forgetting simple things

[choirfarm]

If my child does not go over EVERYTHING daily, she forgets... UGGGGGGG She has embarrassed several times lately.. How many days are in a week? Ummm 5... How many weeks are in a month... 5??

 

She is 10!!!!!!! I remember in 2nd or 3rd grade having her recite things that with FLL ( I think or maybe it was Saxon) 7 days in a week, 365 days a year, etc.

 

What is 1500 plus 1000. I don't know, I have to write it down??? Ok, in the fall we spent weeks adding theses kind of things in our head.

 

What is a verb? Person, place or thing... :banghead::banghead::banghead:

 

You would think I am not teaching her anything!!!!!! So frustrating..

[Pen]

All of us tend to forget things that are not in use. If it seems extreme to you--beyond what you expect for the circumstances--try the Special Needs forum, there could be some learning disability. :grouphug:

[NotAVampireLvr]

If my child does not go over EVERYTHING daily, she forgets... UGGGGGGG She has embarrassed several times lately.. How many days are in a week? Ummm 5... How many weeks are in a month... 5??

 

She is 10!!!!!!! I remember in 2nd or 3rd grade having her recite things that with FLL ( I think or maybe it was Saxon) 7 days in a week, 365 days a year, etc.

 

What is 1500 plus 1000. I don't know, I have to write it down??? Ok, in the fall we spent weeks adding theses kind of things in our head.

 

What is a verb? Person, place or thing... :banghead::banghead::banghead:

 

You would think I am not teaching her anything!!!!!! So frustrating..

 

Is someone quizzing her? Or is it just you? I ask because you use the word "embarrassed" but I'm not quite sure what you're getting at... embarrassed you... herself??

 

If someone is quizzing her it could just be that the pressure to perform has gotten the best of her.

[EMS83]

I second the "who is quizzing her" question. My DD gets shy when people ask her questions. And if it is someone else, they really shouldn't be quizzing her randomly. We don't go into random classrooms and start asking a bunch of questions of the students; no one should be doing that to our children. I tell my kids and others that it's not my children's job to perform for people.

 

If you're just trying to review with her... I'm not sure. I know my DD is afraid of not being able to answer, so she'll just throw things out there rather than simply say she doesn't know or doesn't remember. Maybe just take notes on what she doesn't remember and have a review/drill day a couple times a month? I haven't crossed that bridge so maybe someone else who has will have some solid advice.

[threeofakind]

I realized this year my son does better with a mastery type of curriculum- rather than spiral. He would 'forget' things too but now things are getting better as we use a different approach.

 

How about her learning style- is it all oral that is being asked of her- I too learned my son does better with hands on and written versus oral. Perhaps a combination of 2 learning styles would work for her- kinesthetic, auditory or visual?

 

She reminds me of my son who is 9, and with the adjustments he's better- so maybe consider those factors if you haven't already. I think my learning style was so different from his I didn't catch on and realize his were so different for awhile! Good luck!! :001_smile:

[choirfarm]

It is just family.. we re riding home from church and discussing that a missionary that my husband worked with is coming here to shadow him and will be staying with us. My middle son is giving up his room and asked how long and we said May 1-18th. He said, "Oh I thought you said it would be a month." My husband said more like 2 1/2 weeks. My daughter piped up and said, "How long is a month.. isn't it 5 weeks?"

 

I can't remember what we were trying to figure out in the kitchen but it was a real life math problem and my husband asked her that problem... Deer in the headlights look.

 

The verb question happened with R & S 4....

 

Her spelling is horrible and she doesn't write much because of it. She went on a father/daughter retreat and she had to write him a letter. It was full of misspellings. I tried phonics zoo and it was a disaster so we started AAS in January. She hates it and says they are all baby words. We flew through level one. I was going to post here and ask about a couple of problems she has with level two so far. She is getting most of it and she can recite the rules ( as well as all the rules fromlevel 3. We already did this with Saxon phonics.. She can tell me the rules!!!!) But for a word like begin she will spell it bigin because that is the way she says it. She doesn't pronounce it beegin she says it like a short i and so spells it that way. Same thing for magnet..she will spell it magnit. Or she will spell until like untill ( which is the rule, right... that you double s, l or f) Becus... Sigh. Homophones are the death of her. That was the phonics zoo lesson we could never, ever get past. I tried everything.. I have gone over there, their and they're till I am blue in the face and she cannot grasp it.

 

If I have her orally narrate something she can do it beautifully. She cannot write it. For cursive, she can copy it beautifully if she is copying a cursive example. She cannot write it from printing. She says she cannot remember how to form the letters.

 

BUT... she can memorize anything.. She loves music and can play a lot after she hears it. She gave a fabulous speech about Gettysburg for her speech class at co-op and memorized the most of the Gettysburg Address for the beginning and end of the speech that told about the battle. She never even used her notes. She has been in lots of plays and is always the first one to have her lines memorized. When she was 4 or 5.. ( long time ago) she had been listening to Oddyssey in her room. I guess it was the history series. We were driving by the theater downtown and she asked me, " Mom, if Lincoln was shot by John Wilkes Booth in Ford's Theater, what movie were they watching?" Which led to a discussion of the difference between a play and a movie. We were not even studying that. She remembered that fact from the radio theater program she had been listening to in her room.

 

Althought she had trouble learning to read and we did vision therapy, she now reads beautifully anything I put in front of her and with expression!!! She did a reader's theater piece Sunday in front of church and you could hear her in the back and she read everything perfectly and with great expression. She is doing another reader's theater in speech and has a main part because she does so well..

 

In some ways she is brilliant and in some ways her brothers are always making "blond" jokes because of the things she doesn't know..... I feel like it reflects badly on me at church or in front of my husband. People are not quizzing her. It just happens in regular conversations...

[choirfarm]

Has she done problems where she has to use the facts that she has memorized? That tends to move facts from short term to long term memory.

 

For now, post the family calendar in the bathroom where she can look at it and think....

 

 

As far as the top question I'm not sure what you are asking..math?? We did FLL for several years where you recited the definitions. We are doing R & S 4 right now. She was sick off and on over the last few weeks, so we didn't do it for awhile. She was trying to diagram sentences with either a direct object or a predicate nominative and for the first several examples she was picking out nouns for verbs. Once she saw the pattern, she got it again.

 

Yes, we are looking at the calendar and she gets it again now and can now recite all the facts again...that is until I stop doing it and it is summer and she won't know again..

[choirfarm]

bump

[Hunter]

 

In some ways she is brilliant and in some ways her brothers are always making "blond" jokes because of the things she doesn't know..... I feel like it reflects badly on me at church or in front of my husband. People are not quizzing her. It just happens in regular conversations...

 

Blonde jokes are not appropriate for a number of reasons, and should not be tolerated. Mocking and discriminatory comments, are at the very least, a bad habit that needs to be broken, in young men.

 

If you and your daughter are both doing the best you can, with the resources available to you (intrinsic and environmental), then the level she is functioning at, is exactly where she is supposed to be right now, and shouldn't be compared to others.

 

It sounds like she is making steady progress and that you are both working hard. I'm not concerned with her progress, but more with how the people in your lives are treating both of you, and your reaction to the way you are being treated.

 

Also, the level our children function at is not always reflective of our teaching skills. Our children have personalities, gifts and disabilities; and are affected by their environments. Sometimes they excel and fail, for reasons entirely unconnected from their teachers.

 

It's a boundary violation for a child's performance to be entirely attributed to a parent or teacher or coach. Child and parent/teacher/coach are separate individuals. One does not exist to serve the other.

 

Your daughter's performance sounds fine. On the other hand, it sounds to me like both you and she are being subjected to some emotional abuse, and that isn't fair or acceptable. Just because we have been conditioned that emotional abuse is normal and acceptable doesn't make it so.

 

You have a right to expect your church, husband and sons to treat your daughter and you, with dignity and acceptance and compassion, and sometimes even assistance when they see a struggle.

[choirfarm]

make it so.

 

You have a right to expect your church, husband and sons to treat your daughter and you, with dignity and acceptance and compassion, and sometimes even assistance when they see a struggle.

 

 

Oh my goodness where in the world do you get this???? I am the only homeschooler in my church and NO ONE and I mean NO one has ever criticized me. In fact, they are always telling me what a good job I'm doing and that they could never do it.. An older lady in my church just took me aside and told me that she remembered my decision to pull them out and how hard it was. She said she was so proud of me for sticking through it and said my children were great!!!

 

That said, I feel like I have to prove myself.. I don't want them to think I'm giving a less than stellar education.

 

My husband never, ever talks down to me. HE doesn't do the blond jokes and most of the time the boys don't either. My middle one knows that his sister's IQ is much higher than his and he doesn't understand how she doesn't get simple things..

[Hunter]

I feel bad that I think I have made you feel defensive, or that I might have misunderstood.

 

Why are you so upset about what people are saying or thinking?

 

You do you think you need to provide a stellar education?

 

Really you don't need to prove yourself, and your daughter certainly doesn't need to perform in a manner that proves you.

 

A high IQ doesn't mean a child won't struggle. I think 2E kids are more common than well rounded gifted children. High IQ kids, whether 2E or not, shouldn't have to put up with mocking from lower IQ children, and it's not a habit we want our lower IQ children to acquire. Mocking is emotional abuse. Really it is, even if we have been conditioned to expect it and condone it.

 

I keep rereading both of my posts, and I don't like how I think my tone is coming across. I hate e-mail sometimes when we cannot hear and see the person writing. I cannot seem to get how I feel translated into text. Sigh!

 

I want to give you a big hug, not attack you or put you on the defensive.

[Bula Mama]

I really, really think it would be good to have your dd tested if at all possible for learning issues. Some of the stuff you're saying is sounding familiar, probably exceptional in some ways but struggling in basics in others and forgetting those basics over and over.

 

My ds wasn't evaluated until he was 10 and it was such an eye opener! I was so very glad to finally know what was going on with him and while it was daunting to have a 'diagnosis' it's also good to know now where he needs extra help so he doesn't fall even further behind. I'm glad now because we can give him the best chances possible to work through his extra challenges.

 

I have another dd who is really smart and has no problem with school, yet she often thinks before she speaks so says some pretty silly stuff, too. But, while I'm definitely no expert, that combined with stuff that your dd's not remembering sounds like she could need some specialized help and finding out what that is could be good before she gets any older.

[Pen]

It is just family.. we re riding home from church and discussing that a missionary that my husband worked with is coming here to shadow him and will be staying with us. My middle son is giving up his room and asked how long and we said May 1-18th. He said, "Oh I thought you said it would be a month." My husband said more like 2 1/2 weeks. My daughter piped up and said, "How long is a month.. isn't it 5 weeks?"

 

I can't remember what we were trying to figure out in the kitchen but it was a real life math problem and my husband asked her that problem... Deer in the headlights look.

 

The verb question happened with R & S 4....

 

Her spelling is horrible and she doesn't write much because of it. She went on a father/daughter retreat and she had to write him a letter. It was full of misspellings. I tried phonics zoo and it was a disaster so we started AAS in January. She hates it and says they are all baby words. We flew through level one. I was going to post here and ask about a couple of problems she has with level two so far. She is getting most of it and she can recite the rules ( as well as all the rules fromlevel 3. We already did this with Saxon phonics.. She can tell me the rules!!!!) But for a word like begin she will spell it bigin because that is the way she says it. She doesn't pronounce it beegin she says it like a short i and so spells it that way. Same thing for magnet..she will spell it magnit. Or she will spell until like untill ( which is the rule, right... that you double s, l or f) Becus... Sigh. Homophones are the death of her. That was the phonics zoo lesson we could never, ever get past. I tried everything.. I have gone over there, their and they're till I am blue in the face and she cannot grasp it.

 

If I have her orally narrate something she can do it beautifully. She cannot write it. For cursive, she can copy it beautifully if she is copying a cursive example. She cannot write it from printing. She says she cannot remember how to form the letters.

 

BUT... she can memorize anything.. She loves music and can play a lot after she hears it. She gave a fabulous speech about Gettysburg for her speech class at co-op and memorized the most of the Gettysburg Address for the beginning and end of the speech that told about the battle. She never even used her notes. She has been in lots of plays and is always the first one to have her lines memorized. When she was 4 or 5.. ( long time ago) she had been listening to Oddyssey in her room. I guess it was the history series. We were driving by the theater downtown and she asked me, " Mom, if Lincoln was shot by John Wilkes Booth in Ford's Theater, what movie were they watching?" Which led to a discussion of the difference between a play and a movie. We were not even studying that. She remembered that fact from the radio theater program she had been listening to in her room.

 

Althought she had trouble learning to read and we did vision therapy, she now reads beautifully anything I put in front of her and with expression!!! She did a reader's theater piece Sunday in front of church and you could hear her in the back and she read everything perfectly and with great expression. She is doing another reader's theater in speech and has a main part because she does so well..

 

In some ways she is brilliant and in some ways her brothers are always making "blond" jokes because of the things she doesn't know..... I feel like it reflects badly on me at church or in front of my husband. People are not quizzing her. It just happens in regular conversations...

 

It sounds like there could be a learning disability. But it also sounds like there is probably too much pressure.

 

For example, I like IEW as a writing program because it separates issues of spelling, composing, handwriting, so that a child doesn't have to be performing in all areas at once. For many children that can be too hard.

 

Are you members of the Church mentioned, or are you the pastor's (pardon if I have used a wrong term, I don't know what religion) family and feeling extra watched therefore? It seems like somehow the pressure needs to be lessened (perhaps it is just internal to you), and that perhaps, especially if you are part of the pastor's (or equivalent) family, this could be good role modeling for others in the community who also need to be able to feel less performance pressure.

[Hunter]

How many days are in a week? Ummm 5... How many weeks are in a month... 5??

 

You know what, I just looked at a couple of my calendars.

 

Some of my planners only have 5 days, M-F.

 

My monthly calendar has 5 lines. Sometimes the days of the month even stretch across 6 lines, in some months.

 

As a child, I was a very nervous poll-parrot student. I repeated back what the teacher said and didn't question it, even if what was in front of me did not match what I was being taught.

 

Is part of your daughter's giftedness, keen observation skills? Does she trust her own observations more than her textbooks?

 

My youngest trusted his observations more than textbooks, so often gave "wrong" answers that at first shocked me. I think he taught me as much as I taught him. He taught me not to just repeat what I had been taught.

 

In your daughter's case, there are 5 days in the typical school week, and there are 31 days in March and that is certainly more than 4 weeks.

[EMS83]

2 1/2 x 2 is 5. She may have been associating his comment of 2 1/2 weeks with "half a month." There are actually 4.33 weeks in a month. She's not far off. We have enough weeks in the year to make 13 4-week months, but that's not all nice and even, so...anyway.

 

She sounds fine to me, really. Maybe y'all just need to find what makes things stick in her mind, and it may be an association thing (like 2 1/2 weeks = half a month, therefore 1 month = 5 weeks). I do agree that teasing should be disciplined. And you don't need to prove anything to anyone. A less than stellar education is when the individual is lost in the method. One of the greatest beauties of homeschooling is that we can go at their pace, and approach it the way they best understand it! It's freedom from doing it someone else's way and freedom to do it the way that works for you and that particular child. Will everyone understand that? No. But it doesn't make it less true!

 

Try oral spelling lessons and quizzes and see how that goes. Explain that while people do pronounce things differently sometimes, and that's ok (different spoken dialects of English have their own grammar rules and are considered viable linguistically), there is a standard for of written English that has rules that are not governed by how any one person speaks. But always, always they need to go at their pace. The focus is retention and assimilation of facts. However that need to happen for her is how it should be done. Unfortunately, no one on this board can really tell you the specifics on that front.

[choirfarm]

So.. she read the book Muddy Banks yesterday as part of Texas History. I meant for it to be a book that I read aloud. I read chapter 1 and she proceeded to finish it yesterday. So today I had her write a summary. Are these normal skills for a 4th grader? She hasn't proofread it, but did say she didn't think it was very good because she didn't know how to spell many words:

 

Muddy banks was a slave boy who ran away from his new master. A women him her name was Bethel Banks. She took care of him. She bout him from his new master. Muddy learn how to read and write. He thot abuot running away agin,But he didn't. She gave him his freedom.

 

Sigh.... I have friends at church who teach 4th grade.. This is so low.. My boys papers from 1st grade have better writing than this.

[choirfarm]

 

 

Is part of your daughter's giftedness, keen observation skills? Does she trust her own observations more than her textbooks?

 

QUOTE]

 

 

Yes, when my dad was living with us, he took a ton of pills. She asked him where one of his pills was one day. She noticed it wasn't there!!! ( I'm talking like 15 pills!) She does stuff like that all the time. But then she doesn't notice that her pants aren't zipped.

[AHASRADA]

Oh.My.Word. Your dd sounds *exactly* like mine! Very observant, outgoing, caring and helpful. If anyone can't find anything (keys, socks, you name it) she's the only one who will know where it is. She notices if someone had their hair done and complements them on it. She can straighten up a room in no time flat and can always see the best way for furniture to be arranged, ie: to solve a problem that can be addressed visually or manipulated.

 

She also has the *exact* same academic issues. Anything that is not continually reviewed is lost, or at least buried. If an assignment calls for finding the verb, she might look at me with a blank stare, until I ask her, "What is a verb?" Then the chant from FLL automatically rambles off her tongue at lighting speed, "A verb is a word that does action, shows a state of being, links two words together and helps another verb." Then she can do the assignment. :tongue_smilie:

 

I can't suggest strongly enough to have her tested. It doesn't solve the problem, but it gives you an answer to the "why", so you can stop blaming her, and especially yourself. I was (and still am) sometimes embarrassed by things dd doesn't know or uses the wrong word for, but I know there's a reason. For years, I suspected a problem, but mostly doubted myself, wondering if I really was the problem, I was a bad teacher, she needed to go to school, etc.

 

My dd is severely dyslexic. It sounds like your dd remedied her reading issues, but dyslexia has other symptoms and is hard-wired. All of the strengths and weaknesses I mentioned are symptoms. She may just be a dyslexic who can now read well. Check out Susan Barton's website http://www.dys-add.com/ She has symptoms lists, and will even answer your email with her professional opinion. I sent her a list of dd's symptoms before shelling out the $$ for testing, to see if she thought dyslexia was a possibility. She is very helpful and does not charge for this email advice.

 

Best of luck.

 

 

The special needs board will have tons of suggestions for specific writing programs, etc. that might help. Writing Skills and Megawords come to mind.

[choirfarm]

I e-mailed her so we will see what she says. I'm not sure my husband will go for testing as he thinks she is absolutely normal. He just thinks I need to work on spelling more.