Fallacy Detective users...

[egao_gakari]

Do the answers seem kind of arbitrary to you sometimes?

 

For example, Question 8 in Lesson 7 says:

 

Mrs. A: I'm going through a logic book with my kids. It's called The Fallacy Detective. I really like it.

Mrs. B: Aw, the authors of that book are just a couple of homeschoolers. What do they know about logic?

 

My son argues that this is a genetic fallacy, because it attacks the source of the book. The answer in the back says ad hominem. I tried to explain that the difference is that Mrs. B is suspicious of the authors, who are specific people. My son argues that one of the examples of genetic fallacy is, "Eew, don't you know flip-flops were invented by hippies?" which he says is the same thing since the hippies who invented flip-flops were specific people too. (He is really enjoying the fact that he has a class where he gets to argue with me.)

 

Do you find that the answers in the book are often not well-explained? If you supplement with something else, please let me know!

[RootAnn]

When we do FD, we do it sitting next to each other, out loud, so we can talk about everything. We sometimes have different answers than the authors. Occasionally, our answers from kid-to-kid have been different. (I've done it twice so far.) We write our answers in the back's answer key in pencil so we can compare the next time we go through it.

 

I usually follow up the following year with CAP's Art of Argument. It is more thorough, adds more fallacies, and is more in depth. We do that one with a small group of that kid's friends (or simply peers) with lots of interaction. As FD is just an introduction, we don't supplement. We do run off on rabbit trails sometimes. (My oldest got her first introduction to The Music Man because of FD.)

[egao_gakari]

When we do FD, we do it sitting next to each other, out loud, so we can talk about everything. We sometimes have different answers than the authors. Occasionally, our answers from kid-to-kid have been different. (I've done it twice so far.) We write our answers in the back's answer key in pencil so we can compare the next time we go through it.

 

I usually follow up the following year with CAP's Art of Argument. It is more thorough, adds more fallacies, and is more in depth. We do that one with a small group of that kid's friends (or simply peers) with lots of interaction. As FD is just an introduction, we don't supplement. We do run off on rabbit trails sometimes. (My oldest got her first introduction to The Music Man because of FD.)

 

Thanks for your answer! Do you have previous experience with studying logic? I never have, so if my answer or DS' answer is different from the book I get a little anxious that maybe we're doing something wrong.... I just have no definitive answer for questions like my son posed above.

 

Do you do The Thinking Toolbox before Art of Argument, or is the TT just more of the same if you've already done FD?

[Creekside5]

Thanks for your answer! Do you have previous experience with studying logic? I never have, so if my answer or DS' answer is different from the book I get a little anxious that maybe we're doing something wrong.... I just have no definitive answer for questions like my son posed above.

 

Do you do The Thinking Toolbox before Art of Argument, or is the TT just more of the same if you've already done FD?

I have taught the Thinking Toolbox many times to bright 5th graders.  I think of it as pre-logic.  The whole last third of the book is on the Scientific Method.  I taught it along side a science unit on the scientific method; it was perfect for 5th graders.  The first 2/3 is about mysteries and logical thinking.  My students loved it.  I plan on doing The Thinking toolbox and the fallacy detective for my own 6th grader as pre-logic.  We can then move to something more formal.  I wouldn't get hung up on the answers being correct.  The fun part is debating and trying to prove your answer.  As long as my students had very sound logical thinking we called it good.  We disagreed with a few answers in the book. 

[egao_gakari]

I have taught the Thinking Toolbox many times to bright 5th graders. I think of it as pre-logic. The whole last third of the book is on the Scientific Method. I taught it along side a science unit on the scientific method; it was perfect for 5th graders. The first 2/3 is about mysteries and logical thinking. My students loved it. I plan on doing The Thinking toolbox and the fallacy detective for my own 6th grader as pre-logic. We can then move to something more formal. I wouldn't get hung up on the answers being correct. The fun part is debating and trying to prove your answer. As long as my students had very sound logical thinking we called it good. We disagreed with a few answers in the book.

Thanks! So do you figure the Thinking Toolbox is a prequel to FD rather than a vol. 2? I had the impression that it was first FD, then TT. Or does it matter?

 

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[RootAnn]

We've never done TT. My logic is all formal mathematical logic (from geometry). I don't have any informal (fallacy) training. The first time I went through AofA, I learned just ahead of the kids! By the end of the class, some of the students knew the fallacies better than I did.

 

I agree with SRoss - as long as the kids can discuss their reasoning & it is sound, I don't see any issue with answers that differ from the ones in the back.

[Creekside5]

Thanks! So do you figure the Thinking Toolbox is a prequel to FD rather than a vol. 2? I had the impression that it was first FD, then TT. Or does it matter?

 

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I don't think it really matters.  Your kid would probably enjoy reading it and could do it quickly in a couple of months.  It isn't expensive.  You could also skip it and no harm would be done. If they haven't learned the scientific method yet, I would definitely spend some time on that unit  and supplement with other materials.

[Excelsior! Academy]

We always do TT and FD in conjunction with one another.  I would consider them a great pre-logic introduction for middle school age.  It's fun to watch the kids' reactions to billboard and tv ads after completing the books.  Fallacies are everywhere!  To answer your question, yes, we did occasionally have different answers than the back of the book.

[aharrington]

Thanks for asking this question.  We just started and I was wondering the same thing.