LA experts, help! Please critique my tutoring plan!

[PeachyDoodle]

A friend has asked me to work with her 6yo, who is in first grade. Her biggest concern has to do with reading. While the student reads on grade level, and can verbally answer comprehension questions, he struggles with giving written answers. He does not struggle with writing generally, but it seems as though the process of reading a passage, reading the questions, and writing answers to those questions independently is overwhelming for him.

 

This is not how I teach reading/writing at all. I tend to subscribe to SWB's belief that requiring a very young child to write about what he has read is often developmentally inappropriate, and I suspect that is what's going on here. Unfortunately, this student's school will assess him and determine whether he advances to the next grade based at least in part on his ability to do this, and putting him in a more gentle schooling environment is not an option for the family at this time. The teacher can offer no guidance or assistance of any kind during the assessment (which seems to happen frequently).

 

Aside from homeschooling my own children, I have zero teaching experience. I don't know if I can help this little boy in the least, especially in an hour or less per week, but I'm going to give it a shot. Here's what I'm thinking:

• Split up the reading and writing processes. Have him read the passage once, then narrate it back to me in his own words.
• Re-read the passage, then work through the comprehension questions orally (his teacher provides a reading passage and questions each week for his homework). Encourage him to answer in complete sentences. Scribe his answers for him on a blank sheet of paper.
• Allow him to copy the answers I have scribed onto the worksheet. Perhaps have him read them aloud once more before and/or after he writes?
• Work towards taking dictation of his own answers onto the worksheet. Or possibly incorporate other dictation exercises to help him practice holding thoughts in his mind as he gets them down on paper?

What else would you suggest? I am open to any ideas!!

[regentrude]

I do not consider the expectation that a 6 y/o read a passage and then answer questions about the passage in writing in any way developmentally appropriate.

Your plan sounds fine.

I rather question the whole concept that a 6 y/o needs after school tutoring.

Edited February 4, 2017 by regentrude

[PeachyDoodle]

I do not consider the expectation that a 6 y/o read a passage and then answer questions about the passage in writing in any way developmentally appropriate.

Your plan sounds fine.

I rather question the whole concept that a 6 y/o needs after school tutoring.

 

Perhaps "developmentally inappropriate" is too strong. But the combination of skills required to read a passage, read questions about the passage, formulate answers to the questions, and translate those answers from mind to paper proves difficult for some very young children.

 

As I said, I do believe this little guy will be just fine. His mother is probably overanxious because he is not as advanced as his older siblings were at this age. Her anxiety is feeding his, or perhaps it's the other way around. I hope to be able to reassure them both, because they are my friends, and I care about them. Not having any particular experience working with young children (other than my own -- and I didn't begin homeschooling dd until she was 8 and just began kindergarten with ds this year), and not being the type to fly by the seat of my pants, I hoped to go in with at least some idea of what to do when they show up here next week.

 

If you don't have anything helpful to add, maybe save your comments?

 

[Lang Syne Boardie]

 

 

If you don't have anything helpful to add, maybe save your comments?

 

 

  :huh: 

 

*tiptoes back out, rather than risk being not helpful enough*

Edited February 4, 2017 by Tibbie Dunbar

[regentrude]

If you don't have anything helpful to add, maybe save your comments?

 

I commented to tell you that I believe you have a fine plan, and to that I agree with your assessment of the situation.

Some other posters might have considered this kind of support helpful.

 

Sorry, I will refrain from ever doing so again.

Edited February 4, 2017 by regentrude

[PeterPan]

I've been told VP has a set-up like this in their physical school, where there is no differentiated instruction and low performing kids need tutors to survive. On a personal level, having an ADHD kid for whom that would have been hard and having a dc who is very gifted but with significant SLDs for whom that task would be IMPOSSIBLE, I'm saddened that the poor 6 yo boy is going through tutoring. At this point you haven't yet established WHY the task is hard for him. If it's truly a task that he has received preparation for and that all the rest of the class is doing adequately, then it would be really good to know why he's performing differently from his peers.

 

Personally, I would advise you NOT do the tutoring because I would let the dc fail to force the parent's hand on being realistic. It's not reasonable to require tutoring to survive 1st grade. It's absurd, and she's using you. But you like her. And in reality, with my experience with my kids, I *can* think of things that could be glitching this dc and making it hard for him to do the task that his peers are able to do. There are learning centers that specialize in this kind of intervention, but they're expensive. Again, I go back to my cynical observation that she's using you, which you won't like. But I've been around the block too, and sometimes non-homeschoolers think we're magicians.   ;)

 

I would check his working memory and make sure he can hold 3-5 words, objects or thoughts with distractions. So, if you play games with commands (tap your head, jump twice, twirl, sit down, clap), can he do it? And I would do games for working memory using kinesthetic, auditory (he has to repeat back the commands), visual (play memory games), digit spans, etc. this is stuff I do with my ds, so I'm saying I know it's an important component and it's what I do.

 

I would make sure he actually has the language skills to answer the comprehension questions orally and to sequence. You hit on this. I think you're spot-on with separating apart the tasks. Can he answer wh- questions?

 

I would make sure he can write a sentence from dictation.  *Probably* this is where you'll see a breakdown, especially if there's low working memory. Building up the working memory will make it easier to hold his thoughts while he writes them. That's why I suggested the variety of working memory games.

 

I would do metronome work (heathermomster has instructions, site search to find them) along with the digit spans to increase his ability to hold his thoughts and motor plan with distractions.

 

I would check briefly his visualization, ie. his ability to hold a visual image in his head from something he reads or hears. Visualization is a strong learning strategy and can help comprehension. If he has developmental vision problems (convergence, etc.) they can show up with poor visualization. That's why I was saying it's more intriguing to ponder WHY he's having this difficulty, relative to his peers, because it's possible you're actually seeing the iceburg tip of a problem they don't yet realize. If he has some ADHD or vision issues or this or that, this is a way it can show up at this age.

 

I personally would try to get any writing exercises you do into a game context, games, games games. You'll get better compliance, and when you have fun you make more of the brain connector hormones, hence more progress. I have some games like Dixit and story cubes. Dixit would be super cute for this. You can even do it with sequencing cards, since he's so young. Or just use cards from anything you have. 

 

As a side note, you don't know his language skills and whether there's an actual deficit underlying these difficulties. If he were in the ps, he'd have the advantage of evals and the IEP process to figure out what's going on. They wouldn't fail him but would do evals and figure out the problem. Instead, he's in a private school and being told he's inadequate and needs a tutor. I'm EXTREMELY pro evals, pro early identification of disabilities. So that's another reason why I would STRONGLY consider refusing to work with the dc, because the mother is using your help to skirt the identification of possible disabilities. I would think long-term vs. thinking in the moment. And I'm saying that as someone who COULD do all those things. I'd refuse to and send her for evals or to a qualified tutoring center where they can do those things and more. 

Edited February 4, 2017 by OhElizabeth

[PeterPan]

Amazon.com: Bubble Talk Board Game: Toys & Games

 

Amazon.com: PicWits! Board Game: Toys & Games

 

Amazon.com: Party Game - Pickles to Penguins - Quick Thinking Card Game: Toys & Games

 

See if Target or something you can get quickly has any games like these. They're high on language and make it easy to link cards using narrative. Then, after you've linked 4 or 5 and discussed, then you can ask a wh-question about them. Typically your reading comprehension questions will be wh-questions, so it would be good to figure out if he has a breakdown there. (where, why, etc.) 

 

I think it's fine to work on the skills separately. If the dc doesn't have serious disabilities, then he'll probably be able to pull it together and do the exercise for the testing, even if he hasn't practiced the skills together a lot. 

 

You can also do exercises unscrambling sentences, but my guess is he's going to find them uncomfortably hard.

 

I think it's important to remember you could be seeing a learning disability. Could be anything. He's young for his grade, sounds like. When is his b-day? It's just very important to tread carefully and keep it positive. It's MUCH more important that he come out with a positive sense of his ability to do the tasks you give than it is for him to advance a grade. Keep all the tasks easy, within reach, and fun.

Edited February 4, 2017 by OhElizabeth

[PeachyDoodle]

  :huh:

 

*tiptoes back out, rather than risk being not helpful enough*

 

Oh, for heaven's sake. This is what I mean. If you choose not to comment because you don't feel that you have anything to add, or you think the OP is hostile, or you're just plain uninterested, or whatever other reason you may have, that's perfectly okay. But what good does snark like this do?

 

 

I commented to tell you that I believe you have a fine plan, and to that I agree with your assessment of the situation.

Some other posters might have considered this kind of support helpful.

 

Sorry, I will refrain from ever doing so again.

 

I apologize for misreading your intent. Yes, you said the plan was "fine." You also implied (at least in the way that I read your post) that 1) the expectations placed on this student are perfectly reasonable, and 2) he shouldn't need any outside help. Maybe the expectations are reasonable; as I said, "developmentally inappropriate" was an overstatement of my position, which I should have worded more carefully. Clearly the student is not meeting the expectations -- in which case, what exactly is the right course of action? Did you mean that it's unfortunate that a 6yo is being forced to undergo the additional pressure of tutoring instead of being given more time to learn at school? In that case, I agree, which is why I am hoping to be able to calm the situation down and take some of the pressure off him.

[stutterfish]

nm

Edited February 6, 2017 by stutterfish

[PeachyDoodle]

I've been told VP has a set-up like this in their physical school, where there is no differentiated instruction and low performing kids need tutors to survive. On a personal level, having an ADHD kid for whom that would have been hard and having a dc who is very gifted but with significant SLDs for whom that task would be IMPOSSIBLE, I'm saddened that the poor 6 yo boy is going through tutoring. At this point you haven't yet established WHY the task is hard for him. If it's truly a task that he has received preparation for and that all the rest of the class is doing adequately, then it would be really good to know why he's performing differently from his peers.

 

Personally, I would advise you NOT do the tutoring because I would let the dc fail to force the parent's hand on being realistic. It's not reasonable to require tutoring to survive 1st grade. It's absurd, and she's using you. But you like her. And in reality, with my experience with my kids, I *can* think of things that could be glitching this dc and making it hard for him to do the task that his peers are able to do. There are learning centers that specialize in this kind of intervention, but they're expensive. Again, I go back to my cynical observation that she's using you, which you won't like. But I've been around the block too, and sometimes non-homeschoolers think we're magicians.   ;)

 

I would check his working memory and make sure he can hold 3-5 words, objects or thoughts with distractions. So, if you play games with commands (tap your head, jump twice, twirl, sit down, clap), can he do it? And I would do games for working memory using kinesthetic, auditory (he has to repeat back the commands), visual (play memory games), digit spans, etc. this is stuff I do with my ds, so I'm saying I know it's an important component and it's what I do.

 

I would make sure he actually has the language skills to answer the comprehension questions orally and to sequence. You hit on this. I think you're spot-on with separating apart the tasks. Can he answer wh- questions?

 

I would make sure he can write a sentence from dictation.  *Probably* this is where you'll see a breakdown, especially if there's low working memory. Building up the working memory will make it easier to hold his thoughts while he writes them. That's why I suggested the variety of working memory games.

 

I would do metronome work (heathermomster has instructions, site search to find them) along with the digit spans to increase his ability to hold his thoughts and motor plan with distractions.

 

I would check briefly his visualization, ie. his ability to hold a visual image in his head from something he reads or hears. Visualization is a strong learning strategy and can help comprehension. If he has developmental vision problems (convergence, etc.) they can show up with poor visualization. That's why I was saying it's more intriguing to ponder WHY he's having this difficulty, relative to his peers, because it's possible you're actually seeing the iceburg tip of a problem they don't yet realize. If he has some ADHD or vision issues or this or that, this is a way it can show up at this age.

 

I personally would try to get any writing exercises you do into a game context, games, games games. You'll get better compliance, and when you have fun you make more of the brain connector hormones, hence more progress. I have some games like Dixit and story cubes. Dixit would be super cute for this. You can even do it with sequencing cards, since he's so young. Or just use cards from anything you have. 

 

As a side note, you don't know his language skills and whether there's an actual deficit underlying these difficulties. If he were in the ps, he'd have the advantage of evals and the IEP process to figure out what's going on. They wouldn't fail him but would do evals and figure out the problem. Instead, he's in a private school and being told he's inadequate and needs a tutor. I'm EXTREMELY pro evals, pro early identification of disabilities. So that's another reason why I would STRONGLY consider refusing to work with the dc, because the mother is using your help to skirt the identification of possible disabilities. I would think long-term vs. thinking in the moment. And I'm saying that as someone who COULD do all those things. I'd refuse to and send her for evals or to a qualified tutoring center where they can do those things and more. 

 

These are good things to think about, most of which I wouldn't have known to look for. Thank you.

 

You may be right about my friend. I really, honestly don't think we're dealing with any kind of disability here. I could be wrong, of course, and it is good for me to have an idea of what to keep an eye out for. He is in public school, with access to intervention, etc. (although it is a small rural school system and my understanding is that the district has eliminated a lot of the funding for this). His teacher does not think he needs tutoring, and told his mother so. His "grades" (they don't assign letter grades for 1st, but do give a 1-3 rating on mastery) are average to above-average. His older brothers are both quite advanced, and he's just not as far ahead as they were at this age. That has her worried. In her mind, she sees him falling further and further behind. He knows he's not at the top of the class like his brothers (he's not at the bottom either) and his confidence is flagging.

 

For some reason my friend thinks that her own efforts (reading to him nightly, doing his homework with him) are not enough, and that I am so much better equipped to help him. This is despite my repeated protestations to the contrary.

 

If I can show his mother that he can perform the types of tasks I outlined above, I think she will relax. And hopefully teaching him how to break down the task will also make it easier for him to put it all together the way his teacher expects. At the very least, I can devote some extra time to encouraging him and help to build his confidence. I am willing to do that for him. I don't think any child should feel inadequate at 6 years old, so if I can intervene to keep that from happening, I am happy to do so.

 

If it turns out that I'm wrong, and working with him a couple of times isn't helping (i.e., if I see that he's really struggling with these things much more than I think he is), I've already made it clear that it will be in his best interest for her to find someone better qualified than I am. I'll definitely push that point!

[regentrude]

I apologize for misreading your intent. Yes, you said the plan was "fine." You also implied (at least in the way that I read your post) that 1) the expectations placed on this student are perfectly reasonable, and 2) he shouldn't need any outside help. Maybe the expectations are reasonable; as I said, "developmentally inappropriate" was an overstatement of my position, which I should have worded more carefully. Clearly the student is not meeting the expectations -- in which case, what exactly is the right course of action? Did you mean that it's unfortunate that a 6yo is being forced to undergo the additional pressure of tutoring instead of being given more time to learn at school? In that case, I agree, which is why I am hoping to be able to calm the situation down and take some of the pressure off him.

 

How the heck did I imply the bolded??? I said very clearly: 

 

"I do not consider the expectation that a 6 y/o read a passage and then answer questions about the passage in writing in any way developmentally appropriate."

 

In other words, I AGREED with you.

 

The reason I said he should not need outside help is the same as OhElizabeth explained much more eloquently. It is not good to artificially inflate a 6 y/o's academic performance through after school tutoring and give the school the false assurance that things are fine. No, they are not - a 6 y/o should be taught at school, and if this is insufficient, the expectation is inappropriate.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

Oh, for heaven's sake. This is what I mean. If you choose not to comment because you don't feel that you have anything to add, or you think the OP is hostile, or you're just plain uninterested, or whatever other reason you may have, that's perfectly okay. But what good does snark like this do?

 

 

 

OK, I guess it didn't do any good, because you didn't get it...let me spell this out: I opened the thread with interest, read your original post, had a few ideas, and was about to hit "reply" in order to craft some thoughts JUST for you, when I saw your post to regentrude and was taken aback.

 

The point of MY post was to let you know that you are unnecessarily alienating people who are trying to help. If you bite people's heads off, other people might not want to help you.

 

I guess I still haven't told you my ideas, but since OhE posted, I don't think you need them, anyway. You have all you need.

 

I'm not trying to waste your time or comment unhelpfully or post without anything useful to add, just so we're clear. I'm clarifying a former post.

 

Although I do reserve the right (for myself and for the whole universe) to be inadvertently unhelpful on discussion forums any old day of the week. Nobody can avoid that 100% of the time, you know. It's not like you paid for something and are being robbed if we fail to say what you want to hear, or what you think you need to hear.

[PeterPan]

Ok, I'll play devil's advocate with you a bit here. So you do the tasks with him, he can do them in your home (without the teacher, without the distraction of the classroom, etc.) but he STILL fails or has a low score when he is required to do them with the teacher. Then what? 

 

Also, I think it's really concerning for you to say she's wrong. As someone whose kids have SN (one ADHD, one with a much longer list), I can tell you that *I* was seeing those things WAY before anyone else acknowledged them. You're not a psych and have no experience with SN, but you're saying she ought to just chill. I can tell you that if *she* came over to LC and posted, we'd tell her to LISTEN TO HER GUT. It's the number one, first thing we'd tell her. If her gut is telling her something is wrong, something is wrong.

 

Think about it. You've got a mom having anxiety. Either she has clinical anxiety, meaning the kid may have some anxiety and ADHD. Or maybe she just is actually starting to see things and notice things. And she *is* seeing discrepancy and unexpected challenges. *I* think that's significant. Kids can perform at a very high level and still have SN going on. Happens all the time.

 

It's federal law that they are required to identify disabilities.

 

I just think it's really, really concerning that your friend thinks her bright dc is falling behind. I'm just going to ask here, do you think she has mental problems? Is she suffering from PPD or anxiety or needs medications or something? Because it sounds like you're saying her judgment is impaired, that she's driven by anxiety, and I would question that. She is going to be in-tune with problems in her kids before the teachers, before neighbors, before everyone else. She's connecting little dots. So either you think something is wrong with her judgment, or you really want to ask objectively what she is seeing that other people aren't acknowledging yet. 

 

Just another way to think through it.