Classically Minded Posted May 30, 2011 Share Posted May 30, 2011 We went through AAS 1 and dd7 got a 100 on almost all the written tests. Before we moved on to AAS 2, I wanted to review and had her take some tests of the words in AAS 1. She barely knew any of them! :001_huh: She does Spelling Workout for fun. She is in SWO B and I re-tested her on previous lesson's word lists and she got all the words correct. So why is she remembering ALL the SWO words but not much of AAS? Anyone have any insight on this? :confused: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaydreamingMama Posted May 30, 2011 Share Posted May 30, 2011 :lurk5: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satori Posted May 30, 2011 Share Posted May 30, 2011 Are you doing some review in each lesson? That might prevent a surprise like that when testing after you finish the entire level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Classically Minded Posted May 30, 2011 Author Share Posted May 30, 2011 Are you doing some review in each lesson? That might prevent a surprise like that when testing after you finish the entire level. Yes, we did review before each new lesson that is why I'm wondering HOW could all that not stick? I wonder if maybe the reason SWO is sticking is because she is doing more writing with the words through the activities in each lesson? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satori Posted May 30, 2011 Share Posted May 30, 2011 I barely remember level one, but eventually there is more writing involved. We're doing 12 dictated sentences for each step now and they incorporate lots of review. I also just spend about 5 minutes each lesson having her write old spelling words. It's extremely effective for us. This month we went through the prior two levels of AAS to test on very old words and there were very few that she got wrong. But if another spelling program works better for your daughter, then I'd switch. We also did ETC which has the child write the words a lot and I think that method does help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Classically Minded Posted May 30, 2011 Author Share Posted May 30, 2011 I barely remember level one, but eventually there is more writing involved. We're doing 12 dictated sentences for each step now and they incorporate lots of review. I also just spend about 5 minutes each lesson having her write old spelling words. It's extremely effective for us. This month we went through the prior two levels of AAS to test on very old words and there were very few that she got wrong. But if another spelling program works better for your daughter, then I'd switch. We also did ETC which has the child write the words a lot and I think that method does help. Towards the end of AAS 1 she did start dictation, so we had the sentence practice too. We really love AAS, and I bought the next 4 levels, so I want to continue with it, just wondering if I should review the rules and words for the entire level before going on with AAS 2? We never used ETC, just OPGTR, I know its for phonics but I wonder if it would help her spelling too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OK Family Posted May 30, 2011 Share Posted May 30, 2011 I am not familiar with that spelling curriculum, but when my son was in first, he always got the words right for the test. then later on he barely knew the words. I switched to spelling plus. each day he practices the word and of course the spelling test. The big difference is there is a dictation book that has all the spelling words in it, so he is constantly practicing. Big difference, very happy with his spelling now. I am sure you can do the same without changing curriculum, you would have to come up with the sentences using all the previous words. (this where I found spelling plus to be handy:D) Also spelling plus goes through sixth grade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MerryAtHope Posted May 30, 2011 Share Posted May 30, 2011 Towards the end of AAS 1 she did start dictation, so we had the sentence practice too. We really love AAS, and I bought the next 4 levels, so I want to continue with it, just wondering if I should review the rules and words for the entire level before going on with AAS 2? We never used ETC, just OPGTR, I know its for phonics but I wonder if it would help her spelling too? A few thoughts to consider... Had she had a break in between finishing level 1 and starting level 2? The dictations started in Step 11, so more than half of the book includes dictations--how did she do on the dictations as you went through the book? Did you have her make the words with tiles and write the words both? She may have needed more practice in the individual steps. After finishing a step did you put all of the word cards in the daily review tab for her to review again during the next step? Did you shuffle the cards so they were not just in order? Did you do all of the reinforcement words? Steps 11, 17, and 22 had you review the cards behind the Mastered Tabs--did you do these reviews and she did ok on those? Also for Mastered reviews--did you shuffle all of the word cards so they were not in order? Mixed review is especially important for showing what they have retained. Did you put any cards that she missed during these reviews back in the daily review tab? Do you put any cards that pertain to dictations she misses back into daily review, even if they were considered mastered? When you say she missed a lot of the words when you did this final review--are there any patterns to what she missed (did she miss certain sounds, or are her mistakes more across the board)? It may be that you moved too quickly through the steps and that some of the concepts didn't stick--you may want to do a review of these before continuing on. The first step in Level 2 actually does review a lot of things, but you may need to build on this and work in more depending on your daughter's needs. I have kids who need lots of review, and I actually add to what's in AAS. I do a monthly review of each type of cards with one, and with the other I do 3 weekly reviews inbetween moving a card from daily review to mastered. Oh, another thing--for a card to be mastered, she should be able to answer without correcting herself, and with little or no hesitation. If not, keep it in review awhile longer. Sometimes a card can get moved to review too quickly. What types of mistakes did she make--did she possibly confuse what she learned in Spelling Workout and use patterns she was familiar with in there to spell the AAS words? Maybe slow down the Spelling Workout so that it ends up only reviewing words/concepts she has learned in AAS if possible? Just some thoughts, hopefully something will be helpful. Merry :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Classically Minded Posted May 31, 2011 Author Share Posted May 31, 2011 (edited) Had she had a break in between finishing level 1 and starting level 2? Yes, we did a break but does that matter, shouldn't she know how to spell the words she learned and not forget? The dictations started in Step 11, so more than half of the book includes dictations--how did she do on the dictations as you went through the book? She did really good on the dictations, didn't really miss anything - actually she hardly ever missed a word on a spelling test either, that is what has me so confused. Did you have her make the words with tiles and write the words both? Yes, she spelled all the words with tiles, did all the extra words too in every lesson, the test, the dictation - review, etc. After finishing a step did you put all of the word cards in the daily review tab for her to review again during the next step? Did you shuffle the cards so they were not just in order? I did it like the book taught with the review, she only practiced words she couldn't spell with tiles or got wrong on the test. Did you do all of the reinforcement words? Yes, we did all of them - I didn't want to miss anything lol. Steps 11, 17, and 22 had you review the cards behind the Mastered Tabs--did you do these reviews and she did ok on those? Also for Mastered reviews--did you shuffle all of the word cards so they were not in order? If the book said to do it, I basically did it from what I remember. Not sure if I shuffled cards - what does the shuffling of cards do? Maybe I missed something? Did you put any cards that she missed during these reviews back in the daily review tab? Do you put any cards that pertain to dictations she misses back into daily review, even if they were considered mastered? Yes, we put things she didn't get right in the review tab, which was very minimal because she was doing so good. She never missed anything on dictation that I remember. When you say she missed a lot of the words when you did this final review--are there any patterns to what she missed (did she miss certain sounds, or are her mistakes more across the board)? Well, I didn't really analyze that, she just kept missing all these easy words and it left me wondering HOW could she miss the easy ones. It may be that you moved too quickly through the steps and that some of the concepts didn't stick--you may want to do a review of these before continuing on. The first step in Level 2 actually does review a lot of things, but you may need to build on this and work in more depending on your daughter's needs. We spent about 8 months I think on level 1, in the beginning she was so excited that we did a lot of lessons but slowed down around lesson 10 or so. We really took our time doing everything, the reviews sometimes took the whole lesson. What types of mistakes did she make--did she possibly confuse what she learned in Spelling Workout and use patterns she was familiar with in there to spell the AAS words? Maybe slow down the Spelling Workout so that it ends up only reviewing words/concepts she has learned in AAS if possible? She really loves doing SWO for fun. She is remembering the words from SWO, so that has me confused as to why those and not AAS, which we spent WAY more time on. I don't instruct her in SWO, she reads the rule and does the work herself and then tests good on the tests and reviews. All I can figure is somehow her figuring out for herself how to spell things instead of me teaching her is having better results - isn't that how it seems? Trying to figure it all out before we move on and if we should review all of AAS 1 lessons before moving on. My responses are in pink above. One another thing I wanted to add, she is also having difficulty in some reading - the vowel pairs. In her advanced reading time with words she hasn't ever read before, she is forgetting what sound ou or ai, etc make. However with her easy (on or below level) reading - she gets all the words with those vowel pairs in them because she already knows how to say the words like rain or out, etc. So maybe I need to do a complete review of phonics AND spelling? Thanks for any help, just so frustrated LOL! She was doing SO good and then we hit a wall the past few weeks..... Could be she just forgot a lot of things with our break in March and needs a big review. :confused: Edited May 31, 2011 by Classically Minded Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deeinfl Posted May 31, 2011 Share Posted May 31, 2011 I haven't read the other replies, but maybe she is remembering Spelling Workout words because of the written exercises. She is probably more visual than auditory. My son is not auditory and having him spell the word out loud helps, but what reinforces it for him is writing it down in several exercises. I am the same way. I can't even do much mental math because I just need to write everything down and see it, it's just the way my brain works. Dee :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morosophe Posted May 31, 2011 Share Posted May 31, 2011 My responses are in pink above.Could be she just forgot a lot of things with our break in March and needs a big review. :confused: They do say that much of second grade at a traditional school tends to be a repeat of first grade in subjects like math because students lose almost everything over summer break. Is that about the age your child is? I'm about to start on summer with my first grade son, but we're going to keep up math and writing and reading (even if we slow down or mix it up with more "fun" versions) because I'm petrified about this very thing happening. But we haven't started AAS yet, so at least I won't have to keep reviewing in that, too. (Actually, I'm thinking of starting those first three lessons of Level One this summer, just so we can get to the "real spelling" part for the beginning of school.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kristinannie Posted May 31, 2011 Share Posted May 31, 2011 I haven't read the other replies, but maybe she is remembering Spelling Workout words because of the written exercises. She is probably more visual than auditory. My son is not auditory and having him spell the word out loud helps, but what reinforces it for him is writing it down in several exercises. I am the same way. I can't even do much mental math because I just need to write everything down and see it, it's just the way my brain works. Dee :) :iagree: Honestly, I just bought AAS as well and really want it to work for my DC because I am in love! However, it seems like you found a great program that works for her. If I were you, I would just go with SWO. This would even give you a break since it is much more independent! Do you have other kids you could use AAS for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairProspects Posted May 31, 2011 Share Posted May 31, 2011 I'm inclined to think this is a phonics issue. If she is hitting vowel pairs and not sounding them out, then she doesn't know all the phonograms. OPGTR spends a lot of time working on the various sounds of vowel pairs so I would consider reviewing that part. Also, I think AAS works best with near constant review. IMO, the dictations are a continal review of previous concepts, so you really need to review the trouble words as well as be doing multiple dictations per day to catch the areas that need more work. I know if we only cover a rule once or during the week we are on that step, it is much more likely to get forgotten than if we are doing dictations throughout each step that include a variety of words from different weeks/steps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Classically Minded Posted May 31, 2011 Author Share Posted May 31, 2011 Honestly, I just bought AAS as well and really want it to work for my DC because I am in love! However, it seems like you found a great program that works for her. If I were you, I would just go with SWO. This would even give you a break since it is much more independent! Do you have other kids you could use AAS for? The thing is she loves AAS - she has really missed it. We also bought the next 3 levels (which was quite a chunk of change lol) and not really wanting to part with it but rather figure out maybe what I'm doing wrong. I have also recommended to others, who bought it, so hoping to make it work somehow. Just doing SWO is very tempting because I don't have to really do much at all lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Classically Minded Posted May 31, 2011 Author Share Posted May 31, 2011 I haven't read the other replies, but maybe she is remembering Spelling Workout words because of the written exercises. She is probably more visual than auditory. My son is not auditory and having him spell the word out loud helps, but what reinforces it for him is writing it down in several exercises. I am the same way. I can't even do much mental math because I just need to write everything down and see it, it's just the way my brain works. Dee :) I was thinking this too, AAS is supposed to cover ALL of the learning styles though, so it should work and was working. I just wonder why she didn't RETAIN the spelling of the words? :confused: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Classically Minded Posted May 31, 2011 Author Share Posted May 31, 2011 I'm inclined to think this is a phonics issue. If she is hitting vowel pairs and not sounding them out, then she doesn't know all the phonograms. OPGTR spends a lot of time working on the various sounds of vowel pairs so I would consider reviewing that part. She was doing great, even on new words and then somehow just forgot a lot. So trying to pinpoint what the issue is, either she is getting lazy and not wanting to try and remember or taking time off in March really effected her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MerryAtHope Posted May 31, 2011 Share Posted May 31, 2011 My responses are in pink above. One another thing I wanted to add, she is also having difficulty in some reading - the vowel pairs. In her advanced reading time with words she hasn't ever read before, she is forgetting what sound ou or ai, etc make. However with her easy (on or below level) reading - she gets all the words with those vowel pairs in them because she already knows how to say the words like rain or out, etc. So maybe I need to do a complete review of phonics AND spelling? Thanks for any help, just so frustrated LOL! She was doing SO good and then we hit a wall the past few weeks..... Could be she just forgot a lot of things with our break in March and needs a big review. :confused: The reason I asked about the break was that my son completely forgot how to write during our break between 1st and 2nd grade (age 7.5). It was SO frustrating! And our break wasn't all that long either! I have a friend who has taught 2nd grade at PS, and she said that the break bt. 1st and 2nd grades was the worst for kids forgetting things. So...I don't know if it's just that, but the thought came to me. The reason shuffling the cards is important, especially when doing the reviews, is that otherwise they can just remember the cards in order and according to pattern, without really having to think about the spellings or the sounds etc... I think it's mentioned in the front somewhere to shuffle them. But if she was doing fine on dictations and fine on the 3 mastered reviews, I'm inclined to think that the break affected her. Another hsing mom friend of mine who taught several children observed that in the early elementary years, if her kids were working hard on one thing, they tended to forget other things they had already learned, but eventually they could get it--it was like the new info they were working on pushed out the other info or something. One note on the review--after making the words in the book with tiles and then writing them, all cards are to go in the daily review tab for another review--not just ones she got wrong. When she does get a word wrong, here are some things you can do--one, if the error is phonetic, ask her to sound out exactly what she wrote or made with tiles. See if she can catch her error. If she says the word incorrectly, pronounce for her what she wrote, and then ask her if she can make it ____ (whatever the correct word is). This will get her thinking about the letters and the sounds she makes. I'm sorry it's so frustrating! Merry :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boscopup Posted May 31, 2011 Share Posted May 31, 2011 I notice two things: 1) You took a break and she forgot things. That is pretty normal for any subject at this age. You can take a break from math and your child may suddenly not remember 2+3, even though they've been doing 25+38 for a while. :tongue_smilie: A little review should bring it back to the forefront. She hasn't been doing this long enough to be completely cemented permanently. I wouldn't expect that at this age. 2) I noticed that you said you didn't have very many word cards in the review section. You're supposed to put ALL the word cards in the review section the first time. Then you keep them there for a bit, and move them to mastered later after you've reviewed them and had instant recall. So it's not just the ones she misses. 3) You shuffle the word cards because that makes her really use what she's learned. The words are initially taught in families. For example, my son just did a step yesterday involving "ur", so all the words were spelled with "ur" if they said the /er/ sound. To really test memory, it'd be best to shuffle the words so that there are some "er" and "ur" words in there and he has to really remember which one it is. Yesterday he didn't have to think as much. He was more getting the picture in his head about which one it was, so next time if the word is "turn" and he starts to write "tern", he might look at it and say "That doesn't look right." because he's written it before the correct way. Hope that helps! I say do a bit of review of level 1 topics, then go ahead with level 2 and make sure you put ALL the words in the review section at first and shuffle them when you review them in later steps. Oh, and don't take breaks! :lol: Kidding, of course. ;) ETA: Merry beat me by 5 minutes! LOL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
In2why Posted May 31, 2011 Share Posted May 31, 2011 The only thing I can think of that we do a bit differently is that we review all the words instead of just the ones he misses during the lesson. I would say 5-6 times during each level we read all the cards that we have used so far, and also have spelling review tests using a few from each family. We also review the key cards a bit more than is asked in the program. Once he 'has' it I still go back to the rules every so often to make sure that he still 'has' it. AAS review is one of the things we will continue with throughout our short summer break. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Classically Minded Posted May 31, 2011 Author Share Posted May 31, 2011 (edited) I feel SO stupid! :tongue_smilie: I was just coming on here to tell you all that I found out what I did wrong and the last 3 replies basically said it. I spent most of today reviewing AAS 1 myself and here is what I found I did wrong (I must have totally spaced this stuff because its in the book lol). Reviewing Word Cards - I didn't do this. I thought for some reason that I was only to put the words she misspelled the first time in the "review". Now I understand that I was supposed to put ALL the word cards in the "review" and review them at the start of the next lesson to make sure she really got them. Shuffling - I missed this in the book - not sure how as it was in a gray box a few times in different lessons. I now understand why you need to do this after looking at the word lists. So those are 2 errors of mine but despite that, here is the best part of what I discovered today.........my daughter was doing the review of the words over a few days in tests on Spelling City. (Normally, I administer the tests after each lesson but not for the end review) Well, the voice that says the words on Spelling City is very different from my voice (I have a strong southern accent being originally from TN). So my daughter is used to my voice and that is why she missed a lot of words on the tests on Spelling City. Today, we did all 170 words from AAS 1, taking many breaks and coming back to it of course. With me administering the test, she only missed 5!! So she knew how to spell the other 165 words! So I feel so much better taking today off school to find all this out before going on. Now, I do have a question for those who do AAS - when you "review" the word cards from the last lesson at the start of a new lesson, do you have the child do it with tiles or write the words? Thanks for all the help!! :D Edited May 31, 2011 by Classically Minded Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Classically Minded Posted May 31, 2011 Author Share Posted May 31, 2011 The reason I asked about the break was that my son completely forgot how to write during our break between 1st and 2nd grade (age 7.5). It was SO frustrating! And our break wasn't all that long either! I have a friend who has taught 2nd grade at PS, and she said that the break bt. 1st and 2nd grades was the worst for kids forgetting things. So...I don't know if it's just that, but the thought came to me. She is 7.5, so yes that must be part of it too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boscopup Posted May 31, 2011 Share Posted May 31, 2011 Well, the voice that says the words on Spelling City is very different from my voice (I have a strong southern accent being originally from TN). So my daughter is used to my voice and that is why she missed a lot of words on the tests on Spelling City. Today, we did all 170 words from AAS 1, taking many breaks and coming back to it of course. With me administering the test, she only missed 5!! So she knew how to spell the other 165 words! :lol: Glad to hear it's just an accent thing! Ha! Now, I do have a question for those who do AAS - when you "review" the word cards from the last lesson at the start of a new lesson, do you have the child do it with tiles or write the words?I just have my child write them on the white board. Way faster. We don't spell with the tiles at all though. I can't take the explosions that occur with each.and.every.word. :tongue_smilie: I imagine you don't have that problem. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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