3rd grader struggling with writing-remediate or wait it out?

[KristaJ]

My 8 year old daughter is my most motivated student and loves all of her lessons-but her writing seems behind.  She is great at spelling and has a huge vocabulary, but when asked to write a summary she seems to just do the bare minimum and struggles to include important details.  Should I be concerned, or is this more of a developmental thing that will improve naturally over time?  I wouldn’t have worried about it at all, but the content (but not the spelling or handwriting) of her 7 year old sister’s writing is much more detailed.  I know I shouldn’t compare siblings, but I can’t help wondering if I need to really work with her on her writing or if I should lower my expectations a little.  When I ask her questions orally, she gives long, detailed responses so I know that she understands the topic, she just struggles to put her words on paper.

[Tiramisu]

Writing just comes more naturally to some kids. I would just keep working on it. If she can verbally do it, that's good.

 

Adding more detail can be hit at two levels: sentence and paragraph. Something like the sentence section Scholastics Super Sentences and Perfect Paragraphs might be comfortable for an eight year old. When she gets a bit older, you can look at Killgallon. Or you can take one of her sentences as say, let's add an adjective or an adverb and start out very incrementally.

 

When she starts to write paragraphs, details can be added approached in supporting sentences.

[fralala]

Sounds like it is possible your 7 year old is just advanced, rather than your 8 year old being behind? I wouldn't worry, but have you thought about trying a relaxed approach like Bravewriter where you can take your daughter's great ideas and vocabulary and help transcribe for her? How does she do with free creative writing vs. writing a summary? It sounds like she has a lot of potential!

[MotherGoose]

I have a 2nd grader and a 5 th grader. 5 th grader has hated physical act of writing since she was old enough to be asked to write anything. 2nd grader loves to write and always has. 5th grader has much larger vocabulary, and recalls more details, etc. 2nd grader is much neater and has better spelling. I despaired for years over 5th grader ever writing much of anything, and one of my terrors about homeschooling is that she'd suddenly have to go to school and her writing would be an embarrassment even if she read on a 8 th grade level at 6. In 5th, and this turn happened somewhere in 4th grade, she became better about it all. She's still not great, but I no longer have panic about her having to go to school and write something. All this is to say, I'd continue to apply gentle pressure, scribe when I could, have her do copywork. I wouldn't panic. For me, there was a change around 9 years old where she suddenly got it. I enforced her having to what I did require neatly and correctly. If she can give you a verbal narration then her brain is working fine. Also my 5th grader, at very young ages, read very well and knew words she wanted to use and that we're in her vocabulary were spelled wrong (because they were surely on no 3rd grade spelling list!), she wouldn't buy into the idea of spell it like it sounds, and I couldn't sit there and scribe for as long as she wanted. As for comparing kids, well, that's the only way to try to figure out if there's a problem r if it's normal...and I have definitely been known to say: if your 6 year old sister can manage to pick up all her toys or fold a shirt correctly, then you, my dear 9 year old, can do the same. (Of course I know that she has no delays, it's personality and lack of attention to detail.)

Edited August 27, 2016 by MotherGoose

[KristaJ]

Thanks for all of the suggestions!  I think I’m just at a loss because my 5^th grader is naturally an exceptional writer.  My 3^rd grader is so far ahead in all other areas that it is difficult for me to step back and let her take her time developing her writing skills (I’m working on this).  She knows her grammar and her sentence structure is usually flawless.  I’m more worried about the content seeming “lazyâ€.  She is right on track with creative writing.  I love the idea of using key words, it will help her stay on track and include important details without stressing her out.

[Ellie]

My 8 year old daughter is my most motivated student and loves all of her lessons-but her writing seems behind.  She is great at spelling and has a huge vocabulary, but when asked to write a summary she seems to just do the bare minimum and struggles to include important details.  Should I be concerned, or is this more of a developmental thing that will improve naturally over time?  I wouldn’t have worried about it at all, but the content (but not the spelling or handwriting) of her 7 year old sister’s writing is much more detailed.  I know I shouldn’t compare siblings, but I can’t help wondering if I need to really work with her on her writing or if I should lower my expectations a little.  When I ask her questions orally, she gives long, detailed responses so I know that she understands the topic, she just struggles to put her words on paper.

 

I would not expect an 8yo little person to be able to write a summary. o_0 I would expect her to "struggle" to put her words on paper. Maybe I'm just behind the times, but that just doesn't seem age appropriate to me.

[KristaJ]

I would not expect an 8yo little person to be able to write a summary. o_0 I would expect her to "struggle" to put her words on paper. Maybe I'm just behind the times, but that just doesn't seem age appropriate to me.

 

That actually makes me feel a lot better.  My 7 year old is good at writing a good summary, although I may be the only person who can decipher it.  This is only our second year of homeschooling, so I'm still trying to get a good grasp on what to expect.  All three of my kids have such different strengths and weaknesses that I'm still trying to figure it all out!

[busymama7]

I would not expect an 8yo little person to be able to write a summary. o_0 I would expect her to "struggle" to put her words on paper. Maybe I'm just behind the times, but that just doesn't seem age appropriate to me.

Yes this ^. I deliberately delay requiring *any* written work until age ten and then I go through the key word outline process as described above. Before that it is only spelling and copywork as well as oral narrations. Oral narrations are composition! When the brain catches up to the hand and all the skills are in place to actually write something well, then I start requiring it. The pushing of formal writing instruction at earlier and earlier ages is actually a huge reason I homeschool. two of mine have graduated and had done early college in high school. One is headed to full time college this fall to major in creative writing and oh yeah, she self published a novel at the age of 15. So the delay not only didn't hurt them, I firmly believe it was to their great advantage.

 

One thing to consider is what else could you be doing that is a better use of time. Reading aloud! If that is getting cut short due to desire to have them write more, then that is backwards priorities in my opinion. The talk by Andrew Pudewa, nurturing competent communicators is fabulous as is his interview on the first episode of the read aloud revival.

 

Read aloud more. Have them orally narrate. Then read aloud more. 😉. Work on spelling and some grammar if you must but the skill of writing really is developmentally linked and it's ok to back off for a time. Not only ok, but better if you instead spend that time putting more thoughts, more ideas, expanded vocabulary etc etc etc into their minds by more reading aloud 😊

[vaquitita]

I think it varies from kid to kid. Some kids are better at retelling the WHOLE thing, lots of details, practically word for word. This is considered good in CM/AO style narrations. Other kids prefer to summarize, which is considered good in SWB style narrations. I think they're both good. Recognize them as two different types of narration, and at some point (not necessarily now) make sure to teach the other style. If a kid retelling you the whole story in great detail, at some point give them an (oral) exercise of summing up the story in three sentences. help them focus on the main points, the things at you cant leave out without making the story not make sense. If you have a kid who always sums up a story as briefly as possible (the Britons and Saxons fought and the Saxons won), then you could ask questions to draw out more details and then have them retell it with the added details. So far I have one kid in each camp. ;)

 

If your 8yo is telling you great oral narrations, I wouldn't worry about it yet. Getting that great narration down on paper is a whole nother skill. It'll come. I know SWB starts it earlier, but CM didn't start written narrations till 10. And the written ones were naturally shorter than that child's oral narrations for awhile.