Interesting: To Formally Diagnose or Not

[asta]

I read this guy (a psychiatrist) all of the time. This time, he is tackling a rather contentious subject: the ramifications of formally diagnosing a child as "special needs". His title says "autistic", but there is much more to it than that in the actual article.

 

Before you comment, please read the article - otherwise, my post will be severely misconstrued.

 

 

asta

[8filltheheart]

I read this guy (a psychiatrist) all of the time. This time, he is tackling a rather contentious subject: the ramifications of formally diagnosing a child as "special needs". His title says "autistic", but there is much more to it than that in the actual article.

 

Before you comment, please read the article - otherwise, my post will be severely misconstrued.

 

 

asta

 

 

He makes a lot of suppositions in that article. A lot.

 

 

For ease of discussion, let's just take the simple® case of a high functioning Asperger's boy. Bill, age 6, has social delay, speech and language delay, motor coordination problems but most major milestones hit appropriately, and no intellectual deficits. Struggles with empathy, with articulating emotions, acts out when frustrated. Fails the Eyes Test.

 

Is there a theoretical maximum to improvement? I can predict remission, "cure," in depression. Is it possible to take Bill and make him into an adult who would not be detected as ASD on objective testing? (Let's leave aside whether other people can tell there's "something about him.")

 

If the answer is yes-- that using the best of the best of all of the world's resources a child can eventually "lose the diagnosis"-- then the terrible question I asked is, does the treatment itself cause even worse damage?

 

I find the implication of his argument to be that autism is "trainable" and they can simply "get rid of it." No, they can't. They can be educated to attempt to understand the world from the normal perspective, but that is not the same as their seeing the world that way.

 

And goodness, the entire "teenage" dismissal of his article. I can't even think about our ds's teenage yrs b/c they were so incredibly painful and destructive to our whole family WITH major treatment and interventions.

 

FWIW, I am incredibly glad my ds has an official diagnosis. It opens up services through the state now that he is an adult such as van services for the disabled (since he doesn't drive), etc.

[Stacy in NJ]

is the effectiveness of the treatment. His assumption is that the treatments are effective in changing behavior to "normal". I think this is suspect. My completely uninformed opinion, based only on my observation of the children of several friends who are identified as either PDDNOS or Aspie, is that many of the more accepted treatments aren't all that effective. I'm think primarily of social skills training here. I know he outlined a treatment plan based on the very best available- but my point is that the very best doesn't necessarily seem to be all that great. I've wondered previoulsy if some of the improvements these kids experience are really based upon the treatments or are they simply the outcome living life. I basically wondering if the "experts" are all that expert.

 

I read this guy (a psychiatrist) all of the time. This time, he is tackling a rather contentious subject: the ramifications of formally diagnosing a child as "special needs". His title says "autistic", but there is much more to it than that in the actual article.

 

Before you comment, please read the article - otherwise, my post will be severely misconstrued.

 

 

asta

[Critterfixer]

Asta, I thought it was an interesting article in many ways. I also checked out his post on The eye test (trying to predict a persons emotional state by looking at their eyes--a test I would be terrible at) and I thought this statement was enlightening--because I actually do this...

 

Baron-Cohen's theory of autism is predicated on a reduced ability to imagine the thoughts and feelings of the other person substantially because they cannot recognize them in themselves.

 

So I took the ones he got wrong, and three others that he had gotten right, and asked him to guess again, but this time I told him to imitate the eyes himself. Doing it this way, he got them all right. All of them.

 

Obviously, this surprised me. Admittedly, it was a slow process, but of interest was why it was slow. I watched him "get into character"-- it took five or so seconds to sculpt his eye muscles, individually, into the desired configuration, but once he had done this the answer came easily.

 

It is not abnormal for me to "rehearse" whenever I have to shift roles. Admittedly it might strike others as odd to see me walking down the hall, shaking my head and talking to myself, so I try to do it when no one is looking.:blushing: And, no social skills training. I taught myself to do this. When I was a child it was normal for me to engage someone in imaginary play and come up with every character, their dialogue and delivery. I guess it carried over into reality.

 

I think the point that I took from the article was how treatment strategies designed to "help" AS individuals might actually hinder the individuals learned coping mechanisms. For instance--the above.

 

Point by point as he makes it:

The diagnosis will make the parents want to try and help the child.

 

Good and bad and ugly. I think that every parent has to move through the stages of grief when I child is diagnosed, although I'm not sure my reaction to my own son's diagnosis would be typical. I met very shocked and grim expressions when I had the audacity to say that whatever treatments were to be used for my son I feared would change his nature. I did not want to see my son have to conform without him seeing the need--does that make sense?

 

The race against puberty. That's how long you have to teach meaningful coping strategies before the gigantic burden of sexuality and adolescence hits you in the face.

 

And yet, the logic stage is at this age. I know that I saw no reason to have social skills (beyond having one close friend) for many, many years after the onset of puberty. Thus I sailed through a rough time without a scratch while my peers struggled, fought and got beat up. I think one could teach social skills in childhood, but they are not going to be the same social skills needed for adolescence. The rules are completely different. American football and soccer are not the same game, even if they go by the same name.

 

Do you tell the school?

Well, I am the school, so not a problem. If someone else is doing the education this can be a thorny issue. So many educators have an impression of AS that may or may not fit the child. And they may focus more on trying to get the child to conform to either their own plan for integrating the student or to conform to the rest of the class so that they won't have to deal with it.

 

The treatment harms self-esteem.

I think he has a valid point. Once word gets out in the wild jungle of PS that you have a mental health issue, you're doomed. Might as well paint a great big target on your behind. Unfortunately, I'm not sure adults are any more accepting. Additionally, once you are perceived as handicapped in some way, people will not tell you what you need to hear. I want commentary on how I perform--so I can hone my technique.

 

The treatment is necessarily ab-normalizing.

I don't know that this would be the case for a vast number of AS children. But it is true that not many OT places would be open on Saturdays, Sundays and after five pm.

 

Other parents.

I don't know if a parent would be reluctant to let a son or daughter go out with the autistic kid. This needs some thought. On the other hand, if a child could be so swayed by a parent to not date (or marry) a person that had an AS diagnosis, would I really want my son to marry that individual?

That said, there are differences in marriage that would be complicated by not having a diagnosis.

 

Thought provoking article. Thanks, Asta.

[asta]

He makes a lot of suppositions in that article. A lot.

 

I find the implication of his argument to be that autism is "trainable" and they can simply "get rid of it." No, they can't. They can be educated to attempt to understand the world from the normal perspective, but that is not the same as their seeing the world that way.

 

And goodness, the entire "teenage" dismissal of his article. I can't even think about our ds's teenage yrs b/c they were so incredibly painful and destructive to our whole family WITH major treatment and interventions.

 

FWIW, I am incredibly glad my ds has an official diagnosis. It opens up services through the state now that he is an adult such as van services for the disabled (since he doesn't drive), etc.

 

TLP was predicting remission in depression, not Aspergers. He also wasn't inferring that a person could "get rid of it"; he was asking if a person who tested as Aspie could, with intervention, at some point, not test as Aspie (simply because "the criteria" are not "met"). I test considerably "less" Aspie than I would have as a child. Why? Because of all of the coping mechanisms I've had to adopt. I'm no longer 8, I'm 43. Reading that article as an Aspie is very different than reading it as the parent of an Aspie, I imagine.

 

is the effectiveness of the treatment. His assumption is that the treatments are effective in changing behavior to "normal". I think this is suspect. My completely uninformed opinion, based only on my observation of the children of several friends who are identified as either PDDNOS or Aspie, is that many of the more accepted treatments aren't all that effective. I'm think primarily of social skills training here. I know he outlined a treatment plan based on the very best available- but my point is that the very best doesn't necessarily seem to be all that great. I've wondered previoulsy if some of the improvements these kids experience are really based upon the treatments or are they simply the outcome living life. I basically wondering if the "experts" are all that expert.

 

That has pretty much been my vote. But then again, I am considered HFA, and, due to my age, grew up in the world of "beat it out of them on the playground", not "let's teach Asta via constructive play interaction".

 

Critterfixer: I just agree with your whole post.

 

Rehearsing situations is MAJOR. Do it long enough, and it becomes second nature, eh? Kid is learning it now.

 

One friend. I remember *wanting* to fit in during adolescence (eg: not wear the wrong clothes, etc.) and realizing very quickly that it just.wasn't.gonna.happen. I could have been a supermodel with designer duds and I still would be walking around in that "there's something not quite right about THAT one" bubble. I gave up and went the solitary route. To this day, I only operate with one, maybe two face to face "friends" at any given time. And even that is exhausting. Kid is dealing with the same thing.

 

Now, dealing with adults? No problem. Neither I (then) nor he (now) had/have any problem. I think that, since there was no possibility for a "relationship" (eg: everything was always intellectual), it was "easy".

 

 

I think I am particularly sensitive to diagnoses for this reason: when I started having epileptic seizures (due to a head injury no less!), I was misdiagnosed as having something called "pseudo-seizures" and bipolar, which are mental illnesses. I was "trapped" for lack of a better term, in psychiatry for over five years, unable to get ANY neurologist to listen to me, simply because I had diagnoses that were listed in the DSM. I was mis-medicated, and got sicker and sicker. There is one year I don't even remember.

 

Now, I work in mental health. I don't "have anything against" anyone with a mental illness. Or with a differently wired brain (can you tell that I don't think ASD should be in the DSM?). But unfortunately, there is still a HUGE stigma, both within and without the medical community for certain diagnoses, and ASDs fall under that umbrella.

 

I do not have a "formal" ASD diagnosis on my medical record. I know I have it. I have interesting paperwork / evaluations from when I was in grade school and in a "gifted" pull-out program. Funnily enough, one of the psychiatrists and I talked about it and the worthlessness of putting it in as an adult. I do have a formal epilepsy diagnosis. And every time I meet a new doctor, they open my record and see "bipolar, pseudo-seizures", and I have to explain: "actually, those were misdiagnoses..." and hope they aren't jerks about it.

 

So, yeah - "experts" aren't necessarily expert. And we aren't necessarily setting our kids up for success by labeling them with everything under the sun on the *hope* that someone else will be better at dealing with their issues / will have something more to offer them than we, the internet, and a good bookstore or library can.

 

Just my .02

 

 

asta

[8filltheheart]

TLP was predicting remission in depression, not Aspergers. He also wasn't inferring that a person could "get rid of it"; he was asking if a person who tested as Aspie could, with intervention, at some point, not test as Aspie (simply because "the criteria" are not "met"). I test considerably "less" Aspie than I would have as a child. Why? Because of all of the coping mechanisms I've had to adopt. I'm no longer 8, I'm 43. Reading that article as an Aspie is very different than reading it as the parent of an Aspie, I imagine.

 

 

 

That has pretty much been my vote. But then again, I am considered HFA, and, due to my age, grew up in the world of "beat it out of them on the playground", not "let's teach Asta via constructive play interaction".

 

Critterfixer: I just agree with your whole post.

 

Rehearsing situations is MAJOR. Do it long enough, and it becomes second nature, eh? Kid is learning it now.

 

One friend. I remember *wanting* to fit in during adolescence (eg: not wear the wrong clothes, etc.) and realizing very quickly that it just.wasn't.gonna.happen. I could have been a supermodel with designer duds and I still would be walking around in that "there's something not quite right about THAT one" bubble. I gave up and went the solitary route. To this day, I only operate with one, maybe two face to face "friends" at any given time. And even that is exhausting. Kid is dealing with the same thing.

 

Now, dealing with adults? No problem. Neither I (then) nor he (now) had/have any problem. I think that, since there was no possibility for a "relationship" (eg: everything was always intellectual), it was "easy".

 

 

I think I am particularly sensitive to diagnoses for this reason: when I started having epileptic seizures (due to a head injury no less!), I was misdiagnosed as having something called "pseudo-seizures" and bipolar, which are mental illnesses. I was "trapped" for lack of a better term, in psychiatry for over five years, unable to get ANY neurologist to listen to me, simply because I had diagnoses that were listed in the DSM. I was mis-medicated, and got sicker and sicker. There is one year I don't even remember.

 

Now, I work in mental health. I don't "have anything against" anyone with a mental illness. Or with a differently wired brain (can you tell that I don't think ASD should be in the DSM?). But unfortunately, there is still a HUGE stigma, both within and without the medical community for certain diagnoses, and ASDs fall under that umbrella.

 

I do not have a "formal" ASD diagnosis on my medical record. I know I have it. I have interesting paperwork / evaluations from when I was in grade school and in a "gifted" pull-out program. Funnily enough, one of the psychiatrists and I talked about it and the worthlessness of putting it in as an adult. I do have a formal epilepsy diagnosis. And every time I meet a new doctor, they open my record and see "bipolar, pseudo-seizures", and I have to explain: "actually, those were misdiagnoses..." and hope they aren't jerks about it.

 

So, yeah - "experts" aren't necessarily expert. And we aren't necessarily setting our kids up for success by labeling them with everything under the sun on the *hope* that someone else will be better at dealing with their issues / will have something more to offer them than we, the internet, and a good bookstore or library can.

 

Just my .02

 

 

asta

 

Actually, my ds's traits become MORE and MORE obvious as he gets older, not less. Why? b/c what was quirky as a child are just very abnormal in an adult.

 

ETA: I don't think my ds could identify any of this in himself. He just doesn't see what we see. He has been in treatment for yrs. He has suffered from depression, but it certainly wasn't from seeking treatment. It was recognizing that other people see that he is different, especially young ladies. If I had time, I could go through and make comments on the article pt by pt, but I don't. I know that what I have witnessed in my young adult contradicts what he is asserting.

Edited May 5, 2011 by 8FillTheHeart

[Storm Bay]

I have mixed feelings about this article. If it's autism, then it doesn't just go away unless there is a phsyical cause that can be addressed (I know people where this was the case and more where it wasn't). If it's Asperger's, it's such an umbrella diagnosis that it's hard to say, especially if you are dealing with girls vs boys, and especially since I abhor the phrase "autism spectrum" because it is very clear that not all people with Asperger's belong there.

 

OTOH, early intervention IS important and beneficial. The question is can you do it without imposing labels on a child? Sometimes, those terms can be helpful if you have a dc who is not going to be able to function on their own as adults or who will always need special considerations. But what about those Aspies who can hide it or who grow up and have overcome most of it? My cousin is an Aspie who has never had a formal diagnosis (he's too old). He is very successful and happens to be brilliant, and his junior partners do step in and do the hiring, firing, etc; the things he's not good at. His clients ignore his quirks because he is brilliant at what he does. His ds, OTOH, had had a formal diagnosis, and it has been helpful for him. Part of today's difficult lies in how our culture and education has changed. My cousin started school in the late 1950s (he's a fair bit older than me :)) when the same manners and behaviour was expected at home, school and in public. School was very structured, which helped a lot. His ds is not as intellectually brilliant as he is and is majoring in furniture making (but took astronomy as one of his required academic electives.)

 

I have an aspie girl relative who finds that label offensive and thinks that having a SN label means someone is stupid, which she is anything but. It's hard to diagnose aspie girls and women because it doesn't always show, and while therapy can help, they don't get it. Should those girls and women have a label? Many aspie girls grow up to go into caring professions, so obviously there is nothing there that interferes with their jobs. As for my family, my dad and two of his siblings have definite aspie traits, and his sister (the mother of my lawyer cousin) has that and probably more. I see a few aspie traits in my sister and I as well as in 2 of my dc. My birth brother has none (according to my mother, but I don't agree; I think he has one that doesn't interfere with his social life), nor does my middle dd. However, if you read aspie traits you'll see that everyone has at least some issue that could be lumped on this autism spectrum, so it borders on the ridiculous.

 

disclaimer: I think of psychology as more of a pseudoscience and have since I was in university. I find much of it interesting and think that there are some psychologists who help people if they are good listeners. However, there are many other people who can do a lot to help dc with SN who aren't psychologists with therapy, diet, exercise, coping strategies, etc.

Edited May 5, 2011 by Karin

[Critterfixer]

It was recognizing that other people see that he is different, especially young ladies.

 

I think, and I reserve the right to be wrong, that boys have it tougher than girls (in some respects) but I'm not sure that the greatest part of this comes from the perceptions of men with mental health issues. It is still more difficult for a man to admit that he needs help for something as common as depression. I know a perfectly lovely Aspie boy who has a strong aversion to dirt and general disorder, and I know that he had to face some fairly ugly playground abuse over it which culminated in a fight that he didn't start and actually ended up winning, for which he, not the aggressor (and constant tormentor) was suspended. This was after his diagnosis, mind. He ended up changing school systems and has done better since he was able to get away from that group which had already labeled him. All because he wasn't what a "boy" was supposed to be.

On the other hand, I could get away with being clumsy, being completely unable to hit a ball with a bat, and talking to myself in multiple voices because I was making up stories and playing multiple characters. No girl felt a need to bully me into submission. Tease me and exclude me, yes. But I already excluded myself, and their words were less distressing than physical torture would have been.

 

I think that, since there was no possibility for a "relationship" (eg: everything was always intellectual), it was "easy".

:001_smile:That's exactly it. Many years ago I opted to branch out on my own to do contract work. I point blank refuse to go to any of the "social" events although I am dutifully invited every year. I don't want the relationship to change because that would force an adaptation that I don't find easy or helpful. I'm like pepper--only good in small doses.

 

But now I have a child with high-functioning autism, so I always have to wonder if I am seeing him with twilight vision and whether my experiences will help or hinder him in his quest. Not a quest to be "normal" (whatever the definition of normal is for this age) but in the quest to acquire the armor he needs to wear for the world without being afraid of losing himself in it. I know that if I had been subjected to knowing that I was "abnormal" and not just "me" at an early age that I would not be the person I am today. I think I would have felt as if my very person was being outcast, with no hope of validation. And I knew then as well as I know now, that who I am is not likely to ever change in the root, although the tree has certainly grown and branched out.

I wonder if some of the children feel that same way when they go classes to learn social skills, as if someone is trying to yank up their roots and replant them upside down.

[Niffercoo]

 

ETA: I don't think my ds could identify any of this in himself. He just doesn't see what we see. He has been in treatment for yrs.

 

Just a couple of weeks ago, Austin brought me to his laptop where he had apparently googled the criteria for Aspergers and said, "See! I don't have ANY of these." I tried to gently explain that he does have them, and while he has better coping mechanisms than he did when he was younger, he still does have Aspergers. He continues to deny it and refuses any attempts to involve him in an Aspie social group. When I asked him if he wanted to go to school for high school, he asked if he would have to be in special ed and I said, "Yes." He was extremely upset.

 

At the same time, he says he won't be dating or getting married because "Aspies don't do that." When I insist that Aspies DO date and DO get married, he refuses to believe me.

[Niffercoo]

 

I wonder if some of the children feel that same way when they go classes to learn social skills, as if someone is trying to yank up their roots and replant them upside down.

 

We began RDI (Relationship Development Intervention) when Austin was 11 and he very quickly refused to do anything with me when he felt it was 'therapy' time. Thankfully, RDI blends into your lifestyle once the parents get a feel for it, but when we would have to do videos to submit to our consultant, he would get really upset. A few years later he told me it was because he thought we were trying to 'fix' him, and he doesn't NEED fixing.

[Stacy in NJ]

Niffercoo, I wonder if you would share how effective you feel RDI has been for your family. Pros/Cons?

 

 

[We began RDI (Relationship Development Intervention) when Austin was 11 and he very quickly refused to do anything with me when he felt it was 'therapy' time. Thankfully, RDI blends into your lifestyle once the parents get a feel for it, but when we would have to do videos to submit to our consultant, he would get really upset. A few years later he told me it was because he thought we were trying to 'fix' him, and he doesn't NEED fixing.

[Niffercoo]

Niffercoo, I wonder if you would share how effective you feel RDI has been for your family. Pros/Cons?

 

 

[We began RDI (Relationship Development Intervention) when Austin was 11 and he very quickly refused to do anything with me when he felt it was 'therapy' time. Thankfully, RDI blends into your lifestyle once the parents get a feel for it, but when we would have to do videos to submit to our consultant, he would get really upset. A few years later he told me it was because he thought we were trying to 'fix' him, and he doesn't NEED fixing.

 

That's really a tough question for me to answer. I wholeheartedly embrace the principles of RDI as I understand them as of right now (2011). However, in the several years since I have been aware of RDI, the principles have changed several times and the business plan of the individuals in charge has changed dramatically. The key, IMO, to success with RDI is to find a consultant who meshes well with your family. This is not as easy as it sounds. There are a LOT of bad consultants who are being continually renewed. There are some fantastic consultants as well, but it's hard to discern who will be good and who will be bad. We had a very, very bad experience with our first consultant but our second consultant was fantastic, we just ran out of money.

 

When I first started RDI there was a wealth of information on their website and through yahoogroups, but that has all changed now. You can only get access to the information through a certified consultant, and it is quite expensive. But in my opinion, the principles behind RDI (the Guided Participation Relationship - outlined in a book called Apprenticeship in Thinking and also discussed in Awakening Children's Minds) is absolutely the reason why my children have come as far as they have come. I will caution you ahead of time that RDI (at least the way it was when I was with a consultant) will ask you to go against the traditional approaches for autism. You're supposed to slow your life down, pull OUT of many therapies and social opportunities, not focus on academics. It was and continues to be a challenge, not just within the ASD world but in the rest of the world, too, who wonders why your children aren't in every activity around. But it works. I daresay that we would have made even more progress had we had a competent professional working with us during the bulk of our time (I blamed myself for our slow progress when I should have been wondering why our consultant wasn't giving me the proper feedback so I WOULDN'T be blaming myself).

 

My recommendation to anyone looking into RDI (and I think you SHOULD look into RDI if you have a child with ASD and especially if you have a higher functioning child with ASD) is to talk with the prospective consultant in detail, making sure that his or her MAIN focus is RDI and not RDI in addition to family therapy/counseling/etc. and get lots of lots of references. Ask the families if they are satisfied with the turn-around time in feedback, if questions are being answered, if specific examples are being given and specific assignments are being scheduled. Try to talk to former patients of the consultant and ask why they left. Unfortunately, it is very difficult to find out if people are unhappy with a consultant. The RDI main office only deals with certification, not with quality control. :( Do NOT be afraid to switch to a different consultant if you feel like you are constantly confused and unsure what you're supposed to be doing with your child.

 

Let me know if I can answer any further questions!

[Critterfixer]

At the same time, he says he won't be dating or getting married because "Aspies don't do that." When I insist that Aspies DO date and DO get married, he refuses to believe me.

 

Maybe, maybe not. Plenty of people who are not Aspies don't date and don't get married. All of that will depend on who he meets in the future and whether HE wants to pursue the relationship. That's pretty much true across the board.

 

If it helps (that is if you feel that he is a little upset about thinking about not dating and not marrying-because if it doesn't bother him then it's not worth bringing it up) you can tell him that Aspies do everything different when it comes to finding people and falling in love. In other words, the rules of dating in a traditional sense ARE NOT going to help him find true love. The person that he can love is a person that will love him just as he is, for who he is, and will stand up for him when that's needed and tell him when he's not seeing the whole picture fearlessly.

He is probably not going to meet someone the way everyone else does (whatever that means) and if he did, and if he had to always be someone different around her to win her affection, than it wouldn't be right.

[Stacy in NJ]

Thanks so much for taking the time to answer, Niffercoo.

 

I don't have a child on the spectrum but do tutor a little girl who is diagnosed as PDDNOS. I've been aware of RDI for some time and have briefly spoken with her mom about it. She is 12yo and her family is using a social skills training program that seems (to me, anyways) less than time well spent. She is actually a really sweet girl and pretty high functioning. I would love for her mom to homeschool her, but that is me butting my nose into a situation that isn't really my business.

 

I'm glad to hear your experience because if her mom ever does bring up the topic again (and she very well might), I'm glad to have even some limited information to share.

 

All the best, Stacy

[Niffercoo]

Maybe, maybe not. Plenty of people who are not Aspies don't date and don't get married. All of that will depend on who he meets in the future and whether HE wants to pursue the relationship. That's pretty much true across the board.

 

If it helps (that is if you feel that he is a little upset about thinking about not dating and not marrying-because if it doesn't bother him then it's not worth bringing it up) you can tell him that Aspies do everything different when it comes to finding people and falling in love. In other words, the rules of dating in a traditional sense ARE NOT going to help him find true love. The person that he can love is a person that will love him just as he is, for who he is, and will stand up for him when that's needed and tell him when he's not seeing the whole picture fearlessly.

He is probably not going to meet someone the way everyone else does (whatever that means) and if he did, and if he had to always be someone different around her to win her affection, than it wouldn't be right.

 

I think he says it because it DOES bother him. He's just having such issues with the idea of having Aspergers. I tend to think this is just a typical teen stage - forming your identity and where you fit in the world.

 

He is a really great guy. If there is a lady out there who will try to understand him, he's going to make a heck of a husband and father.

[Niffercoo]

Thanks so much for taking the time to answer, Niffercoo.

 

I don't have a child on the spectrum but do tutor a little girl who is diagnosed as PDDNOS. I've been aware of RDI for some time and have briefly spoken with her mom about it. She is 12yo and her family is using a social skills training program that seems (to me, anyways) less than time well spent. She is actually a really sweet girl and pretty high functioning. I would love for her mom to homeschool her, but that is me butting my nose into a situation that isn't really my business.

 

I'm glad to hear your experience because if her mom ever does bring up the topic again (and she very well might), I'm glad to have even some limited information to share.

 

All the best, Stacy

 

You're welcome! I'm not a big fan of social skills training, but I know that many people swear by it. Since you do some tutoring, you might be interested in reading Awakening Children's Minds for your own use (and then it would give you a little more info on where RDI is grounded). My degree is in early childhood education so I was somewhat familiar with Vygotsky, but this book was eye-opening in many, many ways!

[Storm Bay]

I think he says it because it DOES bother him. He's just having such issues with the idea of having Aspergers. I tend to think this is just a typical teen stage - forming your identity and where you fit in the world.

 

He is a really great guy. If there is a lady out there who will try to understand him, he's going to make a heck of a husband and father.

I agree about the teen stage. One of my high school friends, who is very neurotypical, was convinced that she would never love a man enough that she would want to marry him and was certain she didn't want childrenn At 18 she even asked a doctor to perform permanent birth control, but of course the doctor refused. Finally, late in law school (and she took a year or two of before university, so she was in her late 20s) she fell in love with a man so hard that she decided she wanted lots of kids. They have three kids and have been married over 20 years.

[Critterfixer]

I think he says it because it DOES bother him. He's just having such issues with the idea of having Aspergers. I tend to think this is just a typical teen stage - forming your identity and where you fit in the world.

 

 

 

To bring it back around to the article, I think that is what the writer was driving at. Does diagnosis and subsequent treatment make it harder for the person to be comfortable with his or her own identity?

[Storm Bay]

To bring it back around to the article, I think that is what the writer was driving at. Does diagnosis and subsequent treatment make it harder for the person to be comfortable with his or her own identity?

Sometimes it does.

[Critterfixer]

Yet for myself, coming to the conclusion of AS later in life, the thought was liberating and satistfying in some ways. I understood that all the discomfort of my childhood was not in vain. I had learned to adapt in the ways that let me remain myself, and yet I could create the image I needed for public life.

I'm not ever likely to have a great score for empathy. But I have learned how to be empathetic. It isn't natural for me, but it is natural for me to listen, and I have learned to think more often than I speak, and to organize and practice empathy.