Now that you mention that, I remember that my sister (ADHD, auditory processing issues, and other problems that have had illusive diagnoses for 23 years) had to do something called Rythmic Writing as part of her therapy. Big loops and circles on a chalk board to get her whole arm engaged with her eyes or something like that...

Yogurt is good, definitely. Also get him on a probiotic. My kids like the taste of Yum Yum Dophilis.

At the classical school my sons attended for years, they taught cursive starting in Kindergarten. They emphasized that the children should grip the pencil loosely, and move their entire arm - from the shoulder - NOT just the hand and wrist. The hand/wrist gets tired too quickly if it does all the work, and the larger muscles in the arm can handle it better.

I can't speak to the OT issues, so I don't know how much help I'll be. I know that the Vision Therapy we did with our son was painful, in a way (it was really hard for him to get his eyes to work together the way they are supposed to), and I know that PT can really hurt. You have to hurt a bit to make progress; no pain, no gain, you know? On the other hand, both SWB and JW said at a conference this summer, "If your child is crying, learning is not taking place." It sounds like you made a good compromise: you didn't let him quit completely, but you made it a bit easier so that he could have some success. I think that a little steady progress each day is better than nothing. You know your child better than anyone, so you're best qualified to make the call of if or how to continue in any given "session."

DS6 was re-evaluated today for VT. The good news is that he doesn't need VT, but the bad news is that he doesn't need VT. I really had my eggs all in the VT basket, and am kind of stunned by the results. So now it's off to buy fish oil, cut artificial colors and flavors from his diet, and stay away from preservatives... From what I'm hearing from the rest of you, a visit to the pediatric psychologist might be in order as well.:bored:

:iagree: Love it, Laurie!

So alternating discussion with narration throughout the week, and then writing a book report at the end would be reasonable?

My favorite line from the book Healthy Sleep Habits, Happy Child is "Sleep begets sleep." It may not make sense to us laymen, but a more rested child sleeps better. It has to do with brain waves and REM, etc. I've seen this play out again and again with my kids. Did you ever have a situation when your child goes to bed late, only to wake up extra early the next day? If you have time, it's worth reading this book. Because he may have extenuating issues in his little body, you might not be willing to try this, but we've reached a point where we've let each of our kids cry it out (they were much younger than your son, though, so I don't know what it would look like for an older child) and get themselves back to sleep.

I am following TWTM's reading list and instructions for my ds6th. This is my 1st year following this program, and I'm a bit fuzzy on it. The book says, "Plan to spend 30-60 min., 4 days/week, reading and creating narration pages and reports." Later it says, "You're preparing the child to think critically about literature by conversing with her about it - carrying on a dialogue about what is or isn't important in plots...your conversations will guide her...to think critically about what she reads....you should aim to spend at least 4 days/week, 30-60 min/day, on reading - that is, reading the books, talking about them, constructing a narrative, and then writing up that narrative in the child's best handwriting." It would seem self-explanatory, but for some reason I can't quite get a handle on what it looks like in practice. Can someone who's done this before - with a logic aged child - give me some insight? What's worked for you? When do you talk? When does he narrate? Thanks!

I have 3 sons, and have not experienced anything to the extent that you are experiencing it, so I don't think it's typical boy behavior. Some of it, certainly, and some because of his age. But it sure sounds like this little guy and his family need some help. I completely agree with all of the specialists recommended by others: pediatric neurologist, allergist, pediatric psychologist/psychiatrist, maybe even a nutritionist. It will be difficult to get to them given your location, but so worth it to know what you're dealing with. Has the pediatrician tested his hearing? Physically contain him as much as possible. Protect your relationship with your daughter by doing things just with her when you can. She's old enough to understand that you don't condone his behavior and are going to get to the bottom of it. It might make her sympathetic to his situation. Is there any way you can get a break, even just for a couple hours? Do you have a really good friend who is sympathetic to your situation who could play with him long enough for you to have a date with your daughter or husband? Or even go for a walk around the block by yourself? In the meantime, it might help to think of him as having something "wrong." Oh, this probably won't come out right... Here's what I mean: we suspect that our ds7 has ADHD and are in the process of treating the symptoms and getting a diagnosis. Once I realized that there was probably something "wrong" with him neurologically and he wasn't just being willfully naughty and hyper, my heart softened toward him. I still get frustrated and angry at some of his 7yo boy behavior, but a lot of it is out of his control. It doesn't excuse bad behavior and he still gets consequences when he loses control, but they're different consequences than before. My heart and attitude toward him have changed and he gets more grace and compassion than he does when he's just being willful. Make sense? :grouphug:

51 never looked so good!:D

That sounds like a great plan for a lot of families, and I wish it would work for mine...but my older son "plays up" academically and my 4th grader has learning issues. The 6th grader is doing 7th grade Latin online, and the 4th grader is repeating 3rd grade Latin and still struggling with understanding it (I started him on the 4th grade level, and quickly realized we'd need to repeat last year. He got an A in Latin at school last year, but clearly just memorized and didn't learn. We took a break from Latin for several weeks this year, and are going back into it very slowly.) My 6th grader is a "classic" student, and my 4th grader has dyslexia and visual processing issues. He's also struggling with "getting" math. So even though they're only 21 months apart in age, they're at least 2 years apart in academic ability. He's a v-e-r-y slow reader, but he enjoys it and his comprehension is way above grade level. I often read lessons to him (SotW, WWE, etc) to speed things up for him. I already am only teaching 1 history class 3x/wk (switching that to 2x/week next week to see how it goes), and one science class 1x/wk (dh does the 2nd class). Ds6th only does history with me when he does outlining, because he is still learning that skill. I like the idea of doing some chores before school, like unloading the dishwasher or even piano practice. We try to start at 8, but could start a bit later. It would save me the frustration of having dirty dishes pile up in the sink all day...visual rap music. :ack2:

Today is day 47 for us... What I meant by expectations was my expectations of what our family life would be like, not our academic life. I didn't think schooling would take so long, and I thought we'd have more time for extracurriculars and projects and fun. But I do need suggestions for either how to shorten the day, because if I can shorten it, I will. So, Catwoman, please don't apologize! The SotW audiobook is a good idea; I'll look into it. It would at least free me up a bit, if not them. I think I'll try history on TTh next week instead of MWF. That would lighten up 2 of our heavier days. No, I don't assign all of the work for R&S; could you imagine how long it would take to complete that?! And I think he's really only doing R&S about 2 days/week, because I count his days outlining and writing essays as grammar.

They're gonna do it, so they may as well do it correctly. ;)

Thanks for the encouragement, Mich elle.:) I know that my standards are high. I know what they're capable of, based on what they've done at school in the past...I just want the same results without as much work. Hmm...we'll see how it plays out. Caitlin, what's YMMV? I think I won't be so frustrated with the time it takes for Singapore because I think it's a better program than Saxon. We'll see about that as well. Thanks for the reality check on the timing, though.

Here's what worked, finally (!): I remind them - once - at the beginning of the questioning to answer in a complete sentence. If they begin to answer incompletely, I give them The Look. If that doesn't stop them, and they answer incompletely, I make them stand up and say the whole - complete - answer 5 times. They usually laugh through it, but my point is made and they don't do it again...that day, anyway.

I know you mean it in a nice way. I opened myself up to comments, after all, so I'd better have a bit of a thick skin. :) OK, let's see...my kids went to a classical Christian school up to this point, and believe me, the work I have them doing is LESS than they did while in school. They would do about 5 hours of work in a 7 hour day (allotting time for lunch, recess, specials, and transtions), and then have up to 2 hours of homework (yes, in 3rd grade) at night (and piano and a sport). So they are pretty happy with what I have them doing, are engaged in the lessons, and there's not much dawdling or daydreaming. We've had family meetings and they've all expressed how much they prefer hsing to being at school. My 1st grader could definitely be done by lunch, and usually is close to it. Sometimes he needs breaks because of focusing issues (I'm not going to label him ADHD until all other avenues are investigated, but that's what his behavior is like). We break the reading up into 2 sessions: I read to him and he narrates, and that takes about 15-30 min., and later he reads to me for 15 min. He's been reading for almost a year and loves it. Saxon, unfortunately, takes my kids about an hour. Teaching the lesson is about 15 min, and then doing the problems takes about 45. We all dislike Saxon, and I'm hoping Singapore will be better and faster. The times I listed for lessons are the maximum time I will let them spend on a subject. The lesson and work are frequently accomplished in less time. For example, my ds4th can usually get through an A&P spelling lesson in 30 min, but if we hit the 30 min mark and haven't finished the lesson (for whatever reason), we stop. For history for the 2 youngers, we do the SotW reading (I read it), the comprehension questions, map work, and look up the locations on a map. Then they narrate; the 4th grader writes about 4 sentences himself, and the 1st grader dictates to me. The 6th grader follows TWTM history program: read, write key thoughts or outline, timeline, map. All of that takes about 45 minutes. I appreciate that people are taking the time to help me figure this out. MTW are our hard days, but Thursday is really great (Bible study, out to lunch, half day in the afternoon). Friday is somewhere between Thurs and the rest of the week, and I try to do a fun event or service project on Friday afternoons, which they enjoy. It may just be a matter of my lowering my expectations. I've never been a "working mom" before, and it's hard for me to let go of things (the housework, decent meals) and harder still for the 4 males I live with to pick up that which I let go...

They all do Bible together. The 1st and 4th grader do history together. They all do the science experiments together, but not the actual lessons. I forgot to mention that my ds4th has dyslexia and has undergone vision therapy for visual processing issues (LOVE vision therapy! It made a huge difference for him, and DS1st is about to start next week.), so he will probably never be a fast reader. A WWE lesson - the ones with reading/narration especially, not to mention the ones that add dictation - can take us 30 minutes. The ones with just writing are completed in 5-10 min. In an edit, I added my curriculum. They have Reading as a subject because SWB recommends it in TWTM. I'm using her reading list for the 6th grader, and it does correspond with the history he's studying. I go back and forth between DitHoR and narration in Reading for the 4th grader. I use a modified version of the 6th grader's list for the 1st and 4th graders. When the 6th grader has a writing assignment or an outlining lesson for another subject, I count it as Grammar also. I really do try to "cut corners" without sacrificing content. Concerning time allotted (keep in mind that this is my limit; it doesn't always take us this long): Bible 30 min; Writing 15 min ds1st, 30 min ds4th; Spelling 30 min ds1st & 4th; 15 min ds6th; Math 30 min ds1st (had allotted 60 for other boys because it was Saxon, but I expect Singapore to take about 30 min); Reading 45 min ds1st, 90 min for the other 2 (including 30 min mandatory "free" reading); History - about 45 min, maybe 60 for ds6th; Science - experiment day is about 90 min, lesson day is about 30 for ds1st and 45-60 for the other 2; Latin 30 min/day, plus 1.5 hours of class time for ds6th on M and W (does not always do 30 min of homework on a class day); Grammar ds1st 5-10 min, ds4th 30 min (when ds6th combines grammar and writing, it's about 60 min). After we do Bible, I send the older 2 off to work independently while I get as much as possible done with the youngest. When one of the older 2 needs me, I let the youngest have a break. I teach the olders the lessons, but if they have independent work related to that subject, they do it later in the day (ie I teach the math lesson, but they do the problems later on) so that I can continue through my day at as rapid a pace as possible. If they absolutely can't do anything else on their lesson plans without my help, they practice piano or do chores. I'll send the youngest outside to blow off steam while the older two and I plow through the day. To Carol - Thanks for the suggestions. What is a Stewardship unit study? We do Bible together because it's part of the study that we're all in, and I think it's good that we're discussing the questions together, etc. So I don't want to relegate that to homework. When they were younger and had the same bedtime, we did a family reading time (which did include Treasure Island), but they all have different bedtimes now. Plus, we have soccer 4 nights/week (between all 3, not that all 3 have soccer 4 nights/week!), so it's usually a rush to get home from soccer at 7ish and get the youngest snacked, showered, and off to bed. Evenings are anything but calm and conducive to learning.:bored:

My boys are almost 12, 10, and almost 7. I remember the days when they were all under 6 and I was tired and overwhelmed by the pure physicality of mothering (and I wasn't homeschooling). Looking back, I can see that I was too hard on myself to get life done and I didn't enjoy my time with them enough. So go easy on yourself. Use a Crock Pot. Eat pizza once/week. Eat breakfast for dinner. NAP!! You have a first grader; don't worry now that you have to teach him just the right way or he won't get into college (I used to freak about things like that!). Give yourself permission to relax and enjoy the ride because it will be over before you know it. And caffeine is your friend. ;) :grouphug:

Funny, snickerdoodle! Yes, especially when they're unfocused (which is all the time for my ds1st, and we're working on getting that diagnosed) or have cabin fever. Last week, I made them run in the rain on the sidewalk outside the library before I would let them go in with me. They're like caged animals if they don't get enough exercise. It's nice to hear from someone who "gets" boys.:001_smile:

This is my first year homeschooling my ds6th grade, ds4th grade, and ds1st grade. Here's what I envisioned: school for 5-6 hrs/day, and time for quiet "room time (where they would do 60 min of reading for pleasure and I would have an hour of blessed, blissful silence)," chores, playing, and piano practice before dinner (which has to be around 5:00 because of soccer practice). Here's what I live: school for 7-8 hours/day, I'm lucky if they have time to unload and load the dishwasher, soccer practice is all the playing they get, they practice piano for 15 minutes most - but not all - days, and there is NO quiet room time (thus no blessed, blissful silence). I've already switched spelling and math curriculums because what I was using was taking WAY too long or was too complicated. I switched their day of science experiments to Saturday so that they can do it with my dh (he loves science, and I don't enjoy it at all) and lighten their load during the week. DS4th is repeating the Latin that he "learned" in his classical school last year, but doesn't remember. I'll tell you what I'm doing, but here's the thing: I don't want to compromise their education, so it's not like I can really drop any subjects. Also, Thursday is like a 1/2 day for us because we go to a Bible study for a couple of hours in the morning. DS 1st: Bible M-F; Grammar MTW (FLL); Spelling M-F (just switched to Apples and Pears from Spell to Write and Read); Reading M-F (I read to him and he narrates; he reads a different book to me); Writing MTWF(WWE); Math M-F (Singapore); History MWF (SotW); Science F, Sat (Elemental Science) DS4th: Bible M-F; Grammar MTW (FLL); Spelling M-F (A&P); Reading M-F (Drawn into the Heart of Reading); Writing MTWF (WWE); Math M-F (just switched to Singapore from Saxon); History MWF (SotW); Science F, Sat (Elemental Science); Latin M-F (Latin for Children) DS6th: Bible M-F; Grammar/Writing MTWF Rod & Staff 6); Spelling M-F (Vocab from Classical Roots); Reading M-F (WTM's reading list, sometimes combined with Drawn into the Heart of Reading); Math M-F (just switched to Singapore from Saxon); History MWF (WTM's guidelines); Science F, Sat (WTM's guidelines); Latin online class M, W and homework (which sometimes requires quite a bit of my help) each day (Veritas Academy) DS6th does a lot independently, but I still have to teach him what to do before he's off being independent. DS4th can do some on his own, but mostly needs me. DS1st obviously needs me to teach every subject. So I'm teaching around 20 classes/day...and then doing all the chores at night that I thought I'd be having help with during the day...and grading...and writing up the plan for the next day...and staying up way too late doing all of those things. So were my expectations too high? Or are we doing something wrong?

I sent this link to my DH (who is not on any forums) because we're considering a wood stove insert in our fireplace. Here's his response: "Thanks, read them all. What does dh stand for (designated hitter? dumb husband?)?" :lol:

My ds11 did 5 years of Shurley in his classical school, but we're using R&S6 this year in hsing. I just couldn't take any more Shurley - but I am a grammar queen - so I wanted a good program. R&S is going well; we use it for his grammar and writing.

My BIL went to VA Tech and has worked for NASA (yes, he IS a rocket scientist) for over 25 years. A friend - also a rocket scientist - went to Purdue. A friend who's a pilot went to Kent State, but I don't think his degree was in engineering.

This is from the cookbook from the Charity League of Lexington, NC. A woman named Carol Myers submitted it. I use it whenever I need a "fancy" chicken salad, and everyone loves it. Elegant Chicken Salad Combine 6 diced cooked chicken breasts, 1 C diced celery, 2 small cans well-drained crushed pineapple, 1 C chopped pecans, halved seedless green grapes, salt and pepper to taste, 1 C mayo, and 1 C sour cream (I usually use 1.5 C Greek yogurt and .5 C mayo instead). Serve with croissants or rolls.