How well do TOG and SL line up?

[melmichigan]

Still looking at future plans... I'm wondering where the two programs line up and if there is a clear deliniation? We are using Core 1 and Core 6 now in SL. Are the four year rotations similar in stop and start points? I am wondering how easy it would be to transition between the programs in the future, most likely after Core 2 and 7. I would have to do a lot of adapting to use Core 100.

Edited January 6, 2010 by melmichigan

[melmichigan]

:bigear:

[michelle l]

No advice at all, but wondering how the Core1/Core6 combo is working for you. I was thinking about that for us next year as I think we really want to do ancient history instead of Core 4. Then again, I might go with something completely different. How old are your Core 6 kids? Mine would be 11/6th and 9/4th next year. I didn't know if that might be a too much of a stretch for them or not.

[melmichigan]

The combination is going great for us. My DD's, just turned 7 are doing Core 1. My DD, just turned 10 is doing Core 6. We did change out CHOW for SOTW and use the AG for maps and coloring pages for all (my DD's need something to do with their hands while I read). We also use the Enc. of World History from Core 6 and just use the correlation charts. My DD10 does the test from SOTW as a worksheet once the readings are done.

 

I teach SL secularly so I add in other books for Core 1 history, many from the AG suggestions or from other lists, like TOG. My DD7's are doing History Pockets Ancient Civilizations and my older DD is doing Egypt, Greece, and Rome. My older DD is also using an alternative additional spine for some chapters to bring SOTW up a notch for middle school, personal choice.

 

For Core 6 we swapped out Mara, Daughter of the Nile with Golden Goblet. We also subbed in Black Ships Before Troy for Trojan War. There are one or two other books I may change out or put aside for later once I get through them myself and can make a determination. So many people voiced concerns about this core I was a little hesitant but am glad I made the choice to go with my DD's interests. She seems to focus on the theme of overcoming stuggles in the literature versus some of the otherwise brutal and ugly times of war. I also don't have trouble with some of the material that can spawn discussions about our beliefs, such as Caesar's Augustus World, and others. I want my children to question and realize that there are other views, and I am comfortable having these discussions. If you are concerned there are a few books you can skip until they are older. We own Core 5, I bought it used. We are adding in parts with Core 7 next year and are using other books as additonal and summer readers. My older DD is a very avid reader. So in the long run she will get all but the EHE from that core as well.

[Mynyel]

Hi! I don't know if this helps but we are just finishing up Core 6 and my daughter read all the books. Mara, Daughter of the Nile was a really good book. I read it myself, no violence, no ummm physical activity (if you get my meaning)...ok well there was one kiss. My daughter (11 when she read it) loved it! She won't let me sell it with the rest of the Core six books. Same with the Golden Goblet, SOTW and a few others.

Now she has said, and I haven't read it, that Black Horses for the King was a bit violent. So I really can't say about that book. However she said it was a bit violent but she wasn't real disturbed so I don't think it was extreme.

We also did Core 2 and 6 together this past year and it was fine. My daughter (who was doing Core 6) read all the core 2 books as well as her own. My son (the Core 2er) would listen to the read alouds (the ones we did read I didn't read all of them, my daughter isn't patient enough, she blows through books like they are nothing) so when you are doing two cores at once it is almost like the younger ones are getting a double education. They soak up more than you think! I am going to continue doing it this way, I love it!

[NoPlaceLikeHome]

Are you thinking of TOG instead of SL Core? Do you have any info on TOG and why I should consider it? I appreciate any info:)

[siloam]

Still looking at future plans... I'm wondering where the two programs line up and if there is a clear deliniation? We are using Core 1 and Core 6 now in SL. Are the four year rotations similar in stop and start points? I am wondering how easy it would be to transition between the programs in the future, most likely after Core 2 and 7. I would have to do a lot of adapting to use Core 100.

 

I think moving to TOG after Core 7 would work fine. You can start with any year, but if you can start with year 1.

 

Roughly Core 200 would line up with Year 2. If 200 also covers Biblical history and not just Church history then it would be Year 1 and 2. Also I understand Core 200 includes a lot of missionaries. TOG also does in years 3 and 4. They cover a new missionary about every other week.

 

Core 300 and Year 4 line up the best.

 

Core 400 would go with all 4 years of TOG, because TOG does a continueal government study from ancients to present day.

 

Core 100 would go with the second half of year 2, and with year 3. Probably part of year 4 too, assuming it goes into the 20th century.

 

The philosophy study in TOG also goes through all 4 years. Each time in history a new philosophy/religion appears TOG covers it, and looks at how it changed the thinking of the culture of the time.

 

Literature is also an on going thing. Usually a child reads a title around the time it was written and would have been read by the culture in history. Sometimes you also look at the relationship to the culture, for example with Gulliver's Travels it goes into how it was written to be a political satire, and identify each group of people represented in the book (here is an example where history, government and literature all tie together).

 

I am not sure if this helps at all, but if you have any questions let me know.

 

Heather

 

[Janice in NJ]

SL Core 6 uses SOTW Volumes 1 & 2 which covers ancients up to 1600.

SL Core 7 uses SOTW Volumes 3 & 4 which covers 1600 up through present times.

 

TOG breaks things down a bit differently.

Year 1 is ancients through the fall of Rome - about 450 A.D.

Year 2 continues on through 1800. (Big time span here. TOG is primarily paced with a high-schooler in mind; they want to leave plenty of time to dwell on the last two centuries.)

Year 3 is the 19th Century.

Year 4 is the 20th Century.

 

If you have completed a history rotation with SL 6 & SL 7, it would be easy to begin to cycle through again with TOG years 1-4.

 

Have you seen the scope and sequence charts on the TOG site? (Click on the colored link on each page that says "Scope & Sequence.") They will help you see the topics covered in each of the four units of each year plan. The S&S isn't out yet for year 4. They will be finishing up the redesign this month; then we will see a final S&S for year 4.

 

http://www.tapestryofgrace.com/year1/

http://www.tapestryofgrace.com/year2/

http://www.tapestryofgrace.com/year3/

 

As far as jumping between them, it can be done. But if you end up doing a lot of jumping around, that can be a ton of figuring and planning. And that kind of defeats the purpose of purchasing a plan. :001_smile: It's so easy for me to get caught up in planning and miss the opportunity to learn the material so I can mentor/interact with my kids. I like aspects of each curriculum, but I have to let one drive or else I don't get anything accomplished - ie, I don't have time to read and study to master the material myself. :001_smile: TOG wins on that front for me because it is unit-study based. I am free to use materials that I want when I want. The week-plans keep me moooooving forward through history. I use them to get my kids reading, thinking, and writing about all sorts of interesting topics. (I have a ton of SL books too. I use the books when I want to use them within our TOG structure. And I have lots of materials that aren't mentioned in either the SL or the TOG plan that we use too.) But I love having a that all-inclusive, idea-rich(!!!!!) TOG plan!

 

Peace,

Janice

 

Enjoy your little people

Enjoy your journey

Edited January 6, 2010 by Janice in NJ

[melmichigan]

I like the SL through Core 7. I will probably continue with that for those levels. My DD will be finishing Core 7 next year and I am looking at options from then on. I have trouble with Core 100 but could use it with some adaptations since my DD would still be middle school. I could also do an online history over 2 years that would correlate well and just use lit from both Core 100 and 200. Or I can look for something else entirely.

 

I keep hearing so much about TOG and the depth of discussion, which she will need by then. I had written off TOG because I teach from a mostly secular view but then had heard of a few people successfully using Years 2-4 in this manner. (For me this only excludes a few book in SL.) So I'm trying to decide if I should invest the time in looking at it as a serious option and where I would start.

Edited January 6, 2010 by melmichigan

[melmichigan]

SL Core 6 uses SOTW Volumes 1 & 2 which covers ancients up to 1600.

SL Core 7 uses SOTW Volumes 3 & 4 which covers 1600 up through present times.

 

TOG breaks things down a bit differently.

Year 1 is ancients through the fall of Rome - about 450 A.D.

Year 2 continues on through 1800. (Big time span here. TOG is primarily paced with a high-schooler in mind; they want to leave plenty of time to dwell on the last two centuries.)

Year 3 is the 19th Century.

Year 4 is the 20th Century.

 

If you have completed a history rotation with SL 6 & SL 7, it would be easy to begin to cycle through again with TOG years 1-4.

 

Have you seen the scope and sequence charts on the TOG site? (Click on the colored link on each page that says "Scope & Sequence.") They will help you see the topics covered in each of the four units of each year plan. The S&S isn't out yet for year 4. They will be finishing up the redesign this month; then we will see a final S&S for year 4.

 

http://www.tapestryofgrace.com/year1/

http://www.tapestryofgrace.com/year2/

http://www.tapestryofgrace.com/year3/

 

As far as jumping between them, it can be done. But if you end up doing a lot of jumping around, that can be a ton of figuring and planning. And that kind of defeats the purpose of purchasing a plan. :001_smile: It's so easy for me to get caught up in planning and miss the opportunity to learn the material so I can mentor/interact with my kids. I like aspects of each curriculum, but I have to let one drive or else I don't get anything accomplished - ie, I don't have time to read and study to master the material myself. :001_smile: TOG wins on that front for me because it is unit-study based. I am free to use materials that I want when I want. The week-plans keep me moooooving forward through history. I use them to get my kids reading, thinking, and writing about all sorts of interesting topics. (I have a ton of SL books too. I use the books when I want to use them within our TOG structure. And I have lots of materials that aren't mentioned in either the SL or the TOG plan that we use too.) But I love having a that all-inclusive, idea-rich(!!!!!) TOG plan!

 

Peace,

Janice

 

Enjoy your little people

Enjoy your journey

 

OK you have peaked my curiosity. If I were to be in year 1 now, then that would take her through middle school at the end of year 4. It would also give me more options with mixing dialetic and rhetoric. I have some of the books at the end of year 1. I am tempted to get Unit 4 and have a look.

Edited January 6, 2010 by melmichigan

[siloam]

I like the SL through Core 7. I will probably continue with that for those levels. My DD will be finishing Core 7 next year and I am looking at options from then on. I have trouble with Core 100 but could use it with some adaptations since my DD would still be middle school. I could also do an online history over 2 years that would correlate well and just use lit from both Core 100 and 200. Or I can look for something else entirely.

 

I keep hearing so much about TOG and the depth of discussion, which she will need by then. I had written off TOG because I teach from a mostly secular view but then had heard of a few people successfully using Years 2-4 in this manner. (For me this only excludes a few book in SL.) So I'm trying to decide if I should invest the time in looking at it as a serious option and where I would start.

I agree that year 1 wouldn't work well from a Secular POV. If you weren't easily offended you could use the secular weeks, and skip the Biblical week, but you would be skipping a lot for the cost.

 

Years 2-4 you don't have weeks where the topics is Biblical, except maybe the Crusades, but that one is something that most people study in history anyway. You would just skip the Church History/Worldview portion or pick and choose if you want to cover some other religions. At times you will probably find stuff in the Teacher Notes that you would roll your eyes at, but the kids wouldn't see it at all.

 

Heather

[Cynful]

I keep hearing so much about TOG and the depth of discussion, which she will need by then. I had written off TOG because I teach from a mostly secular view but then had heard of a few people successfully using Years 2-4 in this manner. (For me this only excludes a few book in SL.) So I'm trying to decide if I should invest the time in looking at it as a serious option and where I would start.

 

This is exactly where I am at this point and why I've been asking so many questions too. I actually just went ahead and bought Year 1 used so I can really take a close look at it. Otherwards I'll never really know.

[Cynful]

I agree that year 1 wouldn't work well from a Secular POV. If you weren't easily offended you could use the secular weeks, and skip the Biblical week, but you would be skipping a lot for the cost.

 

Years 2-4 you don't have weeks where the topics is Biblical, except maybe the Crusades, but that one is something that most people study in history anyway. You would just skip the Church History/Worldview portion or pick and choose if you want to cover some other religions. At times you will probably find stuff in the Teacher Notes that you would roll your eyes at, but the kids wouldn't see it at all.

 

Heather

 

Thank you - you just sealed the deal for me I think. :) I'm glad to hear that it is at least doable. Of course, I have to finish Core 3 and then Core 4 first. LOL Then I have to decide if I want to do Core 5. Any opinions? Would Core 5 content be covered already in TOG?

[melmichigan]

I bought Y1U4 so I can see what all this talk is really about...:)

[lovemykids]

This is exactly where I am at this point and why I've been asking so many questions too. I actually just went ahead and bought Year 1 used so I can really take a close look at it. Otherwards I'll never really know.

 

I’d like to know about SL core 5 content as well, my guess is that at least you can add in the books when you are studying the time period. But as far as the actual in depth coverage of all of those cultures…hmm. TOG does cover various religions in year 1.

 

:bigear:

[siloam]

I’d like to know about SL core 5 content as well, my guess is that at least you can add in the books when you are studying the time period. But as far as the actual in depth coverage of all of those cultures…hmm. TOG does cover various religions in year 1.

 

:bigear:

 

When ever TOG covers the history of another country it will at the UG and LG levels suggest culture books, and usually the worldview portion will cover their religious POV (the upper level book after Windows on the World from Core 2 is used in TOG) and often the Literature will be from the culture.

 

The nice thing about TOG is if you want more depth you can always just take another week and do more. I personally plan to continue the culture portion into D and R level as well.

 

Year 1 is the one year of TOG I haven't covered (well and the first half of year 2), but the rest of the years do cover culture.

 

Heather