Sonlight vs. MFW And Does anyone feel confident they are getting it right?

[Jeana]

Hello to all again. I am at yet another crossroad. Are they getting enough. Are they up to standard? Could or should I be expecting more. For 5 lOONNGGG years I have been asking myself this and I fear that I will never stop second guessing myself. For those of you who have been able to stop this cycle how did you do it????

 

Next thing is that I am contemplating changing from MFW to Sonlight as I think it might require more from my soon to be 11 yr old. Both my dd (soon to be 9) and ds really enjoy MFW but I don't think that it stretches my son enough. Next year we are to do Medievel time period after we finish the countries and cultures and it looks interesting but I just don't know. Any comments or suggestions would be welcomed. My son is also DYING to do Apologia General Biology. Is he to young? He will be finishing Epsilon in MUS this year, if that helps.

 

Thanks to all, Jeana

[Julie in MN]

Hi Jeana,

 

I'm sure we all second-guess ourselves in certain ways. It's hard being "lone rangers" out there by ourselves!

 

I have done one year of Sonlight & several of MFW. I'm trying to think of how Sonlight would stretch an 11 year old more than MFW. Probably you mean requiring more books? Is that what you're thinking? Sonlight does schedule more required books, tho not all are advanced. And that can also be done with MFW -- in fact, if he is doing book basket and reading time daily, it probably is being done?! And I like how MFW has kids learn in many different ways, instead of relying solely on gleaning information from stories.

 

RTR is definitely a jump up from ECC. We are just finishing RTR. Both the included books (Augustus Caesar's World, for instance) and the book basket lists (we are reading one by G.A. Henty from the book basket list) include a step up in reading.

 

Vocabulary is a step up from ECC to RTR, using English from the Roots Up. Science includes basically two complete programs (human body and astronomy). Music and art are classical instead of folksy. Bible covers a lot of ground in the actual New Testament, as well as bringing in resources such as Victor Journey and Trial & Triumph and How the Bible Came to Us.

 

Well, that's from the point of view of a happy MFW-er. I'm sure a happy Sonlight-er will share, too :o)

Julie

[midwestbelle]

we are using MFW Adventures now. I'm trying to decide whether to go with ECC next year or switch to SL. I'm having trouble getting books from the library and would like to just have it all here and laid out for me. However, I like that MFW has more integration of the Bible into history.

 

Also, I really don't like doing projects and usually skip them whenever possible. I wish I liked them, I just don't.

 

I just printed out sample instructor guides from SL core 2 and core 1+2 and also from MFW ECC and CtG. I'm going to go over them the next few days and talk it over with DH.

 

Maybe you could print out the samples you're considering and live with them a few days. I'm hoping it gives me more perspective on each curr.

 

HTH

Dawn

[Donna T.]

I've used both at different times and sometimes at the same time!! Both are a good fit for our family. Next year, I'll be teaching MFW to my youngest and SL to my oldest. Eventually, they will both be in MFW again. Then, I plan to have both of them back in SL. If my children were closer together in age, we would most likely stick with SL for just about everything... except, first grade. I think MFW First Grade is the absolute best. I love it and can't wait to teach it again next year. Well, my sons are three years apart, and that's a difficult age span for SL. It's possible to keep them in the same core for some of the years, but probably not all.

 

There are many things to consider when making your choice. Not the least of which is the cost. MFW is so affordable and so complete. I'm not sure how SL would stretch your child more than MFW. Maybe you mean by exposing your child to certain content that is not so much focused on with MFW? Well, I dropped Core 1 with my oldest because he began to have nightmares after seeing some of the pictures in one of the books that SL uses for Core 1. He was GREATLY distressed by some of the content of Core 1. That's why I switched him to MFW. MFW ministered to his heart in a way that SL couldn't.

[Jeana]

Thanks so much for that! I have really liked MFW and I guess really what I mean is that it doesn't require the outlining etc. that the WTM recommends. I often feel as if he might be behind in things like writing etc. He is in the 5th grade R&S english, Epsilon MUS, and is doing Latina Christiana. I just haven't required all the other things that I probally should according WTM. When you have a manual like Sonlight that has it required from someone else it seems like it might be easier to get them to do it. I sound rediculious writing. Sometimes just writing your feelings down make you realize that what you need to do is just knuckle down and do it! Thanks again and I will probally go on with MFW as we have really enjoyed it.

[Jeana]

I have enjoyed ECC and so have my children. It has been great and really the only reason I have thought of changing to Sonlight is a friend has it that I can have. Also, I thought that the added requirements in grammar etc., just might motivate me to do more. After reading what others have said I realize that I need to just stick with what I am doing and stop changing.

 

However, I know what you mean by having it all there and not having to worry about getting the books elsewhere. I did read somewhere on here about a second hand book dealer that is really cheap. I am just not sure what it was. So, you chould buy most of the books that you would need and sell them off before you buy the next years material.

 

Hope this helps you. Good luck with your decision.

 

Jeana

[Jeana]

Thanks so much for that! I have really liked MFW and I guess really what I mean is that it doesn't require the outlining etc. that the WTM recommends. I often feel as if he might be behind in things like writing etc. He is in the 5th grade R&S english, Epsilon MUS, and is doing Latina Christiana. I just haven't required all the other things that I probally should according WTM. When you have a manual like Sonlight that has it required from someone else it seems like it might be easier to get them to do it. I sound rediculious writing. Sometimes just writing your feelings down make you realize that what you need to do is just knuckle down and do it! Thanks again and I will probally go on with MFW as we have really enjoyed it.

[G5052]

I'm about to start my fourth core with Sonlight. We used MFW K only, so I'm not super experienced with MFW, but I did spend a lot of time several years ago comparing the two. In the end I went with Sonlight because having it all scheduled for me really does help immensely, and frankly I like the Sonlight books better, especially when you compare the higher-level programs. I use a lot of library books and books borrowed from a friend who is a long-term Sonlight user. I have one child that doesn't like hands-on at all, and both are avid readers, so that was another factor.

 

So we don't fix what isn't broken. Sonlight isn't perfect, but it's awfully close to what I'd do myself if I had the time and inclination.

[Donna T.]

You know, it's funny how different perceptions can be. One of the reasons that I continue to consider MFW is because I feel so confident that, with MFW, there will be no gaps and that my children will cover everything that needs to be covered... especially in regards to writing. MFW never leaves you guessing. And, they don't ask the child to complete an assignment that he/she hasn't been prepared for. I think MFW provides me more peace of mind in this area than SL. I believe that Intermediate Language Lessons (MFW's suggestion for English) covers some outlining. And, MFW includes the resources needed to teach the child to write a report. Also, with all the copywork, dictation, notebook summaries, and narrations, there really is plenty. MFW is so well organized. I'm not as confident about this with SL. I tried SL language arts in the past and found it to be very confusing. I may end up trying the new LA. But, I really like R&S. So, I'll have to come up with my own assignments to go along with the cores AND be sure that I'm being realistic about my child's abilities. You don't have that issue with MFW.

 

I plan to put both children in ECC after next year. My youngest will be a second grader and my oldest will be in fifth grade. I already have ECC but I've decided to wait on it. Also, by doing it this way, my oldest will be older (duh) and I can add in some of SL Core 5 for him.

[Free Indeed]

This year when we did ECC, we added in some sonlight books. While I would choose MFW over Sonlight, I still really like the book choices Sonlight has made.The next 2 years I am doing my own thing for sure, but in year 3 I think I will be back with MFW- adding in a few Sonlight books. :D

[Donna A.]

RTR is definitely a jump up from ECC. We are just finishing RTR. Both the included books (Augustus Caesar's World, for instance) and the book basket lists (we are reading one by G.A. Henty from the book basket list) include a step up in reading.

 

Vocabulary is a step up from ECC to RTR, using English from the Roots Up. Science includes basically two complete programs (human body and astronomy). Music and art are classical instead of folksy. Bible covers a lot of ground in the actual New Testament, as well as bringing in resources such as Victor Journey and Trial & Triumph and How the Bible Came to Us.

 

Julie is right about this. We're working through RTR here, with a 12yo and 9yo, and there's quite a bit of meat to it. It's not fluff!

 

Remember, too, that if you're following the MFW "plan" in order, the oldest child doing ECC would be only about 3rd grade, give or take. So yes, it's very possible that you might find it to be a little light for a 5th or 6th grader. That's why they offer recommendations for junior highers doing ECC. So, keeping that in mind and assuming you're following the year sequence *as recommended* by MFW, you'll find more meat and harder assignments as you go through each year of the program. Including the fact that they have the older student doing research, outlining, and writing reports in Expl-1850 and 1850-Modern.

 

If you have a friend from whom you can get the SL books, go ahead and take them! Or just borrow them (like a library) to use as part of your Book Basket while doing MFW. Lots of people do that. But you'll find a pretty extensive booklist in RTR as it is.

 

As someone else mentioned, print out the sample lessons for all the coming years of MFW and pick through them to see where MFW will take you as your children grow. Doing this was very helpful to me.

 

And remember that you can continue to use other resources for math, LA and foreign language as desired. You don't *have* to use MFW's recommendations. It all depends on what your goals are for your family and how much time you want to put into a day's work.

 

Be encouraged. It *is* enough. :)

[G5052]

I used it one year, and have used other more classically-oriented things ever since. Both of my children use the Classical Conversations LA program now which meets my criteria for a rigorous grammar and writing program. The content is not alligned with our history, but in my book that's not a must anyway.

[Melissa in CA]

I have used SL for several years at various levels (elem, jr. high, high school). I would never switch to SL for their writing program. Ack! My experience with it has not been favorable. We have not used their new LA though, so perhaps it is more do-able, but the samples I have seen have not convinced me it's any better...just different.

 

Have you checked out IEW's Student Writing Intensive, Level A? I found that with a video teacher (Mr. Pudewa) teaching for me, that writing got done regularly. Mr. Pudewa makes writing fun and painless, with great results. Just a suggestion.

 

You might also want to take look at Writing Tales II. It's a gentle approach to writing, with grammar thrown in, that runs along the same lines as IEW.

 

Bottom line...If your happy with MFW I certainly wouldn't switch to SL just for their LA. Sonlight is wonderful to be sure if you want lots of literature, but their LA is probably their weakest point. My opinionated opinion of course. ;) I know many SLers who use a different writing program though, so I am not alone in my opinions. :p

 

Blessings,

Melissa

[cbollin]

another mfw user experience here.

 

I seem to remember doing more notebooking in RTR. We decided to do most of that writing from an outline even if it doesn't say to do it that way. I wanted to do it like that so I did. The opportunities for history and science writing were there.

 

Also, in year 5, you will do a lot of outlining in the history b/c you will be using the SOTW Activity Book that year.

 

 

 

-crystal, who has to remember to do my sig line over here. ;)

MFW since 2003 (currently in MFW's 1850-MOD)

mom of 3 dd,

[Jeana]

How neat I am thinking of doing the exact same thing with Apologia General Science. We should stay in touch and see how it works. Thanks for the post.

Jeana

[Jeana]

You guys are GREAT!! Thanks for the encouragement and suggestions!! One more question, How do you prepare for Outlining if you were never good at it?????? Thanks again, jeana

[Donna A.]

My understanding with the outlining that's done in MFW, you don't need any prep, as she teaches you how to do it. But I'm thinking of getting the Remedia Outlining book that SWB recommends, anyway. Just for my own peace of mind. LOL. It's not expensive.

[PineFarmMom]

My dd is in 7th and we've homeschooled all the way. From first grade on, I switched around from Veritas Press to SOTW and back to VP. This is the first year we have used MFW and I don't see me switching again. Many people are so good at putting things together on their own, but I'm just not. I lack the confidence and second-guess myself. Having it laid out for me this year has given me confidence to focus in on the skills more and less worry over whether we are doing "enough". We are using MFW ECC and we love it!!! With the extra add-ons for 7th-8th grade, it has been thorough and rich for dd. It has been more than enough and enjoyable!! I can't compare SL, though. It looks like an excellent program, it is just more than I can spend. We use CW Homer and R&S6 for grammar and writing, apologia for science, MUS pre-algebra for math, and LCII for latin. It's been our best year yet!! God, His will, His plans for the nations are the focus while we are getting a great education in the process!!

 

For my younger child, 4th grade ds, I use Writing Tales I and R&S 4 for grammar/writing. It has been a good mix. I add a writing project for him weekly or bi-weekly, along with the assignments in WT. The countries, science, animals, etc., give plenty to write about!!

 

Teresa