dereksurfs
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Posts posted by dereksurfs
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I've used BJU successfully with my other boys, but it is just not working with this child. My sister has used CLE with 4 of her kids through several grades and she loves it, so I've had a chance to really look through the books. I think I may hold off on MM until I can tell if there is a need. I hate to spend money if I don't need to and it's a quick download if I decide we need it.
Thanks!
Yes, I think that would be a wise choice. There really is no rush. In hindsight we should have waited for the 'need for it.' It is *very* easy to purchase MM online, not so much to return or sell when you don't use it. But I'm also a bit of a curriculum junkee and almost always end up with more than is actually needed. :tongue_smilie:
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If I was going to have it just incase I needed another way of explaining it, I would buy the topical books and not the one that is curriculum by grade level.
Yeah, when we purchased it after CLE I think it also acted as our Plan B in case CLE didn't work for whatever reasons. But then we found CLE to be working so well that MM really went to the back burner. We also had them try MM initially and they weren't as keen on it. So it sits unused. Maybe the topical books would be better if one wanted to focus more on division or percents for example vs. an entire year of material which include *all* topics for that year.
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Love that last image, Derek! That is so great that your 9yo has taken a love of it also. My ds6 seems more interested than my dd10, but I told them I'm here if they ever decide to want to really learn.
Do you have a Flickr account?
Thanks, Tammy. I've been more intrigued with night photography over the years. That last one shot near our home in Big Sur won a photo of the year contest. ;) I do use Flickr in a limited way. But I use Smugmug as my main gallery site since it offers much more in terms of storage an other features. You can see it here - http://landandseaphoto.smugmug.com.
And here is my ds11's gallery which he is just starting to post to more: http://landandseaphoto.smugmug.com/LukeSedilloPhotography
I Used to live in SoCal also BTW and then moved to CO where I enjoyed a lot of mountain landscape photography. Later we moved back to the Central Coast where I find the best of both worlds now.
Here's one from SoCal in Palos Verdes you may enjoy:
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I highly recommend starting with Bryan Peterson's book "Understanding Exposure". It was the first book I ever read and gave me the ability to shoot Manual. Shooting Manual is the most important thing you can do, IMO. Then look for books on Light. Photography is ALL about light. So understanding it is critical to understanding photography!
Yes, this is a great place to start. Then follow-up with "Understanding Composition." Quite honestly both of these subjects could cover a first year and should be the focus (no pun intended) in learning good photography. The digital darkroom is more of an advanced topic one develops skills for after gaining a better understanding of these fundamentals. Though its still good to have a decent photo editing tool and Lightroom is probably a good place to start.
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Like Tammy I'm really into photography as a hobby as well. Consequently I started all our dc out early with their own little cameras. Photoshop is really one of the *last* things to learn IMO. Exposure will be first as Tammy mentioned which includes learning how read the light using the camera's light meter. Then learn to set the proper exposure vs. leaving the camera in auto (dummy) mode. Next is Composition. These are the fundamentals of good photography which haven't changed since its very beginning. To set exposure will require a camera with *manual* controls. If you want RAW then that will also be important when looking into which camera to buy. Your standard point and shoot will not take you very far without at least some manual options. And these manual settings shouldn't be a royal pain to set either (e.g. going through too many menus). Then consider using a tripod which really helps minimize blur as well as allows for longer exposures (see ds11 below).
I use photoshop exclusively so I can't really compare with Lightroom except that I would not be able to use layers, masking, intelligent selection or other advanced features. And I use these things all the time. But for a beginner that probably isn't necessary. Here is a chart comparing the feature differences: http://www.adobe.com...comparison.html
Here are some shots of my son who is a budding shutterbug. He's been shooting in manual mode with tripods since he was 9 y/o and with a point and shoot since 5. But I haven't felt the need to teach him Photoshop yet. The only thing he has really needed it for has been for extreme dynamic range conditions in which two or more exposures can be used to capture the full range of light. This takes Photoshop to blend multiple exposures which can't be done in Lightroom - see last photo as an example.
Multiple exposures for night photography:
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This is an interesting question since we use CLE and also purchased MM for this reason as a supplement (grades 4-6)... but then never used it! Of course we haven't had the need for it yet either while going through CLE. Maybe we will at some point. Hm, I was about to sell it. But maybe I'll hang to it just in case.
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CLE really works well for our girls because of its gentle spiral nature vs. a mastery approach which a number of the others are. Based upon what you've described I would recommend at least checking this out as an option. The biggest difference with CLE spiral is that it introduces new concepts, then moves on to others vs. going on and on over the same thing. Then it comes back to these concepts and develops them further in future lessons. The nice part is that it is not as monotonous as other programs with plenty of variety per lesson. It is also designed to be more independent, essentially being written toward the student. I would think she places in CLE 600 or 700 based on her previous placement tests. There is a free placement test here: http://www.clp.org/d...sts_500-800.pdf
A great thing to do after your research is to narrow it down to a 'few' select options. Then include her in the evaluation process. You can do this through looking over the samples with her and demo'ing when possible. This will help her gain a sense of ownership in her new math curriculum. Of course you will still have the final say. But you can then consider her input as a factor as well. This also helps to avoid that program which while sounding good to you she absolutely hates. :closedeyes: Quite a few of us have experienced that one which leads to starting your search over again. This is your opportunity to really tailor a math program around her unique needs and skills.
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I explicitly stated that CC has nothing to do with Nazi Germany. You are putting words in my mouth.
Then please, why bring it up to begin with, if it has nothing to do with CC?
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I did. I even took notes. Please, tell me where I made an inappropriate, arbitrary use of Nazi comparison? I was explaining to Mergath that totilatarian governments use education as propaganda and gave Nazi Gemany as an example. I even specifically stated that CC has nothing to do with it. I was stating facts about Nazi Germany. Your article even said the law does not apply when discussing totilitarian governments, which I was.
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Abigail, maybe you don't realize it when you're saying it. But when you talk about CC and then reference Nazis like this it comes across as inflamatory language implying a relationship exists at the very least. Similarities are drawn. Does that make any sense? I mean why bring up Nazi Germany into the conversation at all if not to imply a correlation? Maybe you use this language to set off 'Alarm Bells' and really stir people up so that they are as *concerned* as you are? I don't really know. It seems like while you try to not explicity compare the two initially you end up doing so using this slippery slope logic. The CC is basically leading us down a path, one step closer to totalitarian gov't mind control where all freedoms are lost just like Nazi Germany.... Is that really where you think the CC is taking us? To mind controlled Americans, just like brainwashed Nazi Germans? Will that be the outcome if we're not careful? That required purposeful intent and careful planning on the part of Hitler. Is this similar to what America's leadership could be planning now with the CC?
"Totilatarian governments DO use national curriculum as a propaganda tool to "brainwash" their citizens. Research Nazi Germany curriculum. It didn't seem to raise any red flags for them either, btw.
I'm NOT saying that is what CC is about bc it's not. However, we should be vigilant that we don't let go of our liberties, and CC is just another step towards centralized control. Every step away from the Constitution should be a cause of alarm, at least for those that wear their foil hats every day at high noon."
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Some publishers will change their curriculum to meet these new standards. Some have already done so while others are in the process of doing it such as Singapore Math, MUS, Saxon, etc... The degree of changes required depends more on the curriculum's S&S prior to the standard. Some are much less conventional than others.
For the homeschooler there shouldn't be much of an impact as you can choose any program with or without it. Are you planning to homeschool, public or private school? There are quite a bit more implications for public schools. The problems seem to arise more out of the way local school districts implement policies to meet the CC rather than the standard itself. This has very little to do with curriculum.
Standardized tests such as the SAT will be based upon these Common Core Standards.
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No problem, glad to help. For us the supplementing hasn't been needed all that much and its been super easy on my part. I just pick out something the night before and assign it to him. ds11 does it independently the next day and occasionally will ask follow-up questions if he has any. The most work I've done is simply mapping up to another source. That's why for Algebra 1 I've created this S&S matrix.
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I've been curious about why some folks in general object to the CC, especially families who homeschool. So I've read most of these posts. I think this thread gives me a bit more of an understanding now. The main thing I'm gathering here from those opposed is that it is deeply rooted in a larger paradigm or worldview. Basically this is the worldview which dislikes/distrusts the Gov't to oversee anything (e.g. immigration, gun control, healthcare, education, etc...). So if that is the premise upon which 'most' everything is based then this is a bad thing. More Big Gov't = Bad, less = Good. I can at least see where the strong ideas/biases are derived.
Now how about any potential negative effects for homeschoolers? I don't see any negatives for homeschool curriculum. Basically some companies will attempt to comply while others simply remain as they are. Then parents still decide what to use or not use based on what is deemed best. Ultimately most students will sit for some standards based test to get into to college. But there are many ways to get there via a variety of standard or non standard methods. Would those homeschoolers who actively avoid CC do so based on this same premise, like conscientious objectors? Basically its the Gov't trying to meddle in something they don't belong? Therefore I will not use any CC compliant materials. Is this the rationale?
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Yes, please provide links to any information as to how CC affects homeschool students. Otherwise I have to regard it as hearsay since I've seen nothing which points to this. In my state, California, this is not an issue and we've had stricter math standards in the public schools even before the CC. I would be surprised if any state could tell you which 'math curriculum' you could or couldn't use. That said I don't see having some minimum standards as a bad thing, per se. But teaching to the test, NCLB and all the other poorly implemented educational programs/policies/agendas are some of the reasons we homeschool to begin with.
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And any other comments you'd like to make about areas where TC is weak or strong? Thanks!
TC offers good quality word problems I think. I base this on our use of Pre-Algbera class currently. I find them adequately challenging especially for this level of study. I am not sure about Algebra 1 since we are not there yet. However I would imagine them to be similar, yet more difficult at this next level. Overall think there is a nice mixture of problem types.
I guess the only weakness I could see potentially is the need for extra problems at times. Though I don't see this as a major issue. There were several times when we pulled from AoPS and Khan for extra problems. This is where I think it is relatively easy to supplement and gain another perspective on the more challenging topics such as linear equations for example. However I would most likely do this with *any* program as I like to present things from a variety of angles, especially if it seems a bit tricky to grasp initially. That is why I have other resources which are so easy to pick up on the used market (e.g. Foerster, Dolciani, etc...).
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There is a thread, that of course I can't find, in which someone asks SWB about Rainbow Science. I do not think her endorsement is current. She gave specific reasons, but I can't remember what they are.
Maybe someone else has better search kung fu than I do tonight.
I take some of the critiques with a grain of salt. Maybe I'll feel differently after using it for a year. Most critiques seemed focused on level of rigor. But that's not really what I am looking for in middle school science. Rather I want to focus on developing a greater interest in science. Rigor will come soon enough in high school and beyond.
Here is a quote from SWB which I think has to be taken in context of her views of 'all' science curriculum at this level:
"In 1998, it(Rainbow Science) was the best (/only). I was less impressed with subsequent revisions.
Right now I'm pretty much unhappy with *all* the home school science options. On the elementary/middle levels, I think RS4K wins out for thoroughness and ease of use. I know that many people have issues with the RS4K author's positions on origins, but this is one of the issues keeping home school science courses out of development right now." SWB -- http://forums.welltr...w-science-site/
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Two of my kids use it and we're not impressed. It's fine, but nothing too deep and many of the chem "labs" were worksheets. We also didn't have everything we needed. The website claims everything is included, but we've been missing several items
Spetzi, I've heard a few mention it didn't include *everything*. But can you be a bit more specific. I've heard others say there are some basic household items which are not included but sometimes needed.
We will probably give it a try next year for 7th grade science. If anyone is interested in selling part or all of their kits send me a message.
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We started all three of our dc with MUS Primer and went all the through Zeta and part of Pre-Algebra with ds11. However for our two dds MUS was never a good fit. They weren't retaining the material and disliked the approach. I wasn't thrilled with the S&S either. We eventually switched them to CLE and they are doing much better now. IMO, it really depends on the child. We are also apart of several homeschool groups where Saxon, TT and MUS seem to be the popular defaults. I'm thinking this partially has to do with ease of use. But there are many other, sometimes better math options worth considering as well.
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Ah, I see, thanks for the explanation. I will watch the demo later. Basically, is it that the free one is just the same thing but it is ONLY the explanation part (with no example sets, practice probs, review notes, chap tests)? Or is it that the explanation part is also shortened?
Dd really loved the few we watched today. To the point of wanting to do that for Pre-alg instead of the Saxon 8/7 we're doing (we're halfway through it but it's mostly been review of arithmetic and not a ton of pre-alg yet).
I don't think we'll switch-she really needs the spiral right now. But I will add in the free ones as supplemental for sure! And it has moved WAYYY up on my list for Alg for the fall.
The only reservation I have with going w/ it for Alg is that it is not time-tested and proven-no online reviews, etc., since it's so new, which is a little scary as opposed to going with Foerster's!
Glad to hear your dd enjoyed the lessons. As far as the video lengths go I'm not certain. I just did a quick review of the free site and the videos looked similar if not the same as the class. That would be a good one to ask John Zimmerman via email. He is very helpful and responsive to questions. email: john.zimmerman@tabletclass.com
In terms of your concern, I had the same initially. But after thoroughly reviewing the S&S and demo'ing the product I was more comfortable with giving it a try. I also found a few glowing reviews on this forum which introduced me to the program to begin with. That said I also have three other Pre-A texts (MUS, Dolciani & Lials) and three other Algebra 1 texts (Foerster, Dolciani & AoPS) which I can supplement with if/when needed. We actually started Pre-A with MUS and Lials was a flop.
I've created a matrix of their S&S which you can also use if interested: Algebra 1 S&S matrix. This allows me to easily supplement from any of these texts If I want to elaborate or present another perspective. I must admit that I tend to go overboard with both research and textbooks. And the older classics can be picked up for pennies on the dollar. I just like having multiple sources available. Overall I've found Khan and AoPS to be best for supplementing this year. ds11 really likes both.
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Awesome! Tablet Class is one of my top 3 I'm considering for Alg!
What are the exact differences between this free thing and the actual TC? Are the free ones considered a full course?
My understanding is these new 'free' videos are to be used as supplemental and are not 'Full' courses. They don't have the full curriculum including the problems (Example Sets) with fully worked out solutions via video, nor do they have practice problems, review notes or chapter tests. If you run the free demo from the TC website you will see the differences: http://www.tabletcla...efaultdemo.aspx
These would be great resources to use similar to Khan or AoPS videos.
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Does TC offer plenty of review or is it a mastery program?
TC's lessons build upon each other as most algebraic concepts do. So the way I look at it is review is built-in every time one gets to the next level. For example ds11 is currently doing polynomials in Pre-A. But way back in the beginning he was learning about single and multi-step equations. So as he progresses he continues to apply the same concepts learned earlier and thru this use it acts as review. Also at the end of every chapter there are review notes note and extra practice problems to review the concepts before they take the chapter test. I find the chapter tests to be great tools for evaluating retension and understanding. If more were missed in a particular area we go back and review over those concepts. Furthermore, TC Pre-A is strongly rooted in Algebra 1. So as ds11 finishes up Pre-A, it is really nice to see the mapping it has to Algebra 1. In Algebra 1 he will be covering many of the same concepts covered but in greater depth. Consequently there will be a lot of review followed by expansion upon it.
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So happy to say we narrowed it down to CLE, Horizons Prealgebra, and Saxon 1/2. Today I sat down with my DD and we looked through all the samples together. After a brief deliberation, she picked CLE - huge relief for me because I feel like that's the best fit for her too. She's going to take the placement test tomorrow and we'll use that to determine which areas need additional reinforcement (in the 700s) before we move on to the 800s. I'm hoping the light is at the end of our tunnel!! Thanks for all the input! :)
Glad to hear KellyMama. Its nice that she got to go through them with you. And its kinda funny that she ended up liking a 'non pretty picture' option. ;) Please let us know how its goes.
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Thanks Beckett, we have been using TC this school year for Pre-A and have been very pleased with it. We found it to be a bit on the rigorous side which was perfect for ds11. We plan on continuing with it into Algebra 1. How far have you gone with it?
Thanks again,
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Derek- Thank you so much! I will check it out more thoroughly this time. About how much time do you spend with your son for math? I am starting to wonder how I can possibly have enough time in the day to get it all done! :glare:
Crimson Wife- thanks for Derek Owens idea. I have looked at his site, it looks good but it is hard to tell if it worth the extra cost as compared to some of the other programs.
We typically spend ~ 1.5 hours per day. This goes up or down somewhat depending on how challenging the topic is. We plan on continuing with math into the Summer break. This will give us a chance to add in some supplementals and jump start 7th grade Algebra 1.
A great feature of TabletClass is that if you pay for 1 year you can do Pre-A and then roll right into Algebra 1 under the same annual subscription. We will be doing this before the end of 6th grade since ds11 is getting close to the end of Pre-A. For your ds11 you could skim/skip certain areas which he already knows. That will allow you to accelerate the class and get ready sooner for Algebra 1. There is an end of the chapter test you can have him take. Then just have him go back and work on areas he missed vs. the whole chapter. The chapter tests really aid in this way to target areas that need the most work.
BTW, we considered Derek Owens Pre-A as well. I think its a great program overall. However it consisted of more elementary math review and less algebraic content. So we opted for TC. ds11 was ready to move up and has really risen to the challenge in this course.
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Derek- I did a trial of Tablet Class a few months ago and found it somewhat confusing. It never seemed that there were any actual problems to work on? Is the actual class more organized and easy to figure out what you are supposed to be doing?
Yes, I think you probably just need to poke around a bit more. The user's guide goes through all of this really well. Go to 'Start Here' and then click on 'How to use Tablet Class.' Also keep in mind that the Demo Site is always available to try out now. See above link.
All you have to do to view the problems and solutions is to click on the chapter icon - it looks like a paper and pen. Once in there it is very easy to follow. I've posted a picture of it below which should give a better idea:
Also note that Khan has problems also which we use as well, not just videos. They work with the video lessons. Here is an example:
Lightroom vs Photoshop
in High School and Self-Education Board
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I agree that there is more than one way to learn and enjoy hearing everyone's input, experiences and perspectives. Most times where one starts depends on where the individual is currently at. For a standard intro to Photography 101 they typically have to assume the student may not have any experience whatsoever. Though today with digitial cameras built into cell phones and tablets it pretty rare folks haven't snapped some pictures somewhere. And even before digital most folks had there own little p&s film cameras.
For me photography is very much an art as well as a science. I learn best by doing and observing. I love looking at beautiful photographs and determining what makes them come alive or have great impact. This is where the *art* aspect comes which includes composition, color, mood conveyed, use of light, a subject, a story being told, etc...
Then there is the technical side, the camera and its use of light. What does the lens do and how does shutter and aperture effect final exposure? The digital darkroom is the last step in *making* the image. This encorporates art and technology. And it really could be a class or many classes in themselves. But I guess in a year long HS course it could be included along with some basics. I would definately not make it a first stop however. Digital or film has nothing to with it really. Post processing is simply adding the finishing touches to a photograph whether film or digital. In the film days folks just had their own closet/basement chemical darkrooms to achieve similar effects.