Banging my head against the wall - reading comp

[Perogi]

I've never really intended to teach reading comprehension as a separate subject. I was sure that between narrating things back, talking about books, reading a lot, doing WWE, etc, I had it covered.

 

I'm no longer sure that approach is working.

 

Today in WWE level 3, week 2, my 8yo dd really struggled to answer the questions I asked her about the passage. Not only could she not remember them, she couldn't find the answers when I told her to look at the passage again and find the answer.

 

So - I need to some reading comprehension suggestions. Reading Detective? CLE Reading? Something else?? I'm placing a big order tonight for other things I'll need next year and would like to get my reading comp curriculum at the same time.

 

Thanks!

[Medieval Mom]

I keep trying to convince myself that we DON'T need CLE Reading, in my never-ending desire to streamline my day. HOWEVER, every time I ask ds8 whether we should drop it, he protests "NO!!!!" Once, he asked, "Could I just do it in my free time, then?" Enough said. We're keeping it in!

 

Honestly, this program has truly helped Ds grasp reading comprehension. I consider it our ethics course, as I truly think it has ds with this as well :)

 

So, IMHO, I think it's worth a try. :)

Edited April 5, 2012 by Medieval Mom

[threeofakind]

This is what I found a few months back; I like it because it is step by step. What I don't care for is 3rd grade (not sure about other grades) the teachers guide is on a cd rom. I like something in my hands, but it's okay.

http://www.perfectionlearning.com/focus-on-reading-strategies

 

I have looked around quite a bit for something I like and has everything but have not found it (this came pretty close tho!), so I am considering writing up my own this summer for next year!:001_smile:

[Perogi]

I keep trying to convince myself that we DON'T need CLE Reading, in my never-ending desire to streamline my day. HOWEVER, every time I ask ds8 whether we should drop it, he protests "NO!!!!" Once, he asked, "Could I just do it in my free time, then?" Enough said. We're keeping it in!

 

Honestly, this program has truly helped Ds grasp reading comprehension. I consider it our ethics course, as I truly think it has ds with this as well :)

 

So, IMHO, I think it's worth a try. :)

 

I bought the gr 2 readers for dd6yo this year and we've really enjoyed them and have seen them have a positive impact on her. I was toying with buying the gr 4 reader anyway for next year. I am also getting their Bible course for my 3rd grader - I did wonder if that would be enough for reading comp?? I'm going to take a closer look at all the samples tonight.

 

Does your ds generally enjoy workbooky stuff?? I'm nervous to take on another "thing" as well because I do try to keep things fairly streamlined and already have some other things I'll be adding next year.

[Perogi]

This is what I found a few months back; I like it because it is step by step. What I don't care for is 3rd grade (not sure about other grades) the teachers guide is on a cd rom. I like something in my hands, but it's okay.

http://www.perfectionlearning.com/focus-on-reading-strategies

 

I have looked around quite a bit for something I like and has everything but have not found it (this came pretty close tho!), so I am considering writing up my own this summer for next year!:001_smile:

 

I've never seen that one before - thanks. I'll take a closer look at it as well.

 

Maybe I should just make better use of my SL book notes - both for the readers and RA's.

[Ray]

Professor Daniel Willingham has this YouTube video called 'teaching content is teaching reading' I think it's worth the time to watch and to consider the points raised in it. Maybe some help with your quest.

 

 

 

[Ohmomjacquie]

My second grader has comp issues. We have started taking reading in much smaller segments then I ask her a few questions before continuing. This and me helping her find the answers in the text seems to be helping, not perfect but getting better. I know how you feel though! Evan moor makes reading comp practice books. May be cheaper than a full curriculum.

[MomatHWTK]

I like the book Reading Rescue 1-2-3 and comprehension exercise materials from Remedia Publications.

 

There was a thread about narration yesterday that might have some tips that would help you as well.

[raisingknights]

Just a couple of questions...Is your dd having problems recalling what she read or what you read to her? And do you give her time to digest it and discuss later? One of my sons used to recall information much better after having heard it, especially when listening to audio books. Another son simply cannot narrate back to me immediately after reading. It seems to be more of a thought organization issue than comprehension. He needs time to think about it.

[Medieval Mom]

I bought the gr 2 readers for dd6yo this year and we've really enjoyed them and have seen them have a positive impact on her. I was toying with buying the gr 4 reader anyway for next year. I am also getting their Bible course for my 3rd grader - I did wonder if that would be enough for reading comp?? I'm going to take a closer look at all the samples tonight.

 

Does your ds generally enjoy workbooky stuff?? I'm nervous to take on another "thing" as well because I do try to keep things fairly streamlined and already have some other things I'll be adding next year.

 

These were my concerns exactly. Ds doesn't always relish MORE work, especially workbooks. He'd really rather read, build with Legos, or play! But he LOVES his CLE Reading. He's even memorized several of the poems included. :)

 

Like I said earlier, it's always the first thing I'm tempted to cut (mostly, because I love our McGuffey Readers-- we now use those for the "Oral Reading Class" portion of CLE). Nevertheless, I know the program covers (in one course) so much that I might otherwise miss, especially in our streamlined approach. In other words, I find that this year and next, I am actually able to streamline our LA *because* we are including CLE Reading.

 

Caveat: We're not Mennonites, and we don't agree 100% with everything written in the program. Once and a while, ds will come to me with a frown. Once, he said, "They say there's no such thing as luck. I don't believe that." Actually, that made for a very good conversation. For several days, and with several people, we talked about the concept of Luck; what we believed, how we defined "luck", whether we "make our own luck", whether luck is really God smiling on us, etc. For other questions or answers he/we may not agree with, we cross them out, discuss them, etc. It's good to know that people believe and think differently in this world. What I DO like about this program is that it make ds THINK, really THINK-- not only about his answer, but also about his THOUGHTS, beliefs, life.

 

In other words, for us, CLE Reading is FAR more than "Reading Comp.", and really doesn't take long every day to accomplish all that it does.

 

The Scope and Sequence for CLE Reading can be found here.

[~Anna~]

Medieval Mom,

Sorry if the answer to this is obvious, but are you just using the "reading" curriculum lessons from CLE for his grade level? I am looking for something for my DD to use for reading comprehension, and wanted to make sure I was understanding correctly :-)

[Perogi]

Professor Daniel Willingham has this YouTube video called 'teaching content is teaching reading' I think it's worth the time to watch and to consider the points raised in it. Maybe some help with your quest.

 

 

 

 

Thanks for the link - it was very interesting!

[Perogi]

My second grader has comp issues. We have started taking reading in much smaller segments then I ask her a few questions before continuing. This and me helping her find the answers in the text seems to be helping, not perfect but getting better. I know how you feel though! Evan moor makes reading comp practice books. May be cheaper than a full curriculum.

 

I had done some of that in WWE 2 - reading half of the passage and asking the questions. This time around with WWE 3 I was helping her find the answers in the passage.

 

Many of the reading comp books are comparable to Evan-Moor. I saw the Daily comp one but I don't really want it to be a daily activity in that sense.

[Perogi]

I like the book Reading Rescue 1-2-3 and comprehension exercise materials from Remedia Publications.

 

There was a thread about narration yesterday that might have some tips that would help you as well.

 

Thanks for the recommendations. I was reading again in TWTM about narration. Today's dictation was awful too.

[Perogi]

Just a couple of questions...Is your dd having problems recalling what she read or what you read to her? And do you give her time to digest it and discuss later? One of my sons used to recall information much better after having heard it, especially when listening to audio books. Another son simply cannot narrate back to me immediately after reading. It seems to be more of a thought organization issue than comprehension. He needs time to think about it.

 

The issue seems to be present whether she reads to herself or hears the passage read. In WWE 2 I was reading to her and she was struggling. I was hoping that with reading the passage to herself in WWE 3 I'd see improvement.

 

I'm asking the questions right after we read the passage.

 

The comp issues don't seem to be as severe when she's reading a book or I'm reading a book to her. It's these passages for which she doesn't have a lot of context or investment in the story that she's struggling the most with. I think, anyway. Maybe there are a lot of details that she's missing in her readers and RA's...we tend to discuss the bigger points of the story, not so much asking her to recall specific details.

[Medieval Mom]

Medieval Mom,

Sorry if the answer to this is obvious, but are you just using the "reading" curriculum lessons from CLE for his grade level? I am looking for something for my DD to use for reading comprehension, and wanted to make sure I was understanding correctly :-)

 

Yep. We've done other subjects in the past, but right now we're just using CLE Reading.

 

Next year, it's just 5 Light Units, so we'll schedule it 3x/wk. This year, in third, it's daily.

 

HTH!

[Perogi]

These were my concerns exactly. Ds doesn't always relish MORE work, especially workbooks. He'd really rather read, build with Legos, or play! But he LOVES his CLE Reading. He's even memorized several of the poems included. :)

 

Like I said earlier, it's always the first thing I'm tempted to cut (mostly, because I love our McGuffey Readers-- we now use those for the "Oral Reading Class" portion of CLE). Nevertheless, I know the program covers (in one course) so much that I might otherwise miss, especially in our streamlined approach. In other words, I find that this year and next, I am actually able to streamline our LA *because* we are including CLE Reading.

 

Caveat: We're not Mennonites, and we don't agree 100% with everything written in the program. Once and a while, ds will come to me with a frown. Once, he said, "They say there's no such thing as luck. I don't believe that." Actually, that made for a very good conversation. For several days, and with several people, we talked about the concept of Luck; what we believed, how we defined "luck", whether we "make our own luck", whether luck is really God smiling on us, etc. For other questions or answers he/we may not agree with, we cross them out, discuss them, etc. It's good to know that people believe and think differently in this world. What I DO like about this program is that it make ds THINK, really THINK-- not only about his answer, but also about his THOUGHTS, beliefs, life.

 

In other words, for us, CLE Reading is FAR more than "Reading Comp.", and really doesn't take long every day to accomplish all that it does.

 

The Scope and Sequence for CLE Reading can be found here.

 

You're very convincing! ;) I took a look at the samples last night and really thought it looked very good. Today dd bombed a bit talking to me about her latest reader so I think it's something I need to seriously consider.

 

Do you think we'd be okay to jump in with gr. 4 or should I go with gr. 3? I know that their math can be ahead of other curriculums and just wonder if the gr. 4 would be too difficult? Her reading abilities are very high, it's the comprehension alone that is suffering.

[Medieval Mom]

You're very convincing! ;) I took a look at the samples last night and really thought it looked very good. Today dd bombed a bit talking to me about her latest reader so I think it's something I need to seriously consider.

 

Do you think we'd be okay to jump in with gr. 4 or should I go with gr. 3? I know that their math can be ahead of other curriculums and just wonder if the gr. 4 would be too difficult? Her reading abilities are very high, it's the comprehension alone that is suffering.

 

I'd give Grade 4 a try. With anything, getting used to a new program may take some time. I think that jumping into higher levels might pose a problem for some children, but I think that jumping in to 4 would be fine. Grade 4 is where CLE starts introducing literary terms and such. In fact, many on this board have expressed that they just have their dc read the readers for Grades 1-3, then begin with the L.U.s in 4th. I honestly think it'll be fine!

 

Ds will once and a while mark a question with ????? When I look through his work and ask him about it, he may pout and say, "I DON'T KNOW!!!" Often, he's over-thinking the answer. Or, he's being too lazy to look things up. We take a big breath, and work through it together. :)

 

Once, he said, "I don't like looking things up!" (Glossary words.) I cheerfully replied, "Well, you better practice, because you'll be looking things up for the rest of your life! Now's your chance to become really good at it!" With lots of smiles and enthusiasm. Think Dale Carnegie! (It worked!) :svengo:

 

At any rate, I'd expect at first to need to be near her and help her. But CLE Reading *can* be as independent as you'd like it to be. Sometimes, I'm rather involved. Frankly, my ds prefers now to do his CLE Reading rather independently, coming to me for my opinion or help with sticky questions.

 

Just a note-- You can decide whether you want to have your dd memorize all the Bible quotes. We used to, but have recently dropped it. I just x off those portions of the quizzes and tests.

[Hunter]

I've been using the McCall Splading books for a little bit, and am only now learning how to use them "right". Even just using them open-and-go and not applying all the added information in the new WRTR, I have found them more useful than any other reading comprehension textbook I have ever used in the past. There are videos now modeling how to fully implement these workbooks.

 

I've been refraining from posting, because I haven't been using these long enough or correctly enough to give advice, but...I thought it best just to provide you some links, as I don't see you getting a wide variety of ideas to choose from, with all the pros and cons listed.

 

Good Luck! :-)

[Perogi]

I'd give Grade 4 a try. With anything, getting used to a new program may take some time. I think that jumping into higher levels might pose a problem for some children, but I think that jumping in to 4 would be fine. Grade 4 is where CLE starts introducing literary terms and such. In fact, many on this board have expressed that they just have their dc read the readers for Grades 1-3, then begin with the L.U.s in 4th. I honestly think it'll be fine!

 

Ds will once and a while mark a question with ????? When I look through his work and ask him about it, he may pout and say, "I DON'T KNOW!!!" Often, he's over-thinking the answer. Or, he's being too lazy to look things up. We take a big breath, and work through it together. :)

 

Once, he said, "I don't like looking things up!" (Glossary words.) I cheerfully replied, "Well, you better practice, because you'll be looking things up for the rest of your life! Now's your chance to become really good at it!" With lots of smiles and enthusiasm. Think Dale Carnegie! (It worked!) :svengo:

 

At any rate, I'd expect at first to need to be near her and help her. But CLE Reading *can* be as independent as you'd like it to be. Sometimes, I'm rather involved. Frankly, my ds prefers now to do his CLE Reading rather independently, coming to me for my opinion or help with sticky questions.

 

Just a note-- You can decide whether you want to have your dd memorize all the Bible quotes. We used to, but have recently dropped it. I just x off those portions of the quizzes and tests.

 

Yes, looking at the gr. 3 samples this afternoon I thought it looked a bit too mechanical still whereas the gr. 4 was more focused on the comprehension/vocabulary and got beyond the phonics and such. Really, for the cost it's probably worth a shot. I do really, really like the gr. 2 readers that my other dd has been using this year. We're not Mennonite either but I've found the reader to be very gentle and not really pushing Mennonite theology. We won't bother with the Scripture memorization because we're doing other stuff as a family.

 

I was hoping I could kill 2 birds with one stone using their Bible curriculum because of the comprehension questions there but I think dd's too familiar with the gospel stories for it to be effective the way I'd want it to be. She wouldn't necessarily be looking at the passage for the answers.

 

Thanks again for your help!

Edited April 5, 2012 by Perogi

[Perogi]

I've been using the McCall Splading books for a little bit, and am only now learning how to use them "right". Even just using them open-and-go and not applying all the added information in the new WRTR, I have found them more useful than any other reading comprehension textbook I have ever used in the past. There are videos now modeling how to fully implement these workbooks.

 

I've been refraining from posting, because I haven't been using these long enough or correctly enough to give advice, but...I thought it best just to provide you some links, as I don't see you getting a wide variety of ideas to choose from, with all the pros and cons listed.

 

Good Luck! :-)

 

I'll look into that as well, thank you.

 

Maybe there just aren't a lot of people doing specific reading comp. programs??

[Perogi]

Like I said earlier, it's always the first thing I'm tempted to cut (mostly, because I love our McGuffey Readers-- we now use those for the "Oral Reading Class" portion of CLE). Nevertheless, I know the program covers (in one course) so much that I might otherwise miss, especially in our streamlined approach. In other words, I find that this year and next, I am actually able to streamline our LA *because* we are including CLE Reading.

 

.

 

I'm looking into the McGuffey readers now as well...thinking I could put them on my Kindle - for free!

[Hunter]

I'll look into that as well, thank you.

 

Maybe there just aren't a lot of people doing specific reading comp. programs??

 

I think you are right about that. Most people think of reading as decoding/phonics skills. Then they move onto literature appreciation. Most kids just create a smattering of their own reading strategies and muddle through.

 

I really want to learn, and then be able to teach a comprehensive set of reading comprehension strategies, to the students I tutor.

 

I was never taught anything like the below objectives, so for a long time I didn't know I was supposed to look for anything like this :-0

 

Reading lesson objectives

Literary appreciation: precise language, emotional appeal, content, insight, universality

Fluency: intonation, expression, accuracy, proper expression, and speed

Text structure: Narrative, informative, narrative-informative

Listening and reading comprehension strategies: monitoring comprehension, predicting, connecting, reformatting, summarizing.

[besroma]

I bought the gr 2 readers for dd6yo this year and we've really enjoyed them and have seen them have a positive impact on her. I was toying with buying the gr 4 reader anyway for next year. I am also getting their Bible course for my 3rd grader - I did wonder if that would be enough for reading comp?? I'm going to take a closer look at all the samples tonight.

 

We have the CLE readers, but not the workbooks. I have read many posts of parents (and kids) really liking the workbooks.

 

I'm not sure if this would be what you are looking for in terms of content, but the R&S reading series is excellent for reading comprehension. My children's retention of what they have learned has surprised me.