I appreciate you reading the article. I think your summary is a bit of an oversimplification of what's being said (although there is, I think, a simple disagreement in there in fundamental beliefs about humanity and society and how individuals relate to one another). I disagree with everything Joel Osteen stands for so I haven't read anything he's said on this issue in particular, however that is coming into play. The foremost experts I know who disagree on crt are pastors (experts in the sense that they regularly study and write about the issue of race and humanity) though the one's whom I know who disagree with crt fundamentals and are black are, in general, excoriated on social media pretty regularly and called stooges and worse. Secular people who I know who disagree are considered persona non grata in academia and elsewhere *because* they write from a differing viewpoint. In other words, their disagreement is de facto evidence of their incompetence and lack of expertise and knowledge on the subject. Anyway, I appreciate your response.

The other thing is that even if symptomatic, colds and flu and other viruses are still out there. Look at percent positive tests during peak flu season when symptomatic people go in to be tested for flu... it's a really low positive rate, usually under 10%. You want that low % positive to know that you're catching most cases. It's different with Covid because we're probably testing exposures and people recovering more than we would with flu, but still a good sign of the percent positive isn't high.

Supporting documentation for people who disagree with crt and intersectionality as a foundational worldview? There are plenty. I am not a search engine though and crt is not a hard science anyway. Paraphrasing, AM said not everyone takes the recommended books as gospel truth and one should read with their critical thinking cap on. Someone asked what specific issues she had with them. AM had other things going on and didn't want to get bogged down in a discussion like this. I provided three internet *opinion articles* about the underlying philosophies of the books and what AM may have been thinking of when she originally posted. I'm not in an academic debate and doing research because someone demands it on an internet discussion board.

You want me to explain intersectionality? Seriously? Lol.

That's rather begging the question. Did you read the critique? Have you explored those authors who are critical of crt and there reasons for it? Do you think they are going to get published in a place where crt is seen as the dominant world view? Are there any poc who disagree with crt you would be willing to read? Most I know of are called vile names on social media and essentially shouted out of the room precisely because they don't subscribe to crt and intersectionality. CRT as a researched-based discipline is kind of a self-licking ice cream cone in that respect. It's a social science and philosophy that begs its own questions among academics. Departments that publish the research you are speaking of would absolutely not give one red cent or even the time of day to someone who doesn't agree intersectionality and crt are foundational truths that society is based on. I kinda realize why AM didn't bother now because no one wants to engage in the critque but rather whether critiquing the idea is even legitimate in the first place.

I would say thay at least the article about crt acknowlges a problem with how poc are treated in America. Disagreeing with the power structure of intersectionality or the underpinnings of crt doesn't mean one doesn't think there is a problem or problems to solve. The biggest issue I see as it relates to current events is that injustice is going to happen. It's going to happen over and over and over again even if people, any one group of people, get the all of the reforms they want. What do we do when injustice happens? How do I respond as an individual? But secondly is the fact that groups can't reconcile. Especially in the US there is no one or two or three monolithic groups with the voice of one person that would ever agree on terms of reconciliation. Individuals can reconcile with each other, but races cannot, at least in my view.

It's a critique of critical race theory. The authors fundamentally disagree with it's underpinnings, which a lot of the recommended books rely on and a lot of au currant arguments about race and racism take as given before even entering into a discussion . I'm sure that ideologically it will not match up with a lot of people who are in favor of such a viewpoint and they will say a lot of things in their social media feeds that proponents of crt would disagree with.. But the deflection and ad hominem are probably why @Arctic Mama didn't want to bother going into such things (but I'll tag her in case she wants to speak for herself). Interestingly, you didnt engage with the arguments presented but did spend time digging into the authors to see if you could dismiss them out of hand. People asked about critiques of the books and their views, so I gave some links with answers.

The books recommended seem to be mostly wrapped up in and founded on assumptions of critical race theory and intersectionality. It would probably take days to delve into all of that, but if you're looking for a genuine critique of the ideas, or of one specific book, here are a couple articles. https://newdiscourses.com/2020/06/flaws-white-fragility-theory-primer/ https://newdiscourses.com/2020/06/do-better-than-critical-race-theory/ https://medium.com/@annekathrynbailey/5-reasons-the-book-white-fragility-is-shallow-and-destructive-7d8512616aab

Plum, that paper looks like it was written before the end of March? Am I reading that wrong? Is it just commenting on stats up to that point? And what we knew about the disease up to that point? Honestly, it seems impossible to make the kind of estimations they are asserting.

Okay, well, I guess you can disagree with me, but it doesn't really change how online shopping carts work.

The WHO also said in late January that there was no evidence of human-to-human transmission when many people obviously knew better.

Did you pay for these items and then they held them? Or you don't pay until delivery? I think ordering from Lowe's or HD and then waiting for delivery is very common. Their store policy is that you pay the price that is listed when ordering the item. But putting something in your Amazon cart is not ordering said item. In fact, the item may be ordered by 10 other people and then goes out of stock before you ever purchase it so it's no longer available at all. These are different things, different stores, different business models. It isn't wrong for Amazon to have one policy and Lowe's to have another. By necessity an online retailer is going to have to have a different policy as far as selling items vs. just holding something in your cart. TL;DR -- you're talking about ordering something from Lowe's and having them hold it for you until you're ready to receive it vs. not ordering something from Amazon and still wanting them to hold it at the same price until you decide you do or don't want to actually order it. These are two different things.

It was Stella...we disagreed on a lot but I always liked reading her posts.

If it is liquid, what I do to get out stuck water is to stand up and bend over at the waist and lower my head as far as I can (I am not a flexible person). I turn my head so that the clogged ear is towards the ground. Then I stand up as slowly as possible. For some reason this combination of movement almost always gets water out but sometimes i have to do it 2 or 3 times...I learned it from a coach when I was a competitive swimmer. All bets are off if there's gunk in there, though.

Someone posted side by sides of the Philly protests today and the parade in Philly that helped set off the second wave of Spanish flu. I am not feeling good about any of this.

That made me super sad to see.

Right, but all the people who have been wanting to open up and go back to normal this whole time??? The people who couldn't have funerals, weddings, or be in the hospital with their preemie babies because NICUs are closed even to parents? All the people who thought the shutdowns were an exercise in government control?

Has anyone seen the footage of protests in Philly and Chicago today? I don't think there's any going back to any kind of distancing measures even if it was warranted.

Wow...after every birth (5, all with different providers) I've been given counsel on what to look for for clots or embolism, or what needs to be seen in the ER right away. After my DH did a stint in the ICU a few years ago we were given similar info when discharged. I know covid is being looked at as a vascular disease now, but AFAIK, there are a lot of risks associated with hospitalization and intensive care treatment that are not unique to covid, clotting and embolism being two of those things. Again, not trying to downplay it, but it's another reason to take this thing seriously. Even just being in a hospital bed for any length of time increases risks of all sorts of things.

Isn't this type of thing a risk after any long illness requiring hospitalization and intubation or dialysis? Embolism, clots, etc., have always been on my radar after childbirth, surgery, hospital stays, etc. I'm not saying it's not bad, but getting very sick often creates these kinds of problems, not specific to sars2.

That you thought there were some sort of advocates of the drug that would find a reason to discount the study when the flaws are reported right in the article. Those things seem significant and I'm not an advocate of any particular drug. Or are they not significant?

Just wondering if you saw this part: "There are some big caveats: The study enrolled people through the Internet and social media, relying on them to report their own symptoms rather than having them tracked in a formal way by doctors. Participants were not all tested for the coronavirus but were diagnosed as COVID-19 cases based on symptoms in many cases. And not all took their medicines as directed."

Did you read the article?

Rice cooker. Also outsourcing mean planning and grocery list making to emeals. I do not think about dinner except briefly once a week to check what we have and what we need and which recipes I'm going to make.

https://science.thewire.in/the-sciences/covid-19-hydroxychloroquine-the-lancet-observational-study-surgisphere/ This is an interesting article about the lancet retrospective on Hydroxy. I don’t knownthe source or veracity of the claims so, block of salt and all that.