Thanks for linking us to this. I listened to it while I did some paperwork this morning. I love that he says the most important things for elementary school-aged kids to be doing in order to become good problem-solvers as adults are to read and to play.

I know it includes grammar, poetry, vocabulary, and writing. I assume you have to find a separate spelling program. But, do you need to find some sort of creative writing program as well? Or is there enough writing in MCT already so that it would just be redundant? Thanks.

In second grade, dd read: Who In The World Was The Acrobatic Empress: The Story of Theodora by Robin Phillips The Courage of Sarah Noble by Alice Dalgiesh Sarah, Plain and Tall by Patricia MacLachlan Skylark by Patricia MacLachlan Caleb’s Story by Patricia MacLachlan One Upon Ice and Other Frozen Poems selected by Jane Yolen Strawberry Girl by Lois Lenski Ballet Shoes by Noel Streatfeild Alice’s Adventure’s In Wonderland by Lewis Carroll Least Things: Poems About Small Natures by Jane Yolen On The Banks of Plum Creek by Laura Ingalls Wilder Free Reading List The Tale of Despereaux: A Junior Novelization by Jamie Michalak Ramona Forever by Beverly Cleary Ramona’s World by Beverly Cleary The Mouse and the Motorcycle by Beverly Cleary Runaway Ralph by Beverly Cleary Ralph S. Mouse by Beverly Cleary

What great ideas. And your daughters are beautiful!

My dd8 (3rd grader) read through all of the words, and it kept moving her to the next level, until it said at the end that the test couldn't assess beyond a 7th grade level and that it was very rare for an elementary school student to test that high.

I found it very interesting and enlightening to go talk to the curriculum director for our school district, and then the elementary school curriculum director (who is also a principal at one of the schools), and finally the enrichment coordinator. We have lived in this district for almost four years now, but all I knew before was second or third-hand information and conjecture. Surprisingly, the reality is a lot better than what I had imagined or heard. Our district is very flexible in working with kids on their own ability levels. Within the individual classrooms reading is leveled according to ability, and all of the elementary classes have the same schedules (math and lang. arts in the morning, social studies and science in the afternoon), so that if a student still needs more challenge it is possible to send him/her to another grade level for individual subjects. They identify giftedness in many different areas, including fine arts, so that students are able to get extra extra challenge in whatever area in which they might excel. In fourth grade they have a special magnet class for kids who test above a certain level in math, reading, and overall cognitive ability to enable those students to have gifted curr. in all subjects and to have extra opportunties for working with middle school staff, if necessary, instead of just getting to participate in a pull-out program once a week, as is common in this area. The magnet class actually uses Michael Clay Thompson curr. for lang. arts (which has been highly praised on the curr. board of late, and is probably what we will be using with dd next year if we continue homeschooling), and also some gifted curr. from the College of William & Mary. There are special writing programs for students who are gifted in writing, starting in fourth grade and continuing through tenth grade, when students get the opportunity to go through the process of trying to get some of their work published. Their math program is similar to what we already use. Although I do have a few issues with how it might be implemented, there isn't anything major that I feel couldn't be addressed and worked through. They learn the scientific process and do experiments for science. Not all of it was surprising or better than expected. The reading program they use in the normal elementary classrooms is pretty typical of public school reading programs, and certainly isn't something I would use. It's small excerpts from lots of different works, with pretty standard questions and exercises. I prefer to have my kids read whole books and be exposed to deeper material. But it also isn't terrible. There's no real literature study in the lower grades, in my opinion. We are used to reading mythology, folk tales, fairy tales, etc., in addition to normal reading selections. They take a standard "social studies" approach, as opposed to the chronological approach we take to history. I still have issues with sending small children into an institutional setting for so much time, and we haven't actually visited a classroom yet to see how everything is implemented by individual teachers, or what the social atmoshphere is like. But I do have to say that I was surprised. After all of the negative things I read on these boards about public schools, and all of the disparaging comments I have heard from teachers, former students, and parents about the current state of public elementary schools (mostly with regard to No Child Left Behind, and teaching to the tests), I was very encouraged to see such innovation in their approach to enrichment programs. And I was pleasantly surprised to see how similar their math program was to ours (which we just love). Also, the elementary curr. coordinator said that all of the elementary teachers read aloud to their students everyday, and they do teach grammar (at least parts of speech, not diagramming, though) in the early grades. It was just encouraging to see that there are some good things happening there.

I think a lot of it depends on what your school is like, which you seem to have a good grasp on, since you have had an older daughter in this situation previously. Some of the schools around us are great at working with kids at whatever level they are prepared to work, within their age-level grade. Dd has a friend who is in second grade, but reads on a much higher level. Her teacher gives her harder material to read and is constantly trying to challenge her. When she memorized all of her addition facts and subtraction facts, they moved her on to multiplication and division. We also know another girl, in another district who is constantly being given different, more challenging work to keep up with her abilities. In our school district, they are willing to send kids to higher grades for certain subjects if they are working at that level and need the challenge. But, if your school district is not willing to do this, I would really push for skipping kindergarten. This is actually one of the reasons we chose to homeschool dd. When she was kindergarten age, she was ready for a lot more than typical kindergarten work. By the end of her kindergarten year she was reading things like Charlotte's Web, just for fun at home in her free time, which is a third grade book in the schools here.

can you tell me about that transition? What thinks were most challenging or difficult? Did your children adjust well to the structure and schedule? Were there social issues? Was it hard for them to get used to having to go everyday, having to get up early, having homework, not having the flexibility of homeschooling? Did they make friends easily or have a hard time breaking into the social circles? What things do you wish you had known before they went back? Did it end up being a positive experience? Thanks for any input.

I have a dd who is 8, almost 9. At 7, she liked Sarah, Plain and Tall and the two books that came after it: Skylark and Caleb's Story. She also liked Ballet Shoes by Noel Streatfield. There are a few others in that series, but we haven't read them yet. She adored Charlotte's Web; it's her favorite book. She would also highly recommend The Trumpet of The Swan, also by E.B. White. James and The Giant Peach and Charlie and The Chocolate Factory by Roald Dahl were well-received.

Are you looking specifically for a swimming theme, or just something fun?

msjones, thanks so much for your thoughtful reply.

Thanks for your sharing your experience and insights. I really appreciate it. I agree with your thoughts about teachers needing to have a good grasp of math before being able to teach it to children. I think a lot of people in the United States believe that anybody can be a preschool teacher as long as they are good with kids, and that only a very elementary understanding of basic concepts is necessary to teach elementary school. I actually believe that these positions need our most intelligent, well-rounded, deep-thinking professionals. And while I know that there are some absolutely amazing and very intelligent early childhood and elementary teachers, I have personally known many who were weren't. And I sat next to a girl in college who admitted that she didn't even like kids and didn't want to be an elementary school teacher, but she couldn't think of anything else in college that she would be able to pass. Can you imagine someone saying that about becoming a college professor? We clearly need to change the attitude we have as a society toward early education. And I don't mean add higher standards and tougher standardized tests. This thread has helped me develop some good questions to ask the school district about how EM is implemented in their classrooms and about their flexibility with allowing a student to incorporate methods (however traditional they may be) that they have learned at home in their classroom learning. I'm starting to wonder, though, how much afterschooling we will really have to be doing, and, in turn, if it would be really worth it to enroll them in school.

Well, I have used both Singapore and Righstart, and I would highly recommend Righstart. The reason we switched from Singapore to Righstart (in dd's second grade year) was that I was seeking a math program that would help me know how to actually teach math to my kids. Perhaps others have had success with Singapore in this respect, but we most certainly did not. When we used Singapore, I really didn't feel that I was teaching dd anything. She was doing worksheets, worksheets, and more worksheets. And I was sitting next to her while she did them. But I wasn't really teaching. And we were trying to use flash cards to memorize addition and subtraction facts. The whole situation was frustrating for dd, and left her feeling at best ambivalent about math, and at times scornful of it. I felt that something was missing, although I couldn't quite place a name on it at the time. Even though we were using Miquon as a supplement (which we both loved), we needed something else, something very different. I had heard of Righstart from the curriculum boards and was intrigued by the mention of math games. I researched it and decided to try it. I am so glad that I did. It has made such a difference in dd's understanding of math. It has helped me learn how to teach math. It has helped both of my children understand math concepts much more thoroughly. We love it's incremental approach, and the way in which it uses games, manipulatives and activities to teach concepts, and worksheets mainly to practice what has been learned and check to make sure the students has actually learned the concept. It is also very incremental in its approach and has built-in review each day.

Thanks for your response. It was very helpful.

This is a good suggestion. When dd was 2 she got ketchup all over a brand-new dress. Our usual standby, Shout, didn't get it out. So I called the Shout hotline and they suggested rubbing the stains with dish soap before washing them again. It worked.

We used to buy Tide (a long time ago), thinking it was far superior to any other brand. But, even then we had to use a pre-treater to get out stains. We have been using All for several years now and really like it. IMO, it works just as well as Tide, at a much lower price. Now, I'll add a little Borax or bleach in the load if I'm doing a load of whites or if I have something that's heavily stained (e.g. kids' dinner napkins), but for the most part, I just use All and it works great! When the kids were younger and consistently got stains all over their clothes, I pre-treated with Shout and had excellent results.

I'm wondering if anyone has seen this to the earlier linked YouTube video? I found it insightful as well.

Shay, thanks so much for your response. I look forward to hearing more from you and other posters! I also wondered why Righstart would be so revered, while EM would be scorned with such severity, when they seem similar to me. I haven't had any personal experience with EM, though, so my knowledge is very limited. I was wondering if the key might be that Righstart uses different strategies, games, activities, and word problems to help children understand a concept leading to understanding the algorithim and being able to apply it in now that they understand why it works, whereas maybe EM bypasses the traditional algorithim completely? Again, my knowledge of EM is admittedly very limited, so I"m guessing here. I would love to hear from more about it.

I'm quite interested in this thread because we are considering putting at least one of our children into a public school next year which uses Everyday Mathematics. I'm somewhat appalled at the number of negative opinions expressed here and at the severity of that negativity. When we spoke to the curriculum director at the local school district which we are contemplating using, and found out that EM was their curriculum, I googled it to find out information. Surprisingly, I thought it looked similar to the curriculum we use at home: Righstart. Perhaps I didn't get a complete picture from the limited information on the internet, though? I would like to know from parents who have actually seen the curriculum and had children using it, do the children never have the opportunity to learn the traditional arithmetic algorithims (for multiple-digit addition, subtraction, multiplication and division) along with the other (perhaps more intuitive for some) ways of solving arithmetic problems? And, is the limitation of what methods they are allowed to use to solve problems coming from the individual teachers or from the program itself? Most of the reason I love Righstart is that it leads children to think about mathematic concepts and to understand the reasoning behind the algorithims before it ever introduces the algorithims. But learning the traditional algorithim is the culmination of that process. By the time they are introduced to the traditional algorithim in Righstart, it makes so much sense that it is a very small, logical step. Then, the students are given ample opportunities to practice using the algorithim, which they now understand. Also, Righstart teaches strategies for addition and subtraction and only expects students to begin memorizing facts when they understand the strategies. But they do memorize the facts. Similarly, they introduce multiplication conceptually using activities that require repeated addition and building arrays, etc., and also have the child learn the multiples for each numeral through 10 before they begin memorizing multiplication facts. But they do memorize multiplication facts. Righstart uses a lot of word problems and real life applications to teach concepts, which has helped my children immensely to understand the concepts themselves and their relevance to real life. We started out using Singapore and Miquon math with dd (now 8 yo) when she was in kindergarten. At the end of first grade I decided that it something was missing and went looking for a better fit for us. We discovered Righstart, and it has made an amazing difference. I can't imagine how different dd's understanding of math would be if we had continued with only Singapore and Miquon. I started using Righstart A with ds when he was five years old, in pre-k. He is now six years old, in kindergarten, and using B. I am constantly amazed at how keen his mathematical though processes are. The games (specifically one that teaches which numbers pair up to make ten) have cemented concepts in his mind that help him to learn higher-level concepts. But to him they're just fun games that he requests even when it's not math time. I guess what I'm taking a huge amount of space and words to say is that I think kids need both. They need to understand the concepts behind the algorithims, and they need to do so before the algorithims are drilled into their minds. But they also need to memorize and be able to use those algorithims, once they are meaningful to them. And my question is: Does EM accomplish this? If not, do you think we might be able to continue teaching our dc the algorithims to complement the EM approach, or do you think it would be ill-received by teachers, which would lead to frustration for the kids? Also my dd (currently finishing up third grade) already knows the multiplication algorithim. She knows all of her multiplication facts through ten, and she does multi-digit multiplication problems daily. She is currently learning division and will be learning the algorithim for that soon. Would she still be allowed to use that knowledge to solve problems or would she be retaught according to EM strategem? Fortunately we live in a school district that believes in placing children by ability, so if she is ahead of her peers she would be able to go to a different grade level for that subject. Do you think she would be ahead? When I looked at the program online, it seemed to me that she would be right in line with what they are doing in her grade level. Thanks so much for any responses!

I don't have any bad ones, but dh makes homemade ice cream for our family's 4th of July celebration every year, and he has made some wonderful ice cream! Cookies and cream (with Oreo cookies) was a big hit among the adults and kids alike, but my favorite was banana. He put real banana slices in, and it was just delicious.

I like this way of thinking about it. :001_smile: Honestly, that's pretty much how I think of our summers, not really a break from education, so much as a break from bookwork academics so that we can have time for learning through other endeavors. Ds gets a lot of nature study in the summers as he loves to explore creeks, fish, hike, and just explore. They both get a lot of physical education in the summer as we go swimming almost daily, they ride their bikes frequently, we go on hikes and walks, and they participate in organized sports. This summer dd wants to go to a few weeks of art camp and they both want to do tennis camp.

I would like to purchase a book for dd for her Easter basket, but surprisingly can't think of what to get. Any ideas? She loves stories, art, classic children's novels. Thanks.

This is very much along the lines of what I was thinking. How does a child have the mental or physical energy to do more academics after such a long school day and homework, and will my dd have the stamina to continue her much-loved extracurriculars? I had thought about doing some things in the car, like SOTW audio cd's or other audiobooks, or our Geography songs, or a Spanish language cd or dvd (we have a dvd player in our car), but I almost hesitate to think about letting dd do anything but decompress during the ride home (or to activities) in the afternoon, after such a long day. And I won't be getting to spend nearly as much time with dd if she attends school, so I'd like to just get to chat with her sometime.

We have homeschooled dd8 from the beginning. She is now in third grade. We are contemplating enrolling her in public school next year because there is a magnet class for fourth graders which will be using curr. designed for gifted students, some of which is the same curr. I was considering using with her at home next year, and we think it might be positive for her to be around other children more often. We still haven't made our decision, and her participation in the magnet class is dependent upon testing, which will not occur until next month, so all of this is hypothetical. But it just made me start to wonder, how do you have time to afterschool a child? She would be in school from 9:00 until 4:00. We live about half an hour away from the school, so she would be gone from home from 8:30 until at least 4:30. I'm assuming she would have some homework. And she is a competitive gymnast, so at least two, but maybe three schoolnights a week (depending on whether she is scheduled for practice on Saturday or not) she will go straight from school to gymnastics practice (3 hrs. long). Since the gym is 30 min. from our house, she wouldn't be getting home until 8:00 or 8:30 on those evenings. She would then have to eat dinner, do homework, and take a shower. It would then be (past) bedtime. Once a week she would have a music lesson (for 1/2 hr.), and then she would have to find 15-30 minutes at least five times a week to practice her instrument. And if she decides to continue tennis lessons, she would have a one hour class on the two days that she doesn't have gymnastics. I just don't see any way we would have time to do anything more than what she would get from school. I was hoping to study Latin again (we did a year in second grade) and begin Spanish with her next year. A foreign language was the main thing I know of that she wouldn't be getting from the magnet class. But there might be other things. I have spoken with the Curr. coordinators for the district, and the gifted curr. coordinator in particular, but I haven't been able to visit the class yet or look at all of the curr. How do you guys do it?

Thanks.