weird question

[ahancock]

OK, here's the deal. I hate to admit it, but I have a daughter that, despite all my efforts, HATES math. I am a huge fan of Saxon, and have successfully used it for the last two years. The problem is that my daughter's hatred of math continues to grow because of the "boring and uncolorful" pages. She is extremely visual, and although I thought that she might "get over it", evidently, this matters to her. Anyway, after doing my research, I came across Horizons math, which has awesome colorful work pages. The problem is that the teacher's manual is horrible, and doesn't efficiently teach the concepts.

 

What my question is: Is there anyone out there that has used Horizons math as their primary math, but used the Saxon book to teach the concepts? Like having the Horizons workbooks as your "spine," as we classical homeschoolers like to call it, and finding the chapter that deals with that concept in the Saxon book in order to teach it. I don't ever even use the Saxon teacher's manuals because the student text does such an awesome job explaining the concept. I just go over it with my daughter. That is why I love Saxon so much, and don't want to give it up. This is a dilemma because I don't want my daughter to continue to hate math. Just looking at the Horizons worksheets excited her. Input please. If any of you have tried this combo, let me know how it worked, please!!

[Mrs Twain]

I haven't used the combination, but I do use Horizons. I think you could use Saxon to teach the concepts, as long as you are following along with the Horizons TM. There is quite a bit of drill work as instructed by the Horizons TM, and I definitely would not skip that. I usually teach the concepts on my dry erase board +/- manipulatives as needed. I don't think it would matter at all if you teach the concepts through Saxon or anything else as long as you are doing the drill, too.

 

I also add in some Singapore workbooks after we finish the year of Horizons, namely the Extra Practice, Challenging Word Problems, and Mental Math workbooks. I think these provide a good complement (as well as summer practice) for Horizons math.

 

HTH a little bit.

[Tarreymere]

I don't have any good advice for you, except that just having to cope with the Saxon teacher's manual made me want to stick a fork in my eye.....I sympathize with your DD. I don't see why you couldn't use the Saxon manual to help you explain the concepts (just please, do not use the word for word scripts if your DD is anything like me, it might put her over the edge of sanity) and then use a more colorful book or look up free colorful worksheets on the web.

My own DD just adored reading the scripts aloud in a very sarcastic voice during the brief time we attempted Saxon. This DD was an advanced reader for her age and she about caused my brain to explode before we ditched Saxon.

 

The Singapore workbooks are more colorful but somehow still annoying, at least to me. Singapore is our latest ditched math curriculum. So right now I am following the Singapore scope and sequence and printing the coolest, most colorful free worksheets off the web that I can find for each concept. This has actually been working really well for both of us.

[NittanyJen]

I started my son in a math book that I absolutely loved to pieces. Talented in math, he quickly hated seeing that book come out. I swallowed my injured pride, and found something else that both teaches solid math and doesn't make him suddenly need a nap, and math is now a pleasant subject for him.

 

Saxon might be a good program, but it isn't the only one. Kids should not get their way on most curriculum choices, in my world, but if something is truly not working, it's not worth forcing yourself to be right. If you'd share how old or what level your daughter is in math, we could help better with some level-appropriate suggestions that might please both of you! In the end, you'll be happier with a daughter who has a solid math background and who neither fears nor loathes math than you will with a daughter who used Saxon just because you liked it!

 

Such things can seem to be tough choices in home schooling when you are in the middle of them!! In retrospect, though, you look back and ask, "What was I so worried about that for??". Well, you worried because you made the first choice with a lot of care and love, and that is hard to let go of. But it is your daughter you love, not your math book.

 

Peace,

 

Jen

http://hillandalefarmschool.blogspot.com/

 

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just go over it with my daughter. That is why I love Saxon so much, and don't want to give it up. This is a dilemma because I don't want my daughter to continue to hate math. Just looking at the Horizons worksheets excited her. Input please. If any of you have tried this combo, let me know how it worked, please!!

[boscopup]

I don't ever even use the Saxon teacher's manuals because the student text does such an awesome job explaining the concept. I just go over it with my daughter. That is why I love Saxon so much, and don't want to give it up. This is a dilemma because I don't want my daughter to continue to hate math. Just looking at the Horizons worksheets excited her. Input please. If any of you have tried this combo, let me know how it worked, please!!

 

There are several math programs that have the teaching in the student text. Have you looked at them to see if any would be a good fit for your DD? Saxon and Horizons are only a couple choices in a vast field of solid math programs for homeschoolers. Some ideas:

 

Math Mammoth

Singapore

Teaching Textbooks

CLE

Math-U-See

 

I'm blanking on more, but there are probably more. :tongue_smilie: All of those are commonly used by folks around here with good results. I think the only one above that you need a TM is Singapore, and the Standards Edition is supposed to have a good TM.

[Ruthie in MS]

:lurk5:

[Tarreymere]

McRuffy came out with a colorful version of their books, but you have to get them from their website. They only go up to fourth grade, I think. My DD will sit and do Math Mammoth on her own without complaint, and I had to mess that up and try Singapore which did NOT go over well. :glare:

Now we are stuck for a while.

[MerryAtHope]

You didn't mention how old your dd is, but levels 4-6 of Horizons have the instructions written to the student in the workbook. (I wish the earlier levels did too!). We used Horizons 1-6 and really liked it. In the earlier levels, I just taught the concepts myself and used Base 10 blocks or other manipulatives to demonstrate when needed. In the upper levels, my kids read the demo or we went over it together.

 

I dont' know how well Saxon and Horizons line up, but I do know that Horizons tends to be advanced--make sure you have her take the placement test before choosing a level if you switch. The color was very important to my kids too (also my youngest loves the riddles & jokes!). It's made a huge difference here in attitude, so I think switching can be worth it.

 

Merry :-)

[Orthodox6]

When I have used Horizons (several times), I never have consulted the teacher manuals. At that level of math, they just aren't needed, other than for checking student answers.

 

As NittanyJen noted, math is a good subject to "match to the student", rather than "match to the teacher". We were fortunate at our house that everybody loathed Saxon, for reasons not pertinent to the thread.

 

Can you borrow a Horizons book for your dd to sample some lessons and see how she likes the program?

 

Other programs are "in colour": Sadlier, for example.

 

I remember reading some homeschool teachers' reviews, across the years, that Horizons math was too distracting to their students because of the colourful, cluttered (in their mind) pages. Is it possible that this is how you are reacting, and possibly another reason why you like Saxon's page layouts? One of my hardest-to-swallow lessons from homeschooling was that student and teacher often have incompatible learning/teaching styles. It can be really difficult to resolve those situations to everybody's satisfaction! :001_smile:

 

P.S. Someone mentioned the differences between Saxon and Horizons in degree of "advanced". Good point. DH and I always found Saxon to be about 1-1/2 years behind grade, and Horizons to match what we had as children.

Edited June 22, 2011 by Orthodox6

[RahRah]

We switched from Saxon to Singapore - for a couple of reasons; first was the death spiral for DS - he hated the constant repetition of concepts he knew cold; second he is a very visual kid and I've learned, really prefers colorful texts, workbooks and other things when we're doing bookwork.

 

The question you may want to ask yourself is, is it just the B&W pages, or is your daughter bored with the work? It took me a couple of weeks to hone in on that DS is bored with the work & spiraling more than anything else.

 

I looked at both Horizons and Singapore and opted to go with Singapore since it doesn't spiral much at all (Horizons does sprial, much less so than Saxon though) and I like the flexibility to supplement or not as needed. I did pick up the Horizons workbooks though and we occasionally will use pages as supplement if I feel DS needs a bit more work on something (in addition to the SM WB, IP and/or CWP).

 

While I don't use the HIG for SM (I'm pretty mathy and feel comfortable not using it at this point), I've read good things about it, so you may want to look into that to use. Also, the SM textbook is very clear (IMO) with detail about how to do the concept, so you may or may not need the HIG.

[Mommy2BeautifulGirls]

This doesn't answer your direct question, but I wanted to chime in to say that my daughter hated Saxon, too. We switched to Math Mammoth and she now loves math. She says it's one of her two favorite subjects.

[momto2Cs]

When we used Saxon Math I gave my kids crayons and colored pencils to make it more colorful.

[ahancock]

By the way, my daughter would be going into Saxon 6/5 if I continued. I have "heard" many people comment on Singapore. I looked at it online and it seems kind of complicated, like a whole different way of learning math kind of thing. We tried MM and the worksheets had a lot of mental math problems--to the point that we dropped it after my daughter cried for 3 straight days. I didn't even know how to teach it, or what the heck they were talking about. I guess that I am pretty comfortable with traditional math, which is why I like Saxon. I don't want to have to learn at 37 how to do math in my head that I can work out on a piece of paper, much less teach my "already frustrated with math daughter" how to do it.

 

So we started out with A Beka. My daughter loved the pages, but it went way too fast. Then we moved to Math Mammoth, hated it. We have been doing Saxon for 2 school years, and that is where we are now. I appreciate every one's input, by the way. Maybe that tidbit of more info will help for those who are chiming in.

[boscopup]

If you didn't understand Math Mammoth, I'd probably not go with Singapore then. ;) It has even more emphasis on mental math.

 

I'd probably look most at Teaching Textbooks or CLE in your case. Both have a reputation of causing kids to like math again. CLE isn't really colorful, but it's not black and white either, IIRC.