keptwoman Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Our boxer puppy came home Monday, it's now Friday and she is 9 weeks old today. Yesterday she started nipping at the kids a bit, today she is chasing DD (7)around the house and biting her legs. She is also doing it to a lesser extent to C (11) She's also jumping up on me for attention more (she doesn't get it) and she is biting at all of our clothes. What I've been doing up until now: She was jumping up when she came home, and we stopped that pretty quick by turning away from her and then giving attention when she sat quietly at our feet. We make her go through the door after us, eat after us and not until we say, we are working on house breaking. I put the crate up on Wednesday and we are putting her in the crate during her naps, and today I will start feeding her in there too. However, she has not been locked in yet. When she came home the kids were laying on the ground and playing with her, but I have stopped them doing that a couple of days ago and explained that they must not allow her to climb on them. We've been trying to get her to wear a collar, she doesn't like it but I think I need to make that a priority. I've tried to train her to sit, but she gets jumpy and yappy and won't pay attention even for a couple of seconds and I'm struggling a bit. I'm HANGING OUT for puppy school which starts next Thursday. I have a couple of questions: 1/ What do I do to teach her to respect the kids? I have been getting between her and the kids, blocking her access and firmly saying no. A couple of times she showed signs of submission, but most of the time she isn't. 2/ I think a small part of her issue is that she is not stimulated enough. We have chew toys which we give her when she wants to bite, and I will go buy more, we take her out in the yard for a run about regularly but it's a small yard. We won't be able to take her to walk or play outside of the house for another 8 weeks!! Parvo is very prevalent here apparantly. I took her to DDs soccer this week and held her, but she will get big and heavy fast and there aren't that many places you can take a dog, even in arms. What do I do to keep her mind occupied? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoughCollie Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 (edited) The Dog Forums have been very helpful to me. Unfortunately, Aidan has a wiffle ball brain (full of holes) and doesn't seem to get the message very quickly. He has the attention span of a gnat, unless he wants something he can't have -- then he's like an elephant who never forgets. He still bites us. I don't have any dog mouth sized bruises on my arm right now (due to the blood thinning medication I take), so maybe he has improved. Here's a link to what to do about puppies who bite and nip: http://www.dogforums.com/dog-training-forum/95575-new-puppy-nipping-family.html'>http://www.dogforums.com/dog-training-forum/95575-new-puppy-nipping-family.html'>http://www.dogforums.com/dog-training-forum/95575-new-puppy-nipping-family.html'>http://www.dogforums.com/dog-training-forum/95575-new-puppy-nipping-family.html The URL for the forums: http://www.dogforums.com/ One thing that has helped us a lot is that we put Aidan's crate inside an exercise pen. This is the one we bought: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000FS4OYA Aidan sleeps in it at night, and we put him in there whenever he is getting to rambunctious or when we need him to be contained. He sleeps in his crate (we leave the door open for him). Because of the risk that his collar may catch on the pen or crate and choke him, we do not let him wear it in the house. Also, we don't want to leave Aidan alone at night (since he is just a baby), so one of us sleeps on the couch in the living room to keep him company -- we take turns. If he is ever completely housebroken, he can sleep wherever he likes. There are all sorts of puzzle toys available for dogs. I bought Aiden a squirrel in a log toy, and he figured it out right away. He loves that thing! I bought the large size, but I wish I'd gotten the jumbo size. I stick his other toys in the log, since he has already buried the squirrels (which DD says are chipmunks) somewhere. Sometimes I put a dog cookie at the bottom of the log, and he about goes crazy getting the toys out so he can get the cookie. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002I0O60 If you search dog puzzle toys on Amazon, you will see a lot of them. The Nina Ottosson puzzle toys are highly recommended by many people on the dog forums I linked above. They are very expensive, though. I like the Kong, too. You can put all sorts of things in there, or freeze it with yogurt inside, for example. Petco sells those squirt cheese cans with cheese, liver, and peanut butter, which make it easier to fill the Kong. They can be washed in the dishwasher. Unfortunately, I have never owned a dog who liked Kongs, but I understand that most dogs do. Another thing Aidan likes are bully sticks. They are sold at Petco, or you can get them at http://www.bestbullysticks.com/ . Bully sticks are dried bull penises. They are safer than rawhide. Best Bully Sticks also sells other things that are allegedly safe for dogs -- horns, antlers, beef trachea, etc. The beef tracheas and ligaments and so forth are dried. Aidan lives for toys, and he loves to play fetch. He likes the flat, long foxes you can buy at Petco (or Tractor Supply), the tug of war skunk with a ball in the middle of it, a pliable plastic ball that looks sort of like a wiffle ball, a big stuffed toy hamster, a big stuffed toy bone, and all the tennis balls we can throw for him. He likes toys that squeak the best, so he can pretend they are struggling while he kills them. I almost forgot the large stuffed duck -- we buy them at the grocery store and at Petco. I think we are on duck #4. Edited May 20, 2011 by RoughCollie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarlaS Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 I have yet to meet a nine week old puppy that doesn't bite. Here is a link I found that looks helpful: http://www.wagntrain.com/PlayBiting.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rafiki Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keptwoman Posted May 20, 2011 Author Share Posted May 20, 2011 Thank you all so much for replying! It was a really stressful morning with DD getting very upset about getting repeatedly bitten! I'm going to check out the links. One more question: She hates her collar, tries to claw at it with her back feet all the time, so she looks like a drunk walking because she can't stop trying to get at her collar. Should I just leave it on until she gets used to it, or keep it at short periods? She really fought getting it on this time! And thanks so much for the dog forum link, I'm having a good read there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cindy in the NH Woods Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 she jumped on and bit the kids (sometimes drawing blood), shredded their winter coats, you name it. Any intervention just seemed to stoke her up. I called dog trainers; tried Bitter Apple spray; etc. Finally, because I thought we would not be able to keep her if she was agressive toward kids, I called the dog's breeder. I figured if a woman who had seventeen GSD's under her complete control could not help us, we were certainly doomed. :001_huh: Basically, she said the puppy was taking us for a ride... She told us that when the dog started to cut up we should scruff her firmly, give her a shake, put her down, and walk away and ignore her for awhile. She also recommended fewer treats, and long down/stays. Worked like a charm (eventually). Of course we followed up with puppy class, and obedience class, but we needed to consistently act as pack leaders. The dog now loves the kids, hates to be away from them, and is under the kids' control. I can see that when the dog wants to behave badly, she will sometimes pick something up in her mouth instead of nip or jump up. She is by no means a perfect dog, but she is great with the family and our friends. Our dog does get freaky when she sees another dog, so if anyone has advice for us..... Just want to add that we are first time dog owners, and by NO means experts. :tongue_smilie: But I hope this encourages you a little. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cindy in the NH Woods Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 There are all sorts of puzzle toys available for dogs. I bought Aiden a squirrel in a log toy, and he figured it out right away. He loves that thing! I bought the large size, but I wish I'd gotten the jumbo size. I stick his other toys in the log, since he has already buried the squirrels (which DD says are chipmunks) somewhere. Sometimes I put a dog cookie at the bottom of the log, and he about goes crazy getting the toys out so he can get the cookie. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002I0O60 If you search dog puzzle toys on Amazon, you will see a lot of them. The Nina Ottosson puzzle toys are highly recommended by many people on the dog forums I linked above. Great ideas~ thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msk Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Just chiming in to agree that puppy nipping is not unusual at all; you should find lots of tips on the dog forums or in a training book. It sounds like she is playing with your kids the way she'd play with other puppies. It takes a while for them to learn that they can't play with humans that way. We used to joke that our dog at that age probably thought "no" was part of her name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keptwoman Posted May 21, 2011 Author Share Posted May 21, 2011 she jumped on and bit the kids (sometimes drawing blood), shredded their winter coats, you name it. Any intervention just seemed to stoke her up. I called dog trainers; tried Bitter Apple spray; etc. Finally, because I thought we would not be able to keep her if she was agressive toward kids, I called the dog's breeder. I figured if a woman who had seventeen GSD's under her complete control could not help us, we were certainly doomed. :001_huh: Basically, she said the puppy was taking us for a ride... She told us that when the dog started to cut up we should scruff her firmly, give her a shake, put her down, and walk away and ignore her for awhile. She also recommended fewer treats, and long down/stays. Worked like a charm (eventually). Of course we followed up with puppy class, and obedience class, but we needed to consistently act as pack leaders. The dog now loves the kids, hates to be away from them, and is under the kids' control. I can see that when the dog wants to behave badly, she will sometimes pick something up in her mouth instead of nip or jump up. She is by no means a perfect dog, but she is great with the family and our friends. Our dog does get freaky when she sees another dog, so if anyone has advice for us..... Just want to add that we are first time dog owners, and by NO means experts. :tongue_smilie: But I hope this encourages you a little. It does, thank you! DD is away on Cub camp this weekend, and she was glad to get out of the house because she has become scared of the puppy :( This has to stop, and fast! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LauraGB Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 Have you watched any of the Caesar Milan episodes or read any of his books? There's *a lot* he does that I don't agree with, but one thing he has is control. I learned a lot about establishing who is in charge from him (and from hornblower - you might search some of her old posts as she was soooooo helpful when we had two pups here at once :willy_nilly:). With the kids, I would make sure they understand that they are in fact in charge of the dog, and then teach them how to properly and effectively let the dog know that. If the pup feels he can get away with things with them until you step in, that will establish his behavior and he will run with it. Puppies will push limits to see how far they can go (like children ;)), so your pup sounds pretty normal, and likely much of it is play; the only kind of play a dog knows. Having all able members of the family show him how to behave like a 4-legged member now is crucial for maintaining any kind of peace. And so is wearing the little guy out by playing and running around outside - oh the naps are beautiful! Congrats on your new addition!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cindy in the NH Woods Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 It does, thank you! DD is away on Cub camp this weekend, and she was glad to get out of the house because she has become scared of the puppy :( This has to stop, and fast! That's so sad! My daughter and I were just laughing the other day about the "Dog Who Stole our Christmas". (We had acquired the pup in November as an early Christmas present, ha ha.) Hang in there~ you can do it! I think it does take some time for the pack to "firm up". ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keptwoman Posted May 21, 2011 Author Share Posted May 21, 2011 I rang the vets this afternoon to double check the vaccination schedule and I asked the vet nurse (long time owner of multiple boxers. Handy!!) She has given me some ideas as well, and suggested that DD come to the puppy preschool so that she understands how to control the dog. I have heard of Cesar Milan, but our library does not have his books and his show is not on here. Is there a specific book it would be worth me purchasing? I have found this site quite good for understanding dog psychology: http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/bruno/puppyraising.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annlaura Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 Before we brought home our puppy, I spent some time prepping DS who had just turned 3. He practiced saying "no biting" and "no jumping" in his firmest voice while giving one stomp of the foot. The foot stomp was because a firm 3yo voice isn't exactly forceful enough. At the same time, he would ball up his hands and pull them to his chest, and then turn his back and walk to me. Puppies hate being ignored, so turning your back on them is quite effective. But your back still gets jumped on at first. So once puppy came home, I helped DS practice this with her. And every time I heard him scold and stomp, I went to him to make sure puppy stopped. We still had a few tears and all, but they both made it through that phase. I've hand fed my pups too, one piece of kibble at a time. You can hold the food so they can barely get it out of your hand, and if you feel teeth at all, say "aht!" or "no!" or whatever, close your hand tighter around the food, and don't let them have it until they nuzzle it out with no tooth contact. Slow work, but gives a soft mouth that I've been able to stick my hand in even if the dog has meat or a bone. I also let DS do some simpler hand feeding, and involved him in training simple commands early on. I think taking DD to your puppy school is a great plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keptwoman Posted May 21, 2011 Author Share Posted May 21, 2011 Yes, she knows about turning her back and walking slowly away, but the puppy continues to nip at her ankles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz CA Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 It's really not biting, it's playing in their minds. This is how pups play with each other. Immediately withdrawing attention has worked with my 1 year old mastiff. Teach the kids to turn their back on the dog as soon as he starts playing like this. He will learn. We have had many dogs and none of them have displayed this behavior for long. The first few months are always a bit of work. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keptwoman Posted May 21, 2011 Author Share Posted May 21, 2011 Yeah, I'm not overly bothered now that I have a plan, but poor DD :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mama Geek Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 I don't have much to add other than I think it has been a little easier with my dd because she is so young. She was 4 mo when we brought our standard poodle pup home. We watched the pup very closely, let him get close to her and any time he would get too rough we would back him off and tell him easy. He is now almost a year and pretty gentle with her. Every now and then he gets too playful with her and ends up in his crate, but it isn't very frequent. They play with each other and get along well. One other thing we did was to teach dd that she had to be easy with him and there were times that if she pulled his hair to long we let him nibble at her to teach her not to do it. He didn't hurt her or make her cry it was just to let her know not to do it. They both have respect for each other now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gingersmom Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 I have a 9 1/2 week old puppy (about 18 pounds at the moment but going up to 60-70 pounds). I have an 11 year old that is less than thrilled when puppy gets overexcited. We try to wear her out by throwing toys for her endlessly. Then we take her on a long walk. Then I have been tying her up to the kitchen table with her leash. She sits on her puppy bed and semi-quietly plays with toys. Eventually she will settle down and just chill. Then my son will come and pet her and talk to her. At night we end all playing by 8pm so she can settle down for the evening. She has been sitting on the bed with us and watching tv. She loves The Amazing Race. :001_smile: Its another time for my son to bond with her when she is less rambunctious. Luckily we have cured about 90% of the puppy biting in one day. It was a very longgggggg day of snapping her collar everytime she nipped at someone and endless puppy timeouts. She thankfully got the hint very quickly. If you have the room a pen for the dog to play is is amazing (Roughcollie mentioned). I don't have room so we are going to be using baby gates to close off a hallway for the puppy to hang out in. Good luck and enjoy your new puppy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarlaS Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 I rang the vets this afternoon to double check the vaccination schedule and I asked the vet nurse (long time owner of multiple boxers. Handy!!) She has given me some ideas as well, and suggested that DD come to the puppy preschool so that she understands how to control the dog. I have heard of Cesar Milan, but our library does not have his books and his show is not on here. Is there a specific book it would be worth me purchasing? I have found this site quite good for understanding dog psychology: http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/bruno/puppyraising.htm Yes. Preferably one written by Ian Dunbar: Before and After Getting Your Puppy: The Positive Approach to Raising a Happy, Healthy, and Well-Behaved Dog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 Our Golden was a dominant personality nipper too as a puppy. One of the books I read advised holding their muzzle closed with your hands after they nip. It is a dominant position for a human to be in and psychologically the dog is uncomfortable with it. Don't do it aggressively and be careful not to let them bite their tongue but just hold the muzzle (mouth) closed until they appear uncomfortable. It will help them associate that feeling with their nipping. It worked wonders for us. I would also discourage you from feeding the dog in the crate. You don't want to do anything that will encourage the dog to become protective of the food. Dogs will 'claim' their crates. Our dog was very food aggressive when we got her and that can be dangerous to the owners and to other pets. We immediately started hand feeding and then gradually worked it up to feeding in the bowl with our permission while we had hands around her. That worked. Food aggressiveness can lead to some bad bites. As far as the energy level, you might get a KONG. It is a hard rubber toy that has openings for treat dispensing. You fill it with nuggets and the dog keeps busy getting the treats out. Stimulates their brains. We had a KONG and our dog got the treats out way too fast so I got a tip on some dog boards. Fill the KONG with Peanut Butter mixed with some treats and freeze overnight. The KONG will last forever, dog is super busy with it and the cold soothes puppy gums! It was one of the BEST tips I'd ever received! This is a KONG: http://www.amazon.com/Kong-Classic-Dog-Toy-Large/dp/B0002AR0I8/ref=sr_1_4?s=home-garden&ie=UTF8&qid=1305981733&sr=1-4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jujsky Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 she jumped on and bit the kids (sometimes drawing blood), shredded their winter coats, you name it. Any intervention just seemed to stoke her up. I called dog trainers; tried Bitter Apple spray; etc. Finally, because I thought we would not be able to keep her if she was agressive toward kids, I called the dog's breeder. I figured if a woman who had seventeen GSD's under her complete control could not help us, we were certainly doomed. :001_huh: Basically, she said the puppy was taking us for a ride... She told us that when the dog started to cut up we should scruff her firmly, give her a shake, put her down, and walk away and ignore her for awhile. She also recommended fewer treats, and long down/stays. Worked like a charm (eventually). Of course we followed up with puppy class, and obedience class, but we needed to consistently act as pack leaders. The dog now loves the kids, hates to be away from them, and is under the kids' control. I can see that when the dog wants to behave badly, she will sometimes pick something up in her mouth instead of nip or jump up. She is by no means a perfect dog, but she is great with the family and our friends. Our dog does get freaky when she sees another dog, so if anyone has advice for us..... Just want to add that we are first time dog owners, and by NO means experts. :tongue_smilie: But I hope this encourages you a little. Cindy, by any chance is your dog a Traumhof GS? Your breeder sounds like mine, and since you're also in NH (breeder we used was in MA), I'm curious :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoughCollie Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 (edited) Yes. Preferably one written by Ian Dunbar: Before and After Getting Your Puppy: The Positive Approach to Raising a Happy, Healthy, and Well-Behaved Dog :iagree: This is a great book and, IMO, a great approach to training a dog. To make that training solid, short training sessions, and at least 100 reps of each command have to be done before the dog will forget he has a choice and just automatically do what you say. After that, the training has to be reinforced pretty much all the time. It is time-consuming, but well worth it to have a solidly trained dog. I suspect that Aidan, who is very active and focuses well only on toys, sticks, and food, will take a lot longer to train solidly than a lot of dogs. He is the happiest, most friendly dog I've ever met, and I don't think he has a serious, pay attention bone in his body. This is a big contrast with our (by comparison) aloof Collie who was trained very quickly (and permanently housebroken in 24 hours). Teddy was interested in being trained, paid attention, loved the process ... he was a much more serious dog. Aidan is much more interested in things like trying to jump onto the dining room table from the floor. If he is ever trained solidly, I will count it as a miracle. Thanks to your post, Sandra, I've now noticed definite improvement in Aidan's biting. I currently have no bleeding wounds or bruises from him. Remember, he is not vicious, but I am taking meds that guarantee any little nip will cause this to happen. He does have the puppy zoomies every night and will get out of control, leaping and running all over the place, and he nips everyone when this happens. He is playing, but I think he is so excited that his prey drive overcomes his play drive, and his bite inhibition goes out the window. When this happens, we put him in his exercise pen to chill out. That works, and after 10-15 minutes, we can release him with no problems. One thing I did with our Collie was put drops of clove oil on the backs of the children's hands and on their shoes or the tops of their feet. One drop per area was all it took, and he avoided biting those places. The breeder suggested this because apparently Collies hate the smell of cloves. So do all of us, now. We bought the clove oil at a grocery store that was similar to Whole Foods, but I think some health food/vitamin stores also carry it. I am not using the clove oil with Aidan because he is nowhere near the problem Teddy was and I hate the smell of cloves now. Aidan does not try to herd anyone. Teddy's herding instinct was very strong and constantly activated with the kids, plus he was a lot bigger than Aidan. Edited May 21, 2011 by RoughCollie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravinlunachick Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 I second the Ian Dunbar recommendation. Pay particular attention to his suggestions for bite inhibition training. Our dog was the mouthiest, bitingest (channelling Yosemite Sam here) dog we had ever seen. She didn't mean to hurt us, but those sharp puppy teeth were awful! We stuck with Dunbar's method, and saw improvement within a couple of weeks. Before we knew it, Rosie was hardly nipping at all. Now, when she does nip to play, she is very very soft, and even the baby is not bothered by it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sahm99 Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 I don't have time to read through all the answers you already received, so I might be repeating... The one single most important thing we were told by our very experienced dog-trainer was to NEVER ever play with your young dog when inside. He actually told us to pretty much ignore our cute, lovable, soft, and tiny puppy for 1 year (when inside the house)!!! Mildly put, we were shocked:001_huh:! Well, the cute little puppy is an extremely well behaved and calm full grown Dalmation today (and anyone who has ever known a Dalmation knows what that means), and dh and I agree that almost physically restraining the kids (and sometimes the dog!) was worth it : She just never associated the house to "fun", but exclusively to "shelter". When inside, she sleeps, eats, or is patted (something done "to her", she is inactive...). ... Now, outside, well, a very different dog:lol::lol::lol: Hth! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cindy in the NH Woods Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 Cindy, by any chance is your dog a Traumhof GS? Your breeder sounds like mine, and since you're also in NH (breeder we used was in MA), I'm curious :001_smile: Hi! No, our dog is a Vom Birkenwald. :) Her breeder lives north of Concord, NH. It would have been fun to have our dogs be "relatives", lol. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest k9education Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Cindy, by any chance is your dog a Traumhof GS? Your breeder sounds like mine, and since you're also in NH (breeder we used was in MA), I'm curious :001_smile: I would have guessed the same when she said "seventeen GSD's under her complete control", but the bit about scruffing and shaking doesn't sound like advice Karen would give at all. I have 2 Traumhof dogs btw. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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