Unmotivated student

[Quiver0f10]

My 12 yo son is unmotivated. Pretty much all he wants to do is play on his computer or the Xbox, which I limit. He doesn't put any effort into school; he rushes in hopes that he can play. When I sit down to read aloud, whether it's history, science, read aloud etc. he will say a something like oh great reading time. I don't have him doing any written work in these subjects. We just discuss orally. Science experiment we do in a group. He doesn't enjoy coloring, drawling or art projects. Every single subject we do is met with an attitude of " can we just get this finished so I can play." Edited to add: he does do the work without question, it's just that attitude of not enjoying it and wanting to just finish it so he can move on that I would ove to change if possible.

 

I don't even know what to ask here. How do I motivate him?

Edited April 4, 2012 by Quiver0f10

[PeterPan]

I see he's doing Barton. Is this also the ds that you were checking into VT for? VT changed our lives. It's really hard to enjoy school when things aren't going well. :(

 

I would probably limit the video time a bit, but really I'd focus on figuring out what's going wrong (eyes, needs a neuropsych eval and meds, whatever) that's holding him back. He sounds frustrated, not like he's BAD, kwim? My 12 (almost 13) yo would be bored stiff and saying life sucks too if she had to sit through read alouds and group work like that. It's sort of a young way to work for a kid who's hitting puberty, kwim? Not faulting you, just saying I got that same I hate school thing for years, and the big transition for us was (well VT for a foundation) then having her not work with me, giving her a clear checklist, changing all her materials to things that COULD be done independently and that were highly engaging (online VP history, TT math), an outside activity she adores (yearbook, gave her something to look forward to and little things to keep up with each day that were part of it). They just have to find ways to grow up that fit with who they really are, not what the rest of the group is or what we wanted for them.

 

Does he have anything he enjoys with his hands? Fixing things? Do you have anything physical he can do like raise a duck or garden or something? Can you hook him up with a man to work with on Saturdays doing something physical?

 

I know you're trying hard. Really though, VT was the turning point for us. It ridded up blocks that were holding her back, and then she started to blossom and could do all these things. If you're saying yeah but not my kid, then I'd back up and look for what that physical block is. I agree with Andrew Pudewa that kids WANT to please us and be happy and do well, and when they CAN, they WILL.

[Quiver0f10]

I see he's doing Barton. Is this also the ds that you were checking into VT for? VT changed our lives. It's really hard to enjoy school when things aren't going well. :(

 

I would probably limit the video time a bit, but really I'd focus on figuring out what's going wrong (eyes, needs a neuropsych eval and meds, whatever) that's holding him back. He sounds frustrated, not like he's BAD, kwim? My 12 (almost 13) yo would be bored stiff and saying life sucks too if she had to sit through read alouds and group work like that. It's sort of a young way to work for a kid who's hitting puberty, kwim? Not faulting you, just saying I got that same I hate school thing for years, and the big transition for us was (well VT for a foundation) then having her not work with me, giving her a clear checklist, changing all her materials to things that COULD be done independently and that were highly engaging (online VP history, TT math), an outside activity she adores (yearbook, gave her something to look forward to and little things to keep up with each day that were part of it). They just have to find ways to grow up that fit with who they really are, not what the rest of the group is or what we wanted for them.

 

Does he have anything he enjoys with his hands? Fixing things? Do you have anything physical he can do like raise a duck or garden or something? Can you hook him up with a man to work with on Saturdays doing something physical?

 

I know you're trying hard. Really though, VT was the turning point for us. It ridded up blocks that were holding her back, and then she started to blossom and could do all these things. If you're saying yeah but not my kid, then I'd back up and look for what that physical block is. I agree with Andrew Pudewa that kids WANT to please us and be happy and do well, and when they CAN, they WILL.

 

Thank you. He already finished almost a year of VT. He had a neuropsych eval done and receives OT, PT ( finished ST and VT) He is on medication for a seizure disorder. I was looking into it for my 7 year old. I do limit the screen time already because that is alll he would do if I allowed it.

 

I hear what you are saying about working with the others in a group and I need to think on that. He can read now, maybe a 4th grade level, but it's so slow, which is why I am reading all his work aloud. The only thing he does independently is math ( MUS). I would love for him to work more independently in some subjects so maybe that is an area I should be focusing on. I was going to post on the general board @ burnout because I am doing so many teacher intensive programs with a few kids having various LD. Having him move towards independence in some areas would be a life saver for me right now.

 

He recently joined the Civil Air Patrol and enjoys that, but I'd love to find something else that he enjoys too. So far nothing has ignited that spark.

Edited April 4, 2012 by Quiver0f10

[BrandieRose]

I had a similar issue with my oldest son. I was pretty sure he was the world's worst dawdler and an attitude case on top of it. He was taking about five hours to finish one math lesson (with a scowl on his face the whole time) and then getting half the questions wrong. He was often up till eleven doing work. Now he finishes his math in about an hour and gets A's and B's. He's still a "high needs" kid, but we're moving forward now. Here are some ideas that have helped him.

 

I bought the book "Raising Real Men". A homeschooling family who taught their six boys through high school wrote it. They suggested adding competition into the school day. My boys now compete to finish math. Whoever finishes first with a B or above gets a small reward and a lot of honor. I was suprised at how much this helped.

 

We keep dad on skype all day so he can be a part of our homeschool day. I've found my boys care more about his approval than mine.

 

I also realized that in an effort to make everyone happy I had dumbed down our curriculum a little. This caused two problems. One, my son was being rewarded for doing badly, and he realized it. Bad attitudes equaled less work. Two, he was in a no-win situation. If he did well, there was no honor in it. He wasn't proud of himself.

 

I also found my boys do better if they are in charge of their own day. I make out a weekly schedule with them, and then leave them alone. No nagging. If they're not done with their work by 3:00, no video games, etc... and they're not allowed out of their seat or to talk until their done. Oh, and "being done" includes correcting wrong answers. If I get upset with him, he wins because he had the power to make me upset. So, I try to be very sad for him and matter of fact. I also go out of my way to hug, encourage, compliment him throughout the day.

 

 

I feel funny writing these suggestions since your kids are older than mine, but it's hard to find advice online on this topic. I highly recommend the book "Raising Real Men", "Future Men", "Preparing Sons" and "Created for Work". They've all been helpful to me in different ways.

 

Hope things get easier!

 

-Brandie

[Quiver0f10]

Thanks,I will look for the book.

[Trilliums]

..............., an outside activity she adores (yearbook, gave her something to look forward to and little things to keep up with each day that were part of it).

 

Don't mean to hijack, but could you describe her yearbook project a bit?

 

:bigear:

[PeterPan]

Don't mean to hijack, but could you describe her yearbook project a bit?

 

:bigear:

 

It's through a co-op, and they do the traditional school approach (Balfour, online editing, blah blah). It's been very involved, and she LOVES it. I'm not sure what we'll do next year. Her teacher wants her to continue obviously. We'll see.

[PeterPan]

Oh Quiver, you work SO hard... I'm sorry you're feeling burnt out. I think when you hit that point, it's ok to do something less than you think *ideal* on things that are not skills. It might even be ok for skills for a little while, but definitely for content stuff. Like if history goes to something online or workbooky (not for this child, some of the others) or whatever next year, that's ok. You can't do everything perfectly. The important thing is the skills, and it sounds like you're pouring yourself into that.

 

Do you school year-round? Can you pause some of those things and come back to them later? Like maybe doing FLL3 now and save IEW for the summer?

 

Does he have a personality trait or interest you can hone into with some tailored assignments or projects? For instance I wrote you in a pm about the interesting, quirky articles in Muse magazine. It will be at your library, or at least it is ours. Or if he likes the computer so much, MAKE UP some encompassing, time consuming project to engross him. I think you're onto something that you want him to be engaged and doing something. It doesn't have to be regular academics to get the growth that engagement and work provides, kwim? Like it could be he sets you up a database for something or learns to write apps for apple or android. (I've heard writing apps is easy for apple products?) Around here the fair is kind of motivating. You can look at the listings and categories to see if there's anything he'd like to enter. That would then become very engaging and work that would give him that maturing and focus without it being academics, kwim? At least for our fair they have all kinds of nifty categories for kids. Or a kit for some kind of woodworking or a model. Or be crass and set him up with some task and a monetary reward. ($1 for each wpm every month where your typing improves by 5 wpm, that's the deal in our house.) Some kids speak the language of money. I probably owe my dd something really nice by now, lol. She keeps making the money notations on her checklist. :D

 

I know someone who built a small woodshed for their boy so he could do things with his hands, the one thing he's really, really good at.

 

You've had other kids go through the puberty thing too. Everybody says they become human at 14. Do think that's also part of what you're seeing?

[Trilliums]

Thank you OhElizabeth. Sounds like a good fit for your daughter. :)

 

I read this post because I have a DS 13 who is also sometimes hard to motivate. His activity level and self motivation fluctuate. He goes through periods of not wanting to do much and then other periods of time with a lot of ideas. I was beginning to wonder what kind of activities I could try to get him involved in last week.

 

Just now, I came back from taking older DS to classes, and younger DS asked if he could make a duct tape hammock! Plus, he showed me how he set up his 3DS to take time lapse photos of some seeds we started a few days ago.

 

If he enjoys computers, you might look into Game Maker, a free video game design program. It is icon based so they do not need to know how to write script. But, it does help develop some of the logic based thinking needed for programming. The library had a book of projects and games to make which DS enjoyed immensely.

[MomatHWTK]

I have my oldest do a lot of online interactive work. It was $ compared to what I usually choose for curricula and I'm still trying to decide whether to continue, but it does work really well for him.

[PeterPan]

I think the main thing with the online stuff is to watch samples and see if it has little checks to make sure they're attending (as in paying attention) or if they can zone out. Some of the live classes people are doing online don't have a video component. And some videos just have the most boring speakers. The ones that are working particularly well for us both have interaction (push a button for it to continue, play a game here, etc.). It can't just go on and on with them zoned out. Just something to watch. We're also doing Chem 101 (told you we're doing a lot independently this year!), and that doesn't have the little checks or anything to do during it. However it's really interesting to her, as he talks a lot about history. She takes notes while she listens, not something I asked her to do.

[Quiver0f10]

Oh Quiver, you work SO hard... I'm sorry you're feeling burnt out. I think when you hit that point, it's ok to do something less than you think *ideal* on things that are not skills. It might even be ok for skills for a little while, but definitely for content stuff. Like if history goes to something online or workbooky (not for this child, some of the others) or whatever next year, that's ok. You can't do everything perfectly. The important thing is the skills, and it sounds like you're pouring yourself into that.

 

Do you school year-round? Can you pause some of those things and come back to them later? Like maybe doing FLL3 now and save IEW for the summer?

 

Does he have a personality trait or interest you can hone into with some tailored assignments or projects? For instance I wrote you in a pm about the interesting, quirky articles in Muse magazine. It will be at your library, or at least it is ours. Or if he likes the computer so much, MAKE UP some encompassing, time consuming project to engross him. I think you're onto something that you want him to be engaged and doing something. It doesn't have to be regular academics to get the growth that engagement and work provides, kwim? Like it could be he sets you up a database for something or learns to write apps for apple or android. (I've heard writing apps is easy for apple products?) Around here the fair is kind of motivating. You can look at the listings and categories to see if there's anything he'd like to enter. That would then become very engaging and work that would give him that maturing and focus without it being academics, kwim? At least for our fair they have all kinds of nifty categories for kids. Or a kit for some kind of woodworking or a model. Or be crass and set him up with some task and a monetary reward. ($1 for each wpm every month where your typing improves by 5 wpm, that's the deal in our house.) Some kids speak the language of money. I probably owe my dd something really nice by now, lol. She keeps making the money notations on her checklist. :D

 

I know someone who built a small woodshed for their boy so he could do things with his hands, the one thing he's really, really good at.

 

You've had other kids go through the puberty thing too. Everybody says they become human at 14. Do think that's also part of what you're seeing?

 

We do some work year round and he definitely needs it, so spreading thigns out a bit is a possibility.

 

He really does enjoy the computer so maybe I should try to work towards finding something he could do with that. My Dh is a computer geek so he could help here.

 

I am going to look into the fair and see what they have that might interest him. He mentioned today that he wants to start a dog walking business in our neighborhood so we are going to work on fliers later.

 

Thank you , Elizabeth, you have me thinking!

[Quiver0f10]

Thank you OhElizabeth. Sounds like a good fit for your daughter. :)

 

I read this post because I have a DS 13 who is also sometimes hard to motivate. His activity level and self motivation fluctuate. He goes through periods of not wanting to do much and then other periods of time with a lot of ideas. I was beginning to wonder what kind of activities I could try to get him involved in last week.

 

Just now, I came back from taking older DS to classes, and younger DS asked if he could make a duct tape hammock! Plus, he showed me how he set up his 3DS to take time lapse photos of some seeds we started a few days ago.

 

If he enjoys computers, you might look into Game Maker, a free video game design program. It is icon based so they do not need to know how to write script. But, it does help develop some of the logic based thinking needed for programming. The library had a book of projects and games to make which DS enjoyed immensely.

 

This sounds fun! I bet my other boys would enjoy it too!

[Quiver0f10]

I think the main thing with the online stuff is to watch samples and see if it has little checks to make sure they're attending (as in paying attention) or if they can zone out. Some of the live classes people are doing online don't have a video component. And some videos just have the most boring speakers. The ones that are working particularly well for us both have interaction (push a button for it to continue, play a game here, etc.). It can't just go on and on with them zoned out. Just something to watch. We're also doing Chem 101 (told you we're doing a lot independently this year!), and that doesn't have the little checks or anything to do during it. However it's really interesting to her, as he talks a lot about history. She takes notes while she listens, not something I asked her to do.

 

Yes, I agree and I was looking at one today that I liked but it didn't have an audio portion so it wouldn't work for him.

[PrincessAriel]

nt

[PeterPan]

What a fun idea to start your together time with games! Thanks for sharing that, momofc&a! :)

 

Quiver, the VP history is largely with audio. There are teachers in costume teaching the lesson. The main reading will be for the games, and that will be limited to straightforward questions and multiple choice answers. (In what year was Augustine born? and then it gives 4 choices, that kind of thing)

 

I'll be interested to hear what other cool stuff you find. It definitely sounds like you're on the right track! And your son sounds very self-intuitive to have figured out that something like a dog-walking business would be so good for him. I'd DEFINITELY pursue that. :)

[mcconnellboys]

We make x-box, etc. go away for extended periods of time when attitudes get bad.

[Quiver0f10]

I don't know if this is what you are looking for, but I have an almost 13yo ds who is pretty unmotivated most of the time but loves his video games, etc. He is seeing a therapist for some other issues but when I met with her recently, she recommended that I play games with him, let him win at times, let him feel successful. She said he NEEDS to win at something (school is hard for him). I hate to admit but I am not a game player, especially a video game player.

 

He has a REALLY hard time getting up and getting going in the mornings. She suggested that I tell him that if he is up and ready by a certain time, that I would play, or have HIM teach me to play a video game for a certain amount of time. She predicted he would probably be up early, have all his chores done and be waiting for me. She was so right!! We did it a few days but have kind of gotten off track again. He did all his morning routine really fast those days. We did play before beginning school time which was SO out of the box for me but she said he needed it, and that sometimes that was more important than getting school started. Plus he could teach ME something that is hard for me, which is so true! I don't enjoy video games, they are too fast for me, too much to handle at a time, my eyes actually burn! I was really impressed with his multitasking when playing these games.

She said these kids get so down from all the testing, being poked and prodded in a way, struggling with school, that they need to feel good about something. They need us to know how THEY feel much of the time.

 

Your post is a reminder for me to get back to it again, in spite of how much I want to squirm out of it.;)

 

What a fun idea! Thanks!

 

What a fun idea to start your together time with games! Thanks for sharing that, momofc&a! :)

 

Quiver, the VP history is largely with audio. There are teachers in costume teaching the lesson. The main reading will be for the games, and that will be limited to straightforward questions and multiple choice answers. (In what year was Augustine born? and then it gives 4 choices, that kind of thing)

 

I'll be interested to hear what other cool stuff you find. It definitely sounds like you're on the right track! And your son sounds very self-intuitive to have figured out that something like a dog-walking business would be so good for him. I'd DEFINITELY pursue that. :)

 

Thanks again!

[Gingerbread Mama]

We make x-box, etc. go away for extended periods of time when attitudes get bad.

 

:iagree: Yes, we are in the midst of that here. I realized my 12 year old had become an absolute addict. He would be on that system before his eyes were even good and open in the mornings, he wouldn't talk about anything else, he was talking about the people he played on LIVE with as though he had a real, person to person relationship with them (and he was calling them by their screen names.... Shadow Eater said blah, blah, blah..) He would play and play and play until I *made* him get off. That was always a fight, always ugly. One day I decided to see how long he'd go before he got off of his own accord. SEVEN HOURS straight!! That was when I pulled the plug. I took the whole thing away - no cords/systems/games/controllers out anywhere. The reason for this is that, if it was visible, he wasn't going to think about anything else. Period. I'll be honest and tell you it was h@!! on Earth at first. The night I took it away he was crying and tearing at his hair. He went through weeks (WEEKS) of mood swings where he would one minute tell me he was really going to DO something else, then the next minute he would ask if he could please, please have it back just for ONE DAY, then he would become irrate when I said no. To me, this just strengthened my resolve - this was the behavior of an addict going through withdrawal. That was in mid February and, I would say, the last couple of weeks have finally started to show some improvement. He is reading now, which he steadfastly refused to even consider before. He isn't a voracious reader, he isn't reading on grade level, but he IS reading chapter books and appears to be enjoying them. His attitude is better, as well. He is less sullen and more helpful to his siblings. I'm not at all sure that we will EVER re-integrate the XBOX into our lives. If we do, it will be a ways off and it will be very limited (if I have anything to say about it, his dad thinks it's all ridiculous and is somewhat of a video/tv addict himself.)

 

Anyway, all that to say - BTDT. I took the whole kit and caboodle away and it has made a drastic improvement. Not that he is where I want him to be completely, but he is at least on the road there.