiums going up, higher risk for illness and more trouble healing)...simply because they cannot pay that much attention to every bite they eat. And of course, there are people who are physically unable to live the active lifestyle that the Fuhrman plan requires; you can't lower your blood sugar without all the exercise.

 

So I'm not being snarky at all when I say that I understand why people won't do the drastic home cures. My problem is that they are not informed of the option. It's assumed that type 2 diabetics will fail, so they aren't told.

 

I wouldn't have appeared to be a good candidate for this plan; I had joint pain that limited mobility, and my weight was such that I gave every impression of having little self-control. But nobody looking at my situation could know that I do have a very strong will, and that have I done very difficult things in the past...probably lots of people are like that.

 

Anyway. What this has to do with Scarlett's boy is this: Some of us are expressing concerns about approaches that can lead to wrong understanding about nutrition, and yo-yo dieting which is even more harmful, and even the possibility of eating disorders that can arise from excessive recordkeeping and feelings of failure. Our ways aren't guarantees against any of that, but since some of us have been down those roads, we just want Scarlett to feel her way carefully.

 

So we're going to speak up against skim milk, and the ADA...Scarlett is free to take it or leave it, of course.

[Catwoman]

I just wanted to use this as a jumping off point to say that a considerable amount of education about low-carb is necessary to make it work, and I honestly think that's a big part of why doctors don't recommend it. It's very time consuming to explain. It sounds easy in theory, just eat fewer carbs! Voila! But it isn't.

 

A lot of people don't realize that dropping your carb intake super low is actually easier than just cutting back a little, because it changes your appetite. People are afraid to replace the carbs with fat, because fat has been so falsely demonized in our culture, and a diet that is both low carb and low fat can be very difficult to maintain. Some don't realize that being in a ketogenic state drastically increases your body's need for sodium, and they suffer with headaches, muscle cramps, and fatigue, and think it's the fault of the diet when it's actually the fault of insufficient education about the diet.

 

And then there's the whole issue of how our society is set up for a high-carb diet. Grocery stores are full of processed foods with white flours and added sugars. Restaurants and social eating situations are filled with high-carb delights. Eating low-carb is made harder by the fact that everyone around you is eating all of the foods you're not supposed to eat.

 

It's definitely not easy. But it definitely is do-able with a combination of determination and education.

I agree with you. :)

 

Moxie had said it was easy for her to never eat bread (or whatever) and I said she was lucky it was so easy for her. I was genuinely glad it was easy for her. Then she said it wasn't luck, so I asked her what she would call it, and she said it was because she had educated herself and is doing what is best for her health. I think it's great that she is doing what she believes is best for her health and that it's easy for her to stick to it, but I think she is more the exception than the rule when it comes to being able to stick to a new diet plan long term without any regrets or cravings for old favorite foods.

 

I think I offended her when I said she was lucky it was easy for her, but I meant it in a nice way. It wouldn't be easy for me, no matter how educated I was about it! :)

[Catwoman]

Just so everyone knows... I ran out of likes, so if I don't like any more of your posts today, it's not because I'm ignoring you! :)

[kiana]

I just wanted to use this as a jumping off point to say that a considerable amount of education about low-carb is necessary to make it work, and I honestly think that's a big part of why doctors don't recommend it.  It's very time consuming to explain.  It sounds easy in theory, just eat fewer carbs!  Voila!  But it isn't.

 

A lot of people don't realize that dropping your carb intake super low is actually easier than just cutting back a little, because it changes your appetite.  People are afraid to replace the carbs with fat, because fat has been so falsely demonized in our culture, and a diet that is both low carb and low fat can be very difficult to maintain.  Some don't realize that being in a ketogenic state drastically increases your body's need for sodium, and they suffer with headaches, muscle cramps, and fatigue, and think it's the fault of the diet when it's actually the fault of insufficient education about the diet.

 

And then there's the whole issue of how our society is set up for a high-carb diet.  Grocery stores are full of processed foods with white flours and added sugars.  Restaurants and social eating situations are filled with high-carb delights.  Eating low-carb is made harder by the fact that everyone around you is eating all of the foods you're not supposed to eat.

 

It's definitely not easy.  But it definitely is do-able with a combination of determination and education.

 

Another issue is that going on and off the low-carb diet makes many people feel terrible. So you have to be the one who skips the birthday cake when everyone else is having some, and skips the pizza when there's a class pizza party, and instead eats your packed low-carb lunch, and a lot of teens really can't handle that. Heck, a lot of adults can't handle that. 

[Catwoman]

Another issue is that going on and off the low-carb diet makes many people feel terrible. So you have to be the one who skips the birthday cake when everyone else is having some, and skips the pizza when there's a class pizza party, and instead eats your packed low-carb lunch, and a lot of teens really can't handle that. Heck, a lot of adults can't handle that.

:iagree:

 

 

That's so true. That's why I'm a fan of eating a wide variety of foods, but in moderation -- obviously trying to stick with healthy choices and limiting the junk food, but not being so strict as to say to never, ever eat certain things.

 

Obviously it's different when there is a known health issue or a high risk situation, but I'm thinking of the average person.

Edited April 10, 2017 by Catwoman

[Greta]

I agree with you. :)

 

Moxie had said it was easy for her to never eat bread (or whatever) and I said she was lucky it was so easy for her. I was genuinely glad it was easy for her. Then she said it wasn't luck, so I asked her what she would call it, and she said it was because she had educated herself and is doing what is best for her health. I think it's great that she is doing what she believes is best for her health and that it's easy for her to stick to it, but I think she is more the exception than the rule when it comes to being able to stick to a new diet plan long term without any regrets or cravings for old favorite foods.

 

I think I offended her when I said she was lucky it was easy for her, but I meant it in a nice way. It wouldn't be easy for me, no matter how educated I was about it! :)

 

I read your tone as being nice!  (I've never known you to be anything but nice!)

 

I did a ketogenic diet for about 12 years, and for me it was pretty easy.  And that was shocking to me because I was very sugar-addicted prior to it!  So I'm a big believer that the education goes a long way in making it work.  For example, I had a friend once who said low-carb didn't work for her, and when I asked why, she started describing the classic symptoms of the "Atkins flu".  Well, yeah, the Atkins flu is not fun!  But if you know what causes it and how to reduce the symptoms and the fact that it only lasts for a day or two and then passes, then you can get through it.  But if you don't know that stuff, well then no wonder you would think low-carb doesn't work for you!

 

But, that said, it truly doesn't work for some people.  So I most certainly am not trying to imply that the reason you don't like it is because you're not educated enough!  I hope I didn't come across that way.  Even world-leading experts on low-carb diets say there is a portion of the population for whom it simply is not a good diet.  And while it worked great for me for 11 of those 12 years, the last year was awful (and yeah, it took me a whole year to figure out that my diet was part of the problem.  I'm slow!).  So I wish more people had the education about it so that they could make their own informed choice.  My choice right now and for the foreseeable future is not a ketogenic diet, as great as I think it can be.

 

 

Another issue is that going on and off the low-carb diet makes many people feel terrible. So you have to be the one who skips the birthday cake when everyone else is having some, and skips the pizza when there's a class pizza party, and instead eats your packed low-carb lunch, and a lot of teens really can't handle that. Heck, a lot of adults can't handle that. 

 

 

 

Yes, that stuff is hard.  I had many "but one piece of cake won't hurt you!" conversations.  People don't understand that when you're trying to maintain a ketogenic state, one piece of cake disrupts your metabolism for days!  And it can be very difficult for younger people to manage social situations like that.