Verbal/Non-verbal learning differences

[DogwoodMama]

I'm curious if anyone has any experience, ideas, encouragement for me?

 

I'll try to make a long story short... I have a very bright and articulate 7 year old. We are Charlotte Mason homeschoolers (Ambleside Year 1) and have used HWOT since kindergarten, Singapore Math 1a/1b this year and All About Spelling is a recent addition for us. For Kindergarten we did FIAR.

 

This year as we have added more writing (not a lot, but just continuing) I started to encounter a lot of resistance, freak-outs, comments like "I just CAN'T do it, it's SO HARD!" from what I perceived to be my very, very bright daughter. There was NO improvement in her handwriting over a two year period, she continued to write with a mix of upper/lower case letters, strange letter formation, no spaces between her words. Until we started All About Spelling she would not even attempt to spell words despite her advanced reading level... she would even misspell words and then read her misspelled words correctly. The only part of homeschool she seemed to enjoy was listening to her readings and art and free play, and at times she liked math unless she was too overwhelmed by writing that particular day.

 

I finally reached a point of "something is NOT right" and burn-out on my part in February, and made an appointment to get a psychological evaluation for her. I also decided to go ahead and do her academic testing and get the Woodcock-Johnson to see what grade level she was really working at.

 

She did (I thought) really well on the WJ-III... her broad reading score was really good (4th grade equivalency, very advanced) as was her letter-word identification and passage comprehension. Her written math scores were grade level, but she did better with the verbal math (?), solving word problems. However, her broad written language was average... her spelling was below average, and writing fluency only average. She did advanced things like used the contraction "It's" correctly, unusual for a 1st grader, but can't spell.

 

The next day we got the results of her psych eval. She has significant anxiety issues, and also "mood" issues, but they think that we have supported her so well in our family/homeschool environment that the mood issues are better than they would be if she were in school. However, the important piece of information that helped a lot of her struggles make sense is that her Verbal IQ (on WISC) was 130, but her Non-verbal (performance) IQ is more than 15 points lower, not quite sure what. They said that *in and of itself* that this disparity would be frustrating and produce anxiety. Also, even though she was technically performing at grade level, because her Verbal IQ is 130, and her broad written language scores were only grade level or a bit below, that in the public school setting she would qualify for Learning Disabled/Writing.

 

Can I say how helpful it is to know that I am not just imagining things or being a bad parent, in sensing that written language skills are truly challenging for my daughter? Her verbal and reading abilities truly amaze me, but it has been so painful to see her struggle with written work. And so much of what we work on in these early years of homeschooling are about basic written skills- doing copywork, etc. Even the little bit of handwriting I expected from her was just so painful and overwhelming. She would tell me that it made her SOOOO TIRED and was just overwhelmed. At the same time, she can listen for very long periods of time to reading and stay on task for non-writing activities without problems.

 

So, we are not in a school environment, thankfully... I have known for some time that Charlotte simply could not do the written work that public schools require these days. But I couldn't figure out why. The psychologist team we worked with said if she were in school they would recommend modifications such as allowing her to type instead of write, and they encouraged me to teach her to type, which I'm happy to do. (Any program recommendations?)

 

Now I'm trying to figure out what my goals for her handwriting should be. I still want her to learn to write in some form, legibly. We have recently started New American Cursive, and that does seem to be easier for her. I'm open to different approaches to help her with handwriting because she is really average in non-verbal so YES she should be able to learn to write (right? b/c the average person can learn to write!). We are going to pursue treatments for anxiety, and they think that should help her do better with non-verbal/writing tasks since right now they seem hard to her and she gets overwhelmed and shuts down.

 

I'm also looking for a math program that is good for kids with non-verbal weakness but strong verbal ability. Maybe I should post that as a thread by itself. She has hated Singapore Math because she doesn't like all the cute pictures and such (how weird is that, still trying to figure it out!) I think for now I will try to use the manual and different strategies to teach concepts verbally first, as much as possible, use manipulative and then move to written work. We need to get the concepts down first before moving to written work. I think I need to get some CD's that have basic addition and subtraction songs to help her verbally memorize those facts, then show her she knows this via manipulatives, and then she can do the written work. Does that approach seem reasonable? I would love a program to help me with this long-term.

 

Oh wow, long post, so sorry! Hoping that someone will have some helpful thoughts but even if not, it is helpful as I process this!

[WTMCassandra]

I'm biased, being a fan from way back, but I think Professor B Math would be a good fit for her. The instruction is on DVD and really is great at telling the "why" behind math, and the workbook is "just enough" practice. You could have her do the problems orally, even.

[Lisa in Jax]

I'm curious if anyone has any experience, ideas, encouragement for me?

 

I'll try to make a long story short... I have a very bright and articulate 7 year old. We are Charlotte Mason homeschoolers (Ambleside Year 1) and have used HWOT since kindergarten, Singapore Math 1a/1b this year and All About Spelling is a recent addition for us. For Kindergarten we did FIAR.

 

This year as we have added more writing (not a lot, but just continuing) I started to encounter a lot of resistance, freak-outs, comments like "I just CAN'T do it, it's SO HARD!" from what I perceived to be my very, very bright daughter. There was NO improvement in her handwriting over a two year period, she continued to write with a mix of upper/lower case letters, strange letter formation, no spaces between her words. Until we started All About Spelling she would not even attempt to spell words despite her advanced reading level... she would even misspell words and then read her misspelled words correctly. The only part of homeschool she seemed to enjoy was listening to her readings and art and free play, and at times she liked math unless she was too overwhelmed by writing that particular day.

 

I finally reached a point of "something is NOT right" and burn-out on my part in February, and made an appointment to get a psychological evaluation for her. I also decided to go ahead and do her academic testing and get the Woodcock-Johnson to see what grade level she was really working at.

 

She did (I thought) really well on the WJ-III... her broad reading score was really good (4th grade equivalency, very advanced) as was her letter-word identification and passage comprehension. Her written math scores were grade level, but she did better with the verbal math (?), solving word problems. However, her broad written language was average... her spelling was below average, and writing fluency only average. She did advanced things like used the contraction "It's" correctly, unusual for a 1st grader, but can't spell.

 

The next day we got the results of her psych eval. She has significant anxiety issues, and also "mood" issues, but they think that we have supported her so well in our family/homeschool environment that the mood issues are better than they would be if she were in school. However, the important piece of information that helped a lot of her struggles make sense is that her Verbal IQ (on WISC) was 130, but her Non-verbal (performance) IQ is more than 15 points lower, not quite sure what. They said that *in and of itself* that this disparity would be frustrating and produce anxiety. Also, even though she was technically performing at grade level, because her Verbal IQ is 130, and her broad written language scores were only grade level or a bit below, that in the public school setting she would qualify for Learning Disabled/Writing.

 

Can I say how helpful it is to know that I am not just imagining things or being a bad parent, in sensing that written language skills are truly challenging for my daughter? Her verbal and reading abilities truly amaze me, but it has been so painful to see her struggle with written work. And so much of what we work on in these early years of homeschooling are about basic written skills- doing copywork, etc. Even the little bit of handwriting I expected from her was just so painful and overwhelming. She would tell me that it made her SOOOO TIRED and was just overwhelmed. At the same time, she can listen for very long periods of time to reading and stay on task for non-writing activities without problems.

 

So, we are not in a school environment, thankfully... I have known for some time that Charlotte simply could not do the written work that public schools require these days. But I couldn't figure out why. The psychologist team we worked with said if she were in school they would recommend modifications such as allowing her to type instead of write, and they encouraged me to teach her to type, which I'm happy to do. (Any program recommendations?)

 

Now I'm trying to figure out what my goals for her handwriting should be. I still want her to learn to write in some form, legibly. We have recently started New American Cursive, and that does seem to be easier for her. I'm open to different approaches to help her with handwriting because she is really average in non-verbal so YES she should be able to learn to write (right? b/c the average person can learn to write!). We are going to pursue treatments for anxiety, and they think that should help her do better with non-verbal/writing tasks since right now they seem hard to her and she gets overwhelmed and shuts down.

 

I'm also looking for a math program that is good for kids with non-verbal weakness but strong verbal ability. Maybe I should post that as a thread by itself. She has hated Singapore Math because she doesn't like all the cute pictures and such (how weird is that, still trying to figure it out!) I think for now I will try to use the manual and different strategies to teach concepts verbally first, as much as possible, use manipulative and then move to written work. We need to get the concepts down first before moving to written work. I think I need to get some CD's that have basic addition and subtraction songs to help her verbally memorize those facts, then show her she knows this via manipulatives, and then she can do the written work. Does that approach seem reasonable? I would love a program to help me with this long-term.

 

Oh wow, long post, so sorry! Hoping that someone will have some helpful thoughts but even if not, it is helpful as I process this!

 

Elizabeth, did the psychologist use the term "nonverbal learning disorder" when s/he gave you the results? It sounds like that's what you're describing. Kids with NVLD are not as good at visual-spatial interpretation/learning as they are at verbal learning. So, it doesn't surprise me at all that the pictures in Singapore Math weren't her thing. Also, kids with nvld have issues with problem solving, so it's no surprise that things can be overwhelming to her, if she has NVLD -- finding a strategy for solving problems may not come naturally to her unless you explicitly teach how to solve a problem step-by-step.

 

My 12-year-old son was just diagnosed with a nvld. His verbal IQ is 35 points higher than his performance (non verbal) IQ. For him, handwriting, writing (essays), abstract concepts, art, visual-spatial interpretation, and parts-to-whole thinking are problems. He can't see the "forest" for the "trees."

 

His verbal skills and memory are strong, so it's hard for people to understand why he "seems" so bright, but - for example - he can't remember faces when he meets people. He struggles to do math word problems. He can tell you what a verb is and what a noun is, but he can't use that information to write correct sentences. He reads individual words very well for his age, but when he reads a story, he can't tell you the main idea, b/c he missed the clues.

 

There are some terrific books about NVLD. Reading about nvld opened my eyes to a lot of issues my son has, and made me understand why I have to tell him 100 times, when his sister needs to hear something 2-3 times to learn it. It helped me understand why he argues so much -- (He's SO CONCRETE!! ;-) -- and why it's so hard for him to follow rules. Kids with nvld don't generalize rules easily, so if the situation is slightly different, they often don't know that the same "rule" applies. So, if you tell a typical kid with nvld, "Don't kick the table!", she might start kicking the chair instead, then wonder why you got angry at her. You didn't *say* not to kick the *chair,* so she didn't realize that you wouldn't want her to do that...

 

It can be crazy-making, if you don't know the reasons behind it. ;-)

 

I can't help with curricula yet, b/c I'm still learning about the disorder myself, but I wanted to say that you're not the only mom dealing with a child with stronger verbal than nonverbal skills!

 

Lisa

[DogwoodMama]

Thanks Lisa! I know that they talked about that there was more than 15 points difference, which in looking at some information online does suggest that she has NVLD. I think they were talking to *me* conceptually and actually trying not to get me to focus on the label, but to understand the concept. But yes, I think that would be her diagnosis... I wish I had the report already to know the specific numbers they gave me.

 

It has been crazy-making, for sure, just figuring out why certain things have not been clicking for her like her "verbal intelligence" would suggest. Very glad to know I'm not alone... didn't know there were books about it, off to search for those! (I am someone who needs as much info as possible.)

[merry gardens]

I'm curious if anyone has any experience, ideas, encouragement for me?

...Now I'm trying to figure out what my goals for her handwriting should be. I still want her to learn to write in some form, legibly. We have recently started New American Cursive, and that does seem to be easier for her. I'm open to different approaches to help her with handwriting because she is really average in non-verbal so YES she should be able to learn to write (right? b/c the average person can learn to write!). We are going to pursue treatments for anxiety, and they think that should help her do better with non-verbal/writing tasks since right now they seem hard to her and she gets overwhelmed and shuts down.

I don't know specifics of your daughter's diagnosis, so take my suggestions with a grain of salt, but I really want to encourage you in your goal that your daughter learn to write legibly in some form!

 

Handwriting has been a major focus for us this year. We tried a couple different things that has helped.

 

One simple thing was different pens. These little fountain pens are fun. My child who always complained about his hand hurting finally stopped complaining when he started using this type of pen. http://www.jetpens.com/index.php/product/view/products_id/421 (It's available in a variety of colors.)

 

Another thing was we started working on stroke formation, zone placement and rhythm separate from letter formation and copy work. We use a program called Callirobics that works on those key elements of legible writing while set to music. It's not an overwhelming amount of work for my children. The music (two songs per daily exercises) varies between relazing and energizing. Maybe something like that migh be helpful. https://secure.nexet.net/callirobics/ecommerce/

[Lisa in Jax]

Thanks Lisa! I know that they talked about that there was more than 15 points difference, which in looking at some information online does suggest that she has NVLD. I think they were talking to *me* conceptually and actually trying not to get me to focus on the label, but to understand the concept. But yes, I think that would be her diagnosis... I wish I had the report already to know the specific numbers they gave me.

 

It has been crazy-making, for sure, just figuring out why certain things have not been clicking for her like her "verbal intelligence" would suggest. Very glad to know I'm not alone... didn't know there were books about it, off to search for those! (I am someone who needs as much info as possible.)

 

I understand their interest in explaining the issues, not the name of the diagnosis, but I'm like you: I *need* information. I am a parts-to-whole thinker, so having the name of the diagnosis helps me get the info (parts) to make sense of the whole (diagnosis). If the neuropsychologist had just said, "there's a 15 point difference" b/t the two parts of the WISC, I'd have struggled to make sense of it.

 

I don't focus on the diagnosis/name, but it does help me to locate the information that I need, so it's helpful. :)

 

In a follow-up post, I'm going to paste all of the details I've been compiling about NVLD. Hopefully, it'll help you.

 

And, if you'd like to correspond via email or telephone to commiserate and/or just share information, please do. I'd love to have someone to "bounce" ideas off of.

 

Lisa

lkporter91 at gmail dot com

[Lisa in Jax]

Copied from various websites -- none of this was written by me. :)

 

Non-Verbal Learning Disorder: 
Guide for Parents

 

 

ERIC Digest article E619, Nonverbal Learning Disability: How to Recognize It and Minimize Its Effects, by Jean M. Foss, 2001. “ERIC Digests are in the public domain and may be freely reproduced and disseminated, as long as the source is acknowledged.â€

 

NLDline, at http://www.nldline.com. “NLDline is hereby granted by the guests to this website the right and license to use, reproduce, modify, publish, create derivative works from, distribute, and display any message posted on NLDline (in whole or in part) worldwide and/or to incorporate it in other works in any form, media or technology now known or later developed.â€

 

What is NLD?

 

Non-verbal learning disorder/disability (abbreviated as NVLD or NLD), is a neurological syndrome where individuals are able to process verbal communication (e.g. spoken or written language), but have extreme difficulties with non-verbal communication.

 

Strengths include verbal, or ‘left brain’ strengths such as

 

Early speech and vocabulary development

Strong verbal ability, so they may talk and sound like they are very competent, and have good memory for things that they have heard (strong auditory retention)

 

Remarkable rote memory skills, attention to detail, early reading skills development and excellent spelling skills

 

Unfortunately, their superficial appearance of competence from their verbal strengths may make it even more hard for others to understand why they have troubles in other areas.

 

Weaknesses may include some but not necessarily all of the following areas:

 

Troubles with non-verbal communication, such as body language, facial expression and tone of voice, understanding humour, or nuances of language

 

Visual-spatial-organizational: they have troubles knowing where things are in space, which may lead to them being lost easily or have more troubles finding their way about; troubles with poor visual recall, faulty spatial perceptions, difficulties with executive functioning.

 

Cognitive processing—difficulty understanding connections between and among independent factors and relating these to the whole; difficulty understanding the "big picture";

 

Language: Social problems: lack of ability to comprehend nonverbal communication, difficulties adjusting to transitions and novel situations, and deficits in social judgment and social interaction; troubles understanding unwritten social rules and social conduct.

 

Behavioral: rigid behavior; difficulty with novelty and transition

 

Troubles understanding what they read, although they may be able to read well

 

Coordination: may have troubles with messy handwriting

 

Because of these difficulties, they may have troubles with ‘executive functioning’, which includes: decision making, planning, initiative, assigning priority, sequencing, motor control, emotional regulation, inhibition, problem solving, planning, impulse control, establishing goals, monitoring results of action, self-correcting.

 

In addition, individuals with NLD may also have other problems that include:

 

Sensory processing difficulties, which may include hypersensitivity to touch (e.g. tags on clothing), sound (e.g. easily distracted or distressed by noise).

Motor problems, which includes problems with gross motor (more problems with balance or being clumsy, which leads to troubles with gym or sports) and fine motor (more problems with handwriting or using one’s hands and fingers).

 

Examples of NLD Behaviors in Children

 

Laura (from ERIC Digest)

 

Laura doesn't like school because the other children don't want to socialize with her. She doesn't enjoy lunch anymore because she has no one to sit with, and now that she's going on 9, her academic work is not as good as it used to be. She has trouble with fractions and reading comprehension.

 

Laura's teacher has tried to talk with Laura, but Laura's response is a monologue of details wtih no point or purpose. She tries to help the girl with reading, but although Laura understands the words, she doesn't seem to comprehend the meaning of what she's read. Problems like these are common for children with nonverbal learning disability (NLD), who often experience social rejection as well as academic difficulty because of the symptoms of their disability.

 

Caitlin (From http://www.nldline.com/dorothy_vacca.htm)

 

Caitlin was reprimanded by the principal for taking a ball away from a classmate. The next day, she took a ball from a different classmate and was again brought to the principal. When asked why she did the same thing for which she had been punished earlier, Caitlin said it was not the same. She would not do it again to the first student, but this was a different student. The principal had to explain that she was not to take anything away from any student, emphasizing both the specific action that was problematic and the application of the rule to all students.

 

Overview of NLD (from ERIC Digest)

 

People with NLD have difficulty processing nonverbal, nonlinguistic information, yet they may be very good at processing verbal information. They often fail to monitor the reactions of a listener. Frequently, they are excessively verbal and expressive. They depend on verbal input, verbal mediation, and verbal self-direction in order to function. They may talk a great deal, yet use words in a narrow, rigid way. Other behaviors affecting communication and social interactions include interrupting people, perhaps by speaking out of turn or by moving back and forth between people engaged in conversation, standing too close, or touching too much. Consequently, other people may choose not to interact with them, may avoid them, or may even ostracize them. Individuals of all ages may exhibit characteristics of NLD. The reactions of others tend to leave them feeling isolated, lonely, and sad. They usually want to learn appropriate social behaviors, and they generally respond positively to instruction that leads to improved social behavior.

 

Performance Patterns in Assessment (from ERIC Digest)

 

The consequences of NLD for learning, life, and work cause concerned parents and teachers to seek a psychological, psychoeducational, or neuropsychological evaluation in order to understand the nature of the difficulties and possible remedies.

 

Assessments usually reveal a pattern of strengths in verbal tasks and weaknesses in visual, spatial, and other nonverbal tasks.

 

For example, on the Wechsler scale, the verbal IQ tends to be significantly higher than the performance IQ. Verbal abstract reasoning as measured by the Similarities subscale of the Wechsler is often a relative strength, while nonverbal reasoning as measured by Block Design is often weak, as are Object Assembly, Picture Arrangement, and Coding.

 

Achievement tests that measure oral reading, word identification, word decoding, and rote spelling yield relatively higher scores than measures of reading comprehension. In mathematics, computation is often stronger than conceptual understanding and applications.

 

Individuals with NLD tend to focus on details rather than on the larger picture. Therefore, they may have great difficulty setting priorities, separating the main idea from details, developing outlines, taking notes, and organizing paragraphs based on topic sentences. Mathematics concepts based on part-whole relationships, such as fractions, decimals, and percentages, tend to be problematic. Because of difficulties perceiving spatial relationships, individuals with NLD may have trouble copying spatial designs and drawing these from memory.

 

The inability to separate the essentials from the details also affects interpersonal and social communications, both receptive and expressive. For example, people with NLD might not be able to select and attend to the important points of a conversation, or they may ramble, providing a myriad of details without making clear points.

 

>>> Continued in next post.

[Lisa in Jax]

Improving Understanding and Performance (from ERIC Digest)

 

Effective educational interventions begin by addressing organizational difficulties, working with part-whole relationships, and working toward integrating verbal and nonverbal processes. Interventions use verbal strength to analyze and mediate information (e.g., by describing a scene or situation to oneself), and self-talk to provide direction for completing tasks (e.g., by sequencing the steps to a task and saying each step to oneself). Effective interventions include modifying academic and social environments and direct skills instruction. Direct instruction must include a clear explanation of the contexts in which the skill can be applied.

 

Modifying Environments (from ERIC Digest)

 

In the academic environment, it is important to address the student's difficulty in prioritizing tasks and organizing the steps necessary to accomplish those tasks. A student who is overwhelmed may become unable to function and thus unable to complete the task.

 

Modifications that contribute to a supportive academic environment for the person with NLD include

 

Ensuring that all the student's teachers know that the student has NLD and understand its implications.

Establishing performance expectations based on observation and knowledge of what the student is able to complete or produce, given the nature of the tasks and the time available.

Providing structure and directions about priorities for completing multiple tasks.

Arranging with other teachers to stagger the demands for products (papers, projects, tests, etc.), so that they are not all due at the same time.

 

Modifications that facilitate socialization include the following:

 

Being sensitive to situations that have high potential for the student to behave inappropriately and intervening to avoid behavior that might lead to criticism, teasing, or social ostracism.

Engaging the student in a collaboration in which the teacher or parent signals when the student is making a social error and the student agrees to immediately stop the behavior.

Arranging structured social activities for young children (through elementary school); coaching the child in how to participate; and signaling the child discreetly if he behaves in a manner that turns others away.

 

Providing Direct Instruction (from ERIC Digest)

 

Students with NLD generally respond to direct instruction and guided practice. Perception of spatial relationships, ability to copy and draw geometric forms and designs, handwriting, reading comprehension, mathematics concepts and skills, and social perception and communication skills can be improved by explicit instruction. This instruction, modified for the nature of the task or skill, incorporates the following underlying principles:

 

Be clear and direct in addressing the difficulty.

Gain a commitment from the learner to collaborate to improve the weakness.

Begin the work with what is most familiar and simple-the more novel or complex, the more difficult the task.

Rely heavily on the student's verbal and analytic strengths.

Model verbal mediation of nonverbal information while teaching the learner how to use this strength. For example, use words to describe and analyze a scene or situation.

Provide specific sequenced verbal instructions, teaching the learner to verbally self-direct and eventually to internalize this process.

Provide instruction to directly associate and integrate verbal labels and description with concrete objects, actions, and experiences.

Encourage the student to use multisensory integration, both receptively and expressively (read it, see it, hear it, touch it, say it, write it, do it).

Teach in a sequential, step-by-step fashion.

Identify opportunities to generalize newly learned skills to other situations and to practice in those situations.

 

Coping through routines, consistency

 

The cluster of behaviors and deficits common in students with a nonverbal learning disability cause the developing student to feel uncertain, insecure, and anxious (Thompson, 1997). To help ease the anxiety, the student becomes dependent on predictable routines and what may appear to be ritualistic behaviors. Unlike individuals with obsessive-compulsive disorder, who are aware of their obsessions and compulsions and do not want to have them, students with a nonverbal learning disability are attached to the rituals and resist changing them. They need to have them. Without them, life is too frightening, confusing, and unpredictable. These routines and escapes vary greatly from student to student. In some instances, they are "good" activities taken to the extreme.

 

Developing Social Competence (from ERIC Digest)

 

The interpersonal and social aspects of NLD have great significance for a student's life. The individual who does not attend to or accurately interpret the nonverbal communication of others cannot receive a clear message. Our concept of self is shaped in large measure by the reflection of how others view us. The person who has NLD, then, may not receive feedback from others and may suffer from a less clear concept of self. The diminished ability to engage with others greatly limits the possibility of defining himself based on such feedback.

 

Because of their verbal strengths, many individuals with NLD succeed in formal educational situations. However, if their social competence has not developed commensurately, they may not find and keep employment at the level for which their education has prepared them.

 

Because individuals with NLD make considerable progress in areas of weakness when instruction is appropriate, accurate diagnosis and appropriate instruction can have great benefit for their lives.

[Lisa in Jax]

Compensations

 

Source: THE GRAM: Nonverbal Learning Disorders. Retrieved Sep 1, 2004 from http://www.ldaca.org/gram/thompson.htm'>http://www.ldaca.org/gram/thompson.htm'>http://www.ldaca.org/gram/thompson.htm'>http://www.ldaca.org/gram/thompson.htm

 

This child will have difficulties with internal and external organization and coordination. Tardiness is something he may struggle with (despite great pains to be punctual) and this should not be treated as a misbehavior. Help this child by allowing him extra time to get places and by giving him verbal cues to navigate through space. Continually assess his understanding of spatial and directional concepts.

Never underestimate the gravity of this disability. Dr. Rourke states, "One of the most frequent criticisms of remedial intervention programs with this particular type of child is that the remedial authorities are unaware of the extent and significance of the child's deficits" and the emphasizes that "the principal impediment to engaging in this rather slow and painstaking approach to teaching the child with NLD is the caregiver's (faulty) impression that the child is much more adept and adaptable than is actually the case." Dr Rourke also warns that: "Observers tend to overvalue the 'intelligence' of NLD adolescents . . . [and] this is the principal reason for an unwillingness to adopt an approach to formal educational intervention that would increase the NLD youngster's probability of success." The naivete of parents and educators regarding the significance of the NLD syndrome inevitably leads to inappropriate expectations being placed upon this child. Expectations for this child should always be applied with flexibility, taking into consideration the fact that she has different needs and abilities than her peer group. (Note: This individual's progress is almost always further impeded by anosognosia--the "virtual inability" to reflect on the nature and seriousness" of [her own] problems").

Do not force independence on this child if you sense she is not yet ready for something (trust your instincts and be careful not to compare her with other children of the same age). It is detrimental to isolate her, but don't make the mistake of thinking she can be left to her own resources when faced with new and/or complex situations. Give her verbal compensatory strategies to deal more effectively with novel situations. The world can be very scary for someone who is misreading 65% of all communication and she will naturally be reluctant to try new things. The social skill development of this child has been delayed by misconceptions which may have caused serious issues of insecurity to evolve. The myth of the "overprotective mother" needs to be dismissed; parents and professionals must both assume a "protective" and helpful role with the NLD child. Dr. Rourke states, "Although sensitive caregivers are often accused of 'overprotection', it is clear that they may be the only ones who have an appreciation for the child's vulnerability and lack of appropriate skill development." Care and discretion need to be taken to shield the child from teasing, persecution, and other sources of anxiety. Independence should be introduced gradually, in controlled, non-threatening situations. The more completely those around her understand this child and her particular strengths and weaknesses, the better prepared they will be to promote attitudes of personal independence. Never leave this child to her own devices in new activities or situations which lack sufficient structure.

Avoid power struggles, punishment, and threatening. This child does not understand rigid displays of authority and anger. Threats, such as "if you {do this}, then {something unfortunate} will happen to you," only serve to destroy this child's sense of hope. The goals and expectations assigned to him must be attainable and worthwhile. Remember that taking away "privileges" will not cure a child of a neurological disability (but may very well establish him on the path to depression). This is an inappropriate intervention model on the part of the adults involved and it is detrimental and damaging to this child's development and well-being. The "confusion" and social awkwardness he displays are real and non-intentional; they should not be viewed as conduct to be penalized.

All adults owe it to this child to always assume the best--to always take a positive rather than a negative approach. As we have seen, life is very demanding and difficult for the child with NLD. Most of her unusual behavioral responses serve a purpose and usually represent the child's own attempt at compensation. It is wise to try to uncover the reason for the behavior and to help the child devise an appropriate (more acceptable) replacement behavior (usually through a detailed verbal explanation). Parents and professionals need to make the effort to have the child explain his dilemma and to try to determine what purpose the behavior might be serving. Then serve the child's need rather than punishing her resulting behavior. Remember, as with all children, at least 90% of your interactions with this child must be positive in nature!

 

Accommodations

 

Source: THE GRAM: Nonverbal Learning Disorders. Retrieved Sep 1, 2004 from http://www.ldaca.org/gram/thompson.htm

 

School assignments which require merely copying text need to be modified or omitted, owing to the visual-spatial nature of such an exercise. Active verbalization and/or subvocalization are the best memory approaches for this child.

Test answer sheet layouts and the arrangement of visual-spatial math assignments need to be simplified (no credit should be lost for a correct answer placed in the wrong column or space). Whenever possible, use of graph paper is recommended to keep columns aligned in written math assignments or consumable math texts should be provided for this student.

Paper and pencil tasks need to be kept to a minimum because of finger dexterity and visual-spatial problems. Occupational therapy is a consideration for the younger child. Verbally mediated practices to improve handwriting may result in improvements in control and fluency, but the process will remain laborious. Use of a computer word processor is highly recommended for all written school assignments, as the spatial and fine motor skills needed for typing are not as complicated as those involved in handwriting.

The global confusions which underlie nonverbal learning disorders also result in limiting the student's ability to produce the quantity of written work normally expected of her grade-level peers. This child requires continuous assistance with organizing information and communicating in writing. Adjustments must be made in teacher expectations for volume of written products. Additional time will be needed for all written assignments.

Tasks requiring folding, cutting with scissors, and/or arranging material in a visual-spatial manner (maps, graphs, mobiles, etc.) will require considerable assistance, provided in an accommodating manner or they should be eliminated entirely.

Any timed assignments will need to be modified or eliminated. Processing of all information is performed at a much slower rate when you are compensating for any type of cerebral dysfunction. Time constraints often prove to be counterproductive, as this student is easily overwhelmed by the unrealistic expectations of his teachers.

Adults need to check often for understanding and present information in plain and clear verbal terms (i.e., "spell out" everything). A "parts-to-whole" verbal teaching approach should be utilized. This child will need to ask a lot of questions, as this is her primary means of gathering information.

All expectations need to be direct and explicit. Don't require this child to "read between the lines" to glean your intentions. Avoid sarcasm, figurative speech, idioms, slang, etc., unless you plan to explain your usage. Write out exact expectations for any situation where the child may seriously misperceive complex directions and/or proper social cues. Feedback given to the student should always be constructive and encouraging or there will be no benefits derived.

This student's schedule needs to be as predictable as possible. He should be prepared in advance for changes in routine, such as: assemblies, field trips, minimum days, vacation days, finals, etc.This child needs to be assigned to one case manager at school who will oversee her progress and can assure that all of the school staff are implementing the necessary accommodations and modifications. Inservice training and orientation for all school staff that promotes tolerance and acceptance is a vital part of the overall plan for success, as everyone must be familiar with, and supportive of, the child's academic and social needs.

[Lisa in Jax]

Modifications

 

Source: THE GRAM: Nonverbal Learning Disorders. Retrieved Sep 1, 2004 from http://www.ldaca.org/gram/thompson.htm'>http://www.ldaca.org/gram/thompson.htm'>http://www.ldaca.org/gram/thompson.htm'>http://www.ldaca.org/gram/thompson.htm

 

This child needs to be in a learning environment that provides daily, non-threatening contact with nondisabled peers (i.e., not a "special" or "alternative" program) in order to further his social development.

This child will benefit from cooperative learning situations (when grouped with "good role models"). Active verbalization is an important element in how this child learns. She usually has extensive verbal information to share with the others and can be exposed to the "give and take" of a miniature social environment in a non-threatening, controlled milieu. Obviously, the child with nonverbal learning disorders would not be expected to be the "scribe" in a cooperative grouping—her contribution should be in the verbal arena. The least effective learning model for this child is isolation. She must be allowed to verbalize an d to have verbal feedback in order to learn.

Transitions will always be difficult for this child so he will need time during the school day to collect his thoughts before "switching gears." This may mean: extra time before and after breaks to disengage and readjust to the changes in pace; less changing of rooms and more time spent with one teacher; a study hall that is built into the student's schedule at middle and high school levels; and/or a carefully selected non-NLD peer "buddy" to help guide him through the day.

Placement must be in an environment which has a well-established routine because this child will not decipher nonverbal cues. She cannot adjust well to constant changes in routine (this child lacks the ability to "wing it" in times of doubt) and has learned to fear all new and/or unknown situations and experiences. She needs to know what will happen next and to be able to count on consistent responses from the staff who work with her.

Special presentation procedures need to be adapted for those subjects requiring visual-spatial- organizational and/or nonverbal problem-solving skills. Or, as Dr. Rourke suggests, "avoid such material altogether."

 

Strategies

 

Source: THE GRAM: Nonverbal Learning Disorders. Retrieved Sep 1, 2004 from http://www.ldaca.org/gram/thompson.htm

 

Do tell this child everything and encourage her to give you verbal feedback. The most effective instructional procedures are those that associate verbal labels with concrete situations and experiences. "I shouldn't have to tell you" does not apply--assume you do have to tell her. She cannot "look and learn."

Verbally teach (don't expect the child to observe) cognitive strategies for the skills of conversational pragmatics (the "give and take" and comfortable beginnings and endings of a conversation, how and when to change the subject, formal versus informal conversational idiosyncrasies, tone and expression of voice, etc.) and nonverbal body language (facial expressions, correct social distance, when the limit or cut-off point has been reached, etc.). This child will not perceive that he is trying someone's patience until that person verbally explodes! Give him some additional verbal cues before the boiling point because he does not "sense" tension or displeasure.

Observe and expand the coping techniques that the child has already acquired on his/her own. Focus on developing flexible concepts and time order.

Group the child with "good role models" so that she can label and learn appropriate behavior. Remember she won't differentiate between appropriate versus inappropriate behavior unless the distinctions are verbally pointed out to her. Isolation is the "kiss of death" for this child.

Adult role models should "talk their way" through situations in the presence of this child in order to give him a verbal view of someone else's "internal speech" process. In essence, you will be making your internal speech external so that the child can pick up the skills needed to coordinate his own problem-solving approaches. Help the child devise a sequence of steps for self-questioning and self-monitoring, verbalizing each step.

Isolation, deprivation, and punishment are not effective methods to change the behavior of a child who is already trying his best to conform (but misinterpreting all kinds of nonverbal cues). If inappropriate behaviors are causing problems at school, a functional analysis and behavioral intervention plan detailing a course of action which is designed to be useful and nonpunitive in nature may need to be a part of this child's IEP or 504 plan

 

Recommended Websites

 

LD OnLine http://www.ldonline.org

 

NLDA, Nonverbal Learning Disorders Association, PO Box 220, Canton, CT 06019-0220. e-mail: NLDResources@aol.com, http://www.nlda.org

 

NLDline http://www.nldline.com

 

NLD On the Web http://www.nldontheweb.org

>>>> end

[Lisa in Jax]

Nonverbal learning disabilities are less well known than language-based learning disabilities such as dyslexia. Typically, people with nonverbal LD show:

- excellent memory for things they hear - poor memory for things they see - good reading ability; poor reading comprehension/poor identification of main idea(s) - poor arithmetic ability, especially abstract concepts, geometry, fractions, etc. - excellent verbal expression and verbal reasoning - problems with written expression (in part because of poor handwriting) - problems with sense of direction, estimation of size, shape, distance - problems reading facial expressions, gestures, social cues, tones of voice

The chief characteristics of nonverbal LD include:

- tactile-perceptual deficits, usually on the left side of the body;

- coordination difficulties, again often more marked on the left side of the body;

- problems with visual‐spatial organization;

- extreme difficulty adapting to new and complex situations;

- reliance on rote behaviors (which may or may not be appropriate) in new situations;

- trouble understanding nonverbal feedback in social situations;

- problems with social perception, social judgment and social interaction;

- distorted sense of time;

- very strong rote verbal abilities (e.g. large vocabulary);

- reliance on language as the primary means for social relating, information gathering and relief from anxiety;

- difficulties with arithmetic and, later, with scientific concepts and theories;

- inattention and hyperactivity earlier in childhood; and social withdrawal and isolation later.

Students with nonverbal LD generally appear to possess above-average cognitive skills because of their verbal strengths, but often show academic difficulties as they reach secondary levels.

Spatial and coordination problems make printing and writing, learning math, telling time, reading and coloring maps and keeping their place on the page difficult from early grades. By high school, more complex verbal language is based on nonverbal processes like spatial relationships (in science, for example), logical ordering, and sequencing (both skills necessary for writing essays). This can cause problems in subject areas other than math. As well, students often experience difficulties with sense of time, arranging written material on a page, making change, and sewing and typing, all of which demand good spatial awareness.

Throughout the school years, kids with nonverbal LD are often inattentive and poorly organized because they have trouble integrating and interpreting incoming information. They tend to pay attention to each detail as it comes in, rather than combining them into more meaningful wholes. The effort quickly leads to information overload, with which these students will often cope by clinging to familiar habits and routines that help them to structure their world. Sometimes this adaptation appears as misbehavior.

In later secondary and postsecondary education, information is frequently presented in lecture form. For students with nonverbal LD, problems arise because they have to integrate information they hear with the act of writing, already difficult because writing is often awkward and slow. As well, students who attend equally to individual details as they appear have enormous difficulty separating important from unimportant information.

Teachers can support students with nonverbal LD by outlining material to be covered, using overheads containing central points while lecturing, providing clear schedules of the day's events, breaking complex tasks down into smaller, sequenced pieces, using discussion rather than lectures to develop and integrate ideas, and using students' strengths in rote learning to help them develop habits and routines to organize themselves and their work.

Has difficulty generalizing previously learned information Generalization is the transfer and application of previous learning to new situations and contexts. We are constantly making spontaneous connections, realizing that a particular concept applies to a wide range of topics and/or recognizing that a particular strategy might apply to a number of situations. The student with NLD is stymied when confronted with a situation which she has not previously encountered, even if the new situation is only slightly different from one for which she has previously developed a successful strategy. This child is often unable to understand what is expected of her because she is unable to apply rules and principles learned at other times and in other situations to a situation she currently faces. Difficulty generalizing information will cause problems in modifying learned patterns to make them applicable to new situations and in prediction of outcome.

When working with a student with NLD, teachers often complain that this child "treats everything as though it were an isolated fact or event." The factual information that is so well-memorized and regurgitated in lengthy monologues by this child doesn't ever seem to get "packaged" with other similar information. Therefore, present learning is not connected to other previous learning. Cause-and-effect relationships are lost. It becomes necessary to discuss individual situations in depth with this student, as they arise.

This child learns through discussion (verbal mediation). Generalization skills that are acquired spontaneously by most students need to be addressed in a specific step-by-step manner with this student. Verbally review the information being presented and take specific steps to help her internalize it and connect it to other previously learned information. Encourage the generalization of learning. This can be accomplished by:

• Never expecting the student to automatically generalize instructions or concepts;

• Using language as the bridge to tie new situations to old learning;

• Reviewing past information before presenting new concepts; • Verbally pointing out similarities, differences and connections; • Verbally indicating generalizations which can be drawn in various

situations; • Methodically discussing the cause-and-effect relationships of

events and situations with the student.

Has difficulty following multi-step instructions

Confusion over what needs to be done can be at the heart of a student's failure to complete class assignments or follow class directions. Most students remember a series of instructions by visualizing themselves performing each step in the series. They don't try to remember each word (verbatim) in a long string of directives. However, because the student with NLD is unable to pass this information to the right hemisphere and visualize the sequence, he attempts to memorize every word as it is said to him. He is then expected to act upon the directives in the prescribed sequential manner. This, of course, is much more difficult than simply storing factual information (and proves to be less effective).

More often than not, one or two of the directions are properly implemented (with possibly a step or two omitted in between), and then the student asks, "What should I do now?" (An exasperated mother recently told me her son with NLD's mantra is "What's next?"). Teachers will often mistake this type of behavior for an attention or listening problem. This is not the case. The child was paying close attention and heard the whole series of instructions, but because he was unable to visualize himself carrying through, he could not "hold on" to the information. He is not inattentive or unmotivated, but rather his brain processes information differently from most other students. So, obviously, this situation will not be helped by repeatedly telling this student to "Pay attention!" It is up to the teacher to "capture" multiple oral instructions on tape or by written handout. You may need to reduce and space out your directions when addressing the needs of this child. Accommodate him for the abilities he lacks neurologically. This can be accomplished by:

• Writing out and/or tape recording multi-step instructions; • Numbering and presenting instructions in the most efficient

sequence; • Breaking all tasks down into manageable segments and

presenting them a few at a time; • Making sure the student understands your instructions- don't

assume that repeating them back to you means that he will

remember and can follow through; • Pairing the student with NLD with a nondisabled "buddy" who can

remind him of "the next step;" • \Teaching the student mnemonic devices for short term memory

enhancement;

• Checking with the student at frequent intervals to be sure he is not "lost" or confused.

Makes very literal translations

The student with NLD tends to make very literal translations of speech and text. Her images are concrete and her ability to make sense of abstract connotations and inferences is poor. She will, in all instances, use and interpret speech literally. This child lacks the capacity to decipher colloquialisms or metaphorical expressions. She will not know when she is being teased or duped. It is up to the teacher to provide an accurate bridge between the child's interpretation of language and the actual meaning of what has been said or written. In this way, the student with NLD can more easily determine the gist of a conversation or literary assignment. Her responses will then become more appropriate.

When abstract concepts must be used, provide additional verbal information, breaking-down and explaining the abstract idea in detail. Avoid making nebulous directives, such as "You need to mind!" or asking vague questions such as, "Are you ready?" Adults need to be specific and interpret abstract concepts, so that this child can make sense of what she hears and reads.

 

>>> Con't in next post.

[Lisa in Jax]

Con't from last post:

 

This can be accomplished by:

• Explaining what you mean by the things you say which may be misinterpreted;

• Simplifying and breaking-down abstract concepts; • Starting with concrete concepts and images and slowly moving to

abstract concepts and images, at a pace set by the student; • Understanding that metaphors, emotional nuances, multiple

levels of meanings, and relationship issues as presented in novels

will not be understood unless explained; • Teaching the student to say "I'm not sure what you mean" or

"That doesn't make sense to me" to give her a specific vocabulary to help her decipher your intent.

Asks too many questions

The student with NLD tends to ask repetitive questions and have trouble letting go of his ideas. He often inappropriately interrupts the flow of a lesson with his seemingly never-ending stream of questions. This can become frustrating for both the teacher and the other students in the class, while the student with NLD remains oblivious to the nuisance he is creating. Remember - - this child learns through verbal mediation. It is his only way of gathering new information. He doesn't learn through observation or "trial and error." A good way to

look at it is: If he's not talking, he's not learning. Understanding this should help you to better appreciate his constant questions and monologues. When this student engages in repetitive verbal questioning, you must validate his need to receive verbal responses (his other senses are not taking in enough information), while at the same time you must find ways to redirect the continuous interruptions of class time and teach appropriate social behavior. Nonverbal reinforcers, such as: using a exasperated tone of voice to show your irritation, raising your eyebrows to denote your displeasure, or even ignoring the child's questions will not get your point across. Merely answering all of his questions seldom helps, either, as there will always be more questions. This child will not know when "enough is enough."

On the other hand, the student with NLD who is repeatedly reprimanded and told "Don't interrupt!" is in danger of withdrawing because he is unable to discern the appropriate times to ask his questions. This child may clam-up and shut-down completely. Dr. Rourke suggests that specific training be employed with this student in "what to say," "how to say it," and "when to say it." It is important to address this dilemma with extreme sensitivity. This can be accomplished by:

• Answering the student's questions whenever it is possible and practical (other students in the class may actually have the same questions, but be lacking in the verbal abilities to ask them);

• Starting the other students on the assignment and then individually answering the rest of this student's questions;

• Designating a specific time during the day when you can continue a discussion which needs to end at the moment;

• Telling the student you only have time to answer three questions right now (a specific number is important - - don't say "a few"), but that you will be glad to answer three more of his questions during the recess break;

• Specifically teaching the student when it is appropriate to ask for help (i.e. if he will be unable to continue his assignment unless something he doesn't understand is explained to him) and the appropriate methods of doing so;

• Explicitly teaching the rules of polite social conduct, so that the child does not constantly interrupt class activities with his questions.

Imparts the "illusion of competency"

The student with NLD is cognitively intact, usually displaying above- average to superior verbal intelligence. This creates an "illusion of competency" and the expectation for success in school. This child's adult-like manner of speaking and impressive vocabulary give the illusory impression that he is highly competent and understands much more about the world around him than he actually does. Although he may have well-developed speech, practical life skills and "street smarts" are deficient.

• Never assuming this child understands something just because he can parrot back what you have just said;

• Never assuming this child understands what he has read, just because he is a "proficient" reader (has excellent word recognition);

• Offering added verbal explanations when the child seems "lost" or registers obvious confusion.

Statements like the following are often true of individuals with a nonverbal learning disability:

• They talk a lot but really say very little. • They see the "trees" not the "forest." • They focus on details, do not apprehend the main idea. • They do not "see the whole picture." • They do not "read" facial expressions, gestures, or other

nonverbal aspects of communication; they miss the subtleties,

nuances. • They may be inappropriate in their social interactions. • They have few friends; friendships tend to be with older or

younger persons rather than peers. • They tend to process information in a linear, sequential fashion,

not seeing multiple dimensions. • In spite of relative strength in sequencing or recalling sequences,

they may confuse abstract temporal concepts; they have

significant difficulty recognizing cause-effect relationships. • They frequently "shut down" when faced with pressure to

perform; such pressure might come from too many simultaneous demands, from tasks which seem too complex, or from expectations to perform at a rate which seems too rapid.

• As adults they tend to be underemployed relative to their educational experiences.

We aspire to help these young people to adapt and to achieve fulfillment in their lives. At the outset, we accept that they are eager to learn, to fit in, to succeed, and to do what they can to accomplish their goals. We seek to understand how they learn, to engage them in explicit and direct instruction to remediate their difficulties, and to use their strengths most effectively. We can be most effective if we do the following:

• Provide verbal mediation for nonverbal experiences, and in conjunction with their interactions with others, whenever appropriate.

• Teach them to use their own verbal analytic strengths to mediate their own experiences.

• Anticipate situations in which they might have difficulty, and act as a buffer and support to facilitate the most positive outcomes possible - help them to anticipate the kinds of situations in which they might have difficulty, and to plan in advance some alternative responses they might have to those situations.

• Teach them to interpret facial expressions, gestures and other nonverbal aspects of communication.

• Teach them to watch for and interpret indications from others that they are talking too much, or that the communication is ineffective in some other way.

• Monitor their understanding when communicating, and teach them to self-monitor their understanding and ask clarifying questions.

• Be particularly careful to ensure their understanding when spatial language is involved.

• Take care to make cause-effect relationships explicit, whenever possible.

• Help this learner to anticipate cause and effect relationships in order to avoid difficulties in many areas of life.

• Teach and practice organizational skills. • Control as much as possible the demands for performance to be

sure they are manageable and not seemingly overwhelming. • Relying on verbal strengths, help this individual practice and

internalize the process of making decisions, setting goals, making plans and taking action to achieve those goals, and reflecting and

evaluating the results. The outcome of the process must be to credit oneself for one's own efforts and accomplishments.

[Alenee]

Lisa, I can't thank you enough for posting this information. :grouphug: I almost didn't come back to this thread after my computer had trouble loading it to begin with. This description is MY KID. I'm curious if any of this falls under a DX of Dysgraphia/Dyspraxia/Dyslexia? We're considering having our 9yo dd tested but I'm not sure it will be helpful unless I can be directed toward ways of helping her. I've been fumbling around the 'net for the past few weeks looking at all of the 'Dys-----' above but *this* thread seemed to encompass nearly everything my dd suffers with. Has anyone worked with Audiblox to help this?

[Laura Corin]

Calvin had a forty point difference between verbal and non-verbal on the test like the WISC but for younger children... WPPSI? He didn't have issues with spelling, though. Things I did when he was your child's age:

 

- we did all subjects orally except those that specifically dealt with writing. So maths, history, geography, science, creative writing... were all dictated to me. Simultaneously, we worked diligently on a handwriting programme (we used HWT cursive) to bring him up to legibility.

 

- I learned to expect that any maths topic that involved spatial perception would take twice or three times as long as one that was abstract/word based. I just built this into my plan for the year: zip through the pre-algebra, wade through the pre-geometry. Over time his geometry has improved, and he is now achieving a low A overall in maths.

 

- we started typing instruction early and made sure that he reached fluency.

 

- slowly, as his writing improved, he did more and more of his work without dictating to me. I would say that he didn't reach a full writing load until he was about twelve. At that point he was doing about half his writing by hand, half on the keyboard.

 

Fast forward to today. Calvin attends private school and is in his first year of high school, in US terms. His teachers complain about his handwriting, but it is just about legible. For longer pieces he uses a keyboard, and has special permission to use one for public exams (SAT and AP equivalents).

 

I remember how very worried I was about Calvin when he was little, but with diligence from him and understanding from me he has achieved a lot.

 

Best wishes

 

Laura

[PrincessAriel]

nt

[PrincessAriel]

nt

[DogwoodMama]

Thanks for all the great info, Lisa!

 

I am currently reading "Raising NLD Superstars" just for a general overview since this is all new to me. Wow. I have marked this book up so much already. So many little quirks and challenges we have had over time, culminating in our bigger issues/challenges are now making sense. I couldn't see before how different things were related- I keep reading and seeing issue after issue is common for NLD kids. My poor dh, he always tends to focus on the one or two pieces that *don't* fit her (for example, her linguistic understanding seems to really be exception, she does use words appropriately and has exceptional comprehension, not just reading ability), so I've been noting all the little things mentioned in the book, and then I'm going to tell *him* a story... because he has a hard thing seeing little things as a whole (which seems to be a NLD thing too! I see aspects of both me & dh seem to have combined, something which we have noted for a while.)

 

Anyway, what other books do folks recommend? I'm looking for good information, encouragement, strategies...

 

Also trying not to panic, because I feel like I have been reading that the elementary years are *better* years and that issues seem to intensify in middle and high school. It just kind of gives me a sinking feeling, and that's when I start getting upset, thinking I just want a "normal" child. Teen years are hard enough. But she is a blessing, and I shouldn't borrow trouble...

[guateangel]

Also trying not to panic, because I feel like I have been reading that the elementary years are *better* years and that issues seem to intensify in middle and high school. It just kind of gives me a sinking feeling, and that's when I start getting upset, thinking I just want a "normal" child. Teen years are hard enough. But she is a blessing, and I shouldn't borrow trouble...

 

Yes! This is what I worry about. DD is a social butterfly but the 'experts' warn that this changes as they get older. There are many other NVLD signs that dd does not exhibit....yet. Sigh.

[Guest attemptedmotherhood]

I am not comment on the LD part of your question at all. But I will suggest that one of the reasons your daughter scored well with verbal math skills and word problems is because of Singapore Math and that she doesn't have to have writing anxiety about math problems she answers verbally or can do in her head. Before you chuck the math, get the Home Instructor Guide if you don't have it. It does exactly what you want, teach the skill verbally and with manipulatives then work through the textbook together and finally the workbook. I know lots of people say you can just teach Singapore without a teacher/Instructor guide, but my daughter's understand is much better since I have more ideas of how to present the material. If you already use this resource just disregard everything I said. If

[DogwoodMama]

I am not comment on the LD part of your question at all. But I will suggest that one of the reasons your daughter scored well with verbal math skills and word problems is because of Singapore Math and that she doesn't have to have writing anxiety about math problems she answers verbally or can do in her head. Before you chuck the math, get the Home Instructor Guide if you don't have it. It does exactly what you want, teach the skill verbally and with manipulatives then work through the textbook together and finally the workbook. I know lots of people say you can just teach Singapore without a teacher/Instructor guide, but my daughter's understand is much better since I have more ideas of how to present the material. If you already use this resource just disregard everything I said. If

 

Can I just say THANK YOU! Really. *I* feel like a dunce. I do have the home instructor's guides, but for whatever reason our pattern was "start with the workbook" and after looking at it, I can see that is really not how they intended. I had only skimmed the home educator's guide, and pulled it out as a resource, not using it as they intended. I would just explain as we went through the workbook. But after looking at it, wow, what a great resource! I think I will try using the guide to finish up our year (I want to make sure she really does have a good working sense all the strategies for adding/subtracting through 100, and do the intro to multiplication/division which we have not gotten to) without even using the workbook at all, just do the teaching parts of it. I did get some tiles with numbers on them, so we can use that instead of writing, if I feel the need.

 

Wow, glad I took a second look at the teacher's guide! Now I'm itching to go look at Grade 2 materials...

[Guest junebugfarms]

Hi Elizabeth,

 

My son was diagnosed 2 years ago (at age 5) with NLD. He had the typical 20 point spread between verbal and performance IQ (136 to 116) along with extremely poor visual motor coordination. Writing is very difficult for him and I've found that the New American Cursive program works best for us (we've tried Handwriting W/O Tears and several others). I particularly like their StartWrite software program which allows me to print out practice sheets with whatever level of guidelines I feel is necessary (e.g. gray lines, dotted lines, etc.)

 

He has seen an OT for the past three years for a variety of issues including sensory processing disorder. They've recently begun working on his visual motor integration issues, which should help with the handwriting frustration. If your son has not yet been screened bym or referred to an OT, I highly recommend you look into it over the summer.

 

I have just about every book you could want on NLD, but my latest favorite is "Nonverbal Learning Disabilities at School" by Pamela B. Tanguay. I've had this on my bookshelf for almost a year and only just last week picked it up. Oh wow, do I wish I had read this before I started homeschooling! She goes into all the details about how best to educate your NLD kid, including specific tips for division, spelling, quizzes, etc. It is by far the most helpful book I've found for navigating the educational maze that seems to exist with NLD kids.

 

I see you're also in Raleigh. If you're interested in talking further, please feel free to send me a private message and I'll get back to you. Our OT is Dawn Rohlik of Pediatric Possibilities.

 

Best of luck!

[Geo]

I understand their interest in explaining the issues, not the name of the diagnosis, but I'm like you: I *need* information. I am a parts-to-whole thinker, so having the name of the diagnosis helps me get the info (parts) to make sense of the whole (diagnosis). If the neuropsychologist had just said, "there's a 15 point difference" b/t the two parts of the WISC, I'd have struggled to make sense of it.

 

I don't focus on the diagnosis/name, but it does help me to locate the information that I need, so it's helpful. :)

 

In a follow-up post, I'm going to paste all of the details I've been compiling about NVLD. Hopefully, it'll help you.

 

And, if you'd like to correspond via email or telephone to commiserate and/or just share information, please do. I'd love to have someone to "bounce" ideas off of.

 

Lisa

lkporter91 at gmail dot com

 

My ds11 was diagnosed just last year, even though I had suspected it for years. His processing speed is in the 1st percentile...that alone makes both of our lives very frustrating. Antidepressants were first order for both of us. That has made all the difference. His meltdowns (which precipitated my own) have decreased to only a few times a week...usually because I am trying to rush him, not on schoolwork mind you (I've got that one down)...just everything else. :crying: Since lat week I'm chomping at the bit to buy the "Simply Classical" book about classical education and special needs children. I read sample pages on memoriapress.com and found it inspiring, as well as comforting. In also I found the 2 books, "Nonverbal Disorders at Home/School" very helpful with matching behaviors with what's really going on with him at the moment. Amazon has some cheap, used copies I saw the other day. Hey would anyone here consider forming a NVLD group on the board? Just wondering (and hoping). Please forgive my stream-of-consciousness style as I type this.

[SadieMarie]

My dd was diagnosd with NLD when she was six. She is almost eight now. Below are all books I have found helpful. There are others.

 

I think one of the things to keep in mind about NLD is that can affect children in different ways and to different degrees. Motor problems, both gross and fine, can be affected. But some kids are very mildly affected or not at all and for some it will be severe. It is the same with problems understanding social cues/interactions. Some will have very slight or no problems and for others it will be severe. Anxiety and meltdowns are common. My dd is a little clumsy sometimes but she can ride a bike and skate. Her fine motor is not a big problem either. Her handwriting is legible but it is really tiring and difficult for her. But the social cues/interactions are really challenging for her. Executive functioning is a big issue. Transitions are tough. She is very literal. Her vocabulary is beyond amazing. Her rhyming and poems are crazy creative. Math is usually not a problem until algebra, until it gets abstract because rote memorization is a strength. However, my dd HATED math until we starts doing Life of Fred. Manipulatives and games have been helpful too.

 

Maybe someone should start an NLD group :)

 

http://www.amazon.com/Raising-NLD-Superstars-Nonverbal-Disabilities/dp/1843107708/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1372368559&sr=8-1&keywords=NLd

 

http://www.amazon.com/Nonverbal-Learning-Disabilities-Home-Parents/dp/1853029408/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1372368594&sr=8-4&keywords=NLd

 

http://www.amazon.com/Nonverbal-Learning-Disorder-Understanding-TeachersNeed/dp/0399534679/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1372368630&sr=8-6&keywords=NLd

[SadieMarie]

My ds11 was diagnosed just last year, even though I had suspected it for years. His processing speed is in the 1st percentile...that alone makes both of our lives very frustrating. Antidepressants were first order for both of us. That has made all the difference. His meltdowns (which precipitated my own) have decreased to only a few times a week...usually because I am trying to rush him, not on schoolwork mind you (I've got that one down)...just everything else. :crying: Since lat week I'm chomping at the bit to buy the "Simply Classical" book about classical education and special needs children. I read sample pages on memoriapress.com and found it inspiring, as well as comforting. In also I found the 2 books, "Nonverbal Disorders at Home/School" very helpful with matching behaviors with what's really going on with him at the moment. Amazon has some cheap, used copies I saw the other day. Hey would anyone here consider forming a NVLD group on the board? Just wondering (and hoping). Please forgive my stream-of-consciousness style as I type this.

 

 

I am embarrassed! I totally missed your post and just realized how old all the preceding ones are. I am tired. That is my only excuse. If you want to start a group I will certainly join. It is such an unusual diagnosis. I had never heard of it before my dd. It would be really nice to have some other parents to talk to about it. Thanks!

[SadieMarie]

Ok I am off to start an NLD group, that is, if I can figure out how :confused1:.

 

Done!