Beginner questions

[jnpa]

My wife and I are in the very beginning stages of planning to homeschool our kids next year. I created this account a few days ago and have spent a lot of time looking through previous posts and learning a lot from others on this forum. However, we still have a couple questions we'd like to get some advice on.

 

1. My son is currently attending 3rd grade in a public school. I understand the logic of breaking the study down in 4 year blocks based on time periods. Since he has gotten essentially none of the exposure to the history/language arts areas as recommended, what level should I start him at next year? Do we just jump right into modern times or should we actually go back and do ancients for two years in a row(4th at the first level and start 5th grade on the normal track)?

 

2. I noticed for books in the history chapter that they really push The Story of the World. I don't know anything about this, but one huge red flag that jumped out at me is that it is written by one of the authors of The Well Trained Mind. I'm not implying that that The Story of the World is a bad book, but to me it's the same situation as when a university professor has you buy a textbook they have written. Does anybody have opinions about this book they can share? Are there other history books similar to these that we can use?

Edited December 13, 2010 by jnpa

[TCB]

This is only our second year homeschooling so I don't speak from great experience. We started homeschooling when my daughter was at the start of 4th grade too and my youngest was just starting K. We just started with Ancients for both of them. I think the chronological approach is really beneficial and we intend to just work our way through 4 year cycles for as far as we get. You can always do something different 1 year (like study just geography or American History) if you want to get completely back to the book schedule but I don't think it's terribly important to do that.

 

Also, I spoke to SWB at a conference about my dd only having 1 year of the Grammar stage. She recommended just letting her move on, not holding her back, and just filling in any gaps we might find.

 

As far as Story of the World goes, I think there are other options, which others with more experience will tell you about. We really like it. It's interesting and organizes things well. We just add in extra things at each dd's appropriate level.

 

Hope you enjoy your homeschooling experience. There sure is a lot of good advice available on this forum.

[Aurelia]

1. I think you could either start with Ancients in 4th grade and move to Middle Ages in 5th (just bump up the work to logic level instead of grammar stage) or take 4th grade and work on world geography and cultures and being your history rotation in 5th with Ancients. As an alternative, you could have him do a 1 year overview with something like A Child's History of the World (available with a workbook from Calvert) for 4th grade before beginning your "regular" rotation. I do not recommend starting with Modern times.

 

2. Story of the World is very popular here, but it is not because it's "required." We used Ancient Times last year and with the activity guide, it was a lot of fun for my daughter. There are not many choices for anything other than US history or "social studies," in the early especially if you are looking for a secular resource, which is part of the reason for the popularity of this series. Alternatives include (and it's not an exhaustive list): Mystery of History (Christian), Tapestry of Grace (Christian), History at Our House (secular, not 4 year rotation), Oak Meadow (secular, not 4 year rotation).

 

Hope that helps!

[TheAutumnOak]

Hello and Welcome :001_smile:

 

I think you could do ancients for two years...There is a lot to cover there...A few possibilities...

 

1. You could do half of it this year and the other half the next...Just break the info into two parts

 

2. You could do some aspects now, keeping it in the grammar stage, and then do other aspects next year (fifth grade) but introduce logic

 

3. You could bypass history altogether next year and study something else, like geography...Then you could just pick up history in fifth grade

 

I personally think any of these would be fine...I am sure other people will have great advice...I am still kind of new...

[Farrar]

In regards to #2, it's certainly true that in the years after WTM was first issued, Susan Wise Bauer has come out with more and more products to support her vision of classical education. Not all of them are to my personal taste as a teacher. However, all of them are high quality options and if you want to do a classical style education, I think they're probably all things to take a look at or consider.

[robsiew]

Welcome! It's a grand ride with lots of ups and downs, but well worth it! I've learned more in the past 2.5 years I've been homeschooling than in all my years of teacher training (and I have a Masters!)

 

For your history rotation I think many of the suggestions here so far are good ones. If it were me, I'd probably either do one of the following:

 

1. A year of American History

2. Cruise through a Children's World Encyclopedia for a quick overview

3. Start ancients (don't worry about being on the right rotation... for those of us schooling more than one child only one child is on the right rotation if we keep them together!) and just move on from there the following year.

4. Do a year of world geography following your child's interest in which countries to study in more depth.

 

As far as curriculum. I don't really think of SWB's works such as a professor writing his own book.... I think of it more as SWB creating something that really does not exist to support a theory of teaching she very much believes in.

 

I have never seen anything like Story of the World. It brings World History to a child in a way they enjoy and can understand. It makes history come alive for us. My husband will even put off leaving for work to hear the end of the story if we're in the midst of one when he's leaving!

 

As with anything in the world of homeschooling, if the WTM material doesn't work for you don't use it! There are many options out there. I will have to say, I've found when I use SWB's suggestions things stay simple. It's when I stray too far that my schooling becomes too complicated. I don't care for FLL so I only do FLL1 with my little guys. Then we move onto something else. I love her writing program and use that. Her writing lectures are also excellent and really makes you feel like you can teach writing simply.

 

As you go along you'll figure out what works for you and your child. You may have to change some things as you go and that's okay. It's the beauty of homeschooling that we get to know our kids and are able to build on their strengths and help them manage their weaknesses.

 

Have fun in the process! :001_smile:

[Hedgehog]

Welcome! :001_smile:

 

1. My son is currently attending 3rd grade in a public school. I understand the logic of breaking the study down in 4 year blocks based on time periods. Since he has gotten essentially none of the exposure to the history/language arts areas as recommended, what level should I start him at next year? Do we just jump right into modern times or should we actually go back and do ancients for two years in a row(4th at the first level and start 5th grade on the normal track)?

 

I believe that in TWTM, it's recommended that no matter when you start through the Grammar and Logic stages, you start History from the beginning and just work through. So your son will get the History cycle twice if you do a 4yr cycle; you have a little time on your side, having an extra year to play with. If it was me, I'd just start on the Ancients right away and enjoy it; if you find yourself running over a month or so each time, then not to worry.

 

2. I noticed for books in the history chapter that they really push The Story of the World. I don't know anything about this, but one huge red flag that jumped out at me is that it is written by one of the authors of The Well Trained Mind. I'm not implying that that The Story of the World is a bad book, but to me it's the same situation as when a university professor has you buy a textbook they have written. Does anybody have opinions about this book they can share? Are there other history books similar to these that we can use?

 

Yes, there are other books, and TWTM recommends many texts - encyclopedias and specific books - at the end of the chapters. SWB might answer your question herself, but I think a PP has the right answer - she wrote The Story of the World because there wasn't much in the way of a story history book available for elementary students and she believed that it was a good way for them to enjoy and learn about History. And it is. We have the Audio CDs, and we listen to them all together while we have hot chocolate and biscuits, or sometimes in the car on the way to Ice Hockey practice.

 

On the general subject of TWTM and SWB's own curricula, there are lots of people here who don't use much of it, but still believe in the principles of Classical Education that she writes about in TWTM. From a personal perspective, we use some of her books and not others; we love SOTW, Writing With Ease (WWE), and Mrs. Jessie Wise's The Ordinary Parent's Guide to Teaching Reading (OPGTR), but didn't get along with First Language Lessons (FLL). I'm not sure why, but it just didn't fit with my kids way of learning, perhaps. We use Rod and Staff's English course instead.

 

HTH!

[Dolphin]

Hi,

I am about 6 months into home schooling my 3rd grade son. He did K-2 at a private school.

 

I would start with ancients, but do it over two years. With most things look at where you want him to start 5th grade on. I have been having to stop and fill in gaps so much this year. Another home school mom told me to just slow down.

 

It has been a learning curve, and I can see why people quit early on. I know 2 other people that started at the same time as me who have already put their kids back in school. It is so different than what you are used to. Not only are you taking on a new role, but your child will most likely go through a 100% curriculum change. Learning the new ways that your chosen courses teach the subject, the language that they use etc... When we got totally bogged down I wrote on here, and then took a two week break. It made all the difference. We are now going at a slower pace, and planning on year schooling at a slower pace. This board has really helped, when I have asked for it.

 

We are really enjoying the Story of the world. It is nice as my 3 year old likes to listen to the chapter and then she does the coloring page too. I have not read the WTM for a few months now, but I think what SWB does is even when she has a product, she usually still gives resources for other options. She also supports this board and has no problem with us all talking about different products. I have never seen them remove a thread when someone is complaining about a product. I really like most of her products, for me they are teaching me how to teach.

 

Nicole

[jnpa]

Thank you to everybody who has responded. We really appreciate all of the help and advice.

 

We read through all of the responses and we think we're just going to start him off with the Ancients and then just move on from there. The other advantage for us is that my daughter will be in first grade next year so they would be on the same track(although he would obviously be expected to do more advanced work).

[cin]

I noticed for books in the history chapter that they really push The Story of the World. I don't know anything about this, but one huge red flag that jumped out at me is that it is written by one of the authors of The Well Trained Mind. I'm not implying that that The Story of the World is a bad book, but to me it's the same situation as when a university professor has you buy a textbook they have written. Does anybody have opinions about this book they can share? Are there other history books similar to these that we can use?

 

Haven't read all the responses, but I can tell you that on these boards, you use what works best for your child. Nobody here pushes any one curriculum.

 

For us, SOTW works GREAT! My oldest daughter loves to work independantly, so she reads a chapter each week and we do the test on Friday. The test is not really graded as a test. We see what she understood and didn't understand, and then discuss things.

 

One homeschooling thing about SOTW: I bought the electronic version and print off each chapter so we can write on it. She is learning to take notes, per se. She hi-lights the important things and then studies those. This is in 4th grade. I struggled with this in COLLEGE! As a homschooler, I want to teach her study skills and life skills as well as facts.

 

The basis for SOTW is that history is taught as one unit, from beginning to end (so to speak). Not in 12 week peices that are disconnected.

 

If you don't want to use SOTW, that's fine. What you want is to use a history curriculum that works for your child AND you!

[ChandlerMom]

I'd vote for starting both kids on ancients and move to middle ages the following year, but do whatever feels best for your family.

 

Only thing I can add is to think about the transition from ps (public school) to hs (home school). I would suggest that you consider beginning that transition NOW. Small steps can help pave the way towards a more confident parent/teacher and a more comfortable child.

 

For example, if ds currently goes off to his room to work on homework, have him start doing it in a (quiet) common space area. Sit with him, discuss what he is working on. Have him read a book to his sister. If you stopped reading to him aloud, start back up. Pick up a book you can both (or all) really enjoy and start reading. If he likes science or art, plan a project for the weekend you can do together that is FUN.

 

Get the kids involved in the curriculum hunt -- a lot of programs have sample pages online. Have ds do some of them and give you feedback. You don't have to decide on curriculum until summer, so you might want to do this on breaks or early summer. With summer break, consider doing 15min of math a day, starting with practice problems or games. Definitely consider a reading program or list and make sure he always has a book to read around. Start visiting the library and talking about which topics most interest your kids. Why not start next year with those topics in science or history or art?

 

ALl through this process pay attention to what time of day works best, reconnect with your kids on a deeper level than ps allows.

 

You will probably discover that you can cover the core subjects in far less time than ps. What they spend 7 hours on, you may be able to cover in 2 or 3. When you start up give yourselves permisison to have "short days" or cover just a few subjects and add more in as you settle in. Plan to have daily then weekly then monthly review sessions with your wife to discuss what is working and what is not. Ditch what doesn't work.

 

I think new HS'rs suffer burnout either because they have unrealistic expectations about how it will work (esp WRT interactions with their kids) or they try to go from 0 to 60 on the "first day of school". I found it easier to remind myself I'm in it for the long haul and start up more like a train than a jet plane: slow and steady and gradually build up speed. I started schooling at home that first year around April so that I was at full speed by Aug. Of course, I didn't tell my kids that, it just snuck up on them! :lol:

[TheAutumnOak]

Thank you to everybody who has responded. We really appreciate all of the help and advice.

 

We read through all of the responses and we think we're just going to start him off with the Ancients and then just move on from there. The other advantage for us is that my daughter will be in first grade next year so they would be on the same track(although he would obviously be expected to do more advanced work).

 

I didn't realize you had more than one child to school next year...I would do exactly what you are planning to do in your situation...I have two starting ancients in January (1st and 5th grade)...That works out, but I have a 4 year old who won't start first for 2 years...He will start at Late Renaissance because that is where my older two will be at the time...

 

I think maybe others thought you were only schooling one child as well...

 

As far as history curriculum goes, we bought Mystery of History Level One (Ancients)...I hear good things about SOTW, but I wanted to try that one...I am still waiting for it to arrive, so I have no feedback yet...But it is another option...

[jnpa]

Only thing I can add is to think about the transition from ps (public school) to hs (home school). I would suggest that you consider beginning that transition NOW. Small steps can help pave the way towards a more confident parent/teacher and a more comfortable child.

 

I think new HS'rs suffer burnout either because they have unrealistic expectations about how it will work (esp WRT interactions with their kids) or they try to go from 0 to 60 on the "first day of school". I found it easier to remind myself I'm in it for the long haul and start up more like a train than a jet plane: slow and steady and gradually build up speed. I started schooling at home that first year around April so that I was at full speed by Aug. Of course, I didn't tell my kids that, it just snuck up on them! :lol:

 

I think this is an excellent idea and we actually started our first "official" home schooling day today. It was the first snow day of the year and had made some contingency lesson plans because we anticipated public schools would be closed. I actually received a phone call from my wife's cell phone about 10:30 this morning and I thought that was a bad sign and she was going to tell me that she was feeling overwhelmed. It was actually from my son who wanted to tell me what he had worked on all morning and how much fun he was having so I think we're off to a good start.