How do you not put a box around learning?

[mamashark]

Instead of giving the regular history assignment today, I pulled a random biography off the bookshelf that she had not yet read and basically told her to read it, take notes and write a report for me including a timeline and that it was due on Friday.

 

She's now been working for nearly 2 hours straight, on the last few pages of the book (it was a pretty easy level book for her) and has 3 pages of notes. She's been working steady through her siblings playing without a break in focus except to ask me if I could help her get what she needed to put together the timeline when she was finished.

 

This from the kid who can't write 3 sentences on a free-write topic of her choice without moaning and groaning.

 

So how do I take that and not box it in with preconceived ideas on how a report should look? Obviously I want to refine what she's doing and help her learn to put it together nicely, but this was kind of off the cuff and I'm not sure how to guide her.

 

Is there something I should be looking for to help me (some curriculum or something like that?) or is this just something I need to learn to do on my own and keep giving assignments like this? 

 

I really expected her to read the book and have something like 4 incomplete sentences scrawled across a page and left abandoned on the kitchen table as she ran off to play...

[hornblower]

How old is your dd? 

[mamashark]

She's 8

 

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[quark]

You don't mention her age. I am going to assume she is in elementary?

 

Sometimes, the best learning comes from the simplest of approaches. Don't overcomplicate it. You know this works so do what you know works. Increase difficulty and expectations gradually. As gradually as she needs to. From time to time, change it up a little e.g. instead of taking notes, have a discussion at the dinner table after reading, letting the facts soak in beforehand throughout the day. Throw a challenge like what might have happened if X (subject of biography) did B instead of A. Ask that question again 2 days later.

 

Our out of the box was mostly reading and talking about almost anything. I didn't draw a line on sensitive topics (I know there are different comfort levels surrounding that). Very few requirements, some expectations on critical thinking and lots of encouragement when there was pattern recognition (even outside of math) and deeper probing.

 

One of our approaches was to have him teach us things. Anything. Even things we already knew about.

 

The target was to keep nourishing the curiosity. To keep the love of learning strong.

[Arcadia]

She's 8

What I did was keep those as writing samples in their "memories" binder as

 

1) my kids have proof that they can write on days they have writer's block

 

2) I don't feel like I fail to teach them writing on days when my kids can only churn out a short paragraph

 

3) when I need work samples for anything, I have something to show even if it is not recent.

 

4) my boys enjoy looking back at what they wrote when they were 5 :lol:

 

If it is assigned work, I would get my kids to proofread hours later or the next day for spelling and grammar errors.

[hornblower]

At 8?

 

I would take anything she gave me & find minimum of 3 concrete things to praise which showed specifically that you are appreciating the time and effort she put into something. 

So not 'wow, this is great!' but "I like how you took the time to explain ______"  or "you worked hard on your printing and it really shows." or "You picked your pictures out very carefully and they make the report interesting to look at"  and the more general "Wow, you really surprised and impressed me with how hard you worked on this! I noticed you kept concentrating on it even when you siblings went to play. Tell me why this project got you so interested and what you liked about it?" 

I would not find any mistakes, errors or anything wrong at all.  Even if the child ASKED me, "did I do anything wrong?" I wouldn't point anything out.   I would say "what did you think? Were there things that were hard?" 

There is plenty of time to learn how to do a report. This is the time to encourage and praise effort, concentration & independent work. 

[mamashark]

Ok so I had to tell her that we weren't going to finish the whole project today and that she had to go outside and play. Then I read through what she kept calling her "report". (I already wrote the whole report, mom! I just need to do the timeline!) 

 

Except for spelling and spacing issues, it is actually a pretty good report, included all the important facts, some of the "interesting" facts and is quite complete (two full pages of writing, wide ruled paper, and a third page of dates and notes for her timeline)

 

So is there any benefit to the contrived "book report" questions that kids are required to write on in the public school if she can produce something like this without any instruction? 

 

I think I might come up with some specific questions to ask as thoughtful extensions, like, maybe what would you ask him if you got to meet him for lunch? or, what board game do you think would be fun to play with him? (the report was on Mozart, btw)

[Arcadia]

So is there any benefit to the contrived "book report" questions that kids are required to write on in the public school if she can produce something like this without any instruction?

If she doesn't need the contrived book report questions then she doesn't need it :)

 

Those book report questions in public school K & 1st did help my perfectionist kids start writing about plot and character anaylsis, which help them with their literature homework in public school 2nd-4th.

[EndOfOrdinary]

Ds is a perfectionist. Without the questions, he locks up. If she can write from reading, let her do it. She is 8. All experiences are good ones at 8.

[quark]

So is there any benefit to the contrived "book report" questions that kids are required to write on in the public school if she can produce something like this without any instruction? 

 

 

I think you answered your own question. :laugh: :thumbup: way to go, young lady shark!

[LisaKinVA]

Here is my experience from "the other side."

 

When DS was very little, he would tell very creative stories.  When we took him to JHU for a complete assessment, the instructor was very impressed with what he had written, and copied off what she could so that we could see.  I had noticed that when we did things orally, they would be detailed and creative.  When he had to write out his answers, though, they looked more like a typical 6-7 year old.  Not long after, we started using K12 (independently at first, but through the charter for 4th and 5th grades).  He did more writing those 4 years than the years before and the following 4 years combined.  

 

It was not good writing.  From 2nd-5th grade, the only thing that changed substantively about his writing was the length of the assignments.

 

Not long after this, I was in a conference with SWB speaking about writing through the different ages/levels.  And, it really resonated with me.  For the next few years, I really backed off writing (he still wrote quite a bit, but I wasn't asking for tons of mundane assignments).  I used Killgallon as my main source for practicing compositions.  We did outlining, and I even went back to oral narrations (I felt I needed to de-school from the formal writing of the past four years).  

 

He's now a sophomore, and can knock out a 3-page essay (including research and citations) in less than 3 hours.  His midterm report was 10 pages long (the minimum was five).  He enjoys writing, he's found his voice, and it's not nearly the drudgery it once was..  

 

All of this is simply to underscore that "more" writing does not create a better writer.  I've taken a much different approach with my younger children, focusing on the long-term goal.  Learning to write well is a long-term process.  Some will arrive there earlier in ability (although, even with my high-ability learners, I'm not forcing lengthy assignments, either).  Besides, what I've also found as a by-product, is they will each spend more time writing creatively on their own (it's more of a game).